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Bad Guy Avoid Steven Patterson (Apex Reptile Center) at all costs!

MCMB-2 said:
No. But I do believe that when they put them in a box truck they already know the specific health of each animal.

If someone gave me a box truck of animals and I drove around with them for a few hours just because, then went back to check and found that some were injured or dead, how can I say with certainty that it was the seller's fault? (obviously a made up scenario, but it seems that's what we're doing).

Also, dehydration and mouth rot is not something that happens on a drive home and CANNOT be the buyer's fault or responsibility. Not a good comparison.
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You just don't give up do you. And to answer your previous comment about quoting posts, I'm doing this from my phone via tapatalk. I don't think it's possible to quote seven different comments into one post from this app and if there is I'm not to interested in doing it. I don't need to quote every single post or line. It's already posted and cannot be deleted, ever.

You keep making excuses for other peoples long trips, etc. You say it's different when people drive a long way to a show and don't stop to check their animals in the back of a truck when the op says she checked on them each time they got back in the car threw a CLEAR DELI CUP but you act like she deliberately abused these geckos because she didn't run straight home lmao ok. Like someone else said many animals sit in deli cups for however long the show is, plus being packed up to be taken there, etc so god forbid she has them on a deli cup for TWO hours.

Let it go because this is getting sad. If I didn't know any better I'd say you're a PETA and HSUS lover to keep harping on it like this.
 
Can I just ask what the heck it matters how long they were in a deli cup? If they're not "extreme harlequins" the seller owes her a refund if she wants to return them regardless of what the person he bought them from told him. The tail kink is irrelevant since they weren't checked when she got them so there's no sure way to know when it happened. "Ready to breed" and "almost ready to breed" are opinions. Weights should have been asked for if it was that big of a deal.
 
MCMB-2 said:
*sigh* my bad. Making a 9 hour trip but stopping for gas and to grab a few snacks and making a bathroom break and then stretching for 15 minutes when you get home is a lot different than picking it up right by your house and somehow not finding time to take them inside.
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No, it isn't different. Your revision still changes nothing. No matter how much you want there to be, there's no real dichotomy there. It all comes down to a conscious choice to put the animals at potential risk. Either scenario was equally avoidable.
MCMB-2 said:
Sorry, I should say "mouth injuries" so that I don't get responded to with more bold text telling me I'm avoiding facts because I don't type out every single word someone says
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Yeah, kinda like your comical attempt at pretending that what I'd left out of the quote somehow changed the context. Out of one side of your mouth, you want to say that her taking the time to run errands isn't the issue; out of the other, you wanna throw her relative nearness to home in her face. Quite obviously meaning that she's in the wrong for not going directly home and putting them in QT. Just another one of those things you can't have both ways. If it's not the main issue, or even an important issue, let it go.

But, hey, maybe you're finally starting to catch on, at least a little bit. It's an important distinction - "injuries" vs. "mouth rot" - as the injuries very well could have happened at any given point. Said injuries would have been clearly visible to anyone who would have focused on the general area of the mouth, even while it was closed.

The rest of your drivel has officially gotten too tedious to continue to bother with. Go ahead and keep hiding behind context or whatever else it is you need to tell yourself is going on here. If you don't realize you've already been soundly beaten, I'll just pretend I'm also a resident of whatever make-believe world you're living in, and not bother piss on your parade. I'm officially done with this. For real this time. :thumbsup:

Bobby Douglass said:
Can I just ask what the heck it matters how long they were in a deli cup?
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I'd add: "What the heck it matters why they spent that time in the cups?" They're both very relevant questions that have the very same answer: "It doesn't."
 
If there's no dichotomy, why did you use it as one? You were doing ok Dan, but now that you're mad its obvious how hard you've been trying. You can only say the same nonsense so many times before you start to look silly.

And I didn't know we were in a competition, but now that I do I feel pretty good about it lol.
 
ElexisOrtiz said:
You just don't give up do you. And to answer your previous comment about quoting posts, I'm doing this from my phone via tapatalk. I don't think it's possible to quote seven different comments into one post from this app and if there is I'm not to interested in doing it. I don't need to quote every single post or line. It's already posted and cannot be deleted, ever.

Let it go because this is getting sad. If I didn't know any better I'd say you're a PETA and HSUS lover to keep harping on it like this.
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You said I attacked her but cant give one example? I didn't ask you if you could or couldn't do certain actions with your phone, I asked you not to accuse me of saying or doing things without proof.

Also, are you implying that caring about animals is bad? I don't understand what you're getting at but that last statement is fairly concerning to me.
 
MCMB-2 said:
You said I attacked her but cant give one example? I didn't ask you if you could or couldn't do certain actions with your phone, I asked you not to accuse me of saying or doing things without proof.

Also, are you implying that caring about animals is bad? I don't understand what you're getting at but that last statement is fairly concerning to me.
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There's a difference between caring about animals and dictating what someone has to do with their animals.

