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Inquiry Why All The Hate Toward Reptiles By Mack?

Just curious I keep hearing how this is going to "destroy the reptile industry" or "they will ban all our reptiles". Don't you think that is a bit much? No one really cares except PETA lovers. Our reptiles are not going anywhere. What is the worst that happens from this video? Less purchases from box retailers? Good, I imagine almost all the reptile community would support that.

Nothing horrible is going to happen to the reptile community because of this. You can chill out and take a deep breath.
This is the way peta wants you to look at the issue, as if you are not a direct target when in fact you are. Each individual incident like this adds to the list of complaints that they take to lawmakers unsuspecting citizens to get them to support different small bans that eventually are designed to spread across the targeted industry. Such as with dogs, they've been pushing to ban American Pitbull Terriers for years. If this is allows what breed is next? But for those that don't own such a dog they think great I hate those dogs so I'm supportive until the start coming after your Labs, Cocker Spaniels, etc.Their agenda is real and they are serious about ridding us of ownership of any animal. Anyone that knows anything about peta knows this. Do your research and you'll find that they are wolves in sheep's clothing
 
Oh so one has to be a member of PETA to have an opinion on such topic? Nothing in that link said anything about PETA. Most people I know would be against most topics covered in that link. Do I have to be apart of PETA to not support dog auctions? That is what you are trying to say.

And you know what some movements by non PETA outlets are very good and should be supported. It should be hard to breed animals and buy them. Why are you generalizing that all animal rights movements are bad and related to PETA?

All I am saying is if you think this video is going to hurt the reptile community and what we do I think you are very wrong. These exact videos have been done in the past and nothing has ever happened. There isn't a big outcry on this video. It isn't on the today show, not on the nightly news...it isn't a big deal.

You made a statement about dogs and I posted a link. You asked a question. I answered and I specified animal rights which is inclusive of PETA,, HSUS AND ALF. I believe animal welfare groups can be beneficial and animal rights, ala PETA are extreme are threaten all animal use and ownership.

I think PETA, and allied groups threaten all animal ownership and breeding including most importantly, reptiles. I don't know if this video is a true representation or not, but PETA has in the past slanted the truth so far as to make it untrue propaganda.

Your statements show empathy to PETA, which I do not share. Let's please agree to disagree and leave it at that.
 
Do your research and you'll find that they are wolves in sheep's clothing

Once again, for what seems like the 100th time, you people are making this too much about PETA. PETA and their views/intentions mean NOTHING. Is the video accurate or not? That is all the matters here. Does it really make it any better if RBM is mistreating animals if some PETA member is taping it in attempt to ban all animals? No mistreating animals is mistreating animals. Of course it is different if the PETA member intentionally did these things vs. another employee. If RBM knows these things are happening and didn't care to fix them that is a way worse situation.

Heck even if a PETA member went into their facility and intentionally did all of this it is still a big issue for RBM. Whether it is a PETA member or some normal employee just being lazy you still have the same issue...Someone working for you is not taking care of the animals very well and you have no idea it is happening...ending of story. Of course at face value it will look a lot better for RBM if some PETA member sabotaged them.
 
Why doesn't anyone care that John mack sold out the reptile industry in Ohio by supporting sb310...

Now he has hired Peta people to take care of his animals and they made a video of animals in really bad conditions and showed the video to the whole world.....

Seriously what's it going to take for the reptile industry to stop supporting reptiles by mack....he didn't support any of the big snake people venomous keepers croc people or any of the large carnivore people in ohio....John mack supported taking away the rights of people to have and breed those animals....
..and now he was so irresponsible that he hired Peta spies...

Just how much damage to the industry will reptiles by mack have to do before the industry holds him responsible....

It was John macks actions that helped to make sb310 law. And it was his actions that lead to Peta spies in his facility and posting that video....and their people on here acting like John mack is some kind of victim...

This is why the industry is doomed..because when the big names in the industry do things to harm it the industry makes excuses for them or just ignores the damage they're doing...and lies for them....
 
Once again, for what seems like the 100th time, you people are making this too much about PETA. PETA and their views/intentions mean NOTHING. Is the video accurate or not? That is all the matters here. Does it really make it any better if RBM is mistreating animals if some PETA member is taping it in attempt to ban all animals? No mistreating animals is mistreating animals. Of course it is different if the PETA member intentionally did these things vs. another employee. If RBM knows these things are happening and didn't care to fix them that is a way worse situation.

