Bill Leverton SCAMMER beware

[Lee Herps]

The newest phrase under your moniker says "I'm not your roll model". Just curious if someone hinted that you were like a jelly donut ...... you know, one thing on the outside and full of something different on the inside, or if maybe you meant to say "role model" ??

Jim Flaherty
The Chameleon Company, LLC

LOL Thats funny Jim

 

[Laura Fopiano]

Okay boys

Step away from the key boards, and allow this to sink back where it belongs. I've seen nothing positive or enlightening added to this thread, it has taken up to much time from all of our lives.
Now deep breath in hold it.......exhale.......Don't you all feel better. Peace out guys and have a groovy week end!!

 

[Chris@TSE]

Found/fixed your camera? How miraculous!

http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/pp_classifieds/showproduct.php?product=10166

 

[critical bill]

Sweet Steals!

In his description where it says, "I got some sweet deals", I paused for a second and my lip curled to a slight grin.

 

[Lucille]

I have been keeping my eyes on the classifieds since I am on the lookout for Vision cages, and I must say that I really am appalled that Bill seems to have decided that he needs to stay in the reptile biz.

On the other hand, there are many posts and warnings; this is a PRIME example of the value of doing your research prior to purchase; in general but especially on the BOI.

 

[Otter_23]

For the love of God let it die. He stole he lied etc.... all of it is right here on the fuana where he posted. Why is this thread like a dead body? It keeps floating to the top and stinking. I know what Bill did is beyond inexcusable but for the people that haven't read this thread do you think there is going to be many that will take the time to read the entire thing? The sheer volume makes it a daunting task and the last 100 or so pages have not really added new evidence or deals. Just my thoughts.
Mark Westberg

 

[Chris@TSE]

YEs, I had said similar in the past... But guess what? I was also told something mighty interesting, I'll pass it along to you.

Don't like it? Don't read it.

Good day to you.....

 

[Otter_23]

I love you guys.

 

[Chris@TSE]

I love you too.

 

[gmherps]

we all have so much love for one another!!

 

[Suncoast Herpetological]

For the love of God let it die. He stole he lied etc.... all of it is right here on the fuana where he posted. Why is this thread like a dead body? It keeps floating to the top and stinking. I know what Bill did is beyond inexcusable but for the people that haven't read this thread do you think there is going to be many that will take the time to read the entire thing? The sheer volume makes it a daunting task and the last 100 or so pages have not really added new evidence or deals. Just my thoughts.
Mark Westberg

Mark

The highlighted portion of your post says it all. What he did is inexcusable and, therefore, should not ever be excused. I, personally like the idea of this thread being subject to periodic resurrection since Bill has decided to remain active in this trade. It makes the info all that much more accessible to those who may need it

 

[Otter_23]

I understand but is what he did worse than what Sal and others like him have done. What makes it worse for Bill is that he was deemed a good guy fallen from grace. Yet I can name many others on this forum that have done inexcusable things and yet were given the opportunity to redeem and some that have made it. I guess I just don't see Bill given this same chance. Maybe thats how it has to be but I can name many people right now that in my opinion have done far worse and suffered far less from this board. Don't get me wrong I won't do business with Bill for a long time and am appalled by his actions. Maybe I am answering my own question in that if a police officer falls from grace its alot less acceptable than if some citizen or common thief did the same thing. I just might be to forgiving etc... As far as I am concerned though I at this point would not do business with Bill on the other hand I would do business with him before I would many others on this forum and that includes those who continue to defend and support known rip off artists (I'm talking about the continual con man).

