Bad Guy Jay of Franken Chams

[Chris Anderson]

Well Mr Anderson as i stated on my previous response i will no longer offer magnets on the inside of the cage just so there can not ever be another scenario like this. If i was not taking this seriously i would not be responding to anything. Personally i find the fact that most old timer cham keepers are never nice to younger or newbies as you can read on most forums and facebook groups i am 33 but have been working with chams since i was 15 half the reason i never posted in my younger years was cause of what i saw and cause of insanity like this i will not mention any names on here but i have seen and i have more than a few youngsters like my self to back up the bullying that the old timers dish out also a little side not i have a degree in biology and environmental science my professor always said i was the perfect student if i could just keep my mouth shut lol ahahah boy o boy was he right.


My responses reflect nothing compared to my knowledge and even now i still learn more everyday i am surrounded by people who are genius in what they do and rarely ever have any issues were i " mouth off " but the pages and the facebook pages and forums are all governed by old timers who if someone disagress with anything said they all gang up and ban and or block what 9 times out of ten is a inexperienced kid trying to learn who does not understand why everyone is mad at him for asking questions. When i reality they should be helped. I appreciate you saying im not responsible but bringing my character in question i will bring the character of the trade it self into question go through the pages boi's and forums and ou will not ever see the negative newbie bashing because mods are smart enough to delete them but it exists and Mr Anderson im sure you know what scenario i refer to in my situation as you are a forum member.

Unfortunately I have no idea what specific situation you are referring to, and while I am familiar with this fairly common issue in online communities, I fail to see how it relates to the issue at hand, unless you are suggesting that the tone you have taken with the original poster is analogous to these old timers bashing less experienced keepers? Regardless, I never brought your character into question and even if I had, what does that or the rest of this thread have to do with the "character of the trade it self"?

I am glad to hear that you are adapting the design of the setups you will be selling in the future. Whether this is in response to a potential safety issue, or simply to avoid future issues with "people [who] don not exercise the proper education and common sense in caring for such delicate and fragile animals", it probably is a good idea.

Chris

 

[Jay Sick]

and my words show that i am a fair business man because i offered him a resolution and that i am not a cookie cutter kiss everyone's behind because i fear my business will fail unless i pretend to be happy to help people who may be bs 'ng me. If a small business owner who in reality sells at amazing prices which i guess is just not a good idea. Because no matter how much good yah do there is always this nonsense involved like this. The customers that know me well can tell you i go way above and beyond for the people who earned my respect and deserve it. I along with the rest of the world owe no one anything except common courtesy. Which falls short allot in this day and age.

 

[Fangthane]

Unfortunately I have no idea what specific situation you are referring to, and while I am familiar with this fairly common issue in online communities, I fail to see how it relates to the issue at hand, unless you are suggesting that the tone you have taken with the original poster is analogous to these old timers bashing less experienced keepers? Regardless, I never brought your character into question and even if I had, what does that or the rest of this thread have to do with the "character of the trade it self"?

Bazinga! Excellent posts, Mr. Anderson. You get my vote for today's "King of the Lab" award.


The buffoonish manner in which Mr. "Ciccone" has chosen to address this situation pretty much speaks for itself. I find myself wondering something else - Who's Jason McKnight? A business partner with a startlingly similar [lack of] grasp of proper syntax and punctuation; as well as the very same attitude?

 

[Jay Sick]

My legal last name is mcknight it was ciccone and has been changed but I guess in all your great detective work you did not figure that out lol but I guess you fell better now lol

 

[Jay Sick]

And fyi I asked the moderator to please change this account in spite of the fact that I rarely use it.

 

[AbsoluteApril]

And fyi I asked the moderator to please change this account in spite of the fact that I rarely use it.

Webslave is the only one that can do that for you (I'm not sure which mod you contacted). Please PM him or leave him a visitor message.
thank you.

