Beware of Steve Weissman aka Santa Cruz Reptiles

[Dr Owens]

Is Dave taking any legal actions, $7,500 is a lot to lose.

Yes, but I wouldn't want to comment on that publicly.

 

[Junkyard]

Understood, thanks.

 

[lars5277]

I usually don't post here too much. I research buyers and keep my mouth shut. I thought this news article might shed a little light on the situation.

I will post the article link and the article. I will post in bold some of the more interesting points. Keeep in mind the dates on the story.

http://www.ktvu.com/news/7965222/detail.html

Snakes Stolen From Santa Cruz Dealer

POSTED: 10:35 am PST March 13, 2006

SANTA CRUZ, Calif -- More than $10,000 worth of snakes were stolen from a local dealer.

The vipers disappeared while being shipped from Santa Cruz to customers nationwide, Sheriff's Department investigators said.

The first snake, a Super Pastel Ball Python worth $7,000, was boxed up for shipment to a customer in Kansas, but the customer said the shipping box was empty when it arrived.

The Santa Cruz Reptiles owner, whose name was withheld because he fears he will be the target of future thefts, was suspicious. He's never lost a snake during 10 years in business.

Then, a week ago, the snake dealer packed up four female pythons worth about $3,000 and shipped them via United Parcel Service to a long-standing customer in Georgia. The reptiles were missing when the box arrived.

The snake dealer told deputies he normally hands the packaged snakes directly to a UPS driver. However, he brought both packages that arrived empty to a shop that handles packages for shipment.

"Anything that has value is of interest to criminals. It's no different than any other crime. In terms of the investigation, it's grand theft," sheriff's Sgt. Fred Plageman said.

I am not taking sides in this, but Steve may be keeping his mouth shut for a reason. My only problem is that Steve said he packed the box himself and told the authorities a different story.

 

[lars5277]

Sorry for the large font, I didn't want it to be that big. I just wanted it to stand out a little.

 

[Cat_72]

Hm.......that's an interesting note, Lars. Thanks for posting it.

I did find it funny that the missing snakes were "vipers" in the beginning of the article though, lol.

 

[Chameleon Company]

Lars,
Thanks for getting that into the thread. I will stick with the small type though. I was critical of Steve earlier, and still am in spite of this latest twist. While there may or may not be a true third-party theft here, my criticism then still stands now, in that Steve did not honor his TOS to the customer. If this UPS drop-off is the source of the problem, it is still due to a choice made by Steve. I could speculate forever about the likelihood of the surgical box opening and reclosure, but it is possible in this scenario if the theft occured at the drop-off point. If a polygraph can be brought into play here, now that the police are well involved, I am sure the truth will be forthcoming shortly. This has the possible makings of being a very unique situation, but as you point out, there may be one inconsistency here, and it is for law-enforcement authorities to sort through. Are the authorities aware of the contradiction that you point out? If not, you may want to forward it for them to digest. As you notice more info on this, please keep us posted. I think it a safe guess that someone will go down on this one as the crime has been repeated, as once again, the greed of the thief will be his or her undoing. Whoever the thief is, they just got stupid.

 

[Chameleon Company]

One other thing. David and Dr. Owens would now seem to be removed from the list of co-conspirators in a felony theft. That was obvious to many of us early on. For those who posted earlier in the thread suggesting that the only logical explanation was that they had integrity issues, how do you like your crow pie served?

 

[lars5277]

I called the local sherifs's department in that area and informed them of the inconstistencies. What can I say, it's Monday night and I have chosen not to have a life since it was sucked out of me all day long. I am sure something funky is going on here, I'll let the police sort it from here.

 

[Chameleon Company]

Lars, I'm glad you picked up on it, and ...

What can I say, it's Monday night and I have chosen not to have a life since it was sucked out of me all day long.

Don't think that any of the NCAA's will be played on Monday nights, but Monday Night Football will be back (albeit on ESPN) in less than six months !! On a side note, the use of the drop off ... lets assume a UPS store .... just demonstrates the added risk every time you allow one more set of hands into the mix. Most of us schedule a pick-up, are signed-up for daily pick-ups, or take it straight to a main service center. Not to discount the UPS stores in general, which I believe are mostly if not all franchises, but if you stick with dedicated UPS employees, you keep a higher standard of handling inherent with your shipment.

