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Whats up with this????

Gregg M

Gregg M

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Whats up with crestedgecko.com selling hypo/super hypo leos that are "double het for patternless albino and sunglow"????

#1 there is no such thing as double het for patternless albino

#2 there is no such thing as het for sunglow

#3 how can someone claim that if you breed this pair together, you "WILL" produce patternless albinos, super hypos, and sunglows???

I think people are getting alittle out of hand with what they are calling their animals they have up for sale..... It is misleading and not very good buisiness ethics..... People realy need to start representing their animals truthfully.... Are the people that are giving out this misleading info just trying to make a quick buck or are they just not well versed in leopard gecko genetics and or buisiness ethics??? Just something that gets on my nerves..... Figured I would vent alittle....
 
I think what garret meant was that they are double het for patternless albino, and can produce sunglows...I just think he didn't know how to word it. If it concerns you send him an e-mail and ask about it...he's a really nice guy and would probably fix it... As far as #3 goes...He does not say that you "WILL" produce albinos, super hypos, and sunglowsl...his exact wording is "Produce Sunglows and Sunglow Patternless Albinos!" ...which I take to mean that that would be the expected offspring....which it would (although I don't know if I like the term sunglow patternless albinos...would they be orange?...lol). He leaves out plain patternless offspring alltogether...which I find odd. Anyway...just my thoughts on the matter. You should e-mail him and ask him about it.
 
hmm...clarifications

#1 there is no such thing as double het for patternless albino

YES there is. patternless x albino= normals that are double hets for BOTH patternless and albino aka "double het for patternless albino"

#2 there is no such thing as het for sunglow

yes and no?...thats a difficult question to answer since "sunglows" are just selectively bred albinos carrying super hypo carrottail or hypo tangerine genes...its about marketing... i bred my best rainwater albinos x my best hypo tangerines back in '02/03 to produce "very nice hets carrying hypo tangerine genes" (i dont give them special names, just NICE hets?)...ive produced some screamer albinos but i dont give them special names...just "nice and nicer" haha

#3 how can someone claim that if you breed this pair together, you "WILL" produce patternless albinos, super hypos, and sunglows???

i dont really know for sure but im GUESSING...that what he has for sale came from patternless albino x super hypo carrottail/hypo tangerine, thus making the offspring "double hets for patternless albino AND carrying nice hypo tangerine/carrottail genes"...true, i agree that u cant say "WILL" (meaning 100%) but i think if u produce enough eggs, statistically u will get normals (ranging from normals to hypos), normals possible hets for pat or albino, normals possible double hets for both albino and pat, normal albinos, albinos possible het for pat, normal patternless, patternless possible het albinos, "nice or above average" albinos, "screamer" albinos (sunglows?) and patternless albinos.

i dunno if that makes sense...hope it kinda of helps?

im still smacking myself in the face for selling off my 60% ct patternless albino male in '03...i really thought EVERYONE would have ct patternless albinos?? (havent seen very many?) too bad its in japan or ild buy it back haha

-jon
 
I see what you are saying Jon but to call something double het for patternless albino is implying that you will without a doubt produce patternless albinos from this breeding when in actuality, you might never see a PA baby from the breeding..... Also, het for sunglow is not yes and no..... It is no.... There can not be a het for a selectivly bred pattern or color morph.... Bottom line..... They are het for patternless and het albino..... I have said this before, when you start to get lazy and not pay attention to correct names and the proper way to lable, it starts to confuse most people..... This has even been the case on a real scientific level with some species taxonomy..... I just do not see a need to continue and raise the confusion level..... The best thing to name That particular mix is, super hypo carrot tails, het for albino and het for patternless, not double het for patternless albinos and sunglow..... See where I am getting at here.... I guess I am just nitpicky about stuff like this.....
 
Also, I am not bashing Garret at all..... His animals are awesome..... I just think when someone is selling something they should be alittle more detailed and let the buyer or buyer to be know EXACTLY what they are getting..... To call them double het for patternless albino and sunglow is a bit vague and a bit misleading.... I say the same thing when I see double het for Blazing blizzard..... LOL
 
to call something double het for patternless albino is implying that you will without a doubt produce patternless albinos from this breeding
Click to expand...

What exzactly would you call them? I have sold "double het patternless allbino" for the past 4 or 5 years bow and that's what I have always called them. I can see why calling them "HET patternless albino" might be misleading, however double het implies that they are carriers of two recessive traits, dont you think?

As far as the other animals, I am sure they are SHCT het for PA. You most likely will produce hybinos from them (aka "sunglows"). It seems really apparant to me what Garrick is talking about. Yes the correct terminology would be "SHCT het albino" but most people know what he is talking about. I don't think it is really misleading. IMHO.
 
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It is not misleading to me either but not everyone knows the lazy terminology..... What would I call and animal that is het for patternles and het for albino???? Ummm Double het for patternless ***and*** albino..... "DOUBLE" because of the two recessive genes, "HET" obviously because they carry both genes but do not show them, "PATTERNLESS" because that is on of the RGs, "AND" because there are two, "ALBINO" because that is the other RG..... Now by calling then double het for patternless albino, it is sending the message that breeding the pair will result in PAs automaticly and that is not the case...... Yes, there is a chance of producing them..... But that is all it is, a chance.... And There is no way any animal can be het for a selectivly bred color or pattern..... The word AND between the words patternless and albino is alot more important than some seem to think..... Like I said, I am very nitpicky about this for some odd reason.....
 
I think there is just confusion with how things are worded. I didnt know ther ewas a difference between a double het patternless albino and a het patternless and het albino. Well the ball world is just as badly off. anythign that looks any big different is something totally new and worth an extra thousand bucks for. I feel your pain.
 
It is not misleading to me either but not everyone knows the lazy terminology..... What would I call and animal that is het for patternles and het for albino???? Ummm Double het for patternless ***and*** albino..... "DOUBLE" because of the two recessive genes, "HET" obviously because they carry both genes but do not show them, "PATTERNLESS" because that is on of the RGs, "AND" because there are two, "ALBINO" because that is the other RG..... Now by calling then double het for patternless albino, it is sending the message that breeding the pair will result in PAs automaticly and that is not the case...... Yes, there is a chance of producing them..... But that is all it is, a chance.... And There is no way any animal can be het for a selectivly bred color or pattern..... The word AND between the words patternless and albino is alot more important than some seem to think..... Like I said, I am very nitpicky about this for some odd reason.....
Click to expand...

I think the first couple of years I sold them I actually called them "double het patternless X albino" but really, I do not see the difference. I understand what you are saying but I think by using the term "double het" it is clear that the animal in question carries two recessive genes. Now, the "double het sunglow" boa is kind of a confusing name as it implies there are 2 recessive genes in play, when actually they are referring to a hypomelanistic boa that is het albino.

I think as long as one is honestly representing their animals (ie. explaining to a customer what double het means) then there is really no problem with not putting the word AND in between patternless albino when referring to the double hets. Just my opinion, nothing else ;-)

I do understand the point you are making though.
 
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