Bad Guy Bad Experience with Carson Phelps of Herps Etc

[Parysa]

Paige,
I personally have jumped on the "proof" issue specifically related to what I believe to be the "KEY" question, or comments related to it.

Neither party had documentation in the beginning, that we know of.
The "deal" feel through.
Then again neither party had documentation as to how they agreed to solve it, that we know of.

So again this leads me to the "KEY" question, can anyone provide proof for the agreement after the original deal fell through.

If Carson can provide proof that Guy "wanted" snakes and not a refund, he can clear his name, come out on top and prove to the rest of us that Guy is untrustworthy.

OR vice versa

If Guy can provide proof that he asked for a refund and was denied it, he can clear his name, come out on top and prove to the rest of us that Carson is untrustworthy.

OR

Since neither party has produced anything tangible, I am/have been hoping there is/was a third party with some actual "facts".

OR WORSE YET

No one ever produces any facts/proof and BOTH Carson & Guy come out of this with wounded reputations. Ultimately, we are all here on the BOI to figure out who is or isn't trustworthy. Those who have figured it out for themselves have since moved on and are no longer reading. Those like myself are willing to wait it out a little longer.

If people have got on you for expressing your opinion, sorry to hear that. We all have one and are entitled to it.

Thank you, Robert. Unfortunately, there appears to be a lack of written evidence on either side, which means it's all speculation and he said/he said. I would think that if there were written communications available on either side that they would have been presented by now and I'm surprised this has gone on this long without it. I've talked to Carson about this on multiple occasions and his story has stayed absolutely consistent in every detail from day one. He's owned up to his mistakes and has been very open about the whole thing. I would highly suggest talking to him personally in addition to the thread.

 

[Wraith]

Paige,
So again this leads me to the "KEY" question, can anyone provide proof for the agreement after the original deal fell through.

If Carson can provide proof that Guy "wanted" snakes and not a refund, he can clear his name, come out on top and prove to the rest of us that Guy is untrustworthy.

OR vice versa

If Guy can provide proof that he asked for a refund and was denied it, he can clear his name, come out on top and prove to the rest of us that Carson is untrustworthy.

OR

Since neither party has produced anything tangible, I am/have been hoping there is/was a third party with some actual "facts".

Currently, Carson is the only one who has obvious avenues of providing "proof", but seems reluctant to do so. He can get the mystery scaless breeder to come foward, post proof of lawyer contact/letter and/or post proof of police contact/report.

I was in contact with mr miles for a few months and then his phones was off

I contacted my lawyer and had him send letter with 0 RESPONCE

I contacted local police and there was no one at that address

 

[Robert Walker]

I've talked to Carson about this on multiple occasions and his story has stayed absolutely consistent in every detail from day one. He's owned up to his mistakes and has been very open about the whole thing. I would highly suggest talking to him personally in addition to the thread.

Paige, as you make your own personal assessment as to who to believe or agree with, have you spoken to Guy on multiple occasions to hear his side as well. You know a fair and balanced approach?

 

[Robert Walker]

Currently, Carson is the only one who has obvious avenues of providing "proof", but seems reluctant to do so.

This concern has bothered me from the beginning when it was brought up 30 pages ago. It bothers me because it appears to be simply ignored, when in reality this kind of proof would be a tremendous asset to the truthfulness of Carson's statements/character and could only make him shine like star.

Adrian is correct, while other avenues of "proof" between Guy and Carson may not/never exist, this seems like something that if I were Carson, I would be excited to post and squash all rumors about him "scamming" in the first place.

 

[Chris Kennard]

You're deliberately misconstruing what I'm saying and selectively reading the way you've been doing the entire time.



First, you have absolutely zero ability or authority to compel me to answer *anything* you ask. Unless I'm mistaken, you aren't the Fauna judge and jury. Therefore, I'm free not to answer any question that I don't feel like wasting my time on. Considering that you can see that my location is in Alabama and his is in New Jersey and that I've already stated that I don't know Carson personally, I'm not quite sure why you're asking me to divulge personal information for him that I don't possess and that there's no logical reason to assume that I would have access to.

Really, you're such an obvious troll, I'm not sure why anyone is even giving you the time of day.

Kinda renders this post misleading, yes?

 

[Chris Kennard]

Thank you, Robert. Unfortunately, there appears to be a lack of written evidence on either side, which means it's all speculation and he said/he said. I would think that if there were written communications available on either side that they would have been presented by now and I'm surprised this has gone on this long without it. I've talked to Carson about this on multiple occasions and his story has stayed absolutely consistent in every detail from day one. He's owned up to his mistakes and has been very open about the whole thing. I would highly suggest talking to him personally in addition to the thread.

