Bad Guy Ty park/ ty lizards FL

[Cletus Marley]

This place brings out the worse in people. It's sad.

 

[kerrek]

Thomas, I agree with almost 100% of what you posted, however, I think that the $3000 was more what Michelle wanted. I will post a little of what I am talking about from the post by Michelle of their conversation. I think Ty was going to send her a purple, but that is only my opinion. I think when Michelle said he could not be trusted, his raffle felt shady and scammy, she made a mistake. This is only my opinion, most disagree.

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Casey why do you put all the responsibility on the OP? In every one of your posts you say she should be nicer, she should just accept what Ty does, she should have just sent her address. She is the customer in this situation Ty is the "seller" Ty already raised all his money for the charity and then changed the prize. She had the winning ticket and has every right to ask where its coming from. Why are you not all over Ty for being petty and not just telling her what he was sending. If he had said I'm sending you and the other winners purples because that's all I produced this would be over he'd look like the hero he seems to think he is, and everybody's happy.

 

[caffeinecynic]

Casey why do you put all the responsibility on the OP? In every one of your posts you say she should be nicer, she should just accept what Ty does, she should have just sent her address. She is the customer in this situation Ty is the "seller" Ty already raised all his money for the charity and then changed the prize. She had the winning ticket and has every right to ask where its coming from. Why are you not all over Ty for being petty and not just telling her what he was sending. If he had said I'm sending you and the other winners purples because that's all I produced this would be over he'd look like the hero he seems to think he is, and everybody's happy.

At the very beginning of the thread, Casey did say that he thought Mr. Park handled this wrong. I don't think that he's necessarily putting all of the responsibility on Michelle so much as pointing out what he believes were her misteps - in essence, what I take from Casey's posts is that he is trying to play devil's advocate to point out that there's multiple sides to every story. In the end, while I do not agree with most of what he has said, I do think it's important to consider that what he says might very well be also what Mr. Park is thinking, and dismissing those thoughts isn't going to help Michelle get a resolution.

Bare minimum, I think it does show the kind of thinking on the other side of the fence, which is important to understand in trying to reach an agreement.

 

[tlmoon]

I side with Michelle on this issue, but I do respect the voices of others who post possible other interpretations, solutions, or viewpoints (well, except for the guy who thinks we are all racist for not agreeing with Ty!). I think the point of the BOI is for people to post in a venue for the whole herp community. So I would never tell someone not to post or want to stifle a dissenting opinion. But that doesn't mean I won't disagree....it's not easy to have a differing opinion from the majority of the group, but please remember not everyone who disagrees with you is attacking you for saying so. (using "you" in the generic sense)

So with that said, I'm surprised by the number of posts that imply or outright state that this situation is somehow Michelle's fault, caused by her behavior, or is incumbent upon her to fix. With very few (any?) exceptions, most posts do not dispute that Michelle won and should receive what she won. What's odd (to me) is the excuses that are made for Ty's actions and choices and the idea that Michelle is somehow to blame for...what? questioning Ty? Insisting on what she won? I just don't get it.

 

[kerrek]

At the very beginning of the thread, Casey did say that he thought Mr. Park handled this wrong. I don't think that he's necessarily putting all of the responsibility on Michelle so much as pointing out what he believes were her misteps - in essence, what I take from Casey's posts is that he is trying to play devil's advocate to point out that there's multiple sides to every story. In the end, while I do not agree with most of what he has said, I do think it's important to consider that what he says might very well be also what Mr. Park is thinking, and dismissing those thoughts isn't going to help Michelle get a resolution.

Bare minimum, I think it does show the kind of thinking on the other side of the fence, which is important to understand in trying to reach an agreement.

It's pretty obvious what TY was thinking by his own posts. I just don't understand why Casey seems to hold the OP to a different standard of behavior then he does TY. People don't usually go from excited and happy to get something to calling you or a situation scammy or shady unless something happened to make them uncomfortable. Just as the OP could have been easier on Ty, Ty could have been more understanding of her being uncomfortable with his decision to keep changing the prize. First it was a blue albino he produced or $3000 then it was a blue from an un-named source then it was a tegu from him that he was going to keep, but wait he said he didn't produce any like the one he said was up for raffle. So he said he didn't have any blue tegus , now all of the sudden he does have a tegu to send. And don't forget he told her he wasn't sending her a purple tegu because they were worth $5k so where did this mystery tegu come from well Ty's not saying. That seems awful shady to me.

