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Good Guy The Veiled Chameleon (Steve)

ucal

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Greetings. I just wanted to comment on my very good experience with Steve at theveiledchameleon.com. I picked up a group of U. phantasticus and a Fantasy Frog and they all came promptly, in good health, and condition. Steve was very open to my constant questions, etc. and the prices were very competitive. Needless to say, I was very happy with the purchase. I understand they are including other animals besides their specialties of veiled chameleons. I would not hesitate to purchase more animals from him in the future. Thanks for listening and thanks to the members of this board for all their info/insights/experiences.
 
Veiled Chameleon-where are you?

Anyone know what's going on w/ Veiled Chameleon? I know these guys have a great reputation, this is NOT a complaint or bad guy report, I just can't get ahold of them. I ,too, bought a U. phantasticus from this last group, Steve confirmed payment was recieved but it was too cold to ship. Steve and I agreed to watch the weather and pick an appropriate day. A couple Mondays were acceptable, so I emailed a request and heard nothing back. I've been calling their number daily, left messages, and several emails just to find out how better to contact them for shipping. I'm in no hurry to ship and the animal's safety comes first, but where are they? Any thoughts?
 
Looks like someone got lucky. Good for you.

Anyone know what's going on w/ Veiled Chameleon? I know these guys have a great reputation, this is NOT a complaint or bad guy report, I just can't get ahold of them.

If you are talking about Steve and Karin they DO NOT have a good rep. They have many posts on here. It is normal for them to stop contact when something goes wrong.
 
Me again. Whoa! I heard about the 'great reputation' from some local breeders who've bought from them. Should've checked here. Apparently they've scammed others in the same manner. If I never see this animal, I'll consider it my own fault for not checking thoroughly. Live and learn.
 
Me again. Whoa! I heard about the 'great reputation' from some local breeders who've bought from them. Should've checked here. Apparently they've scammed others in the same manner. If I never see this animal, I'll consider it my own fault for not checking thoroughly. Live and learn.


It happens not your fault. Its the fault of these known scammers and poor excuse for reptile breeders / flippers what ever you want to call them.
 
Only the one experience

I am sorry to hear about others not getting the type of service I received and you deserved. This was my ONLY experience with them, but they were responsive after the animals were received. Please continue to add your comments and if there enough negative experiences (with evidence of course), I will ask the admin to remove this positive review/thread. I don't want anyone else to take this review and end up having a poor experience. Although, in their defense, MY single experience was positive.

Greetings. I just wanted to comment on my very good experience with Steve at theveiledchameleon.com. I picked up a group of U. phantasticus and a Fantasy Frog and they all came promptly, in good health, and condition. Steve was very open to my constant questions, etc. and the prices were very competitive. Needless to say, I was very happy with the purchase. I understand they are including other animals besides their specialties of veiled chameleons. I would not hesitate to purchase more animals from him in the future. Thanks for listening and thanks to the members of this board for all their info/insights/experiences.
 
I am sorry to hear about others not getting the type of service I received and you deserved. This was my ONLY experience with them, but they were responsive after the animals were received. Please continue to add your comments and if there enough negative experiences (with evidence of course), I will ask the admin to remove this positive review/thread. I don't want anyone else to take this review and end up having a poor experience. Although, in their defense, MY single experience was positive.


You won't be able to remove the thread.

This is their M.O.
It seems to happen. The ones who get their animals are happy as long as they don't die in the following days after receiving them. As soon as their is a problem they disappear. Steve isn't available and Karin plays dumb or disappears as well. Sometimes if a big enough stink is made they will finally attempt to resolve the issue.

They count on the ones who are not as vigilant as others.
 
They did the same thing with me a few weeks ago. I paid through paypal though and I was able to file a claim and get my money back. These people made a typo and lead me to believe they had already shipped (a Pink Belly Sideneck Turtle) and that the package was possibly lost. I will not be recommending them to anyone. If anyone else was lucky enough to pay through paypal, file a claim. Paypal will rule in your favor because they have no proof the item was delivered.
 
If you have a good experience with them, consider yourself...lucky. It took a call from a Judge Judy producer to get them to give me a new snake after they shipped the first snake poorly and it died.
 
Clarification- One Good Experience with Veiled Chameleon (Steve)

I just wanted to clarify the facts- I had one very good experience purchasing a group of fairly expensive animals from Steve at the Veiled Chameleon. I CANNOT vouch for others and perhaps I was lucky, but simply put I had one good experience and have not purchased from them since (because I have not found anything I would want to buy). I am not taking one side or the other, but just stating the facts. If I was lucky and this was a one time good thing then I will just count my blessings. Perhaps if the forum could install some sort of rating system like Amazon (with the stars) that may be better but I am not an IT person so I don't know how hard that would be. As a scientist, I believe a rating system would even out and provide an average rating in addition to the detailed specifics of the transaction. It would provide a large sample size with an average rating score. Just a thought.
Thanks for listening. I would hate for my info to be taken out of context and/or used to hurt anyone in the future.
 
I read that their paypal acct had been locked by paypal. It was posted in one of the many bad guy threads on these two. They have a new name and will turn up again Im sure. Really sad these two cant get their act together. They have some contacts because they get some outstanding animals at times. I was tempted by some parsons they were selling. But no matter how good the animals look. Your rolling the dice you'll ever see the stuff you paid for...
 
As an example: let's say you buy a gun and it works great for you. But over 20 other people who bought the same gun end up having it backfire on them either maiming or killing them....just cause it worked for you do you keep using it?

