I just read this thread from front to back and it looks pretty incomplete without my original posts on Upstate Exotics Bad Guy thread. I have pasted them here so all my posts are together.
This was my first post in response to the "bad guy" post on me.
you be the judge
Thats a great post allison, I was refraining from including details in my earlier post but since you decided to retaliate, I will tell the details from the beginning.
I was contacted by Upstate Exotics via a Kingsnake.com ad offering various reptiles for sale or trade. Sal and I spoke over the phone several times and he seemed to be a decent guy. I had several animals he was interested in so I decided to drive to his facility to swap some reptiles on May 25, 2003. When I got there, he examined my animals and gave me credit for them. I picked out the following for my credit:
10-ball pythons $100
1-redtail $200
1-bird and cage $600
2- western collerd lizards $40
3- savanah monitors $60
10- iguanas $70
2- uromastyx $40
2- florida softshells $40
1- black and white tegu $20
I was very picky and chose the best stuff. I brought them home and quarentined everything. Shortly after having them,
2- softshells
1- savanah
2-western collerds
2-ball pythons
died and none of the ball pythons would feed. I had a pretty good idea at this point that the problem animals were wild caughts and not the captive bred that he claimed. I called Sal and he said no problem, he would cover it on our next deal.
I had a customer contact me wanting 6- 3 toed box turtles. I contacted Sal and he agreed to let me come get them and reimburse him when I was paid.
On June 27 2003 I made the trip to get the Turtles. It was pouring rain and after the long trip, my 3 and 4 year old boys slept in the minivan and we continuosly checked on them(just to clear that up). The place was discusting this time and I was glad I left my kids in the van. They had alot more reptiles and it was obviously too much for them to handle, judging by the filth, rotten feed, regurgitations and on and on. Sal showed me the remainder of the ball pythons from my original visit, about 75 of them dying off in the bottom of a cage. Sal told me at this point that he would covor any ball pythons I loose from that batch.
I picked out the six box turtles I was after and I told Sal I had no money to purchase anymore reptiles right now. There were several animals I wanted Sal to hold onto for me but he insisted I take them now and pay for them later. I, again, told him I was tight on money and wouldnt have any for a few weeks. He replied " shut up, shut up, I understand, dont worry about it". I figured he must really trust me and was cool with it so I offered to make weekly payments once I was financially able. then I picked out the following:
3- Hogg Island boas $425
1- Spotted Python $40
2- Savanah monitors $20
1- Blue tongue skink $125
6- 3 toed box turtles $150
1- peachthroat monitor $125
2- wood turtles $70
25-ball pythons $250
He had around 200-300 ball pythons that he told me were a fresh batch and guarenteed feeding. They were much larger then the first batch and looked really good. We wrote up an invoice and I was on my way.
I got home and quarentined everything. The ball pythons had mites that I foolishly missed before bringing home.
I was satisfied with the new animals but the original ball pythons continued to die. The customer that got the three toed box's got a partial refund becouse some of the box turtles had upper respitory's.
I contacted allison and told her about all the animals that had died and she asked me what I was doing to kill everything. I have been keeping reptiles for most my life and am not a novice keeper. I froze all carcasses for proof.
I got nowhere with allison but sal told me he would make good on everything. I wasnt complaining too hard on account of the unpaid animals I still had.
Aprox. 2 weeks after bringing home the animals on credit I recieved numerous calls insisting full payment or return the animals. I offered to divide the the total into three weekly payments that I would start immediatly. He didnt want to do that and insisted his animals back. Sal claimed he was about to merge with a larger reptile dealer and needed the inventory.
I told him that was fine and agreed to send them back. I continuosly was in contact with them becouse the ball pythons were dying on a daily basis, and everything was looking sick and most of the lizards refused feed. Sal even tried to get me to pay for some of the dead ball pythons"to be fair".
Once we had discussed shipping arrangements, I told him what animals were still alive. Here is a list of what he was getting back.
3- hogg island boas
1- savanah monitor
6- ball pythons
2- wood turtles
2- mali uromastix
That left me owing him for the following animals I no longer have.
