• Responding to email notices you receive.
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  • IMPORTANT! PLEASE READ!! About the Google Adsense ads being displayed

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    Posted 08/15/2025
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    Yeah, I know. They are a pain in the butt. But they pay the bills to keep my server running. Just a fact of life, I am afraid.

    Want to get rid of them? Simple. Just become a Contributor level member or above and they will be gone. -> Please click HERE."

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    Google Adsense ad revenue for December, 2025 was just $30 over the cost of the lease for the server running this site. So, in effect, the money providing the incentive for me to continue running this site is coming SOLELY from the paid memberships and sponsorships here. Which honestly ain't much....

Bad Guy Dave goyeau

Keithbeaton said:
I see what you are saying.
When I posted the ad I was making it to smear Dave's name not to sell it, honestly I couldn't believe I got any replies!

My question to you is what do I do with this snake?

Its been here for over two months now, eats poops and sheds fine and now that I've researched the morph this is common, its just not for me! I will never own a spider because of this same issue but I do own this caramel and every time I open its tub its a reminder of being ripped off and it makes me mad, everyday! I work too hard at work, when I come home and deal with my snakes its my way to unwind but now with this constant reminder waiting to slap me in the face I find myself putting off what I used to do before doing anything! Honestly I got off work early today @ 130 and I still haven't done my daily snake business! This snake must go but how do you suggest I do it if not to a stranger? I plan on not letting it go without the buyer fully understanding the snake isn't right, I'm no vet but this isn't ibd or any disease, I've had it long enough if it were surely its condition would have deteriorated even a little but it hasnt! its the same today as the day I got it, now I'm just aware of it and pissed off about it!
I don't have many friends that are into snakes, the guys that are I got into the hobby and I don't want them to have to deal with it either!

So what do I do?
Click to expand...
When I re-home a less-than-perfect critter I ususally 1) give it away, and 2) have the new owner sign a first right-of-refusal contract stating that if the new owner wants to rehome it, I have first option to take it back at no charge. I also put "teeth" in the contract, meaning, if the new owner violates it then I have grounds to sue for a specific dollar amount; more than the animal is worth but well under the small claims limit in my state, so no need for attorneys to be involved.

Flippers avoid me, people intending on providing long-term or forever homes for pretty pets are thrilled, not only because they are getting an animal they usually couldn't otherwise afford to purchase, but because they know the animal has a safety net if something should happen to them.
 
If you are honest, you are not accountable for another person's potential or hypothetical dishonesty. If someone intends to flip it without disclosure and you know that, then refuse sale. If there is no such indication presented to you, you are fine to sell it to or place it with another person with your own full disclosure (which you have already offered). This is simply my perspective on placing compromised animals. You can charge something. You can charge nothing. Up to you. If you as an honest seller find what you believe to be an honest buyer, then I think that is then the business that is owned between you two parties and only you two parties have to agree to it.
 
nickolasanastasiou said:
If you are honest, you are not accountable for another person's potential or hypothetical dishonesty. If someone intends to flip it without disclosure and you know that, then refuse sale. If there is no such indication presented to you, you are fine to sell it to or place it with another person with your own full disclosure (which you have already offered). This is simply my perspective on placing compromised animals. You can charge something. You can charge nothing. Up to you. If you as an honest seller find what you believe to be an honest buyer, then I think that is then the business that is owned between you two parties and only you two parties have to agree to it.
Click to expand...

I agree. But is telling potential customers that the animal is "off" considered full disclosure? Not all customers are seasoned herpers.
 
crowtree99 said:
I am not sure what would be considered an acceptable amount of time to ensure it does not have an communicable disease but Im sure others will.
If it could be truly confirmed it is just what it is and not a spreadable disease then I see little harm in advertising it as such along with ALL of the facts to a genuine potential owner who will take it in and care for it as a pet only .
Sort of like finding a rescue for it?
And yes those people do exist, I have done so on several occasions , probably why I own way too many snakes right now...lol
Of course with the best will in the world, people will be people and even though they may say what you want to hear at the time, who knows what they may do with it after they take the snake from you
Tough situation to do the right thing tbh
Click to expand...

Nicely put. Damn you!
 
I can almost gaurentee the vet in my city would want to put down a spider so that's what he will say to do with this but its because he has zero knowledge of issues associated with morphs not because this snake is sick, which I really don't think it is.

I've spoke with a person who has been dealing with caramels for a long time, a very well respected person in my eyes, he told me this is normal, it happens just like in spiders. It sucks I didn't know about it prior to the deal but Its not common knowledge, in my eyes it should have never made it out to the public just like I think spiders shouldn't be bred but that doesn't mean I'm right, I'm the minority, a lot of people still breed spiders. yes they are pretty but I don't want to breed anything where my chances of producing defects are high but again that's my personal belief, it is accepted in our hobby to breed these snakes.

Even with a contract you can't be certain those snakes are still with those people, no matter what i do I can't be sure where the snake ends up, all I can do is ensure that I am satisfied the buyer knows before, the condition of the animal and accepts it for what it is, as much as I think it shouldn't be bred people still breed them! who am I to say they are wrong, which I am not, I'm saying its not for me!

Sent from my HS_9DTB37 using Tapatalk
 
Keithbeaton said:
I can almost gaurentee the vet in my city would want to put down a spider so that's what he will say to do with this but its because he has zero knowledge of issues associated with morphs not because this snake is sick, which I really don't think it is.

