Tom Crutchfield - dba Herps Ltd

[Ed Clark]

Marc, Just to clear something up, Tom Crutchfield is a consultant/employee of Herps Ltd.

 

[Cephaloid]

In light of some of the replies to my initial post and in the absence of any firm evidence to the contrary, I suppose it is only fair to let Tom Crutchfield continue to prove that he has mended his ways. I didn't realize that he had fulfilled the terms of his probation. Five years is a significant period of time; enough, I should think, to at least lay the foundation for an honest life.

In my own short life, I've witnessed quite a few profound personal transformations. I believe people can change if they want to and work towards it. I hope Mr. Crutchfield doesn't disappoint us in the future.

 

[lanceheads]

Marc,
That was a very nice post.
Opposite of John Apple's negatives towards Tom.
I hope/believe Tom will continue to contribute to herpetoculture and advance it as we know it.

Randal Berry

 

[EricIvins]

You'd be surprised how many people still operating in the Reptile/live animal business have similair charges/convictions/violations against them. It seems to come with the territory when you import/export/sell/broker/breed/move alot of animals, although alot of allegations are BS ( Especially from uneducated people ). Look at what happened to Don Hamper; Unfortunately thier are too many laws that contradict ( and confuse ) each other, and if you follow one correctly, you're usually breaking another. Especially those laws that no one knows about, but have been in effect for 40+ years and are only enforced when seen fit ( or seen as an easy victory for the DA )

 

[bcherps]

Whether or not Tom will run the straight and narrow from now on will ony come with time. However, no one can take away what he has given to the herpetological community for locality data on species, how many breeding colonies that have started from animals that came here through him, and the knowledge of keeping that he passed on years ago and still continues to if you bother to talk with him.

If you bothered to look around at any reptile show that has wholesalers you could count probably count ten that have been locked up for import violations. I for one am glad beardies, the first albino monocled cobra, and several tortoise, monitor, australian species got brought into the hobby even if it was by below table practices.

I, for one, have never gotten a bad animal from Tom or the people that he sells with. I bought mainly boas so it was pretty simple. I have gotten a few ETB's and never had issues with them(which are far more likely to have issues). However, I have the knowledge, vet support, and setup to deal with imported animals. If you are going to buy imports, newly described species, delicate species, or new mutations you need to be prepared to deal with thier special needs.


To whoever said "all my boas died", why? did you get a necropsy? what treatments were completed? or attempted?, what local were they? what time of the year were they brought in? what was the size when they were brought in? what is your quarantine regime? Why did Tom supposedly threaten you? Did you deal with him curteously or immediately blow up and go on the attack when there was a problem? We need more info.


Is there a chance that you got bad boas, that could not have been saved by anyone?-YES, some batches of farmed boas have incredibly high % of losses.

However, Tom could not survive in this industry for DECADES if he only sold crap.

Thanks
ben cole

 

[kmurphy]

Look at what happened to Don Hamper; Unfortunately thier are too many laws that contradict ( and confuse ) each other, and if you follow one correctly, you're usually breaking another.

Eric, nothing at all against either Don, or Tom, but I would bet good money they knew exactly what they were doing when they broke the laws they did. It was sad to see either one of them go down but hopefully their issues are in the past and they can again be the value to the herp community that they once were.

 

[Cat_72]

The summer before last I bought some pastelish baby boas from Tom.
I paid , he shipped and one died two days later [he replaced it] and eventually all died. Now the packaging was less than better, box with some shredded newspaper and a snake bag in it with the snake in the bag.
I posted my experience in another thread here and I got some rather colorful calls from Tom at my house. Ya know threats about what he would do if he ever saw me, name calling ,,yadda yadda yadda. Looking forward to it
I remember when I was younger and I would go to his place in southeast Florida and was amazed at all the animals. Now I am amazed he still does some business.
Never again with me

Perhaps I'm a bit confused here, but between John's post, and Cathy's post showing a mislabeled animal offered for sale.....wouldn't the "average" Joe get a lot of flack for this kind of thing? Past convictions aside...I have no doubt he has made great contributions to the "industry", but does that negate the fact that he threatened another person for posting about a bad deal?

 

[EricIvins]

Kevin,




I'm sure most do, however what are you going to do about the Gray areas most animal laws have? They are subject to interpretation by the local governing authority so your view on it may be different and could be found in violation. Bottom line is that these laws are put on the books for one reason; To eventually ban Herpetology in the private sector ( mainly through fear and ignorance, but also personal agenda and ego )

 

[kmurphy]

Perhaps I'm a bit confused here, but between John's post, and Cathy's post showing a mislabeled animal offered for sale.....wouldn't the "average" Joe get a lot of flack for this kind of thing? Past convictions aside...I have no doubt he has made great contributions to the "industry", but does that negate the fact that he threatened another person for posting about a bad deal?

Cathy, I don't know Tom very well, I've only met him a few times prior to his conviction, but from the little I have seen, that's not his normal style. Others that know him better could very well show me to be wrong. A phone conversation that gets out of hand could be just that. I've said some pretty stupid things to my friends when I've been pissed at them. An hour later we've gone fishing or something. Believe me I'm not saying the John isn't describing what he feels is true but there's nothing more to go on than his post.