 

[chondroqueen]

Man, shipping reptiles just got stickier....I was just curious why we hadnt heard anything from the other buyer who was supposedly receiving the female ball pythons? Why didnt they come here and post about not receiving their snakes either? I wonder if they dont know about the BOI, because if they would have came here and said "hey, wait a minute, Steve is not to blame, as I received an empty box as well" that would have changed the song a little right? I still dont understand why-If Steve really in his heart knew that he had shipped the snake- he didnt come here and defend himself....why he didnt get to the bottom of this in the beginning. I know for a FACT one thing....he made one big big boo boo and that was shipping a 7500 dollar snake via UPS in the first place.

 

[KelliH]

My only problem is that Steve said he packed the box himself and told the authorities a different story.

Where is it stated that Steve told the cops he did not pack the box?

 

[Chameleon Company]

ChondroQueen, you raise some good points in your post:

Man, shipping reptiles just got stickier....I was just curious why we hadnt heard anything from the other buyer who was supposedly receiving the female ball pythons? Why didnt they come here and post about not receiving their snakes either? I wonder if they dont know about the BOI, because if they would have came here and said "hey, wait a minute, Steve is not to blame, as I received an empty box as well" that would have changed the song a little right? I still dont understand why-If Steve really in his heart knew that he had shipped the snake- he didnt come here and defend himself....why he didnt get to the bottom of this in the beginning. I know for a FACT one thing....he made one big big boo boo and that was shipping a 7500 dollar snake via UPS in the first place.

With the authorities definitely involved now, it may have been reason enough for the most recent victim to stay away from the BOI. Like many, I would be curious to see how Steve handled that customer, as I am one who currently believes that the onus is still on him to make good on both losses. As for where the current blame may still lie, I think that the only people eliminated, from what little we know, would be the two customers, unless there could be shown to be a conspiratorial link between them. Steve and his business, and the entity that shipped this, UPS and its affiliates, are still suspect. If Steve has not yet returned the money to these customers, or made adequate replacements, just like the "boo-boo" that you note, I find it worthy of at least a raised eyebrow.

 

[lars5277]

Where is it stated that Steve told the cops he did not pack the box?

You're right I read the article and posts the wrong way.

Still Steve has four problems in my opinion. 1. He broke his routine this is normally not good. 2. He still has a TOS to honor. 3. He broke the rules by shipping through UPS. 4. He probably practiced bad OPSEC (Google it), by that I mean he probaly said "Hey man these are real expensive snakes, take care of them please." to the guy at the store. These snakes were targeted (if they were), because he gave out too much information. No one had to know what was in the box period. He probably knew the guy at the UPS store and chatted him up for a few minutes.

 

[kmurphy]

This whole deal is just weird. So someone in the shipping company that Steve went to carefully opened the box, removed the styrofoam liner and the contents, then re-taped the box so that it looked untouched. Since that went so well they decided to try again. I guess they were planning on doing it until they got caught. Just doesn't seem plausible to me.

 

[KelliH]

Still Steve has four problems in my opinion. 1. He broke his routine this is normally not good. 2. He still has a TOS to honor. 3. He broke the rules by shipping through UPS. 4. He probably practiced bad OPSEC (Google it), by that I mean he probaly said "Hey man these are real expensive snakes, take care of them please." to the guy at the store. These snakes were targeted (if they were), because he gave out too much information. No one had to know what was in the box period. He probably knew the guy at the UPS store and chatted him up for a few minutes.

Steve should obviously send David a replacement snake. He should then do whatever he needs to do in order to keep this from happening in the future.

 

[Dr Owens]

This whole deal is just weird. So someone in the shipping company that Steve went to carefully opened the box, removed the styrofoam liner and the contents, then re-taped the box so that it looked untouched. Since that went so well they decided to try again. I guess they were planning on doing it until they got caught. Just doesn't seem plausible to me.

It doesn't seem plausible because it's not. If I had to guess, I would say that Steve is probably trying to cover his tracks after he found out that he'd committed a felony (and that the detectives here in O.P. were very interested in pursuing this case.)