She didn't throw it across a room, she had them sitting in a deli cup in the back of a car that was in the 70's degree rage and continued to check them each time she got in and out. That's not abuse or neglect.

And continuing to harp on her keeping them in the cup for 2 hours versus 12 if she had them shipped is just ignorant.

Her aunt asked if she wanted to go with her, *speculating* she did to get her animals, but what if that aunt didn't want to run straight home to put them in a cage then go back out to finish? But I guess you over looked that her aunt was driving so you can continue your attack and harp on her having them in a cup for 2 hours, omg that's so horrible! Call the humane society! She abuses her animals! Get a grip.
 
So since you've ignored my request to provide proof for the third time, I'm going to assume you didn't find any? Accusing people of things with no basis is a very bad habit to get into, it doesn't put you in a very good light. Either provide evidence of what you're saying or just stop and save yourself the embarrassment.
 
And I'm sorry, but I've yet to see someone use the word "ignorant" in this thread correctly. Using words that you don't know the definition of is definitely ignorant :)
 
MCMB-2 said:
So since you've ignored my request to provide proof for the third time, I'm going to assume you didn't find any? Accusing people of things with no basis is a very bad habit to get into, it doesn't put you in a very good light. Either provide evidence of what you're saying or just stop and save yourself the embarrassment.
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Lol so I have to quote posts? No. It's already written in your own words. You keep attacking this girl over it being in a deli cup for 2 hours. I'm not embarrassing myself. You are just an ignorant person who seems to get off on this. I'm not going to go back and read over all your posts, try to figure out how to quote from each just to satisfy your need for "proof" when it's already been said in your own words. Oh and your flip flop from how the issue was her leaving jt in the cup then saying that wasn't the issue lol someone already quoted that. Have a good day. I'm done with this nonsense, got better things to do.
 
ElexisOrtiz said:
Lol so I have to quote posts? No. It's already written in your own words. You keep attacking this girl over it being in a deli cup for 2 hours. I'm not embarrassing myself. You are just an ignorant person who seems to get off on this. I'm not going to go back and read over all your posts, try to figure out how to quote from each just to satisfy your need for "proof" when it's already been said in your own words. Oh and your flip flop from how the issue was her leaving jt in the cup then saying that wasn't the issue lol someone already quoted that. Have a good day. I'm done with this nonsense, got better things to do.
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And I'm the one attacking people? Interesting.

If I continually attacked her, as you said, why should it be so hard to find an example? Your hole keeps getting deeper.
 
ElexisOrtiz said:
She abuses her animals!
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And as far as me "flip-flopping", here's what happens when you misquote people and take things out of context.

You said it yourself, she abuses animals. Why are you siding with her when you are the one saying it? I don't think anyone else said it was abuse, just that it was irresponsible, so why do you feel the need to attack her like this?

This is why context is important :)
 
Honestly, you know what helps the situation? A dozens debating like pre-schoolers... There is so much speculation in these posts that its driving me crazy! The only thing WE know for sure is that:
SELLER
1) Sold harlequins as extreme harlequins.
2) Sold male as RTB but really should not be attempting to breed this low of a weight.
3) Didn't allow seller time for inspection before leaving.

BUYER
1) Never inspected the geckos at point of purchase.
2) Attacked seller for selling "Almost ready to breed" females as "almost ready to breed" females....

Seriously, both seller and the buyer had pretty shady transaction. Why would you buy an animal without even a minimal inspection? The seller DID try to offer a new gecko though, and if this was SUCH A HUGE PROBLEM, then the buyer should have just taken the offer. The he said/she said tail kink question won't be solved, so I don't see a point in continuing this argument.
 
Lucille said:
Not at all. I'm impressed by your reducing the situation to what you see as the important points.
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It really was. People can come up with the wildest excuses and talking points about this post, but at the end of the day, there isn't a single piece of evidence that proves what the gecko's tail looked like at the time of purchase. He/she said goes nowhere!
 
Agreed. With the failure to inspect the animals at the time of transaction, no one is clearly accountable for the tail kink. The animals being in their deli cups for two hours only increases the chance of the tail kink possibly happening in OPs possession (just as someone would expect an animal got sick at the buyers house the longer it's been in their possession). It doesn't prove it.

In line with what NTReptiles suggested as the important points of the situation, I think the focus would be better spent on how OP and the seller chose to try to resolve the issue. Since most of these concerns were either explained (breeding size and their morph label) or were a wash (kinked tail), the remaining red flag to be addressed is the misconduct in the texts. If either of them would be so kind as to submit the full conversation, that would help us get a clear picture of their expectations of each other, and where the communication broke down.
 
At what point in our texts would you like to see? I will post EVERY SINGLE text from february 10th to february 12th when I stopped contacting him. I have nothing to hide at all.
 
The texts regarding your plans to meet up to receive the geckos will help, as will all the texts you two have from when you first brought up your concerns when inspecting the geckos until you two stopped talking. I know you had posted some earlier in the thread, but if I remember correctly some parts were left out and context is important. Thank you!
 
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