 

[sschind]

Kevin,




I'm sure most do, however what are you going to do about the Gray areas most animal laws have? They are subject to interpretation by the local governing authority so your view on it may be different and could be found in violation. Bottom line is that these laws are put on the books for one reason; To eventually ban Herpetology in the private sector ( mainly through fear and ignorance, but also personal agenda and ego )

I disagree. While some of the bans put in effect more recently may seem that way, and many may in fact be aimed at that goal, it would seem to me that the laws regarding the importing/smuggling of Fiji iguanas had nothing to do with keeping them out of the pet trade other than the fact that their limited numbers couldn't withstand the exploitation. Likewise, state bans on indiginous wildlife are generally enacted to prevent over exploitation and not specifically to keep reptiles in general from being kept as pets. If that were the case why wouldn't the states just come out and ban all reptiles. Many of these bans regarding the trade in native wildlife were in place long before reptiles became as popular as they have become. It is only because of the recent popularity have the laws been enforced to the degree that they have been. And that is only because the recent popularity has caused such laws to be broken at a higher rate. I do not know the specifics of the Hamper issue so my comments may not be appropriate for that particular case but for the most part, native wildlife laws are concerned with just that, native wildlife.

I never thought I would find myself coming to the defense of wildlife laws but to suggest that convictions for certain illegal activities were the result of gray areas when, as Kevin said, I'm pretty sure they knew what they were doing was breaking the law, doesn't make much sense.

As far as Kevins comments of "It was sad to see either one of them go down", I would have to reword it to "it was sad that either one of them felt they had to break the law"

 

[John Apple]

Yup nothing more to go on but my post, the only thing is I don't lie and have no reason to do so. Those are the facts it is as simple as that.
Ol Tommy called my house and made the threats and called me a few colorful adjectives. I don't take lightly to some chest thumping and yes I replied in kind to his words. It is as simple as that.
While a newbie might be in awe , most of us old timers know better.
Herp laws are there for a reason and what ever that reason might be [just or not] it is up to us to follow them so the lawmakers do not make adjustments.

 

[lanceheads]

John,

How long ago did your "bad" transaction with Tom take place.

If I recall, one boa died and Tom replaced it and he even paid the freight.
And he said he didn't hear anything about it until your post on the BOI.

Tom called me tonight about a completely different matter, and I mentioned this "revised" post about him and he responded that he would like to meet with you at Daytona or at his breeding facility in Ft. Lauderdale where you two could "discuss" your dis-pleasure with him. He didn't deny being angry with you, and said likeways, that you were threatening him also.
I would suggest you meet with him instead of bringing up the past everytime a new thread is started about him. That is getting old John. This is at least the second thread where you brought your "unhappy" dealings with him. I think Tom and you could work something out or at least agree to disagree.

Randal Berry
Berry's way or the Freeway

 

[John Apple]

OK Randall...first off I don't make threats at all, I respond to them accordingly.
Yup I would love to meet Tom again, probably doesn't remember me from his earlier days. I met him way back then through a friend of mine [Dale Marantz].
If this is getting old or what..?..duhhh....this is the BOI and these posts are what it is for.
When he called and was being colorful on the phone it pissed me off and I am sure I responded in kind. I don't take to threats and I look at them as a don't pee on my fence thing.
the Tarnsaction took place two summers ago.

 

[lanceheads]

John,
I just checked this.
Fair enough.
Tom said he remembered you, and the invitation still stands.
i.e., he would like to meet with you and discuss things.
I have never met you,so, I don't know what you look like. Tom told me your were a biker wannabe, and I just laughed. (whatever that means)
I do know what Tom looks like and his demeanor. I'd never mess with him! LOL!
Good luck and I hope you guy's work things out.

Randal

 

[critical bill]

So what youre saying is Tom actaully doesnt want to discuss anything but rather wants to kick John's ass. You kind of make it sound like you know what Tom looks like naked. Do you shave the guy down?

Good luck to you too....its sounds like you and Tom are a happy couple.

John,
I just checked this.
Fair enough.
Tom said he remembered you, and the invitation still stands.
i.e., he would like to meet with you and discuss things.
I have never met you,so, I don't know what you look like. Tom told me your were a biker wannabe, and I just laughed. (whatever that means)
I do know what Tom looks like and his demeanor. I'd never mess with him! LOL!
Good luck and I hope you guy's work things out.

Randal

 

[East_Coast]

?

So what youre saying is Tom actaully doesnt want to discuss anything but rather wants to kick John's ass. You kind of make it sound like you know what Tom looks like naked. Do you shave the guy down?

Good luck to you too....its sounds like you and Tom are a happy couple.

This is so ridiculous - yet so predictable.

 

[brucestephenson]

Hey Jolles, Just to fill you and everybody in: Critical Bill is a farmer who sits at his computer all day and makes fun of people. He made fun of Tom Crutchfield, then Tom tried calling Critical Bill a bunch of times, but Critical Bill was too chicken to pick up the phone. Chicken, chicken, chicken, chicken, chicken, chicken, chicken, chicken, chicken!

 

[John Apple]

Heh Heh Heh...biker wannabe....yeah that is me.
This is me ..5"8" and 210 lbs a few bug tattoos on the arms and back. Father of 6 kids and many theraphosids. Been in jail a few times in my younger and stupid days. Now I am an upstanding individual that can't stand a scammer and lier or a thumper.
Not worried about getting my ass kicked or afraid for that matter. I have met Tom before in my younger days and am not impressed by his stature. We will meet of that I am sure someday.
The simple fact is that the truth hurts

 

[East_Coast]

You guys ought to drop the whole violence bit. Who cares how big you are or if you can kick each other's butts?

I see a lot of bickering and fighting in here - and constantly. Funny that I have never seen any fights at any reptile shows.

Bunch of pansies.

 

[monkeywrench133]

You guys ought to drop the whole violence bit. Who cares how big you are or if you can kick each other's butts?

I see a lot of bickering and fighting in here - and constantly. Funny that I have never seen any fights at any reptile shows.

Bunch of pansies.