 

[Laura Fopiano]

One bad deal and no one will let this nightmare rest, and yes I have been on this thread since it's conseption. Comparing Bill and Sal.......there's no comparison. How many name changes bad business dealings, and job changes that left a trail of deceit and thievery have Sal had????????? This makes me very angry, I didn't know the man until this all came out, and I know this man now.
Wendy took a lot of heat for being his friend, and I guess it's now my turn, because he is mine too. And I a stupid woman? Hardly, seeking lower companionship? I think not. I've been in trouble in this industry for far worse than Bill, and what a change he actually talks to me.........I understand that there are a lot of hurt and betrayed feelings between some of you and Bill, but that is between you guys and him. This thread needs to die before it winds up in hell.
Let the buyer find out on their own and allow them to make a informed decision on what they care to read.

 

[Lucille]

Laura, I understand and admire the concept of sticking up for a friend. And, you have indeed been in the industry for a while and your opinions are valuable.

But, the opinions of others have value also. This thread had pretty much ended; but by advertising and stating that he was going to remain in the business, Bill is once again in the forefront and like any who do business, subject to discussion on the BOI.

The BOI serves a valuable function; and this decision by Bill to try to resurrect his business is new and people do have feelings about it. Beating a dead horse (where on earth did that phrase originate?) is one thing;
but when there is new information, and it concerns a vendor, that falls squarely within the purview of the BOI and those people who have something to say on the subject are, in my opinion, supporting the purpose of the BOI by discussing that new information.

 

[Lucille]

Let the buyer find out on their own and allow them to make a informed decision on what they care to read.

There are two parts to this sentence and I would like to address both of them.

First, 'Let the buyer find out on their own'. The entire thrust behind the BOI is that buyers should NOT have to find out on their own; that they should get to see what kind of prior deals a seller has made before the buyer sends off his or her hard earned dollars. This has saved potential customers untold and large amounts of money and heartache.

Second, 'Allow them to make an informed decision on what they care to read'.
I agree absolutely. Every day, on Fauna, there are hundreds of new posts. I make a decision on what I choose to read that day based on the forum, the title, and my own curiosity. If a potential buyer from Bill sees this post and chooses to disregard it, that is their prerogative.

But others should not try to preempt their prerogative by directing silence on the thread when there is new activity. Bill told us all he was leaving the industry and selling out, and now he is advertising that he is back in business.
People have a right to read and decide what they want to do and how they want to make their purchases. That right should not be taken from them.

 

[DragonCharm]

One bad deal and no one will let this nightmare rest, and yes I have been on this thread since it's conseption. Comparing Bill and Sal.......there's no comparison. How many name changes bad business dealings, and job changes that left a trail of deceit and thievery have Sal had????????? This makes me very angry, I didn't know the man until this all came out, and I know this man now.
Wendy took a lot of heat for being his friend, and I guess it's now my turn, because he is mine too. And I a stupid woman? Hardly, seeking lower companionship? I think not. I've been in trouble in this industry for far worse than Bill, and what a change he actually talks to me.........I understand that there are a lot of hurt and betrayed feelings between some of you and Bill, but that is between you guys and him. This thread needs to die before it winds up in hell.
Let the buyer find out on their own and allow them to make a informed decision on what they care to read.

One bad deal is one bad deal too many. He flat out stole the snake and lied.....that proves he can and will do it. IMO that makes him as bad as the others, not in the volume of the theft but based on the fact that he can decieve people without hesitation. Once a liar and a cheat always a liar and a cheat. The minute someone trys to give him another chance he'll probably do the same thing again.

 

[The BoidSmith]

Originally Posted by The BoidSmith
Bill,
You still seem to find amusing to insult the intelligence of the people that frequent this site, both openly and in private.
I dont try to openly but the privite thing has got me lost.
__________________
Bill Leverton

