Bobby Douglass
Active member
A copy of the check is useless. The signature from recieving the check would be nice though.
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Star Reptiles(bad Guys)
- Thread starter godsmack000
- Start date
Zoo_Dad
New member
Bobby Douglass states:
Not necessarily so, although it's possible to submit a fraudulent document, it's rather unlikely. If an individual were of a mindset to potentially defraud a customer, it's highly doubtful that they would write a fraudulent check, request or pay for use of a scanner from another party or local Kinko's, copy and post to satisfy this group, and then destroy said bogus check. Possible? Sure, but doubtful! This also implies that just because Star Reptiles was accused, they must now somehow prove innocence. Wrong answer!
The burden of proof is upon the accuser, NOT the accused. Most of us still subscribe to the tenets and S.O.P. utilized in USA courts. As previously stated, "innocent UNTIL PROVEN guilty!" I do however agree that Ms. Hetland should indeed show evidence of a refund or her handling of this transaction, but ONLY after some proof of impropriety is shown by her accuser! Then it's imperative, in order to refute the erroneous allegations & more importantly, to defend and uphold her otherwise untarnished & respectable reputation. 
Not necessarily so, although it's possible to submit a fraudulent document, it's rather unlikely. If an individual were of a mindset to potentially defraud a customer, it's highly doubtful that they would write a fraudulent check, request or pay for use of a scanner from another party or local Kinko's, copy and post to satisfy this group, and then destroy said bogus check. Possible? Sure, but doubtful! This also implies that just because Star Reptiles was accused, they must now somehow prove innocence. Wrong answer!
The burden of proof is upon the accuser, NOT the accused. Most of us still subscribe to the tenets and S.O.P. utilized in USA courts. As previously stated, "innocent UNTIL PROVEN guilty!" I do however agree that Ms. Hetland should indeed show evidence of a refund or her handling of this transaction, but ONLY after some proof of impropriety is shown by her accuser! Then it's imperative, in order to refute the erroneous allegations & more importantly, to defend and uphold her otherwise untarnished & respectable reputation. godsmack000
New member
the refund check
Well then that is for her to do. I have never seen a refund check or signed one from her. The reason why she is a bad guy is because she got the money, all of my e-mails, phone calls from us to her about this matter ( in which she hung up on us several times and was not willing to discuss the matter), and we never got the product in this case the bearded dragon or a full refund for our money that we sent.
Well then that is for her to do. I have never seen a refund check or signed one from her. The reason why she is a bad guy is because she got the money, all of my e-mails, phone calls from us to her about this matter ( in which she hung up on us several times and was not willing to discuss the matter), and we never got the product in this case the bearded dragon or a full refund for our money that we sent.
godsmack000
New member
star reptiles
well I would like to know, has anyone ever heard of star reptiles because I never have until this deal which went bad.
well I would like to know, has anyone ever heard of star reptiles because I never have until this deal which went bad.
Bobby Douglass
Active member
Sorry, but if the check was never written then this would be an extremely easy way out. It's not doubtful at all that someone would do this.
It doesn't imply anything of the sort. I tend to believe her, but if she chooses to show proof then the signature reciept is the closest thing to it. The copy of the check will prove nothing.
Zoo_Dad
New member
Bobby Douglass:
I respectfully disagree. Unlike godsmack000's unproven allegations thus far, in a thread now pushing 10 pages, Star Reptiles, who are yet innocent of any wrong doing on this or any other forum, could simply show a copy of the check to this board forum as a good faith effort! (Since they are still innocent victims of a verbal accusation at this juncture!) To say that it's likely for an individual to cover their
by writing a bogus check solely to satisfy this group is presupposing guilt rather than innocence! In a court of law, you're certainly correct that a copy of a check wouldn't indicate proof of anything, but this board is far from a legal venue! You say the implication isn't to disbelieve Star Reptiles, yet you don't ask for substantiating proof of this young man's-(godsmack000) allegations, however, you quickly ask that Star Reptiles post a signed receipt for the refund check. 
Just seems a bit inappropriate IMHO. Burden of proof is on the accuser, not the business which has been on the Internet for at least 4 years, and has yet to receive any negative feedback or accusations. That's until this young man, who incidentally is banned from the Reptibid forums for impropriety, who has an ax to grind, comes here and makes his yet unfounded allegations and impugns an otherwise untarnished business person's reputation. As I stated earlier, he needs to provide proof or apologize and go away!
godsmack000:
Seems quite simple, with respect to proof of criminal impropriety in this or any deal for anyone who's ever been wronged.....put up evidence, file a claim to be made whole or shut up & go away!
