Sorry every one hates this question....but help

[lilraider]

If i breed a tang to a albino(tremper)what will be my out comes?Please help.THANKS



-john

 

[The NY Gecko]

tangerine 1005 het for albino. babies from the next generatino will be tangerien albino

 

[lilraider]

Cool so if i breed the babies they will be tang albinos

 

[The NY Gecko]

you got it.

 

[nwheat]

Well, almost.

It's correct that you will get 100% hets in the first generation of offspring. The parents are AA for the tangerine (assuming it is not a het) and aa for the albino. You can set up the Punnett square to see that all offspring will receive an A from one parent and an a from the other.

...A...A
a Aa Aa
a Aa Aa

But if you breed two of the offspring together (Aa x Aa) the Punnett square would look like this:
...A...a
A AA Aa
a Aa aa

So, 1/4 would be albino, probably with some amount of tangerine, 1/2 would be hets, again with some tangerine, and 1/4 would not carry any albino alleles but would probably have some tangerine.

Breeding one of the het offspring (Aa) back to the albino parent (aa) will give you 1/2 albinos and 1/2 hets:

...A..a
a Aa aa
a Aa aa

Remember that tangerine is a line bred trait and does not work in the same way as albino. I would guess that you'd get tangerine offspring, but perhaps not as bright as the tang parent. You might get brighter tangerine albinos by crossing the siblings, I believe crossing a het back to the albino parent would further dilute the tangerine.

 

[YJHB]

Would any come out as SUnglows?

 

[The NY Gecko]

you need a super hypo tangerine carrot tail baldy for that. im currently getting into a sunglow project. its a complicated trait(kinda) but basically without all the punnett non-sense if you take a pure tangerein with a pure albino and get babies the babies are now tangerein 100%het for albino. if you take the siblings and breed the together then you WILL get tangerine albinos no bones about it. its a fact not a chance. tangereins a line bred or co-dominant trait depending on what you wanna call it. to me no matter what you say i cant see the diff and theyre the same but its open for debate. i think the urban geckos website shows how they came up with sunglows. if not ill paste how they did it in here. lori sent me an email explaining it.

 

[lilraider]

Cool thanks im so far behind in genes

 

[YJHB]

Ah, thanks, I wondered about that; seen it on a couple of sites but it wasn't explained as clearly as you just explained it

 

[nwheat]

if you take the siblings and breed the together then you WILL get tangerine albinos no bones about it. its a fact not a chance.

Tom, it is true that you will get some tangerine albinos by breeding two hets together, but not all of the offspring will be albino - most (75%) will NOT be albino - so why mislead John into thinking he will get only albinos?

My goal in answering genetics related posts is to try to help people understand how to come up with these answers themselves. Some people can intuitively just see what the possibilities are - most can see the possibilities better using tools like Punnett squares. Everyone learns differently!

 

[Southwick Herps]

Nancy, I thought the recessive traits were the lower case, and the dominant were the upper case...?
Heh, Im just givin you a hard time, but thats the way you always see it. Normal is AA, het is Aa, Albino aa for example...

 

[lilraider]

Well, almost.

It's correct that you will get 100% hets in the first generation of offspring. The parents are AA for the tangerine (assuming it is not a het) and aa for the albino. You can set up the Punnett square to see that all offspring will receive an A from one parent and an a from the other.

...A...A
a Aa Aa
a Aa Aa

But if you breed two of the offspring together (Aa x Aa) the Punnett square would look like this:
...A...a
A AA Aa
a Aa aa

So, 1/4 would be albino, probably with some amount of tangerine, 1/2 would be hets, again with some tangerine, and 1/4 would not carry any albino alleles but would probably have some tangerine.

Breeding one of the het offspring (Aa) back to the albino parent (aa) will give you 1/2 albinos and 1/2 hets:

...A..a
a Aa aa
a Aa aa

Remember that tangerine is a line bred trait and does not work in the same way as albino. I would guess that you'd get tangerine offspring, but perhaps not as bright as the tang parent. You might get brighter tangerine albinos by crossing the siblings, I believe crossing a het back to the albino parent would further dilute the tangerine.

WOW you have explained something about genes that i could never learn im clueless when it comes to genes thanks!!!!