 

[Chris Kennard]

Post #1 correspondence. Ty solicits his unsuspecting victim. His exact words. "How many of you would be interested if "I" ran an on-line raffle for a baby albino "blue" Tegu to be delivered in July?...if for any reason "I" do not produce any albino this year (chance of this will be almost none) I would pay the winner $3000 out of MY OWN POCKET. Where is the grey area here?

 

[FresnoTortoise]

The Grey area is the word "produce." Does it mean breed in the eye of the law? I do not produce any albino, could mean I am not able obtain an albino this year.

I will be a better poster. Online posting does bring out the worse in me. I regret most if not all of the remarks I have made.

 

[Chris Kennard]

He said produce, not obtain. You're reaching. Nice try.

 

[filenamex5100]

people have been arrested and charged with possession of crack cocaine while selling crushed walnuts. its called "intent". welcome to the new world where we finally punish people for being deceptive.

TY is wrong. anyone who thinks otherwise must be under ty's kitchen table at dinner time for some dessert.

if anyone is implying that ty didn't actual mean hatch his own babies when he said "produce", that tells me that ty is a deceptive person and so are you. he, nor anyone else, can pick and choose when the word "produce" means anything else or benefits them at a given time.

there is no grey area! Ty said one of two things will happen for the winners. he can claim michelle is greedy or whatever else he wants to claim as a excuse. it doesn't matter if she told ty that she hates him and he cant read good or "ty" his shoes.....that still doesn't justify him not sending her the due prize or the auxiliary prize of $3000 cash. he cannot legally void the contract unless he has specific terms in place prior to accepting money that clearly state what will violate/void the contract.

Mitchell, you are 150% right in this deal. I'm with you. even if I wanted to settle the deal and accept a tegu from an unknown source, I couldn't. I'm too hard headed. Id go to the end of the earth to ruin him. I wouldn't be able to accept something he did produce at this point because I wouldn't trust that it was actually from him (nor would I want anything related to his name after all this). Id fight for the cash if I were you. By his own admission he didn't produce what he said were the prizes, right? regardless if he produced a high priced tegu, that's not what you signed up for so that means you are due $3000 cash.

 

[filenamex5100]

ill also give an example of deception:

EXAMPLE:
1) you buy a captive born tegu produced by XXX seller through the classifieds. you pay, all is good, it ships. it arrives.
2) you contact the seller about the condition of the tegu which you now see is wild caught, scars, parasites, yada yada whatever.
3) you ask for a refund because it is clearly wild caught.
4) seller says "i produced one for you (out of thin air, cough cough) and sent it. nothing wrong there".
5) you upset now???? seller produced it right?!
6) my point exactly!!!

 

[Sugarhedgie]

The Grey area is the word "produce." Does it mean breed in the eye of the law? I do not produce any albino, could mean I am not able obtain an albino this year.

I will be a better poster. Online posting does bring out the worse in me. I regret most if not all of the remarks I have made.

Produce
verb (used with object), produced, producing.
3.
to make or manufacture:
to produce automobiles for export.
4.
to bring forth; give birth to; bear:
to produce a litter of puppies.

To get
A1 [ T ] to obtain, buy, or earn something:
He went to the shop to get some milk.
uk I think she gets about £40,000 a year.
We stopped on the way to get some breakfast.
I managed to get all three suitcases for under $200.
How much did he get for his car? (= How much money did he sell it for?)
Where did you get your shoes from?
When I asked him why did his post say if he didn't produce one ...... His reply

 

[Sugarhedgie]

The Grey area is the word "produce." Does it mean breed in the eye of the law? I do not produce any albino, could mean I am not able obtain an albino this year.

I will be a better poster. Online posting does bring out the worse in me. I regret most if not all of the remarks I have made.

My sugar gliders produce pieds. My sugar gliders don't get pieds
If your gonna
Argue
That he said if I don't produce any. Well ty is
Anbreeder. He produces some amazing reptiles. That's what their breedins do they don't get them the produce then

A broker would maybe get an animal. A breeder would produce them
Smh

 

[Sugarhedgie]

This is a serious question. Out of all the times ty has raffles or auctioned off a reptile to help a non profit. Has he ever auctioned or raffled off an undesclosed breeders or even one that he did not produce at his farm because as far back as I looked I had. It seen any


False advertising maybe

 

[FresnoTortoise]

ill also give an example of deception:

EXAMPLE:
1) you buy a captive born tegu produced by XXX seller through the classifieds. you pay, all is good, it ships. it arrives.
2) you contact the seller about the condition of the tegu which you now see is wild caught, scars, parasites, yada yada whatever.
3) you ask for a refund because it is clearly wild caught.
4) seller says "i produced one for you (out of thin air, cough cough) and sent it. nothing wrong there".
5) you upset now???? seller produced it right?!
6) my point exactly!!!