Heck even if a PETA member went into their facility and intentionally did all of this it is still a big issue for RBM. Whether it is a PETA member or some normal employee just being lazy you still have the same issue...Someone working for you is not taking care of the animals very well and you have no idea it is happening...ending of story. Of course at face value it will look a lot better for RBM if some PETA member sabotaged them.
Well I don't know Mack from a can of paint so I'm not sure what he's capable of. "IF" what's shown is true he deserves ridicule. That's"IF"... What I do know is peta has a track record of doctoring evidence to sensationalize a situation and I don't trust them at all. Is this guy guilty of the alleged accusations? I hope not and will withhold judgement until I learn more. I have an avid interest in all animals and their welfare so I can definitely see where you are coming from. I just have intimate knowledge and personal experience of peta and their tactics which is steeped in illegal activities and slander. They're not above staging things such as the video in question. How can we be sure they didn't put those lizards in the plastic bottle themselves to make this company look horrible? (They did have access and opportunity) They've been known to do such things. I can go on with several scenarios but I'll leave it at that.
 
Am I just talking to myself or are you guys actually reading what I say? I talked about staging in the post you quoted dajuice. Even if it is all staged a lot of that is still a huge issue for RBM and not good for them. Take all the starving injured bearded dragons for sale. Even if intentionally done RBM doesn't know it is going on in their own facility. People are not being watched closely enough or not being held accountable for what they are doing. Intentionally done or not if that happened in their facility and they are responsible for it.

They look a lot better if they didn't know, but regardless it is not a good thing on their part. If they know employees do this kind of thing and figure who cares it is just a few...well...that's when RBM looks really bad. I don't think it is a question of if this stuff happened, but if RBM knew about it or not.
 
Am I just talking to myself or are you guys actually reading what I say? I talked about staging in the post you quoted dajuice. Even if it is all staged a lot of that is still a huge issue for RBM and not good for them. Take all the starving injured bearded dragons for sale. Even if intentionally done RBM doesn't know it is going on in their own facility. People are not being watched closely enough or not being held accountable for what they are doing. Intentionally done or not if that happened in their facility and they are responsible for it.


I can agree with this. Whether what we're being shown in this footage was staged or not notwithstanding, there is clearly a very serious managerial problem and someone at RbM needs to be held accountable for that and take steps to correcting it.
 
:>off_to<: If anyone here wants to support RBM or you feel they've been wronged, may I suggest leaving some five-star feedback on Google review. The PETA sheep destroyed their review rating.
 
Thank you Justin, we will be posing out response to the PETA allegations later today and really appreciate your support. Paul

Thank you for offering a response. Believe it or not, that actually increased my support for you. Please, if you are going to do this, be honest. Admit if you messed up, admit if PETA was not being honest.

The only way to seek redemption on this subject is clean your house and show us how you are going to behave moving forward.

For the record, I never bought anything from RBM. But I don't believe anything PETA says.
 
Thank you Justin, we will be posing out response to the PETA allegations later today and really appreciate your support. Paul

Hey remember that time you supported sb310 with pijac and helped it become law,and sold out the entire exotic community in your own state.....so you would be safe to continue mass producing $50 throwaway pets for corporate pet stores...that was really awesome
 
Mr. Boalich, care to take this to its own thread so we can talk about it on topic?

It isn't off topic..read the name of this thread..why all the hate toward reptiles by mack.. this isn't a Peta video thread...it's a thread asking why people hate rbm...well a lot of people in Ohio hate reptiles by mack for what he did to them....he supported the state taking their rights to own exotic animals away......he supported bans and regulations for anything bigger then a boa...he sells boas so boas are ok....