Bill,

It was off topic to continue this conversation in the Tom Crutchfield thread. But I didn’t want to be the one to bump this thread to the top either. You probably think that if you stick around there are people that will soften-up. And to a certain extent it’s working. You were told that with time some people will forgive. But you were also told that most will never forget. If you use Faunaclassifieds to advertise your items you can expect your past to be brought-up to light. Posting in other sites is no guarantee that it will not happen. Now, back to your statement: “I dont try to openly but the privite thing has got me lost.. Below is your e-mails to me and my replies. Stealing a boa in itself was enough to ban you from the circle of “trustable” people. But if that was not enough you further betrayed the trust of those you privately tried to convince that this was all a big misunderstanding. Among the things you told me (the rest can be read in your e-mails) you said you were sending the money and the boa back. What a surprise! You just sent the money and tried to sell the boa again. Can you see the deception still going on? You told me you were out of snakes for good? You got it far too easy. Some people mentioned in other threads broke the law and paid with jail. You, on the other hand broke the law, denied it in the open and continued to do so in private. Only when the evidence was overwhelming you decided to confess. But then you continued to play with some people’s trust. And now you ask everyone to forgive and forget? You are compared to people that have been in jail for breaking the law. Unfair comparison in my opinion, you broke it repeatedly and got off far too easy. You can go on with your life but rest assured that although most might be able to forgive your actions they will not forget. If someone chooses to send money your way in the future it’s their prerogative, although don’t count me among those.

Here’s our e-mail exchange (first e-mails in the bottom). Re-read it Bill, and try to convince me again why I should now trust you. My apologies to those that don’t want to read this again.

Dan I said Im not posting anymore on that thread ..Do you really think that
I would accept any apologies after all of this I paid Lee his money plus
what he borrowed as far as Im concerned I'm done with this deal and I'll
continue reading what people have to say and take it as I see it, Just a
bunch of chest thumping and trying to be the alpha male I have nothing left
to prove I'll let people think what they want from now on and I really dont
feel my life needs to be put under a micro scope Its done the partys
involved have concluded Business Billy