I respectfully disagree. Unlike godsmack000's unproven allegations thus far, in a thread now pushing 10 pages, Star Reptiles, who are yet innocent of any wrong doing on this or any other forum, could simply show a copy of the check to this board forum as a good faith effort! (Since they are still innocent victims of a verbal accusation at this juncture!) To say that it's likely for an individual to cover their
by writing a bogus check solely to satisfy this group is presupposing guilt rather than innocence! In a court of law, you're certainly correct that a copy of a check wouldn't indicate proof of anything, but this board is far from a legal venue! You say the implication isn't to disbelieve Star Reptiles, yet you don't ask for substantiating proof of this young man's-(godsmack000) allegations, however, you quickly ask that Star Reptiles post a signed receipt for the refund check. Just seems a bit inappropriate IMHO. Burden of proof is on the accuser, not the business which has been on the Internet for at least 4 years, and has yet to receive any negative feedback or accusations. That's until this young man, who incidentally is banned from the Reptibid forums for impropriety, who has an ax to grind, comes here and makes his yet unfounded allegations and impugns an otherwise untarnished business person's reputation. As I stated earlier, he needs to provide proof or apologize and go away! godsmack000:
Sure have. Here is Star Reptile's site, which I previously linked. Now, since the burden of proof is yours, where's all of the e-mails with the header information? I personally see nothing here as yet. On page 7 of this thread, posted on 4/22/04, godsmack000 states:
The two week time frame in which you threatened to litigate is now coming up tomorrow....how's that working for you?
Seems quite simple, with respect to proof of criminal impropriety in this or any deal for anyone who's ever been wronged.....put up evidence, file a claim to be made whole or shut up & go away!
Pennebaker
New member
Star reptiles also stated that the check was never cashed--therefore, godsmack has not been refunded (the money is still in Star reptiles' bank). Perhaps the check went to the wrong address? Since the check was never cashed, I would think that something could be done here for godsmack to get his refund.
Dana
Dana
godsmack000
New member
File for fraud
I already filed with reptibid fraud against sarah hetland. So far I haven't heard from them but it hasn't been very long since I filed that.
I already filed with reptibid fraud against sarah hetland. So far I haven't heard from them but it hasn't been very long since I filed that.
godsmack000
New member
The supposively banning
I have NOT been banned from anysite. I am not banned from reptiforms, reptibid, reptimart, ks, this site, herptrader or any other site. Sarah might have said I was but I am not.
ZOO_DAD:
If she did say I was banned why believe her about that and not me about anything else. You should ask me or her for proof of that before you say anything. Get your facts straight. You seem to not believe me about many things yet you beleive her just because she says something. You know it wouldn't surprise me if you knew her personally.
I have NOT been banned from anysite. I am not banned from reptiforms, reptibid, reptimart, ks, this site, herptrader or any other site. Sarah might have said I was but I am not.
ZOO_DAD:
If she did say I was banned why believe her about that and not me about anything else. You should ask me or her for proof of that before you say anything. Get your facts straight. You seem to not believe me about many things yet you beleive her just because she says something. You know it wouldn't surprise me if you knew her personally.
godsmack000
New member
peace
I have no problems with anyone so please stop telling me I have to do anything for you people you tell me show proof. What for to prove she bad I only say this becuase she called me a bad person. For what I did nothing is all I did was send her money asked for my lizard got nothing and is all I want is my money back. So please stop your little comments the only reason you don't believe me is cause im not 30 or older if I was you people would be on my side. What wisdom do you have through everything we have been through has any one yet learned to that you should not make a judgement by looks or age or intelligence so think what you want, one way or another I'm going to get my money back those who have not made judgements against me because of my age I thank you. Oh and if star reptiles or Ms. Hetland was a nice person they would have done sent me a refund and i would tell everyone that in my opinion I had problems and don't want to deal with her after this. You can and good luck with her. but if I dont get my money back I forgive her and hope God does too and doesn't send her to dante's inferno for stealing.
I have no problems with anyone so please stop telling me I have to do anything for you people you tell me show proof. What for to prove she bad I only say this becuase she called me a bad person. For what I did nothing is all I did was send her money asked for my lizard got nothing and is all I want is my money back. So please stop your little comments the only reason you don't believe me is cause im not 30 or older if I was you people would be on my side. What wisdom do you have through everything we have been through has any one yet learned to that you should not make a judgement by looks or age or intelligence so think what you want, one way or another I'm going to get my money back those who have not made judgements against me because of my age I thank you. Oh and if star reptiles or Ms. Hetland was a nice person they would have done sent me a refund and i would tell everyone that in my opinion I had problems and don't want to deal with her after this. You can and good luck with her. but if I dont get my money back I forgive her and hope God does too and doesn't send her to dante's inferno for stealing.