So there's no need for me to take this to another thread...the person that started the thread ask a question and I posted some information that I thought would help clarify why someone people (namely the people in Ohio that had the state come to their homes take their animals ie their private property and kill their animals and then send the people the bill for doing it) might not like reptiles by mack

Now how is that not suitable for this thread
 
Another reason for the hate is Jon mack was sitting on the board of pijac I believe at the same time as ed sayres was made ceo...he's the guy from aspca you know the group that denounces the keeping of any reptiles....I believe ed sayers is still in an active role in pijac just not the ceo...not sure is mack is still on the board of directors.......pijac supported most anti reptile legislation that dealt with reptiles not sold in pet stores....pijac also push for regulation bmps care standards for all the bigger reptiles..but not the little reptiles that mack sells
 
I've notice in this thread people it was the Peta people that did that to the animals and didn't care for them....now I would like to point out in the article link I posted...if you read it it says rbm has 50 employees...
50 employees...
So I ask the question out of those 50 employees how many would need to be Peta spies to pull off that level of abuse and neglect?

How many Peta spies does it take to pull off a staged animal abuse video..?

I can't imagine that there was more than 2 to 4 Peta spies working at rbm

And I can't imagine that those 2 to 4 spies were in charge of taking care of all the animals while the other 48 to 46 employees did what exactly...answered emails all day....

40 plus employees an no one say we or 3 employees sticking dozens of lizards to glue traps..or they did see it and didn't say anything

40 plus employees and they didn't notice any of the stuff you all are suggesting that the Peta spies did when nobody was looking

OK keep telling yourselves that...

It doesn't seem to matter if it's Wyatt wasting donation money and pushing for anti reptile legislation...the usark board covering it up...the big names in the industry lying to all of you or a wholesaler that sold out his own state and industry getting caught neglecting his animals.....you people always have an excuse..a reason to look the other way....a way to rationalize it so it's ok
 
I've notice in this thread people it was the Peta people that did that to the animals and didn't care for them....now I would like to point out in the article link I posted...if you read it it says rbm has 50 employees...
50 employees...
So I ask the question out of those 50 employees how many would need to be Peta spies to pull off that level of abuse and neglect?

How many Peta spies does it take to pull off a staged animal abuse video..?

I can't imagine that there was more than 2 to 4 Peta spies working at rbm

And I can't imagine that those 2 to 4 spies were in charge of taking care of all the animals while the other 48 to 46 employees did what exactly...answered emails all day....

40 plus employees an no one say we or 3 employees sticking dozens of lizards to glue traps..or they did see it and didn't say anything

40 plus employees and they didn't notice any of the stuff you all are suggesting that the Peta spies did when nobody was looking

OK keep telling yourselves that...

It doesn't seem to matter if it's Wyatt wasting donation money and pushing for anti reptile legislation...the usark board covering it up...the big names in the industry lying to all of you or a wholesaler that sold out his own state and industry getting caught neglecting his animals.....you people always have an excuse..a reason to look the other way....a way to rationalize it so it's ok

:thumbsup:
 
Hey remember that time you supported sb310 with pijac and helped it become law,and sold out the entire exotic community in your own state.....so you would be safe to continue mass producing $50 throwaway pets for corporate pet stores...that was really awesome

I looked this up Mr. Boalich. I can find where he negotiated to stop the law from banning all animals, but I have not seen where he supported and help past the law. Do you have anything of him saying that he 100% supports the law?

It isn't off topic..read the name of this thread..why all the hate toward reptiles by mack..

I was just trying to keep this from turning into a 1000 page circular argument. We can do it here, you are correct, this is about the hate against them.

Another reason for the hate is Jon mack was sitting on the board of pijac I believe at the same time as ed sayres was made ceo...he's the guy from aspca you know the group that denounces the keeping of any reptiles....I believe ed sayers is still in an active role in pijac just not the ceo...not sure is mack is still on the board of directors.......pijac supported most anti reptile legislation that dealt with reptiles not sold in pet stores....pijac also push for regulation bmps care standards for all the bigger reptiles..but not the little reptiles that mack sells
You know in order to change things, you have to be a part of it. Can you show where Mr. Mack support this person? Can you show where he voted for him?
https://www.pijac.org/blog/pijac-behind-scenes-reptiles-mack-ed-sayres-pijac-pres-ceo

Here's a link to an article ed sayres did on rbm when ed was ceo....

So let's see pijac hires an animal rights activist as their new ceo..he go's to macks place and then Peta spies end up working at rbm...

