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www.serpenco.com (INQUIRY)

R

RichB

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My Name Is Richard Brooks



Well, what he told me was that he couldn't let me come to where he is to pick out and buy a snake due to zoning restrictions. He never outright said I'd have to buy $100 worth of snakes from his web site and have them shipped, but that's his web site's specified minimum sale. I specifically asked him in an email if the only way I'd be able to buy from him was to buy $100 worth of snakes and have them shipped, but he didn't answer that question....he only responded to the part of that same email that asked him if he ever sells to pet shops. That's when he said he sells to Pet Paradise.

I've been very frustrated about this, although after seeing Pet Paradise, I doubt I could comfortably buy from him anymore, even if he lifted his "zoning restrictions" and decided to sell me one.
Click to expand...

As you can see from the question/response that I received from someone, there seems to be some confusion or a lack of understanding with how Florida deals with the sales of corns.

The individual wanted to make a single purchase of a corn. Seeing as they live in the close proximity of the dealer, they wanted to go choose the snake by site, purchase while there, and then bring the reptile home. (Thus avoiding overnight shipping stress/cost, allows personal interaction with the snake that would become a purchase prior to the deal, and would also allow for a visual inspection of the snake and its habitat.)

They were informed that they could not come and retrieve a snake because the zoning laws in Florida prohibit this company from selling in that manner.

Another response to an inquiry ,as you can read above, also indicated that this company sells to a local pet shop called "Pet Paradise". From the interactions I have had with the poster, this isn't a very reputable company in the respect that it is dirty and the reptiles are housed improperly.

Now, has anyone ever purchased directly from this company by means of personal interaction opposed to web sales?

Are there really zoning laws that prohibit the personal sale of corns to any party?

These questions were presented to me because this person feels that there may be some "gimmick" behind this to help induce a larger sale. (Minimum sale through website is $100, while a "pick-up" would result in the single sale of 1 $20 corn.)

He doesn't want to succumb the snake (s) to shipping stress when they are easily obtainable via pick-up.

Also, some concern was brought forth after the potential customer visited the store that this company emailed they have business dealings with.

I myself do not reside in Florida and have no first hand experience with the laws,this company, or the store in question. I bring these questions to you because I can't give an answer to questions I have no knowledge of.
 
Serpenco.com is owned by Rich Z., the owner of this site. If your friend was told by Rich the zoning laws prohibit the sale, then I would believe Rich. Rich is one of the most honest individuals you will find in this hobby and he wouldn't be telling your friend this just to "boost" his sales.

I have no first hand knowledge of Pet Paradise so I can't really comment on them. But, if they really are as bad as your friend says, then by all means let Rich know this.
 
Most reputable breeders, especially ones with high dollars collections, don't let strangers off the street into their homes and businesses. Too many criminals out there.............
 
More than likely he just doesn't want you coming by his house, which (i think) is also his place of business...Nothing personal, he may just value his privacy a bit (and don't we all?)...
 
Well, I can answer this, since Rich Z is a good friend of mine. Also, I was a frequent visitor to Tally when I was stationed at Moody AFB.

To begin with, Serprnco is a bona fide business, and not a hobbyist selling out of a spare bedroom. As such, when and where he can conduct business is indeed regulated. Rich's residence is not a storefront. As such, he's pretty much limited to mail order and shows

Legalities aside, only a fool would let someone whom they do not personally know come by their residence to pick up an animal nowadays. Doing so invites the theft of high-dollar animals. This is not to imply that your friend is untrustworthy, but merely unscrupulous individuals have "ruined it" for the honest customers in many cases.

As for Pet Paradise, I've been there several times in my visits to Tally. I've seen no unhealthy animals there, and can attest to the fact that they've invested quite a bit of time, money and effort into their livestock.
 
that is just his way of doing business

I've asked and asked to be able to come by and hand pick snakes and the answer has always been "no". That is just his way of conducting business, I don't believe there are any hidden agendas. To help you better understand his position...consider this:

You are Breeder "X" and you produce over 5000 corns a summer. You are strapped for time just feeding/cleaning and caring for that many snakes...let alone stop everything so you can have a person come over and hand pick his $50 snake. It's just not worth the time or effort.