 

[hhmoore]

He knows that he has to go through Rich - I told him twice; and will post the messages to confirm that, if necessary.
Take care of it, Mr McKnight... and, until it is done, sign your posts.
Also, as I've told you a number of times - fix your location.
(You've had ample time; so tomorrow morning I'll start deleting your ads if it remains as is)

 

[hhmoore]

* In one of my messages, I mistakenly typed that the location field is locked; but you know that isn't true because you've already edited it (just not in a manner that complies with the requirement)

 

[hhmoore]

I along with the rest of the world owe no one anything except common courtesy. Which falls short allot in this day and age.

ummmm

You are a low life lyer no chameleon unless it is on steroids and can bench 600 pounds could move one of those magnets. let alone use it's tongue to do so those are rare earth super neodymium magnets the strongest magnets pound for pound on the planet one magnet can hold atleast 2 gallons of water Your chameleon did not eat one nor did it maneuver 2 other magnets any one with a brain will figure it out . We have been on vacation for the past week and what do i see when i get home this crap. Anesthesia ???? are you serious chameleon was thin??? who are you trying to kid in none of the other statements did you say thin i guess on here yah just spice it up for the public. I would have offered you compensation if you were able to prove this to me but instead yo ran here on a public forum to bash me good job pal.

Chams don't go under Anesthesia well so your vet was pretty stupid to do so that shortens their life span, if the cham was thin why did you buy it then ??? lol hahaha makes allot of sense to me i always buy thin sick chams lol ahahaha. You are a shinning example of why i don't want to sell to the public anymore. Because somehow it there is always some jackass embellishing stories online to make the story seem more dramatic than it is trying to get money out of a person. Also if i remember correctly i offered you the option to epoxy the branches in place which is one of the 6 variations we offer and you wanted the magnets so i don't see how yah doing this. I will say this if that cham is strong enough to do what you said it did ill buy it back from yah cause that will be one hell of a breeder.

I'm not seeing much common courtesy in your opening remarks... but I guess you covered that with your falling short comment. I can acknowledge that your responses improved a bit; but, overall, they did fall well short of any mark on the scale most of us use.

 

[tkevan]

"Opinions are like @$$ HOLES everyone's got em and usually the people with the most are the biggest ones"

... unless anyone else would like to comment and further antagonize a situation ...

Nice. Insult us who provided you with some FACTS about the materials you apparently used, then accuse US of being antagonists?

All Chris and I tried to do is provide you with some information based on typical senarios, instead of your "they're really super duper strong".

Here's a suggestion. USE the calculator I linked to. You'll see there's no need to used magnets on the inside, as the pull strength is the same for magnet to magnet, and magnet to steel disc. Had you done a modicum of due diligence, you would have known this information.

Also, I didn't use the CHEAPEST RE magnet grade, only the one thats both cheaper and MOST COMMON. If your magnets are N27-N30, the pull force is even less, and falls off faster.

BTW, the mechanical pinch factor is not what damages the skin, it's the capillary blood flow restriction, which causes the necrosis.

(My degree is in cardiopulmonary science)

 

[Jay Sick]

ummmm




I'm not seeing much common courtesy in your opening remarks... but I guess you covered that with your falling short comment. I can acknowledge that your responses improved a bit; but, overall, they did fall well short of any mark on the scale most of us use.

you do not know what my conversations were with this kid prior to this thread i tried to work with him and see if this was real and all he did was hang posting on here over my head just like anyone else who does not get what they want when they want it they instantly say " O well i do this and it will ruin your business" Like i said i know how i am and do not take any shame in who i am. I have a laundry list of Happy customers and a lrge list of shops that buy off me with no issues. It's always a inexperienced person who runs to a forum rite away.

 

[Jay Sick]

Nice. Insult us who provided you with some FACTS about the materials you apparently used, then accuse US of being antagonists?

All Chris and I tried to do is provide you with some information based on typical senarios, instead of your "they're really super duper strong".

Here's a suggestion. USE the calculator I linked to. You'll see there's no need to used magnets on the inside, as the pull strength is the same for magnet to magnet, and magnet to steel disc. Had you done a modicum of due diligence, you would have known this information.

Also, I didn't use the CHEAPEST RE magnet grade, only the one thats both cheaper and MOST COMMON. If your magnets are N27-N30, the pull force is even less, and falls off faster.

BTW, the mechanical pinch factor is not what damages the skin, it's the capillary blood flow restriction, which causes the necrosis.

(My degree is in cardiopulmonary science)

If you want to assume that was solely directed towards you and Mr Anderson that's on you. It was and still is a general statement because I do not walk around on any hi horse and judge anyone regardless of any degree or status and i am not saying this about you or Mr Anderson again general statement. But if i did not have a fauna account or friends that went on here i would have no idea some random dude was trashing my name as much as this maybe a help to people it is also a great way for someone to falsely accuse someone and or create a situation like this which then pisses said accused off big time and " antagonizes" My reactions in the first place.