Now I'm not implying anything...just putting together a time line of events

https://www.pijac.org/press/pijac-leads-way-ohio-reptile-ban
https://www.pijac.org/sites/default/files/ohio_dangerous_wildlife_ban_press_release.pdf
http://www.reptilesmagazine.com/Ohios-Exotic-Animal-Ban/

And this

https://www.pijac.org/sites/default/files/pijac_oh_reptile_bill_gov_desk.pdf

It does not seems like the supported anything. It seems like they saw a law that would ban ownership of all reptiles, they lobbied to get it to ban only some.

Unless you want to argue that lobbying to go from all to some is a bad idea, I don't see your argument.

After all, if a bus was stuck on a rail road tracks going to get hit by a train, I doubt anyone would say that every child had to remain on the bus until we got the whole bus off the tracks. You are not saying, right?

I've notice in this thread people it was the Peta people that did that to the animals and didn't care for them....now I would like to point out in the article link I posted...if you read it it says rbm has 50 employees...
50 employees...
So I ask the question out of those 50 employees how many would need to be Peta spies to pull off that level of abuse and neglect?

How many Peta spies does it take to pull off a staged animal abuse video..?

I can't imagine that there was more than 2 to 4 Peta spies working at rbm

And I can't imagine that those 2 to 4 spies were in charge of taking care of all the animals while the other 48 to 46 employees did what exactly...answered emails all day....

40 plus employees an no one say we or 3 employees sticking dozens of lizards to glue traps..or they did see it and didn't say anything

40 plus employees and they didn't notice any of the stuff you all are suggesting that the Peta spies did when nobody was looking

OK keep telling yourselves that...

It doesn't seem to matter if it's Wyatt wasting donation money and pushing for anti reptile legislation...the usark board covering it up...the big names in the industry lying to all of you or a wholesaler that sold out his own state and industry getting caught neglecting his animals.....you people always have an excuse..a reason to look the other way....a way to rationalize it so it's ok

I honestly don't know what happen in the PETA video. You talk like you where there, care to tell us what you saw?
 
I've notice in this thread people it was the Peta people that did that to the animals and didn't care for them....now I would like to point out in the article link I posted...if you read it it says rbm has 50 employees...
50 employees...
So I ask the question out of those 50 employees how many would need to be Peta spies to pull off that level of abuse and neglect?

How many Peta spies does it take to pull off a staged animal abuse video..?

I can't imagine that there was more than 2 to 4 Peta spies working at rbm

And I can't imagine that those 2 to 4 spies were in charge of taking care of all the animals while the other 48 to 46 employees did what exactly...answered emails all day....

40 plus employees an no one say we or 3 employees sticking dozens of lizards to glue traps..or they did see it and didn't say anything

40 plus employees and they didn't notice any of the stuff you all are suggesting that the Peta spies did when nobody was looking

OK keep telling yourselves that...

It doesn't seem to matter if it's Wyatt wasting donation money and pushing for anti reptile legislation...the usark board covering it up...the big names in the industry lying to all of you or a wholesaler that sold out his own state and industry getting caught neglecting his animals.....you people always have an excuse..a reason to look the other way....a way to rationalize it so it's ok

Of course, there is another way of looking at the numbers you are presenting. So there were 40+ people working at RBM at the same time that the alleged PETA spies were there, and these people, who most likely are people with at least a modest personal interest in animals, all aid and abet the conditions that PETA shows in the video? They ignore any such alleged animal abuse that PETA is apparently claiming as "normal" for RBM and come back to work day after day to have to go through all that as a normal part of their daily routine?

Seriously? What sort of people, who have enough interest in animals to want to have a job at RBM, could stand by and allow anything close to what PETA is portraying as par for the course to take place on their watch? And yes, quite likely the greater majority of all those other employees are also taking care of the animals, as you inferred. They would have to not only be NOT doing their jobs because of laziness and/or incompetence, but also PURPOSELY not doing their jobs maliciously to allow such abuses. How long do you think management at RBM would allow such employees to continue working there?

As a business, RBM cannot afford to NOT take care of their animals. Even from a strictly business sense, every animal that dies or is in such poor shape that it cannot be sold, is money lost. Even if everyone there had zero empathy for the animals, they are in the business to make money, and treating their marketable merchandise poorly is just a damned poor method of running business. Personally, I just do not think that likely, in the least. It is in their best interests to hire people with empathy towards the animals because people with that sort of empathy will strive to try their best to take care of those animals as best they can. To even infer that someone could hire semi-human robots in those numbers that would allow outright abuse to animals in their care just absolutely stretches credibility beyond belief. To infer that all of the employees and management at RBM are incompetent, malicious, or just too blind to notice those alleged abuses, is ludicrous.