Trust me I know how you feel but you've got to understand his side of the fence too. Try finding another small time breeder in your area that has a smaller collection and can afford taking time out of thier schedlule to meet your request.....they are out there.

To echo what someone up this chain said earlier...there are a lot of not so good folks in this hobby.

Good luck,
Russ
 
Well there are several issues being addressed here.

Anytime someone starts a business, they have some decisions to make on how they intend to do business. Some types of business are easier than others to do. If you decide to do a retail storefront business, there are a number of zoning and regulatory issues you need to address. Is your property zoned as commercial? If not, then you need to get an exemption to be allowed to do retail storefront business on your premises.

My property is zoned as agricultural, so I certainly would have had to pursue some sort of changes.

Once you have overcome that hurtle, then you have other problems to deal with. One of the biggest is the Citizens with Disabilities Act. I only browsed it to come to the conclusion that I didn't want to have anything to do with it in relation to my business. My building, if used as a retail storefront, would have to be extensively modified in order to comply. Not the least of the modifications would be that every room in the building would have to be able to accomodate a person in a wheelchair. On top of that, part of my property would have to be designated as an exclusively reserved Disabled Parking Spot, by law.

You are welcome to read about such things in your spare time, if you care to, but it was my decision that I didn't need to do business in that manner.

And lastly, people don't realize what they are really asking of you when they want to save that shipping charge. What they are saying is that they want YOU to take time out of your day to show them around your shop while they look through nearly every animal to try to pick out that one $20 animal. What is your time worth to you? How long would it take before the time spent was far and above that $20 bill you were trying to earn?

Quite frankly, I used to have people over early in the game, but after seeing my time eaten away in this manner, had people consistently late or no-shows after they made appointments, I decided that I really don't need, nor want, to do business this way. How do you tell someone, without appearing to be extremely rude, that you don't have a couple of hours to spend while they look through your animals, bombard you with questions, and are basically keeping you from doing things you really need to be doing? On top of that, one of the people I allowed over to my place got some sort of mental short circuit later on and I was downright apprehensive that he knew exactly where I live. I certainly do not need to make that sort of mistake again.

So this is how I do business: either via shipping from mail order/internet sales, or at shows. Period.

Oh yeah, almost forgot one other point. About the $100 minimum order. I had to determine what a minimum value for my time to pack up a box is worth. I have to put the box together, locate the animal (s), prepare a heat pack or cold pack, pack the animal and padding materials securely, print up an invoice and labels, then have FedEx come over to pick up the box. How much profit do you really think there is in sending out a single $20 snake? For that matter how much profit is there in even that $100 shipment?

To be honest, unless I am making the effort of selling animals worthwhile, I would just as soon go lay on the beach then to be packing boxes.
 
This is directed to the original poster.

Why are you posting this inquiry rather than the person whom you are quoting in your first post? If he has a question or comment on Rich Z's policies, I would think he would post himself.

That said, I think you will find that virtually all of the private breeders out there severely limit access to their facilities for a variety of reasons. The rare exceptions that I make are few and far between and usually involve someone recommended by a fellow breeder in the business that I know and trust.

In this day and age you have to be nuts to allow strangers access to your home.
 
I've purchased from Rich (last year). My wife picked up a couple of corn snakes. AWESOME animals. Shipping was very professional. Would recommend him to anyone.

Nice thing about owning your own company (pays back for a the extra paperwork and stress of not having a slave job) is that you can set your own work environment. The hours you are open, the level that you do business etc.
 
Suncoast Herpetological said:
In this day and age you have to be nuts to allow strangers access to your home.
Click to expand...
Before this last hurricane wiped me out, I could count the people that I allowed to see my collection on one hand. The same will hold true once I start keeping herps again.
 
Suncoast Herpetological said:
This is directed to the original poster.

Why are you posting this inquiry rather than the person whom you are quoting in your first post? If he has a question or comment on Rich Z's policies, I would think he would post himself.
Click to expand...

John, you are correct in pointing this out. This is a perfect example of a third party posting, so I will be giving the original poster warning points for it.

Ordinarily a thread of this nature that starts out in blatant violation of the rules would just be deleted. But considering the nefarious nature of the subject in the title of the thread, I will allow it to remain. :duck01:
 
Oh yeah, Mr. Webslave? Nefarious? Me? :kill:

Don't forget that I know where you live....... and I have guns......