Compared to this.

 

[Chris Kennard]

"Consistent in EVERY DETAIL". Gotcha.

 

[Chris Kennard]

"From DAY ONE". Get it.

 

[DaveyFig]

I asked Mr.miles where he picked up his scaleless corns and he told me BHB
And he sent me a few photos and answered all my questions and I felt very confident on sending him money

It is possible that Mr. Miles exists, has scaleless cornsnakes, and did burn Carson.Has anyone contacted BHB to see if they sold scaleless corns to a Steve Miles?

 

[Robert Walker]

It is possible that Mr. Miles exists, has scaleless cornsnakes, and did burn Carson.Has anyone contacted BHB to see if they sold scaleless corns to a Steve Miles?

Do you know BHB well enough to ask? I don't unfortunately. Great suggestion.

 

[DaveyFig]

I don't know them at all. I just thought that would be a great starting point. Steve exists and does have scaleless cornsnakes, then perhaps some heat can come off of Carson.

 

[DaveyFig]

*If Steve exists...

 

[Parysa]

Paige, as you make your own personal assessment as to who to believe or agree with, have you spoken to Guy on multiple occasions to hear his side as well. You know a fair and balanced approach?

I haven't. Carson contacted me. Guy hasn't. If Guy wants his side heard in detail, he's welcome to do so as well.

Kinda renders this post misleading, yes?

Compared to this.

I don't know him personally as in *in person*. I have spoken with him on the phone. Again, you're twisting things.

Davey, good idea. If there's a real Steve Miles, he might have the info. If not, then it'll either show (as it sounds to me) that the guy claiming to be Steve Miles was a scam artist or (as it'll sound to others) that he never existed at all.

Wraith, as far as having reports and copies of letters, etc, I'm really not surprised he doesn't still have them. But then, I don't keep up with things like that years later. However, at least Carson is claiming to have done *something* besides logging onto the internet three years loan the road to recover the money, so who does it seem more important to? Guy has had Carson's contact info, why didn't he go through small claims court or make a police report (aka the *actual* appropriate channels)? Why, after the first deal went south, didn't he get anything in writing?

Anyway, this dead horse has been beaten enough. I'm done. When people already have their minds made up, all debating does is further seal their views into their own minds as this thread has shown on both sides. Robert, Wraith, you're classy individuals. It's been a pleasure debating with you.

 

[DaveyFig]

Paige, you wrote about Carson's consistency in his story, implying (and maybe even saying) that Guy has been inconsistent.

Guy states that he requested his money back in September of 2013 and was told that Carson couldn't pay him back. Prior to that, all of the deals had been "replacement deals" for other snakes.

Very first post:

... Then last December(2012) we came to a new deal on ball pythons because it was clear to me Carson had no intention of completing our deal and I would not see the snakes or my money back...

It was clear that the deal for the snake he wanted (the scaleless corns) was not going to work out. He wasn't going to get those snake (the scaleless corns) or his money...so he SETTLED ("new deal") for balls. Where is the inconsistency on Guy's end?

 

[Chris Kennard]

I haven't. Carson contacted me. Guy hasn't. If Guy wants his side heard in detail, he's welcome to do so as well.




I don't know him personally as in *in person*. I have spoken with him on the phone. Again, you're twisting things.

Davey, good idea. If there's a real Steve Miles, he might have the info. If not, then it'll either show (as it sounds to me) that the guy claiming to be Steve Miles was a scam artist or (as it'll sound to others) that he never existed at all.

Wraith, as far as having reports and copies of letters, etc, I'm really not surprised he doesn't still have them. But then, I don't keep up with things like that years later. However, at least Carson is claiming to have done *something* besides logging onto the internet three years loan the road to recover the money, so who does it seem more important to? Guy has had Carson's contact info, why didn't he go through small claims court or make a police report (aka the *actual* appropriate channels)? Why, after the first deal went south, didn't he get anything in writing?

Anyway, this dead horse has been beaten enough. I'm done. When people already have their minds made up, all debating does is further seal their views into their own minds as this thread has shown on both sides. Robert, Wraith, you're classy individuals. It's been a pleasure debating with you.

Nice try Paige. Don't think so. There's no "misconstruing" about the two posts which speak volumes about your deceptive nature. Who should take you seriously now? The only one here "selectively" reading is you. Funny how you have those "why didn't he" questions for Guy, yet none for Carson. Just excuse after excuse. Just like Carson.

 

[Chris Kennard]

You're deliberately misconstruing what I'm saying and selectively reading the way you've been doing the entire time.