>From: "Alvaro Garcia" <[email protected]>
>To: "Bill Leverton" <[email protected]>
>Subject: Re: Fwd: Fwd: The Deal - Clearwater Reptiles
>Date: Fri, 22 Jul 2005 13:20:50 -0500
>
>>But I do need you all to do me one last favor Not word one please till I
>>drop this On the thread Please..even if it makes me look worse then I do
>>now Thank Billy
>
>Bill,
>
>OK, we kept our word. By now you should have both snakes with you. When are
>you going to post the pictures of both and your explanation? How about the
>police and UPS reports? How about the name of the person who bought the
>snake from you and tracking number of the shipping? Believe it or not this
>is very important as it will show how a picture can deceive dozens of
>people. It might turn around the whole concept of the picture ID thing.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Dan
>
>A.D. Garcia
>----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Leverton"
><[email protected]>
>To: <[email protected]>
>Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:50 PM
>Subject: Re: Fwd: Fwd: The Deal - Clearwater Reptiles
>
>
>>Dan I think you missed my point Im sending it back(snake & money) And I'm
>>Gone no coming back under assumed names or anything like that..I did my
>>best to make myself clear on what happened so If somebody comes across
>>this thread and happens to say hey I know that guy great...If its a bad
>>thing then so be that I told you Im sorry for the way I handled this whole
>>thing, I wont open my life up to questions all I know is Im walking away
>>with a clear conscience and thats all that matters to me.Billy
>>
>>>From: [email protected]
>>>To: Bill Leverton <[email protected]>
>>>CC: [email protected], [email protected]
>>>Subject: Re: Fwd: Fwd: The Deal - Clearwater Reptiles
>>>Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 13:37:28 -0500
>>>
>>>Bill,
>>>
>>>Alright then, but that information is not only for the people in the BOI.
>>>It's
>>>actually me who needs reassurance. Could you give me the contact
>>>information of
>>>the person who bought from you the boa in the picture? You can't just
>>>return the
>>>boa and think everything will go back to normal. You need to show that
>>>there was
>>>in fact another boa that's almost identical to the one you are returning.
>>>
>>>Thanks,
>>>
>>>Dan
>>>
>>>Quoting Bill Leverton <[email protected]>:
>>>
>>> > Dan, If they did not get this E-mail then their opinion dont matter to
>>>me no
>>> > more Billy
>>> >
>>> > >From: "Alvaro Garcia" <[email protected]>
>>> > >To: "Bill Leverton" <[email protected]>
>>> > >CC: <[email protected]>, <[email protected]>
>>> > >Subject: Re: Fwd: Fwd: The Deal - Clearwater Reptiles
>>> > >Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 12:53:40 -0500
>>> > >
>>> > >Bill,
>>> > >
>>> > >You can't just send the boa back and walk away. It's not only your >
>>> >name
>>> > >that's now on the line but also those that got involved in that
>>>thread
>>>and
>>> > >manifested their opinion, Ben Siegel among them. You will have to
>>>provide
>>> > >the information of the person you sold the snake to. Additional
>>>pictures of
>>> > >that snake will be requested from him to compare them to the pictures
>>>of
>>> > >the boa you will be sending Lee. In addition all police and UPS >
>>> >reports
>>>as
>>> > >well as their contact information.
>>> > >
>>> > >Thanks,
>>> > >
>>> > >Dan
>>> > >
>>> > >A.D. Garcia
>>> > >----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Leverton"
>>> > ><[email protected]>
>>> > >To: <[email protected]>
>>> > >Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 12:41 PM
>>> > >Subject: RE: Fwd: Fwd: The Deal - Clearwater Reptiles
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >>Dan thank you The best I can say right now Is I will send Lee the
>>>snake
>>> > >>and the money and just walk away Im not wrong in what I'm doing and
>>>I
>>> > >>thought that I was doing the right thing here, up until this thing
>>>my
>>>life
>>> > >>was not a question and answer and I will not let it be now. Lee will
>>>get
>>> > >>the snake and money and how ever it looks so be it. Thank you for >
>>> >>your
>>> > >>thoughts Billy
>>> > >>
>>> > >>>From: [email protected]
>>> > >>>To: Bill Leverton <[email protected]>
>>> > >>>Subject: RE: Fwd: Fwd: The Deal - Clearwater Reptiles
>>> > >>>Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 11:55:46 -0500
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>>Bill,
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>>Now I noticed this:
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>> > As I told you on the phone the