6-3 toed box turtles $150
1- spotted python $40
Total=$190
now subtract the dead animals from my original order
10-ball pythons $100
2- softshell turtles $40
2- savanah monitors $40
2- western collerd lizards $40
2-uromastix(werent dead yet but close-sent back)$40
They also owed me for 14 painted turtles $64
Total=$324
What I owed=$190
Subtract what they owe me=$324
Guess that means they still owe me $134
That is how the figures REALLY work out. I havent asked for a cent from them, I packaged the animals and he said he would have Airborne Express pick the package up that day. I stayed home and they never showed becouse he never called. I called him and planned to ship the next day, I sent the package to work with my wife so Airborne could pick it up becouse it was a tuesday. Airborne got there to pick up the package and we didnt have Sals account #. My wife called him and he refused to give her the number. Obviously Airborne didnt take it. My wife brought the package home and I unpackaged and recaged everything. Alot of the ball pythons died from the two days in box and some other stuff didnt look great.
I didnt hear another word from Sal for a week. I wasnt around when he began calling, he started jumping to conclusions, leaving nasty messages and accusing me of avoiding him. He left messages threatening that he was gonna drive up here and do things the hard way,on and on. When I got home I called him immediatly and he totally changed his toon. I made it very clear that I would love for him to come here and check out my place and see that I am all lagit. "oh no thats okay" this last thursday he contacted me wanting me to ship this last friday, I told him I would try but I was out of shipping supplies. I was unable to ship on friday, I called him saturday morning on my way out of town and told him I wouldnt be able to ship till monday. All weekend he called my house leaving more rediculous messages. I got home very early monday morning, packaged the animals and sent them to him overnight airborne billed to his account. Now he has all the animals back that he needed so bad and I am so happy I dont have to keep putting dead reptiles in my freezer. Before dealing with Upstate exotics I went along time without dead critters in the freezer. well anyways, thanks for nothing Upstate.
Thats the whole deal, Im sure that people can look this over and see who the real crook here is. The sad part is, Im sure they turned around and sold those sick animals again like nothing ever happened. Oh and by the way, I wasnt contacted by any legal office, lawyer or anything even remotely close. See the problem is, you have to be able to pay a lawyer before they work for you. this post has shown us how poor this failing company is, unpaid reimbursements, unpaid botch carpentry jobs, overpriced web sites,unpaid child support,home forclosure. Its no wonder these guys are trying to rip everyone off. I fell for it but I still got my shirt on my back. I did loose alot of top quality animals in trade for crap. lesson learned. Bombs away! let the lies begin upstate!!
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Kingsbury Exotics
Corey Kingsbury
lies
Allison will continue to lie and nothing will change that.
I suppose allison doesnt remember denying to me that they ever had a batch of ball pythons die even though I saw about 75 of them dying. on the same visit there was a large dead burm in a garbage bag pushed off to the side and two huge dead red tegu's. I was turning over deli cups with dead colubrids. I suppose these too are lies. The nastyness that I witnessed was on my second visit and I do regret putting a posative post on here for them.
oh, and about the peachthroat, this was supposed to be another c.b.b that refused feed and dwindled away, I even spoke with sal about that one when it was still alive. I also didnt include the blue tongue in the figures but thats not relavent becouse I sent it back. I traded them top of the line, top quality parasite free animals in return for a bunch of w.c crap streight from the importer. Just like allison uses excuses on here about her employees, partners etc. thats all a crock. Sal an Allison run this flop by themselves and I pity the poor guy thats about to get wound up with them. Sal and Allison, you can write whatever you like, make all the accusations you want, but the truth of the matter is you are lying thieves and noone will give you the slightest credability. This business is supposed to be your livelyhood but it is a hobby for me.
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Kingsbury Exotics
Corey Kingsbury
rozanne, My computer program(windows xp) is messed up so I rebooted windows 98 and it doesnt recognize my digital cam or my flatscreen so pics dont show up right on my computer and I cant post any pics. My wife is at work right now, she does all my bookwork, she has all the exact figures. I do have a pic of one of the dead b.p's in it's cage and when my wife comes home, I will get to a friends house and post them on their computer. As for the dead animals that Sal told me to bury, I could dig them up if enough people are that interested in seeing decomposing reptiles. Being that I am not asking for any componsation this seems pointless. I would have photographed everything if I had known their was doubt. My only point in adding to this post was to simply retract my good guy post. I am not asking for anything from anyone. I believe that alot of this is going to be left up to peoples own interpretation and opinion. So anyone who reads this whole post can form their own opinions of Upstate. I have nothing to gain or loose through this. The bad deal with Upstate was my fault for the most part becouse I should have sent all the garbage back when things started failing. I was in constant contact with sal and he was aware of the dying reptiles despite what "allison the victim" says. Trust me allison, If I was going to rip you off, I wouldnt have sent back anything. I am not even remotely concerned about the hot air you blow off about lawyers yaddi yaddi yaddi. your a joke.
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Kingsbury Exotics
Corey Kingsbury