 

[The NY Gecko]

huh wah? if youve got 2 1005 hets for albinism why would the sibling not come out as albino then? kinda makes one wonder. as when you have two normals that are 1005 het for albino the babies will be albino. thats my understanding. local specialty shop owner told me that. unless im mistaken(btw he sold me a sick gecko once so now he is kinda one to me) guess i confused myself on this one

 

[The NY Gecko]

oh wait one more addon say you take 2 tangerines 100% het for albino and breed them together, the babies that arent albino, well wtf are they then? bit of an enigma

 

[KelliH]

oh wait one more addon say you take 2 tangerines 100% het for albino and breed them together, the babies that arent albino, well wtf are they then? bit of an enigma

If you breed two tangs that are both 100% het albino together, you will get (statistically) 25% albino, 50% het albino, 25% non het albino (as Nancy already posted). The non albino offspring are 66% possible het albino.

but basically without all the punnett non-sense if you take a pure tangerein with a pure albino and get babies the babies are now tangerein 100%het for albino. if you take the siblings and breed the together then you WILL get tangerine albinos no bones about it. its a fact not a chance. tangereins a line bred or co-dominant trait depending on what you wanna call it. to me no matter what you say i cant see the diff and theyre the same but its open for debate. i think the urban geckos website shows how they came up with sunglows. if not ill paste how they did it in here. lori sent me an email explaining it.

Actually, you can take a "pure" tangerine and breed it to a "pure" albino and get completely normal looking babies. Trust me, I've done it on numerous occasions This of course means that it is not a fact that if you breed the siblings together you will always get tangerine albinos.

Tangerine is a line bred trait, not co-dominant. They are not the same. A co-dominant trait is a gene that causes the homozygous form to look different than the wild-type and the heterozygous form to have traits of both (thanks NERD). An example of a co dominant trait is the Mack Snow. It is a visible het for the super snow. The Ray Hine line of Hypos is also (IMHO) a co dominant trait. It has nothing to do with tangerine however, because let me tell you, my first hypo carrot tails were pale yellow. It took several years of crossing the carrot tails into line bred tangs to get them as orange as they are these days.

 

[The NY Gecko]

i gotta stop trying to figure out genetics and just screw around with them, all im getting is a headache.

 

[KelliH]

i gotta stop trying to figure out genetics and just screw around with them, all im getting is a headache.

Give me a call sometime, I'll explain it all to you. I like talking genetics!

 

[The NY Gecko]

ny to texas is a mighty long distance call kell, thanks for your offer though. i guess im gunna really have some issues when i try to start my sunglow project. i cant even get the danged tangerine albino genetics right. ive spent the last like 3 hours looking for a gecko and i think i got one. dan lubinsky has one i think im going to buy. its his tornado line.

 

[A_Kendergirl]

OI, I hate the "tornado" lines stuff. It's such a shameless marketing ploy.

Good luck with getting that new gecko (tornado or not, heehee).

Here's a way to think of line breed traits...

When you are breeding a line breed trait your results are *mostly* unpredictable. You will get a lucky few that look better than the parents, and an unlucky few that will be the opposite of what you want (normals)...most will fall somewhere inbetween. You can improve your changes of good looking offspring by breeding two geckos with similar traits. By that I mean, you have a much stronger chance of making a nice SHTCTB if you breed SHTCTB x SHTCTB than you would SHTCTB x normal. It's kinda the point of holdbacks...you keep the best results for yourself to improve your lines even more the next season.

So, what Kelli was saying, while it's true the offspring will be 100% het (meaning NO QUESTION that they carry 1 gene), it's not necessarily true that the offspring will be tang. Some (if you're lucky) will be nice and tang, and others will be totally normal looking.

Oh, and spend the $10.00 to call Kelli for awhile...it will be well worth your money! (Get a pre-paid phone card if you must)

 

[KelliH]

ny to texas is a mighty long distance call kell, thanks for your offer though. i guess im gunna really have some issues when i try to start my sunglow project. i cant even get the danged tangerine albino genetics right. ive spent the last like 3 hours looking for a gecko and i think i got one. dan lubinsky has one i think im going to buy. its his tornado line.

Feel free to email me your number and I will gladly call you. My long distance is free, thank goodness!