Mods - please note that this is NOT a threat. Just pointing out something to the WebSlave that he, from his ivory tower, might have overlooked.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
 
LOL....this thread brings to mind a -shirt I once saw....it said "I used to be schizophrenic, but we're ok now." :D
 
I met RichZ personally in Daytona this year... He was very nice and professional. Even though I was there Early Saturday morning (Or was it Friday before the Hurricane... There was too much alcohol and too little sleep involved in that weekend) he took enough time out of his VERY busy setup to talk to me for a second or two.

I also have had one business transaction with him some years back that I, unfortunatly, had to back out on due to the relatively new, freaky herp regulations in the state of Kentucky. I was willing to take the rather large loss on the deposit I paid, but he went out of his way and refunded the money that was rightfully his because I backed out on the transaction. To me, this is the mark of a REALLY good guy who goes out of his way to be the best in the business.

I will do business with him again in the future.

And Back Off Mr. WebSlave! No matter how nefarious Rich may be, he's still a good guy! ;)

-Your Sick Uncle Morti, AKA Donnie Smith for the sake of BOI Rules.
 
I fully understand this. Back when I used to breed American Bulldogs, I used to let people come over and meet the parents and pick the puppy they wanted. I would say at least 50% never showed or called so this is a day wasted and a few stopped back by a few days after the sale looking around my yard without ever coming to the front door. When I was there I would confront them and they always had some shaddy reason for this. This made my wife feel unsafe due to the fact some times this happend at night and I am not always at home. So I told I would not let anyone come by anymore. Just my reason that I do this also.

Thanks, Tim Rash
 
I have never bought a reptile from Rich at Serpenco.
So, my opinion may not count for much. I would buy from him any day of the week...and feel privledged to own animals from his stock. His reputation precedes itself. Unless you are new to reptiles...and there is nothing wrong with that...you would know that he is among the top commercial breeders of cornsnakes in the world. I can count the breeders I would consider in that rank on one hand. I have never seen anyone who has had a bad thing to say about a business or personal transaction with him...or a complaint about his animals. In fact many smaller breeders and hobbyists will advertise when their parent animals came from his lines because of his excellent reputation in the industry. His commitment to bettering the reptile industry is outstanding. He created this website (and this forum) for the sake of keeping reptile owners informed and for the betterment of the industry. Notice this isn't the "SERPENCO FORUM"...he doesn't even have the biggest ad on the page...

Just wanted to sound off...gotta go...new snakes just arrived!
 
no one has mentioned disease . . .

. . . I have just a small collection, but I am very reluctant in bringing in people to look through my herp room. Who knows what they handled before - if they are carrying mites, etc.

It's just not worth it.

Oh, and rich, could you pack up a 20 dollar snake for me and meet me at the end of your lane?
 
Hmmm...

I haven't posted here in a couple of years, but due to a really nice thing Rich did for me recently I'm going to jump in here. I've bought corns from him every year for a few years now, both mail order but the last couple of years at shows only. Although he's sent some really good looking babies to me, I prefer to buy at shows and pick out my own specimens. That's part of the fun. We all have different tastes, and baby corns are so variable. At a recent show I was debating between two very nice female butter motley babies, almost striped, and showing a lot of yellow. These are rather expensive for corns, and I couldn't make up my mind between the two. As a lot of you know, Rich doesn't usually let people handle his snakes, but will show them to you. I don't have a problem with that WITH HIM and fully understand his reasons. With another vendor I might not be so trusting. So he showed me each one several times (rather patiently, I have to add). Unfortunately, the prettiest baby had a slight bump in the upper body, which Rich found and pointed out to me. I was a little disappointed, as it was the nicer of the two. Rich told me he would make me a deal. If I bought the other one, which I was going to do anyway, he would GIVE me the little butter striped. Well how could I refuse? Not too many people would give away such a pricey snake, even if it WAS flawed. Thanks Rich, you certainly made my day!

I would encourage your friend to go to a show to pick out his corn, there are plenty of shows in Florida that Rich is at.

By the way Rich, I think the names "Apple" and "Orange" are going to stick :(

Meg Gandolfo
 
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