This should have never been posted in the first place NO MATTER WHAT MY ATTITUDE OR JOKES WERE I OFFERED HIM A SOLUTION WHICH WAS MORE THAN FARE and i decided to change my design both things this kid asked for so after a long drawn out thread of nonsense he got what he wanted is this fair to a seller ???? You tell me ? if every buyer did this to sellers WHAT WOULD BE THE POINT OF BEING A SELLER ???


My comments to Mr Anderson stem from a previous situation involving another forum and another situation similar to what my comments to him were about. Mr Anderson has no recollection of this and that is fine in the end what people don't realize is that none of the bickering and nonsense matters if i did not approach these situations with humor i would be apart of the problem and not a solution. I take my work very seriously the proof is in the pudding so to say when my web site launches you can all see the work i have done to make quality products based on ease cleanliness and simplification of breaking in a new cham owner. Yet i can only do so much if someone chooses to not read literature provided or heed warning about things Then WHO IS TO BLAME ???

AND TO ANSWER YOU STATEMENT about why i use magnets in the cage on the branches to connect the branches that go left to right with a outside magnet to fasten the branch in place. It is because during production when epoxying the steel disc which i tried there is no initial hold even if you tac it with epoxy as soon as the hot epoxy touches again to make a bond and seal it it reheats and falls off. Using a magnet it holds it self in place regardless of heat. but that is not the magnet this kid said he ate he is referring to the free standing magnets used on the branches that go front to back that the branch rests on he is saying cham moved branch and then ate magnet if branch was not moved cham could not see magnet because it was covered by branch. Normally as i said before as a cham ages i offer to epoxy branches for free.



Regardless i will leave with this, because i am a smart @88 people get thrown off by me and i would not have it any other way i'm sorry but i can't just sit back and let people walk all over others based on the imaginary customer is always rite idea. My Great Granddaddy my Grandaddy and my self did not did not serve our country come home and start small businesses based on " The American Dream" Only to let other people just tarnish our names in business if you don't take a firm stand for your self then there is no point in believing in what you do and if you don't treat the scenarios like this with humor you become Jaded to all scenarios and lose site of the love you had for your business and the passion that inspired you to do it.


God bless this beautiful country and all that love her in return.

"13 stars on a flag" proud and true

 

[Fangthane]

Flip-Flop

We have been on vacation for the past week and what do i see when i get home this crap.

That certainly appears to be a clear allusion to the idea that you had no idea there were any issues with this transaction; that you'd like us to believe you were blindsided. If your claim - that he was holding a BOI thread over your head - is true, I don't see how your surprise can be anything other than completely feigned.

everyone wants to be a businessman after they publicly bash a person instigate them to respond and then try to use words to manipulate what i said to render me the opposition. Yes my nephew posted pics as you see he posted them late following a pending post that said we were gonna be posting pics at a certain time and we did not because he is young and gets side tracked we were not here he is not responsible to answer messages unless you would like to deal with my 16 year old nephew he probably has more reserve towards this kind of nonsense than i do.

This appears to be supporting the idea that there was indeed no communication with the OP, prior to this thread being posted. If you'd already addressed the situation, you'd have no need to rationalize the strongly implied lack of communication.

you do not know what my conversations were with this kid prior to this thread i tried to work with him and see if this was real and all he did was hang posting on here over my head

Seeing how the first two quotes don't jive with the third, I'd love to see these supposed conversations that took place prior to this thread. Let me guess - it was all done over the phone, right? Based on your very own words; as well as your tacit admission that he needed to "instigate" a response, I think the OP's contention is much more likely:

Currently I have not received any form of response from Jay or Franken Chams even following up on the events.

 

[jj-mitchell]

Not that at this point I would care to do business with either if these people , I have enough suspicions that the OP is full of it, and not really sure that this should have turned into a bash the other party because he has a crappy attitude. The OP clearly stated he has a degree in " caring for animals" and he works a pet shop. Seems a bit far fetched. Also how many cages built to this standard has Jay or Frankenchams built without incident? Something doesn't seem to fit.

I ask the OP what degree he actually held earlier, I will ask again what degree do you hold and where did you study to attain it?