>>> > >>> >snake in the picture was sold and shipped...
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>>You will need to contact the person who bought it from you so
>>>he/she
>>>can
>>> > >>>provide
>>> > >>>some pictures for you as well as his contact information. You will
>>>also
>>> > >>>need to
>>> > >>>provide copies of any documents from the police and/or UPS that
>>> > >>>corroborate you
>>> > >>>story. Once you receive the snake back from the police they will >
>>> >>>make
>>>you
>>> > >>>sign a
>>> > >>>receipt. Keep it and post it in the BOI. That's the only way I can
>>>see
>>> > >>>this go
>>> > >>>away. Why in the world would you admitt guilt if you were not >
>>> >>>guilty?
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>>Thanks,
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>>Dan
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>>Quoting Bill Leverton <[email protected]>:
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>> > Dan the reason is they are 2 different snakes Billy
>>> > >>> >
>>> > >>> > >From: [email protected]
>>> > >>> > >To: [email protected]
>>> > >>> > >Subject: Fwd: Fwd: The Deal - Clearwater Reptiles
>>> > >>> > >Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 10:52:21 -0500
>>> > >>> > >
>>> > >>> > >Bill,
>>> > >>> > >
>>> > >>> > >I received the message from Wendy. Once you post this new > >>>
>>> > >version
>>>you
>>> > >>>will
>>> > >>> > >need
>>> > >>> > >to be ready to post proof of what you are saying. That will
>>>include >
>>> > >>> >and
>>> > >>>not
>>> > >>> > >be
>>> > >>> > >limited to any police reports, UPS contacts, etc. There are
>>>certain
>>> > >>>things
>>> > >>> > >that
>>> > >>> > >still don't ad up. Maybe I'm missing something but you have
>>>different
>>> > >>> > >pictures
>>> > >>> > >of the same snake (that IMO even shows some growth when
>>>compared
>>>to
>>> > >>>Lee's
>>> > >>> > >initial pictures) although the snake was never in your > >>> >
>>> >possesion?
>>>How
>>> > >>>were
>>> > >>> > >you
>>> > >>> > >able to take those pictures? Why not giving Lee the true story
>>>right
>>> > >>>away
>>> > >>> > >in
>>> > >>> > >private? You will have to be ready to answer those questions
>>>and
>>>more
>>> > >>>when
>>> > >>> > >you
>>> > >>> > >posts this new version of the story.
>>> > >>> > >
>>> > >>> > >Dan
>>> > >>> > >
>>> > >>> > >----- Forwarded message from [email protected] -----
>>> > >>> > > Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 10:25:28 EDT
>>> > >>> > > From: [email protected]
>>> > >>> > >Reply-To: [email protected]
>>> > >>> > > Subject: Fwd: The Deal - Clearwater Reptiles
>>> > >>> > > To: [email protected], [email protected],
>>> > >>>[email protected]
>>> > >>> > >
>>> > >>> > >
>>> > >>> > >
>>> > >>> > >In a message dated 7/13/2005 10:18:32 A.M. Eastern Daylight >
>>> >>> > >Time,
>>> > >>> > >[email protected] writes:
>>> > >>> > >
>>> > >>> > >Wendy. I hope you have a large coffee as your read this. Let
>>>me
>>> > >>>start
>>> > >>>of
>>> > >>> > >by
>>> > >>> > >saying while talking to you on the phone it was always
>>>hectic...LOL
>>> > >>>I
>>> > >>>know
>>> > >>> > >about kids. Before I start I need for you to forward this >
>>> >>> > >e-mail
>>>to
>>> > >>>the
>>> > >>> > >following people if you would (donâ?Tt feel) like typing this
>>>again
>>> > >>>Dennis
>>> > >>> > >Thomas Sales [email protected] Info - [email protected]
>>> > >>>Cat_72
>>> > >>> > >Chuck
>>> > >>> > >Kimmil critical bill Dan Garcia [email protected] Wes
>>> > >>>Pollack.�
>>> > >>> > >PLEASE
>>> > >>> > >READ EACH AND EVER WORD THIS IS IMPORTANT" As I told you on
>>>the
>>> > >>>phone
>>> > >>>the
>>> > >>> > >snake in the picture was sold and shipped...What I never got
>>>to
>>>tell
>>> > >>>you
>>> > >>> > >was
>>> > >>> > >the rest of the story and here is the rest of the story Lee >
>>> >>> > >sent
>>>me
>>> > >>>a
>>> > >>> > >snake
>>> > >>> > >thatâ?Ts true no doubt. The box arrived damaged there is
>>>doubt(
>>> > >>>after
>>> > >>>Ben)
>>> > >>> > >showed up thatâ?Ts when most people jump fence sides thatâ?Ts
>>>when I
>>> > >>> > >headed
>>> > >>> > >out.
>>> > >>> > >the point of them being similar wasnâ?Tt an issue its the tip
>>> > >>> > >of
>>>the
>>> > >>>tail,
>>> > >>> > >that was nothing more then just words I typed once Ben got >
>>> >>> > >there
>>> > >>>nothing I
>>> > >>> > >could say would of mattered, At this point only I knew the >
>>> >>> > >truth.
>>> > >>>nobody
>>> > >>> > >was
>>> > >>> > >listening Blood was drawn sharks start circling.....Ok Here it