Zoo_Dad
New member
"Texas Twit" aka godsmack000 states:
Perhaps you don't actually read the contents of the thread in which you make your infantile accusations, but I've provided the linked ReptiForum thread wherein the administrator of ReptiBid forums states the following, and I quote:
I don't know you, nor do I personally know Sarah Hetland of Star Reptiles. I was interested in a snake she posted on Redtailboa.net and sent a query about said snake while doing a check on this board for any information. That's when I became aware of this post. I have since chosen to await the outcome of this debacle, and to rely upon my own senses based on phone conversations with Ms. Hetland, to make my personal choice whether or not to purchase an animal from Ms. Hetland & Star Reptiles.
As for whether you want to engage me in a confrontation, believe me young twit when I tell you that you don't! Before engaging someone of my intellect in a battle of wits, you need to arrive adequately armed!
Perhaps you don't actually read the contents of the thread in which you make your infantile accusations, but I've provided the linked ReptiForum thread wherein the administrator of ReptiBid forums states the following, and I quote:
I don't know you, nor do I personally know Sarah Hetland of Star Reptiles. I was interested in a snake she posted on Redtailboa.net and sent a query about said snake while doing a check on this board for any information. That's when I became aware of this post. I have since chosen to await the outcome of this debacle, and to rely upon my own senses based on phone conversations with Ms. Hetland, to make my personal choice whether or not to purchase an animal from Ms. Hetland & Star Reptiles.
As for whether you want to engage me in a confrontation, believe me young twit when I tell you that you don't! Before engaging someone of my intellect in a battle of wits, you need to arrive adequately armed!
Bobby Douglass
Active member
Jeff, I believe you may be missing something here...
I'll try this again. I BELIEVE THE SELLER. If SHE chooses to prove that she sent a refund check I believe the signature to be better proof than a copy of a check. I'm NOT asking or suggesting that she needs to do either one.
This has been verified by the seller. So would that count as the best form of proof to support their claim?
So it's okay for you to mention it to her, but not anybody else. I understand I guess.
I been a member of the BOI for a long time. I assure you it wouldn't be unusual.
The only proof that means anything to me from them is that they sent the money. None of the other stuff matters since the seller already said she sent a refund check.
Also inappropriate is this untrue allegation toward me.
Just to be fair, do you have proof of this?
I'll try this again. I BELIEVE THE SELLER. If SHE chooses to prove that she sent a refund check I believe the signature to be better proof than a copy of a check. I'm NOT asking or suggesting that she needs to do either one.
Zoo_Dad
New member
jim0602
New member
really starting to look like she is the bad person as stated.she has admitted to taking his money and she has admitted to not shipping the product.she claims to have made a refund but admits it has not been cashed.she's not willing to send him another refund.i was believing her at first but now don't think she has ever refunded it.it dosen't really matter the age of this buyer.he paid for the product.so jeff since he is a kid and was banned from reptibid for beign a kid and not for taking someones money it looks like your saying she has the right to just rip him off ??he has gone well beyond what was needed for proving his case.he has provided un-disputabel proof that he paid and she did not ship.why is it that you ask for more and more proof from him but are believing her 100% ??? she sends him a money order like he paid with and not a personal check and this is all over with.if and i do now say if she sent him a check then it looks like he never received it.she wants to cry over a 15 or 20 dollar stop payment fee from her bank on the check she clains to have already written.it looks like to me it would be a far smaller loss than she is going to suffer if she preferes to not take care of this.zoo dad has already put a purchase on hold and how many others will do the same ?
jim burns
jim burns
Zoo_Dad
New member
Jim Burns states:
So if Star Reptiles did send a refund as Ms. Hetland claims, and this family of folks with, shall we say questionable tactics-(i.e.-use of numerous user names, involvement with a trio consisting of father and two sons, banned from participation on another herp site for impropriety, etc.) haven't cashed said check, this automatically equates to a "bad person" title for Star Reptiles before all the facts are in?
