Adam at Millenium Morphs...give me my money

[mdc]

I have seen him post it for sale twice on KS, but only for a day each time. The first time it was listed for $3500 and the second for $3000. If my refund depends on the sale of this animal, it should be sold for the same amount I paid. According to Adam's post on here, he is brokering the animal for me, so shouldn't I decide the selling price, or at least get all the money it sells for.

Matt Crabe

 

[Dembinski Reptiles]

Well, I'll chime in here. First, let me get this clear, before anyone starts bashing on me. I think Adam should just pay Matt ASAP and end this. Mistakes where made and we ALL make them. EVERY big name breeder that seems to have flawless reputations, HAS made mistakes. I have made mistakes, corrected them and moved on. And I feel this is what Adam should do here and learn from it.

But in Adams defense, Ill say he has no plan on ripping anyone off, as I have had first hand deals with Adam that would judge his chacter. We agreed on a trade a couple years ago. The trade was for a male Spider Ball Python and he only had 1 left. Well, after we came to terms, the White Plains show came up. I remember a friend of mine was to pick up the Spider from Adam. Adam noticed something different about the Spider and took it to NERDS table and asked Kevin's thoughts on it. Well, not only was it a male Spider Ball Python, but it was also Paradox. Adam found out that the value NERD put on that Spider and what they would sell it for was over 10K than what he traded it at. He still gave me the Spider and stated a deal was a deal !!! WOW, I just made 10k in a trade !!! Now, Im not one to screw anyone one out of anything, so I told Adam I could promise a offspring it proves genetic OR if he had another male, then Id give it back. Well, he contacted me and let me know he had a hold back Spider that was much larger. I told him I would take it. We meet at the Philly show and did the swap. I was still coming out ahead and this male was over 300 grams and even then, Adam stated a deal was a deal, and I could still keep the Paradox Spider !! I opted for the bigger Spider and flopped out. I just couldnt do that to anyone. And I think speaks volumes considering he still gave me the option to keep it, even though the Spiders value was 10K more than our deal. Adam seems like a great guy and Id hate to see his rep get hurt by this, so I hope Adam just sends his money back. We all have those goofy deals where things just don't line up right and I think that's the case here. Just my thoughts on dealing with Adam and hope everything works out for Matt and Adam in the end.

 

[Bighaze]

You know, your right, everyone has a bad deal every now and then.

BUT,

Adam has said, I have the money, BUT you will wait another 30 days before I'll give it to you. Now I don't think he has the money, but he might, he said he does. That kind of makes this worse, he could give it back but would rather make Matt wait, or he is just FOS about haveing the money.

So he is either a d.ck, or a liar, nither of which I would want to buy from.

 

[A_Kendergirl]

Wow...I'm really simply amazed that he would rather go down in flames than do what is right. Adam...going down in flames is exactly what you are doing right now. You pretty much sealed your fate with your last post.

You can add my list to the names of people who will never by a THING from you. I don't even have any snakes, but who knows what the future holds. As non-threatening (even laughable) as that sounds, just think of this...

I, a person with no snakes, find your actions so deplorable at this point that wouldn't (as Mike said) buy a cricket from you. We'll be generous and say you've lost an $0.08 future sale. Think it's funny, a drop in the bucket? Now you need to think of the people who ARE into snakes that are reading this...there are quite a few of them, and from the looks of things they feel much the way I do at this point. Some of them (I'm sure) have pockets that are MUCH deeper than mine...people that would agree that $2600 is a small amount (that is NOT my opinion). You are not just losing an $0.08 cent future sale from me....you are collectively losing $100,000+ in potential future sales from the members of this forum. You should have a cold shiver go down your spine right now. It's a hard concept to swallow, and I'm sure you don't feel the pinch yet...but it's coming. When it does, remember that it was your choice.

You HAD the opportunity to refund his money, still look good, and still make additional money off of the sale of the snake. Your refusal to do what is right is putting you DEEP in the red. You had been warned that it would get ugly, and now it has. Matt has given you one last chance to make things right before legal action is taken. You should be thanking him profusely, as you refund his money, that he has given you that chance. Trust me, you don't want a court to weigh in on this - you're most certainly on the losing side.

There's your bed, I hope you like sleeping in it.

Matt: I sincerely hope that when I wake up in the morning I find a post saying you've got your money back. If not, I wish you good tidings in your trek into the legal system.

I, for one, am done posting here - I've spoken my mind. I do look forward to updates to your situation Matt. This isn't a position anyone should have to be in.

 

[Otter_23]

As I stated before in one of my replies. I said to the people who do not understand, to go down to a local store that has a no cash refund policy and to buy something. Then go back a couple of days later and try to get a cash refund. You will be bashing that store on the BOI along with Matt Crabe. Do you understand a little more on where I am coming from. I am just being realistic.