IMHO, and certainly a rationalization (as you say) based on rational thinking.

And for the record, I sold quite a few animals to John Mack when I was in the business and talked to him at length several times. One thing he always seemed to bring into the conversation was his own reputation and how he endeavored to produce and offer the best quality animals that he could. He knew that his reputation was riding on every animal he shipped out the door. I seriously doubt that his attitude has changed, because he has to be fully aware that a good reputation is something that always has to be worked at constantly.

Anyway, about your question...
How many Peta spies does it take to pull off a staged animal abuse video..?

Actually all it takes is one. One person being around any large number of animals for a sufficient amount of time can take video footage of the worst situations and compile an "animal armageddon" style video. Animals will get sick, get injured and die. Everyone who works with animals knows this. Most don't video the heartbreaks they experience and post it on YouTube. But someone who WANTS to show the worst? Sure it would be easy enough to do for a single person to present a biased view, if they are so inclined.
 
Of course, there is another way of looking at the numbers you are presenting. So there were 40+ people working at RBM at the same time that the alleged PETA spies were there, and these people, who most likely are people with at least a modest personal interest in animals, all aid and abet the conditions that PETA shows in the video? They ignore any such alleged animal abuse that PETA is apparently claiming as "normal" for RBM and come back to work day after day to have to go through all that as a normal part of their daily routine?

Seriously? What sort of people, who have enough interest in animals to want to have a job at RBM, could stand by and allow anything close to what PETA is portraying as par for the course to take place on their watch? And yes, quite likely the greater majority of all those other employees are also taking care of the animals, as you inferred. They would have to not only be NOT doing their jobs because of laziness and/or incompetence, but also PURPOSELY not doing their jobs maliciously to allow such abuses. How long do you think management at RBM would allow such employees to continue working there?

As a business, RBM cannot afford to NOT take care of their animals. Even from a strictly business sense, every animal that dies or is in such poor shape that it cannot be sold, is money lost. Even if everyone there had zero empathy for the animals, they are in the business to make money, and treating their marketable merchandise poorly is just a damned poor method of running business. Personally, I just do not think that likely, in the least. It is in their best interests to hire people with empathy towards the animals because people with that sort of empathy will strive to try their best to take care of those animals as best they can. To even infer that someone could hire semi-human robots in those numbers that would allow outright abuse to animals in their care just absolutely stretches credibility beyond belief. To infer that all of the employees and management at RBM are incompetent, malicious, or just too blind to notice those alleged abuses, is ludicrous.

IMHO, and certainly a rationalization (as you say) based on rational thinking.

And for the record, I sold quite a few animals to John Mack when I was in the business and talked to him at length several times. One thing he always seemed to bring into the conversation was his own reputation and how he endeavored to produce and offer the best quality animals that he could. He knew that his reputation was riding on every animal he shipped out the door. I seriously doubt that his attitude has changed, because he has to be fully aware that a good reputation is something that always has to be worked at constantly.

Anyway, about your question...


Actually all it takes is one. One person being around any large number of animals for a sufficient amount of time can take video footage of the worst situations and compile an "animal armageddon" style video. Animals will get sick, get injured and die. Everyone who works with animals knows this. Most don't video the heartbreaks they experience and post it on YouTube. But someone who WANTS to show the worst? Sure it would be easy enough to do for a single person to present a biased view, if they are so inclined.

Blah blah....

Defend him like you use to defend Andrew Wyatt...it's what is expected from you.....
Seriously look at your own logic...you are really grasping at straws here...to say it only takes one Peta spy over a long time to do a video like that....
Well I'm guessing rbm knows who it was...so why don't they post all that information....like hire and fire dates....so we can put your theory to the test..

I suppose it was that same one Peta spy that implemented the glue tapes for those lizards too...right webslave. ...it was the Peta spy that came up with the glue trap idea and then hung them up all over the place....since rbm is so responsible I'm sure there isn't loose lizards running around so that means that one Peta spy stuck all those lizards to those glue traps when no one was looking. ..

Right is that what happened....all those caring rbm employees didn't know a thing about any of it....
 
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