I've spoke with a person who has been dealing with caramels for a long time, a very well respected person in my eyes, he told me this is normal, it happens just like in spiders. It sucks I didn't know about it prior to the deal but Its not common knowledge, in my eyes it should have never made it out to the public just like I think spiders shouldn't be bred but that doesn't mean I'm right, I'm the minority, a lot of people still breed spiders. yes they are pretty but I don't want to breed anything where my chances of producing defects are high but again that's my personal belief, it is accepted in our hobby to breed these snakes.

Even with a contract you can't be certain those snakes are still with those people, no matter what i do I can't be sure where the snake ends up, all I can do is ensure that I am satisfied the buyer knows before, the condition of the animal and accepts it for what it is, as much as I think it shouldn't be bred people still breed them! who am I to say they are wrong, which I am not, I'm saying its not for me!

Sent from my HS_9DTB37 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

What do you base that accusation on regarding your vet? Are you saying the vet will just look at the snake and make that judgement without doing any tests? Surely you would share your knowledge of this morph affliction first. Maybe you should google more qualified vets in your vicinity. I'm sure some of the awesome detectives here could help.
 
I base the accusation on a friend bringing a spider in for what he thought was a ri and immdiatley the vet jumped to ibd after seeing the snakes awkward motions even after the friend told him the wobble is tied to the morph. I have brought a snake to this vet once and I'll drive the 3 hours to go to the next one because this guy is stubborn , he is the vet so he is right even when he is not, you can't tell this guy something he doesnt know because he knows all, he is the vet here not you kinda guy!

Sent from my HS_9DTB37 using Tapatalk
 
Keithbeaton said:
I base the accusation on a friend bringing a spider in for what he thought was a ri and immdiatley the vet jumped to ibd after seeing the snakes awkward motions even after the friend told him the wobble is tied to the morph. I have brought a snake to this vet once and I'll drive the 3 hours to go to the next one because this guy is stubborn , he is the vet so he is right even when he is not, you can't tell this guy something he doesnt know because he knows all, he is the vet here not you kinda guy!

Sent from my HS_9DTB37 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Can your friend share that experience here? What was the outcome? How was IBD ruled out?
 
Keithbeaton said:
I base the accusation on a friend bringing a spider in for what he thought was a ri and immdiatley the vet jumped to ibd after seeing the snakes awkward motions even after the friend told him the wobble is tied to the morph. I have brought a snake to this vet once and I'll drive the 3 hours to go to the next one because this guy is stubborn , he is the vet so he is right even when he is not, you can't tell this guy something he doesnt know because he knows all, he is the vet here not you kinda guy!

Sent from my HS_9DTB37 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I truly hope people don't get the wrong message here. If everyone with your thinking passes off symptoms synonymous with IBD, or whatever, as a "morph" problem, the reptile community has a new problem on it's hands. How many people would kiss someone with a svab on their mouth. It's only a cold sore, right? The doctor said so.
 
Keithbeaton said:
I've spoke with a person who has been dealing with caramels for a long time, a very well respected person in my eyes, he told me this is normal, it happens just like in spiders. It sucks I didn't know about it prior to the deal but Its not common knowledge, in my eyes it should have never made it out to the public just like I think spiders shouldn't be bred but that doesn't mean I'm right, I'm the minority, a lot of people still breed spiders. yes they are pretty but I don't want to breed anything where my chances of producing defects are high but again that's my personal belief, it is accepted in our hobby to breed these snakes.
Click to expand...

It seems morph issues that were 'common knowledge' are mainly discussed when they are first observed and then not brought up as often as time goes by. Here's an old thread from the discussion forums you may find useful:
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=118875

It's a shame the seller hadn't made you aware of the extent of the issues before you purchased. From what I know, sometimes those type of issues (wobble-type issues in some of the BP morphs) only start manifesting after stressful times (like shipping) or during excitement (like eating). If you can, take it to the vet that is farther away, they can hopefully determine if it's a virus or something else. If it's fine, my opinion would be to try to find a good pet only home for it, perhaps through your local reptile society. Good luck!
 
Last night after I posted my post about putting off doing my snakes because of the freakshow, I came to the conclusion that i have spent way to much time and energy on being angry at this situation!!

So I decided to give the snake away, nothing is worth the anger I feel about this situation and I just need it out of my sight so I can move on!

This post is up, I placed my ads, I made people aware but now for me I just need the snake gone and to move on, what's the difference if I lost 200 or 400, a loss is a loss! Instead of giving it to a stranger I gave it to a buddy, fully disclosed its situation, told him it hadn't been to a vet, told him caramels kink and throw freakshow babies! When I pulled into his driveway I pulled the snake from the bag and showed him why I'm so mad and have to get rid of it!

My buddy is happy cause he has this gorgeous snake to give to his daughter as a pet! I'm just happy I'm done with this whole situation!

I'm already a member on another forum but since I now have you guys on taptalk maybe I'll check out the boards! Thank you to everyone that showed interest in this thread, it sucked to talk about but it helped get me to the decision I made and now that the snake is gone I'm happier already!





Sent from my HS_9DTB37 using Tapatalk
 
Sounds like you made a great choice on the rehoming, at least somebody is happy.
Still a shame you lost out on the deal
And yes please keep checking in on Fauna!
Good luck.
 
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