>>> > >>> > >is
>>> > >>> > >.......Lee
>>> > >>> > >sent me a Dh Ghost ....(Lee's first post).It arrived late Yes >
>>> >>> > >it
>>>is
>>> > >>>true
>>> > >>> > >the
>>> > >>> > >box had A BIG HOLE covered over with cell tape This is all
>>> > >>>Known......What
>>> > >>> > >isnâ?Tt Known is the afterwards(wasnâ?Tt giving sharks anymore
>>> > >>>Blood)..I
>>> > >>> > >went
>>> > >>> > >crazy running all over all the hubs of UPS raising all kinds
>>>of
>>>hell
>>> > >>> > >(close
>>> > >>> > >to jail couple of them) on May 1st I went to Texas to visit my
>>> > >>>daughter.
>>> > >>> > >When I got back there was a message on my answering machine,
>>>From
>>> > >>>the
>>> > >>> > >police
>>> > >>> > >department saying that I needed to get In touch with them (my
>>>1st
>>> > >>>instinct
>>> > >>> > >oh what did I do now)Well as it turns out A UPS handler was
>>>arrested
>>> > >>>and
>>> > >>> > >upon a search of his house, what Did they Find MY BOA....Ok >
>>> >>> > >boys
>>>and
>>> > >>>girls
>>> > >>> > >here comes the ??? Why didnâ?Tt I contact Lee well to be
>>>honest
>>>the
>>> > >>>snake
>>> > >>> > >was
>>> > >>> > >not in my possession. and my thought was its not here yet so I
>>> > >>> > > >
>>> > >>> >legally
>>> > >>> > >hadn't taken possession of it, So there was no real need The
>>>deal
>>> > >>>between
>>> > >>> > >Lee and I was still the same $200 me $175 Lee. And when the
>>>thread
>>> > >>>started
>>> > >>> > >my first thought was Crap I only needed 10 more days(getting
>>>Lee's
>>> > >>>snake
>>> > >>> > >he
>>> > >>> > >plead guilty and will be sentenced on 7/20) Hence Lee getting
>>>his >
>>> > >>> >$200
>>> > >>> > >Back.
>>> > >>> > >Excuse NOPE Truth Now as it sits I will be E-mailing Lee, when
>>> > >>> > >I
>>> > >>>have
>>> > >>> > >possession asking for Address to ship it back to him and pay
>>>paling
>>> > >>>him
>>> > >>> > >the
>>> > >>> > >$200 I know that you all are thinking why didnâ?Tt I just come
>>> > >>> > > >
>>> > >>> >forward
>>> > >>> > >with
>>> > >>> > >this up front Because I needed to see who was for real and not
>>> > >>>swayed
>>> > >>>by
>>> > >>> > >the
>>> > >>> > >crowd and out all of them you 6 are the ones before all this
>>>crap >
>>> > >>> >went
>>> > >>> > >down
>>> > >>> > >I had the most respect for ok now for the individual notes
>>>here
>>>lets
>>> > >>>start
>>> > >>> > >with Dennis you and I have done business together and even
>>>though
>>> > >>>you
>>> > >>> > >pulled
>>> > >>> > >your vote you didnâ?Tt go negative Thank you. Cathy Your kind
>>>words
>>> > >>> > >through
>>> > >>> > >this whole ordeal gave me respect for you Thank You.....Chuck
>>>your
>>> > >>>offer
>>> > >>> > >of
>>> > >>> > >help and your laid back attitude Well thatâ?Ts why you are
>>> > >>>here.....Which
>>> > >>> > >now
>>> > >>> > >brings me to Dan You sort of had it right if I offered the
>>>$200
>>>it
>>> > >>>would
>>> > >>> > >go
>>> > >>> > >away or just come clean either way it would go away ....that >
>>> >>> > >did
>>> > >>>make
>>> > >>>me
>>> > >>> > >laugh but when you said bill just stop posting and let people
>>> > >>>forgive
>>> > >>>and
>>> > >>> > >forget well I did see what happened with that one LOL ....And
>>>now
>>> > >>>The
>>> > >>> > >Willow
>>> > >>> > >
>>> > >>> > >man....Wes when this all broke and I saw your name as a post I
>>>was
>>> > >>>scared
>>> > >>> > >Iâ?Tve seen what you have done with scammers, and I really
>>>thought
>>> > >>>you
>>> > >>>were
>>> > >>> > >going to rip me up but you just stayed calm and keep saying
>>>thereâ?Ts
>>> > >>>some
>>> > >>> > >thing heâ?Ts not saying ...Wes I wanted to tell you, But
>>>couldnâ?Tt
>>> > >>>find
>>> > >>> > >the
>>> > >>> > >words....Now for the lovely Wendy despite how it looked for me
>>>you
>>> > >>>stood
>>> > >>> > >by
>>> > >>> > >me and never moved I always admired that in a lady. Thank you
>>>very >
>>> > >>> >much
>>> > >>> Ok
>>> > >>> > >now this the story if none of you want to believe it then when
>>> > >>> > >it
>>> > >>>goes
>>> > >>> > >down
>>> > >>> > >on 7/21/05 then I will walk away and be labeled what the > >>>
>>> > >massâ?Ts
>>> > >>>have
>>> > >>> > >labeled
>>> > >>> > >me I never done anybody any harm or went out of my way to get
>>>over
>>> > >>> > >everâ?¦.Believe that or not your choice But I do need you all
>>>to
>>>do
>>> > >>>me
>>> > >>>one
>>> > >>> > >last favor Not word one please till I drop this On the thread
>>> > >>> > >Please��even
>>> > >>> > >if it makes me look worse then I do now Thank Billy
>>> > >>> > >
>>> > >>> > >
>>> > >>> > >
>>> > >>> > >
>>> > >>> > >Thanks