My God do you read what you type. You can't see a difference between your analogy and your situation with Matt? Try this go to your local store buy something but leave it there and then go back and get a refund. I bet you can. See Matt never recieved his animal. You never followed through on your end of the agreement. Had he gotten the snake then maybe I could see your point but he didn't. Are you really having this hard of a time grasping this concept. I can't can't believe you have this type of reasoning skills and run a business. Your not being realistic your being penny wise/pound foolish. You have sunk your own ship.
Mark Westberg

 

[Casey Hulse]

I do not ever like having an unhappy customer. Regardless of who is right or wrong. I always do my best to make my customers as happy as possible.

Adam, if you mean what you say in that statment, you will refund Matt right away.
I know you feel angry that this was brought to the BOI, but it is a done deal,(maybe Matt should have given you a "last chance" before he posted). This thread will live for a long time here on Fauna, and there is still time for you to "see the light". It is a very bright light.

 

[ms_terese]

Adam, has anyone ever accused you of having control issues?

Every apology for any wrongdoing on your part is followed with a "but";

you've used continual condescending statements in regard to your "kindness" towards this lowly customer who had to arrange a payment plan and send money in "dribs and drabs";

you wordsmith your posts to allude to some corporate heirarchy and empire;

you continually point out that you will choose how to return Matt's money.

You may wish to see how the rest of the world views this, since apparently you've dismissed the fact that every opinion differs from yours.

You have horrible business practices, as evidenced by:

You have TOS that would NEVER hold up in court, but you don't have SOP for shipments (animal is paid for, you have a certain amount of time to ship);

you have horrid accounting practices (no firm date of when you received/deposited the payment);

you have lax communication standards (constant excuses for why you didn't check email or return calls);

Stop opening new ventures and learn some basic business skills. I think you're probably a nice guy who has nice animals, but you have much to learn on how to conduct business.

 

[Serpwidgets]

As I stated before in one of my replies. I said to the people who do not understand, to go down to a local store that has a no cash refund policy and to buy something. Then go back a couple of days later and try to get a cash refund. You will be bashing that store on the BOI along with Matt Crabe. Do you understand a little more on where I am coming from. I am just being realistic.

I don't think this analogy is realistic. Instead, try this one:

You go to the local store to purchase a $2600 glass figurine to add to your collection. You bring it to the checkout line, the cashier takes your money, hands you your receipt, and then in the process of bagging your item, drops it on the floor and it is shattered into a million pieces. You are then told that (too bad, so sad) cash refunds are against the store's policy, and all they can do is give you store credit... and that they will have another one in stock a year from now. But, as a special favor to you, they will hold on to your money for 60 days and at that time issue you a refund.

 

[SPJ]

You guys are not going to get anywhere with Adam.

He has made up his mind that the refund will come if and when he is good and ready to send it.

Time to let the CC company and the authorities handle this.

Adam isn't going to do the right thing.

Adam
Since you seem to think $2600 is such a small amount of money, why in the world would you ruin your reputaion over it?
I just don't understand your reasoning (and neither does anyone else).

Keep us posted Matt on how the refund goes.
Hopefully you will get it back soon.

 

[Chris@TSE]

Frankly I would pull that cashier over the friggin' counter and beat his head in.............

All I know is this fool is now making his customer pay for trusting his buyer to ship, causing him lost wages, and failing to respond promptly to correspondence. But we all see the buyer made prompt payment, followed his side of the transaction to a "T" and made every effort to contact and obtain this animal.

The seller dropped the ball here, It is so obvious it is sickening....

Even he has admitted this, yet he is hiding behind his TOS to a fault.

Ride that wave man........ You'll see where it has taken you soon enough.

You can rest assured you lost many potential customers here, thats for sure. Not that it matters to you.....

What a stand up guy..... Can admit his fault and still screw his customer. Kudos.

 

[KNOBTAIL]

How do you explain this feat of your midget thinking

Originally Posted by MillenniumMorph
"As I stated before in one of my replies. I said to the people who do not understand, to go down to a local store that has a no cash refund policy and to buy something. Then go back a couple of days later and try to get a cash refund. You will be bashing that store on the BOI along with Matt Crabe. Do you understand a little more on where I am coming from. I am just being realistic."

But the store did not keep the item and the money! Dummy!

 

[Chris@TSE]

And the logic in adams anology is mentally retarded.

sure, I'll go down to that cash store with no refund policy and buy something.

GUESS WHAT? I'll GET WHAT I PAID FOR WHICH IS MORE THAN ANYONE CAN SAY FOR YOU RIGHT NOW!

You did not fulfill your obligations as the seller. You failed miserably.

Your customer had every damn right to request his money back, you stalled long enough. You failed to ship, you failed to reply, you failed failed failed.

Give him his money back. Simple as that.

You're making him pay for YOUR mistakes. Now thats LOW. And when I mean low, I mean low.

Frankly after this is said and done I'd seriously doubt any educated or knowledgable buyer will be purchasing anything from you. You have no idea what you are doing to yourself and your reputation by sticking to your guns on such a stupid pathetic little false sense of righteousness. You're wrong. Stop making excuses and do the right thing.