When you see dozens of Bad Guy reviews on these people ita pretty clear to me that the fraction of good ones got lucky and it's not worth trying them again. Why not instead support the Good Guys. No price is worth the risk of getting screwed and knowing fully how bad these people are. If I was a member here before I decided to purchase from them, I never would have after reading the endless complaints about them. No stars needed, I rather read the actual accounts of people getting scammed. Ratings systems are easily abused. However it's much harder to abuse having to post real names and evidence of problems with them.
 
I am sorry for posting again

I HATE having to continue to write this thread BUT since I started it I feel the need to clarify. FIRST of all a the problem I notice with the BOI as it stands, in my opinion, is having to weed through all the posts that have a lot of feelings and lack direct evidence (example- a thread I went through that was 27 pages long and had about 2 paragraphs of actual information). Also, I find MOST people do no take the time to carefully read each post to the end before posting themselves or just read the first and last pages. That said, I agree with you that if 20 people have a terrible experience and one person has a good one that does not make give you, in this case, the buyer a strong statistical chance you will have a positive transaction. Rather, I think it is up to the buyer to decide with the evidence. However, as it is currently set up it is very difficult to see the 20 negatives and one positive without having to weed through tons of extra opinions that may be on or off topic. As I said in my previous post, it would be good to have BOTH a quick rating system AND the opinions/stories/etc. This way IF you are a seller or buyer that wants to change their ways they can do it one person/transaction at a time until it statistically ends up in his/her favor. The problem with only having opinion posting is that you sometimes get a "mob mentality" and people pile on leaving you with only a negative feeling rather than a clear picture of exactly how many individual transactions were negative versus how many were positive including seeing a clear pattern and trend. I want to say again that I do not know how hard this would be as I don't want to give the site more work, but I would NEVER keep from posting a positive experience that I actually had just because others had a poor one. That does not make sense. Let the facts stand and hopefully it can be presented in both an easy one snap shot way AND with all the anecdotes. I do not direct this to anyone in particular and I am sorry if I am coming off insulting/arrogant. I just have a lot of experience with anecdotal versus hard evidence and I find a place for both as long as they are in context and both present. Thanks for listening and I apologize for taking the sites memory with my thread. I did not mean for it to be so long and just wanted to give my opinion/evidence and add it to the pool.


As an example: let's say you buy a gun and it works great for you. But over 20 other people who bought the same gun end up having it backfire on them either maiming or killing them....just cause it worked for you do you keep using it?

When you see dozens of Bad Guy reviews on these people ita pretty clear to me that the fraction of good ones got lucky and it's not worth trying them again. Why not instead support the Good Guys. No price is worth the risk of getting screwed and knowing fully how bad these people are. If I was a member here before I decided to purchase from them, I never would have after reading the endless complaints about them. No stars needed, I rather read the actual accounts of people getting scammed. Ratings systems are easily abused. However it's much harder to abuse having to post real names and evidence of problems with them.
 
I completely understand your spin on it, except one point...How do you know MOST people who read these threads don't read the whole thing? I find a majority of people on BOI WANT to be informed, the best way to be, is to read. I see a lot of first posts where people say "so and so screwed me" and the next dozen posts are members asking for EVIDENCE. Not just believing what is said. They want to see pictures of the sick/dead animals, emails, proof of payment, etc. I see very well informed smart members. Sure, there are members who don't read the entire thing, I am very sure there are, but to lump the membership who doesn't read the entire thread as "most" is hardly fair or true. Not without the evidence to back this up. I see the exact opposite of what you do. I see admin, mods, and members pushing for more info, more things to read, more evidence.

Ratings systems are very easily jacked up. If you can change your IP, you can rate something as much as you like. You can make as many accounts as you like so long as you have all the emails you need and just make fake names. You can go to the library, a friend's house, any place with free wi-fi and rate again and again. Where as if you FORCE people to sit down and take a long time typing out their story, explanations, evidence, etc, that is not so easily faked. Especially since with every account here, the person they are either praising or attacking can then rebuttal or thank. With a rating system, this is anonymous, I can give someone a 1 star or thumbs down and give NO explanation as to why, they don't know who gave it, and they have no chance to rebuttal it.

Good example: I know of a local computer business who has been sued several times, its public knowledge how bad they are. They have stolen computers and internal hardware and given back the customers completely different computers, often of down-grading it...And yet, for the past 6 years, they have been voted #1 in the county. How? Well, to vote, you simply need the newspaper with the ballot, check off their name and send it in...no means of identifying who voted. Get enough newspapers and the #1 vote is a shoe-in.

And technically we DO have a ratings system...You're either a Good Guy or Bad Guy. And the only way to rate someone good or bad is to post your experience. Which is what counts far more than "Good/Bad". I have seen several posts here where a member rated a seller a Bad Guy and what I read was far from it. Now if we had the rating system only or if I was one of the "most" who don't read, then I would have taken that as scripture that he was bad. When all I read was the member was very impatient and wanted the animal sent during a blizzard. I still don't believe most the membership here don't read the posts.
 
Im not piling on the OP. But I can say I read 99% of the posts on the threads Im interested in. I will say I skip over some of the posts that are obviously just people piling on someone. But if its part of the explanation by the seller or buyer or another member with expereience dealing with the said bad guy. I read those throughly.

That said you really dont have a leg to stand on regarding these two. If you had read ANY of their bad guy threads you'd have prob steered clear of them. Like I said earlier in this thread. I wish they'd get their act together because they bring in some rare outstanding lizards and frogs at times. I have been very tempted. But like the old saying goes. "You knew it was a snake before you picked it up!" Now your whining about getting bit. I know their snakes and so I cant do business with them. Plain and simple. ;)
 
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