 

[Wilomn]

Well guys, I think some of you are thinking that YOU know better what someone will do than does the person in question.

bill MIGHT continue lying and thieving.
bill MIGHT not continue lying and thieving.

WHO here KNOWS which it will be?

I THINK bill MIGHT. I'm pretty sure NO ONE else conclusively knows either way.

Since I was on "hiatus" during about 200 of the pages of this thread and I never went back and read them it is entirely possible that I am missing something here, but I doubt it.

Keep him on your radar and let him do what he wants. He'll either patch the leaking lifeboat he's currently in or he'll sink.

I'm PRETTY sure that decision is HIS and NOT anyone elses.

Let's also put some perspective on this. While it was BIG and STUPID bill's mistake is SINGULAR so far as I know.

Who else, currently active here, have had MORE THAN ONE INCIDENT OF PROVEN THEFT, LIES, AND SUBTERFUGE and yet post away like their sh#t don't stink?

I know double standards are common and I am NOT saying to give bill anything extra by way of trust or benifit of the doubt. However, presupposing that he is guilty of crimes as yet uncommitted is a bit much.

Let's see some of that spunk that keeps getting splattered on THIS thread spread around to those who ALSO deserve it or, perhaps, if that is not possible, silence should be attempted for a while.

 

[Lucille]

silence should be attempted for a while.

I do not think silence is appropriate. Yes, the scam itself was singular, but it has been, as they say in the bank industry, compounded daily.

Bill said he was leaving the industry. Now he is back in business.
One thing after another has come up untrue.
Bill will do what Bill wants to do; this is a free country.
But because it IS a free country, I think the posts that urge silence are confounding justice.

Bill is entitled to his choices, but we should not be denied ours.

 

[Wilomn]

You have taken my wording in ways other than as I intended it to be understood.

Let me try again.

The continued beating up of bill, while mostly deserved, is not necessarily accomplishing anything.

If questions are asked, by ALL means answer them, withold nothing, put out all the facts.

By silence I meant that the bickering about what to do about bill is getting not only repetitive but redundant to the point of overkill.

He messed up, lied and stole. OK.

Now, let's see how he does from here on out.

Marks, cards, chumps; they're a dime a dozen. IF they are his target market then soon enough we'll know.

There are also some pretty adept folks out there and they may wind up being his customers too. If they are his target market then we'll know that soon enough too.

He's not going away, apparently, so what are you going to do?

I'll wait and see what he does, not recommending him by any means, waiting until he shows something to base a new opinion of him on.