I hope you pay someone one of these days just like your customer has.... I hope that seller fails to respond to you, fails to ship when promised, and makes YOU jump through hoops. Finally, when all is said and done and you have had enough and wish to obtain your money back.... THEY make YOU wait until they sell that animal. They make YOU wait for their mistakes....

Talk about a kick in the teeth. Not only have you screwed your customer, but he's on the ground... bleeding... And you're twisting the knife.

I'm sorry, I can no longer participate in this thread. You disgust me.

My apologies to the staff here.

Best of luck Matt, I'm sorry this had to happen to you.

 

[mdc]

I would like to comment on the poster that said maybe I should have given Adam one more chance before coming to the BOI. I feel I gave Adam multiple chances to right the situation, but he failed to email me back or call me. I even left him a message that if I didn't get my money, that I would bring it to the BOI - but as usual, no response from Adam.

Joe D. I understand your post, but just because Adam didn't rip you off in the past, doesn't mean he hasn't changed his ways. He has had my payment in full since July along with the merchandise. It is now October and I still have nothing. As far as I'm concerned, he has ripped me off.

It is Wednesday morning now and not so much as an email or call from Adam. I have already contacted my CC company and started the process of disputing the downpayment. I have also downloaded a claim form from the Suffolk County Executive's Office of Consumer Affairs. Since my checks and CC payment were made out to Adam's business name of Millenium Morphs, I can go through this department and maybe not have to travel to New York for small claims court. It is also easier to collect from his business than from a single person.

Adam, it will take me the rest of the day to fill this form out and mail it off. If you get me my money before the final mail pickup today, I won't send it off. After that, it is out of my hands.

Matt Crabe

 

[Bighaze]

I have been doing some thinking, No,no,no adam is still a ............., but I was thinking about how long this has been going on.

Matt sent the deposit back in May, how long can you wait till you file a complaint with the CC company?

"Adam accepted the offer and I called him on May 27, 2005 to pay the $1500 deposit with a credit card."

It's been like 5 months is it too late? I think someone said you had 90 days, if that is the case, shouldn't Matt just file the court case for the full amount+ the time off work, court cost, and I think there is a way to get something for the lost income he would of made from breeding her. Not sure about the last one, never been sued, and have never sued anyone(knock on wood) but have known people who have sued.

Damm you add all that up, and the $2600 would look like chump change(to some) way to go there Adam.

Of course if I'm wrong let me know.

 

[mdc]

I contacted my CC company and told them the situation and the date, and they replied that they would get the process started right away. No mention of 90 days, so hopefully since I never received the "product", there is no limitation on time. Also, like I said, I'm going to try using this Consumer Affairs division from Adam's county before filing a lawsuit. This division of Consumer Affairs assigns an investigator and I believe can enter a judgement against his business. I will be speaking to them on the phone today to get more info. I will also be going for the whole amount through this, just in case the CC company doesn't come through.

Matt Crabe

 

[Chris@TSE]

Good Job. I am glad to hear you are taking steps to obtain your money, this will surely end up costing him MUCH more than the initial $2600 in the long run. Well deserved too.

 

[Bighaze]

Matt you must of posted that why I was still typing out my reply. Glad to hear the CC company is going to do something.

Good Luck!

 

[Alias47]

But Matt and I spoke the very first night in regards to the return policy and he was more than clear on our terms. That is another reason why I am sticking to my guns.

Ummm...I know you have this nice fantasy about company policy and your hard line adherence to your Terms of Sale...and Matt may very well have been fully aware of these things...however...you tacitly admit through your own words that this TOS of Biblical importance DOES NOT APPLY HERE!!!!

This is a RETURN policy...
You never sent him anything to return...

For over three months now...he has not been sent a refund...or his merchandise...sounds like GRAND THEFT to me...

Sorry for beating the horse...but I cannot let this one go...for someone who seems to have such a high regard for himself...as well as a couple people saying what a swell guy he is...the stubborness and ignorance are overwhelming...makes me want to yell out loud.

 

[Laura Fopiano]

Good for you Matt

I hope that this all works out for you, and to those who doubt the power of the BOI............................So sorry for your loss Adam!!

Keep us posted!!!

 

[KNOBTAIL]

the 90 days would apply to a return, but

their is nothing to return in this situation because you received nothing. Also, I would complain to the credit card company about his policy. When you sign up with Mastercard/etc., you agree to abide by the rules and regulations of the credit card company as the TOS for your own business. You cannot change these rules to suit your needs.

He was legally obligated in providing either the product or the refund within a reasonable time. So I dont think you will have any problem in recouping the monies through his credit card carrier. But I would send them a strong letter, and if enough people follow suit, he could be easily bounced off from using credit cards in the future as a sales method.

Finally, if his business is not a legal corporation (in the state he resides in ), he can be sued personally. My strong suggestion would be to no longer attempt to make contact with him. Their is no advantage at this point, and he may attempt to strengthen his position by maintaining a line of communication that would only benefit him.