Patience, persistence, and clever tactics will ultimately prevail and the truth will be discovered. Although this forum is widely known many times for it's gang mentality "witch hunt" assaults, with a total lack of objectivity, it can and does work properly if ALL facts are allowed to be heard and patience is observed. The old adage about giving a person enough rope is a fitting analogy. I personally prefer not to rush to judgment, despite my overwhelming "sixth sense" gut feelings, until I can back my feelings with some factual proof! "He said"..."she said"...isn't adequate!
I assure you that is not the case. There is a definite method to my madness, if you will allow me some latitude. Don't assume, as it....well, you know the rest! Have I once stated unequivocally that I believe 100% of Star Reptiles' claims? I realize that I'm a virtual newbie to this forum, however, I am far from a newbie at the use of intelligent resourceful tactics to uncover the truth! I have had quite the opposite take on this transaction from the beginning. Presumably, 180 degrees from what many here have inferred! Keep in mind that I have had the privilege of additionally speaking, one on one, with one of the integral individuals involved here! If I thought I could resolve the situation by jumping to hasty conclusions, prior to uncovering the maximum available facts, I would quite possibly be posting my own disappointing post for a deal gone awry. I'm trying to weigh the evidence, do some research, and invoke a "benefit of doubt" mentality before finalizing a decision. In my middle age, I'm learning to employ the art of tactful patience as a wise means to an end! I can say with 100% candor, I've not chosen a "side" or placed my belief in one individual involved in this transaction. Those who may infer otherwise, may find in the end, we were likely on the same page throughout the journey!
(I'm brighter than it often appears!
..."Conceited, party of one; your table is ready!" 
So if Star Reptiles did send a refund as Ms. Hetland claims, and this family of folks with, shall we say questionable tactics-(i.e.-use of numerous user names, involvement with a trio consisting of father and two sons, banned from participation on another herp site for impropriety, etc.) haven't cashed said check, this automatically equates to a "bad person" title for Star Reptiles before all the facts are in?
Patience, persistence, and clever tactics will ultimately prevail and the truth will be discovered. Although this forum is widely known many times for it's gang mentality "witch hunt" assaults, with a total lack of objectivity, it can and does work properly if ALL facts are allowed to be heard and patience is observed. The old adage about giving a person enough rope is a fitting analogy. I personally prefer not to rush to judgment, despite my overwhelming "sixth sense" gut feelings, until I can back my feelings with some factual proof! "He said"..."she said"...isn't adequate!
I assure you that is not the case. There is a definite method to my madness, if you will allow me some latitude. Don't assume, as it....well, you know the rest!
Have I once stated unequivocally that I believe 100% of Star Reptiles' claims? I realize that I'm a virtual newbie to this forum, however, I am far from a newbie at the use of intelligent resourceful tactics to uncover the truth! I have had quite the opposite take on this transaction from the beginning. Presumably, 180 degrees from what many here have inferred! Keep in mind that I have had the privilege of additionally speaking, one on one, with one of the integral individuals involved here! If I thought I could resolve the situation by jumping to hasty conclusions, prior to uncovering the maximum available facts, I would quite possibly be posting my own disappointing post for a deal gone awry. I'm trying to weigh the evidence, do some research, and invoke a "benefit of doubt" mentality before finalizing a decision. In my middle age, I'm learning to employ the art of tactful patience as a wise means to an end! I can say with 100% candor, I've not chosen a "side" or placed my belief in one individual involved in this transaction. Those who may infer otherwise, may find in the end, we were likely on the same page throughout the journey! (I'm brighter than it often appears!
..."Conceited, party of one; your table is ready!" 
HerpVenue
New member
Okay if she posts a check..... it is okay.
If he posts a copy and paste of e-mail it is not okay.
She goes on reptibid and starts accusing him of things without proof.......it is okay
he comes here and starts accusing her of things "without proof"....and it is not okay.
do you see what I am getting at yet?
in your own words......you do not know neither of them. But yet you ask him for proof and don't ask her for none.
Then you say she did not accuse him of anything and he was the one that posted first. Funny thing is you seem to conviniently forget her posts on reptibid. You took her posts as gods word and never asked for proof.
kinda making me wonder what is really up
lets cover some facts.
he sent money.
she admits to getting money.
he has no animal
she admits to not sending the animal.
He has no refund.
she says she sent one.....but admits that it has not been casehd yet.