Steve should obviously send David a replacement snake. He should then do whatever he needs to do in order to keep this from happening in the future.

You're exactly right. I don't know if it will help him avoid criminal charges or not, but it certainly wouldn't hurt his case.

 

[varnyard]

There is no way the snake was in the box on the day in question. By Steve's own admission. The box was shipped and the weight at the time of pick up/drop off was one pound. We keep hashing this out but facts are facts. There is no way the box weighed 1 pound/ 16 oz and had the needed items in tact. Snake, heat packs, Styrofoam liner, cup/bag tape label and the box as well. Would this all not weigh more than one pound? On top of all of this DR Owens was there on the day in question. His reputation speaks for itself IMO. He said the box was empty, IMO his word is proof enough along with the proof Steve provided in his statement here about the weight of the box.
The box weight is 12 oz, that leaves 4 oz for the snake, Styrofoam, tape, label, and the bag/cup. There are the facts. Also Steve's TOS clearly says he guarantees a live delivery. I might add he is having trouble honering. IMO it is clear cut in every way.

 

[varnyard]

I said 4 oz for the Styrofoam, tape, label, and the bag/cup. I forgot to add the heat pack as well.
Someone suggested I weigh the items in question, so I took their advice. I weighed a 12 oz box just like the one in question, a small 40 hour heat pack the 1/2 inch Styrofoam liner, one 100 gram ball python, and a small snake bag. The total was 1 pound 9 oz. That is without the tape and label. I will be calling UPS to see if it is possible to round off 1 pound 9 oz to 1 pound. I think I know what they will say, but every time I have done any shipping (which is all the time) The weight is rounded off to the higher number. I will post their answer. I will also ask if a 12 oz empty box would still round off to 1 pound. In any case Steve’s TOS is still in question, IMO. I have a question? If it is not up to Steve to make this right then who is the one to take the loss? The buyer that bought a empty box? IMO, I think not. How could we call ourselves a good seller if the buyer does not get what they paid for? Even if it is a $10.00 snake or a 10,000.00 snake, it is up to the seller to make good on the deal. Even if it was not in Steve’s TOS, would we be able to say we done the right thing and call ourselves a good seller if the buyer must take the loss and never receive what his hard earned dollars paid for? IMO, no!! It is up to the seller to take all responsibility for shipping errors. We take that chance when we trust the shipper to deliver the package, and it is up to us to make it right if they don't. I do not know David or Steve, and never had the pleasure of meeting either of them. But as a seller I do know what is right and what is wrong. If Steve did in fact ship the snake as he has said. And someone took the snake at a UPS hub. Then does this make it right to make the buyer responsible for the loss? IMO, no way, shape, or form. This post is just based on my own opinion, as well as the facts in these threads.

 

[Chameleon Company]

Bobby,
I appreciate all of the calculations that you have done with regard to weight, etc. There was some discussion of it early in the thread as well. Without reviewing all, I think it even possible that there was some indication that Steve had been the one to record the weight. Like you and many others here, there is no doubt in my mind that Steve is responsible to the two buyers, not only because of TOS, but also other poor choices and irregularities in these events. But weight is not one of them. Air Freight via UPS is not an exact "by weight" calculation. Exact weight is not relative to the shipment, as they charge by "dimensional weight", assigning a weight based on size, and then billing that "size weight". There is no requirement that there be an accurate weight recorded, or if one is written down, that it be accurate. In all my shipments, UPS has a spot for me to record the weight in, then bills me a new higher amount once I enter the dimensions of the box. I therefore only record a token "actual" weight, where whatever the box might truly weigh (assume 2.4 lbs), I enter 4 lbs as actual weight as I have no need for an accurate weight, for UPS will then bill me for 6 lbs based on the measurements of the box.

Perhaps the weight issue could be dissected if this ended up in court and people where then made to contradict themselves based on sworn testimony. But as written on the box, it need have been no more than a very bad estimate, as there was no need or reason for it to be accurate, and we just don't know enough to make any more of it than that. It does make for interesting speculation though!

 

[Torin]

Just checking because I was very interested in this, has it been resolved, or is action still pending?

Did a search and didn't see anything new.