First, you have absolutely zero ability or authority to compel me to answer *anything* you ask. Unless I'm mistaken, you aren't the Fauna judge and jury. Therefore, I'm free not to answer any question that I don't feel like wasting my time on. Considering that you can see that my location is in Alabama and his is in New Jersey and that I've already stated that I don't know Carson personally, I'm not quite sure why you're asking me to divulge personal information for him that I don't possess and that there's no logical reason to assume that I would have access to.

Really, you're such an obvious troll, I'm not sure why anyone is even giving you the time of day.

You're not QUITE SURE why I was asking you to divulge personal information for him that you don't possess and there's NO LOGICAL REASON to assume that you had access to? Really. That was some acting job. EVERY DETAIL FROM DAY ONE. No twisting those words around.

 

[Pottersgirl]

Yet again, he contradicts his original post and claims that he had asked for a refund when he had been very specific that he requested a refund in September of 2013 and neither he nor Carson ever before or after this comment said anything about Carson promising a refund and not delivering.


If the refund was so important to Guy and was more important to him than receiving snakes, then why is it that he continually stated that their deals were for replacement snakes until everyone jumped on and the post had gotten however many pages long and only THEN claims he requested a refund prior to September 2013?
That, combined with him demanding more and more valuable snakes on top of the $3000 he was owed back makes me think that he either changed his mind on the banana male and/or realized he could use fauna to pressure Carson to get more than they agreed to.

It is true that there is no actual written proof to say when Guy asked for a refund, but you have stated that Guy requested snakes instead of a refund, and there is no written proof of that. From the posting in this thread between Carson and Guy, it seems more likely to me that Carson offered snakes instead of a refund.

This might seem like a small distinction, but I think its actually quite important. If Guy felt like the replacement snakes was his only option at seeing anything for the money he sent to Carson. Plus, I dont doubt that Guy wanted snakes too, but after 3 years Im sure he felt like he was getting the run around

Even if Guy did wait until September to ask for a refund, why didnt Carson agree right away? If Carson knew he had made mistakes too, and if he had nothing tangible to offer Guy at that time, why didnt he just agree to refund the money? Why did Guy have to post here?

 

[Iraqvet]

I don't think Guy should be taking the heat for this either..Did he lack getting documents to cover his butt?..Yes..Was he way more lenient to Carson than I would have been?..100%...$3,000 isn't chump change..The documents etc should be standard for someone who sells thousands of animals a year..Some people lapse their judgement..But it still looks like guy was strung along and forced into taking snakes for trade..He said he didn;t feel he was gonna get his money back, and I didn;t see anywhere in this thread where Carson said he wanted to refund it..Not until Guy came here anyways..I would do business with Guy..For Carson, I would want a signed contract including shipping time span,TOS, and the amount of $ paid..

 

[Chris Kennard]

It is true that there is no actual written proof to say when Guy asked for a refund, but you have stated that Guy requested snakes instead of a refund, and there is no written proof of that. From the posting in this thread between Carson and Guy, it seems more likely to me that Carson offered snakes instead of a refund.

This might seem like a small distinction, but I think its actually quite important. If Guy felt like the replacement snakes was his only option at seeing anything for the money he sent to Carson. Plus, I dont doubt that Guy wanted snakes too, but after 3 years Im sure he felt like he was getting the run around

Even if Guy did wait until September to ask for a refund, why didnt Carson agree right away? If Carson knew he had made mistakes too, and if he had nothing tangible to offer Guy at that time, why didnt he just agree to refund the money? Why did Guy have to post here?

Paige can back up all of statememts with proof. That proof being Carson told her so. Case closed, right? Thread over.

 

[herpsetc]

To answer guys questions

Misunderstanding on our agreement:

The agreement was that guy would receive multiple babies from the ultramel and spark breeding. Neither of those males bred last season which I stated in a prior post. so that voided our agreement and we needed to resolve this transaction in another way.

Timing
once we discussed the breeding of those males I had told guy it was going to be some time before these males would be ready to breed due to fact they were babies
That's one of the major reasons this transaction had taken so long

Refund:
I stated in the beginning that guy had requested other reptiles
We had went back and fourth with different species when we came up with the ball pythons (breeding deal)
Guy has received his $2975.
He requested that I send it overnite delivery which was a Saturday delivery that was $25 which he offered to pay with a Total of $3000
If guy wants $25 to make it whole I have no problem sending him $25

He asked for proof
I do not have any it was all done verbally

I offered guy a ball python package for the incovience of this whole transaction
Which is only rite

The package will be shipped out this Thursday via airlines

Guy will receive the following

1.0 2013 vanilla pewter
0.2 2013 Mojave
0.1 2013 Yb