 

[Jay Sick]

to answer you question if you have seen any of my videos it will show you that i myself have roughly 30 cages built this way in my collection. As far as others about 200 other people have these branches and or cages because branches are sold separate as well as packaged with cages also they are made to order so there have been a few odd ball customs like hexagon screen cages. this is a rough number but its been allot

 

[jj-mitchell]

That was my point Jay. Roughly 230 of these out there and only one problem. The one fault or problem that has occurred by a user with what I see as several loops and unlikelys in his story. He tried to make good, and the OP wants to make unreasonable demands.....

Don't get me wrong I understand Jays frustration and know he has been less than professional in his statements. However he has made legitimate offers and stood behind his product.

 

[Fangthane]

I have enough suspicions that the OP is full of it, and not really sure that this should have turned into a bash the other party because he has a crappy attitude.

Be that as it may, a great many people will find it very telling, just how the seller chooses to respond to issues - if he chooses to respond at all without seeing his name on a BOI thread, which is a very big "IF". In this regard, he's gleefully chosen to crash and burn.

The OP clearly stated he has a degree in " caring for animals" and he works a pet shop. Seems a bit far fetched.

While we're verifying scholarly pursuits, I think that the following should also be questioned:

i study physics and biology

Considering his laughable claims about his understanding of just how powerful his magnets are (when he admitted he doesn't even know which specific grade he uses), I have my doubts about how much "study" he's put into physics. Honestly, I'm surprised he can muster the smarts to spell "physics". I have to wonder just how loose of a definition he uses for the word "study". Since his own educational boasts are also meant to bolster his credibility, I think you should ask that he address them. It's only fair, right?

Also how many cages built to this standard has Jay or Frankenchams built without incident? Something doesn't seem to fit.

Unlikely doesn't even remotely equate to impossible. Based on the forces required to dislodge the magnets, I think it's been shown that the OP has put forth a plausible scenario.

While I wouldn't bother wasting too much energy in arguing against both parties being duds, I'm thinking that the OP is much less full of it than the seller.

 

[tkevan]

sellers WHAT WOULD BE THE POINT OF BEING A SELLER ???

My Great Granddaddy my Grandaddy and my self did not did not serve our country come home and start small businesses based on " The American Dream" Only to let other people just tarnish our names in business if you don't take a firm stand for your self then there is no point in believing in what you do and if you don't treat the scenarios like this with humor you become Jaded to all scenarios and lose site of the love you had for your business and the passion that inspired you to do it.


God bless this beautiful country and all that love her in return.

"13 stars on a flag" proud and true

Save it. You get no extra points with me. USAF Ret. 1981-2007. Wife, USAF AD, 1991-Present.

 

[Jay Sick]

Even if i was more professional about it it would not matter I would still have people bash me which is why its a waste of time responding to any of this crap now I got sgt slaughter above me telling me to "save it" and listing his outfit and time of service like it matters.This is why my responses are what they are you people care more about drama than your animals the only reason I`m hated is cause I don't kiss the rear of the cool kid club and i`m fine with that i sat at outcast table during lunch and I gladly do it today. Im sure im not the only one,down the road you will all gang up on someone again and you will not realize how bad it makes being a forum member sound. Every thread I have ever seen winds up like this now some jack hole is calling me stupid? If fauna was smart they would elect judges to review cases like this instead of letting the general public rip people apart and upon their decision they cant post their conclusion instead of resorting to listing mindless opinions from people who have no clue this is not referring to anyone specific cause who is anyone to judge anyone. Also to answer the question of punctuation and spelling most of my responses are on my phone and rushed because im not glued to my chair watching a forum boi post that has warn itself out along time ago. Im mean seriously what do you people want or expect when you create a forum with this kind of option in it everyone to hold hands and sing songs. Yup there I go again all sarcastic and unprofessional remember folks energy rotates

 

[Lucille]

listing his outfit and time of service like it matters.

You opened the door by talking about service. Are you now saying it doesn't matter?

If fauna was smart they would elect judges to review cases like this instead of letting the general public

I trust the general public, and I think most people are good, and I also think people can figure stuff out on their own. They sure can make up their own minds about who to buy from for their own possible future transactions. And the general public is who juries are made of.
It is uncanny how the truth comes out in this threads.