And now she wont resend the refund that probably got lost in the mail.
in other words she is going to hold on to money that DOES NOT belong to her.
boy my opinion of her just took a 180 degree turn.
thomas davis
New member
well
well jeff o'neil, my what a post,
first let me say time will tell in this one(thread) from what ive read this deal will work itself out, i see no "badguy" i see some miscomunication, and some attitudes, but i beleive it will work out also FTR i dont know or have delt with either parties concerned
it will be interesting to see how it does all come out, anyway keep us posted as to the outcome,,,,,
jeff i must say your post's are very entertaining reads
esp. w/the how SMRT you are and your sig. and all th cool lil smileys! i must say very entertaining,,,,,,,,peace
thomas davis
well jeff o'neil, my what a post,
first let me say time will tell in this one(thread) from what ive read this deal will work itself out, i see no "badguy" i see some miscomunication, and some attitudes, but i beleive it will work out also FTR i dont know or have delt with either parties concerned
it will be interesting to see how it does all come out, anyway keep us posted as to the outcome,,,,,
jeff i must say your post's are very entertaining reads
esp. w/the how SMRT you are and your sig. and all th cool lil smileys! i must say very entertaining,,,,,,,,peace
thomas davis
Zoo_Dad
New member
Thanks Thomas! FYI, my name is actually spelled O'Neill.
For other respondent(s) to whom it may be applicable:
A mind is a terrible thing to waste! :laugh:
My point is apparently lost on some of the intellectually challenged here, so I'll get back to work and refrain from expanding on what would obviously fall short of being properly understood.
"Don't hate! Pontificate, altercate, ventilate, confabulate, orate, deliberate, negotiate, dissertate, or even litigate, but don't hate!" Moi
(Magnificent Omniscient Individual or me!)
For other respondent(s) to whom it may be applicable:
A mind is a terrible thing to waste! :laugh:
My point is apparently lost on some of the intellectually challenged here, so I'll get back to work and refrain from expanding on what would obviously fall short of being properly understood.
"Don't hate! Pontificate, altercate, ventilate, confabulate, orate, deliberate, negotiate, dissertate, or even litigate, but don't hate!" Moi
(Magnificent Omniscient Individual or me!)
thomas davis
New member
far-out
wow,,,far-out,,,moi,groovy man! sorry 'bout the misspelling
peace
thomas davis
wow,,,far-out,,,moi,groovy man! sorry 'bout the misspelling
peace
thomas davis
SpindleHead
New member
Zoo_dad,
You seem to be to want to only believe the seller...you say you haven't made a decision on who is wrong yet you ONLY ask for proof from Godsmack...Perhaps you should rethink that whole "innocent until proven guilty" philosophy. You very obviously think he's lying...every post you have left has been a backhanded accusation against the buyer. You don't know for a fact that he is lying about the refund check and the only person who can confirm that it actually got to the buyer is Ms. Hetland. So post your proof Ms. Hetland. She has already admitted to receiving his money and not shipping the beardie.
Post the SIGNED receipt showing he or his dad actually got the refund and you will be vindicated. Don't and you shouldn't be surprised if your business suffers.
Why is it so difficult to understand that making enemies of your buyers is NOT a good idea. I understand that you can't please everyone but why drag out situations like this one when you could make it all go away by making SURE they got their refund. Cancel the first refund check and send a new one. Confirm with the buyer or if you feel more comfortable with his Dad that you have the correct address and get a copy of the signed delivery receipt. Simple, NO?
And while I do feel that there are a number of people who will make assumptions and personally attack others in any given thread I feel that the BOI is overall a very useful tool.
Chris Marston
You seem to be to want to only believe the seller...you say you haven't made a decision on who is wrong yet you ONLY ask for proof from Godsmack...Perhaps you should rethink that whole "innocent until proven guilty" philosophy. You very obviously think he's lying...every post you have left has been a backhanded accusation against the buyer. You don't know for a fact that he is lying about the refund check and the only person who can confirm that it actually got to the buyer is Ms. Hetland. So post your proof Ms. Hetland. She has already admitted to receiving his money and not shipping the beardie.
Post the SIGNED receipt showing he or his dad actually got the refund and you will be vindicated. Don't and you shouldn't be surprised if your business suffers.
Why is it so difficult to understand that making enemies of your buyers is NOT a good idea. I understand that you can't please everyone but why drag out situations like this one when you could make it all go away by making SURE they got their refund. Cancel the first refund check and send a new one. Confirm with the buyer or if you feel more comfortable with his Dad that you have the correct address and get a copy of the signed delivery receipt. Simple, NO?
And while I do feel that there are a number of people who will make assumptions and personally attack others in any given thread I feel that the BOI is overall a very useful tool.
Chris Marston