But the seller produced a wild caught produce, not a captive born tegu produce, not the same. Now if 1) said, you buy a tegu produced by XXX seller through the classifieds, then I would be like damn, that was my fault for not asking.

Us reptiles folks understand the word "produce" it doesn't mean it has the same meaning in a legal document.

 

[filenamex5100]

Lol. But if the document is produced by "us reptile folks" then your point is not valid.

Ty is "reptile folk" right?
Ty made the raffle right?
Ty allowed people to enter his raffle right?
Ty has a rule that said entry into the raffle was $100 per entry right?
....that means by entering the contest, youre entering a contract. By accepting mitchells money, she is legally locked in to his terms as is ty.

If you say "produce" is a grey area in his post it means youre part of the problem. Might be time for dinner at ty's. You should head on over!! Lol

 

[Sugarhedgie]

But the seller produced a wild caught produce, not a captive born tegu produce, not the same. Now if 1) said, you buy a tegu produced by XXX seller through the classifieds, then I would be like damn, that was my fault for not asking.

Us reptiles folks understand the word "produce" it doesn't mean it has the same meaning in a legal document.

We'll have to agre to disagree
His first post explained what the terms were going to be. And he asked him many people would be interested if he did the raffle. The second post march 10 said "an albino tegu " both purple and blue (t* and t-) are both considered albinos And tone delivered July. Since he said he only produced the purples and they are worth $5,000 he only owes me $2500 ( when he then decided to try to "get me a different one from the undesclosed breeder, which ty admitted he couldn't even get. shows that ty knew what produced meant right? Well if he only produced the t+ albinos , he couldn't get any of the less exoencivei es from the undesclosed breeder. What do you then think the prize should have been?? He gave the other 2 albinos he produced. Right.

 

[filenamex5100]

There are two ways to "produce" reptiles in your eyes apparently.

Produce by breeding.
Or
Produce by aquiring.

My point is made. The example i gave above is accurate. In the example you were purchasing a cb animal. But since xxx seller didnt produce by breeding a cb animal, he produced a tegu by aquisition.
That explains both my point, what ty did exactly, and also proves you are wrong as well.
P.s. Chris kennard produced pet rocks het for diamonds. Great prices im sure too. You should pick up a bakers dozens. Ill produce some for you (out of thin air of course) if you prefer since youre good with anyone producing anything, from anywhere.

 

[FresnoTortoise]

This is a serious question. Out of all the times ty has raffles or auctioned off a reptile to help a non profit. Has he ever auctioned or raffled off an undesclosed breeders or even one that he did not produce at his farm because as far back as I looked I had. It seen any


False advertising maybe

There has to be only a handful of people that breed albino tegus. If he raffles off some lizards, mostly likely they would be high end lizards, how many high end lizard breeders are out there? Maybe a handful of high end tegu breeders and a handful of high end rock iguana breeders out there.

To be fair to Ty, he did tell OP that he was looking into getting OP an albino tegu from another breeder. It seems little out there that OP would suggest he would not tell somebody this.

I can understand why he choose not to tell OP the breeder's name, he didn't want the OP to harass the other breeder.

 

[filenamex5100]

I should clarify that all my posting about producing are aimed toward fresnotortoise unless otherwise noted.

 

[filenamex5100]

Thats the point you are missing fresno!!!

It doesnt matter who he tried to get one from or why. His raffle wasnt for a tegu from anyone else!! Period!!!!!! He owes her $3000 cash since a tegu produced from him as described in the raffle isnt available. Youre making a fool out of yourself by saying things like "to be fair". What about being fair to mitchell??!!

She doesnt want, nor ever signed up for, or agreed to a lizard from anyone else....no matter the value. If ty offered her two $10,000 lizards, she doesnt have to accept because the raffle wasnt for that.

Thats like going to the grocery store and asking to buy apples but they tell you to take oranges instead.
"But the oranges cost more....you should take them". Not if you came for apples.
Ya....fresno, you need a het for diamond rock!! Kennard....he needs a rock!