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Break in at Carolina Reptile Exchange (Bruce Eisenmanns store)

Ok, let's take what Kerry says as fact for a minute. Assume there is no insurance on the snakes (which I HIGHLY doubt there was), there are still some things that just do NOT add up here.
1. An animal disappears at "X" point in time.
2. The "helper" who turns out to be the owner sets "traps" days after the first snake goes missing.
3. The "helper" who turns out to be the owner sits in the dark awaiting the return of the "suspects" that took the first snake...again, days after the first was gone.
4. Not only does the owner not set traps (who KNOWS what kind we are talking about, I will revisit that in a minute), but only stays until 1:30am on "X" night.
5. At a undetermined time after the "helper" who turns out to be the owner leaves, his place is 'hit' yet again.
6. Not sure what the hours of opporation are, but it seems awefully odd that nobody wold be at the shop by 11:45am when the 'neighbor' reported the break-in. I believe it would be a Saturday, would that not be one of your busiest days? All to be gone at nearly noon on the suggested day?

Now, back to these "traps". What kind of traps were these? What, if anything, did they reveal about the perfect timing in placing them just hours before the 'hit'? Did they not work? If they did work, what did they reveal (oops, I said that already)?

Now, back to Bruce. Just a side note, as I at this point I do not see it relivent, but why does he claim to be a helper if indeed he is the owner? Is this to not have any blame for unforseen challenges in the future placed on him? Would this be to decieve his clients/custmores? I would be proud to say I owned "X" store. That is just me.

Now, lastly, what if they were not in fact stolen at all. What would be the motive for this? Assuming no insurance is on these (which I still say there was not any), there would not be any financial gain. I can only think of two possibilities on this one:
1. Set someone up that he does not like
2. Hold 'sold' some or all of the "stolen" snakes and thinks he can keep the money for them and just tell the customer/s that they were stolen.

What else is there to add to this.....Ritchie. Am I on the right track? I know we can figure this one out, we have before on other things.
 
1. You held pie balds.....because someone mentioned it but you never saw one before.

2. Out of the blue you just happen to ask if he had insurance.

3. The other guy stole it because Bruce did not and you did not.




1. You know the background of the "other person"
2. You know what snakes he had
3. You now what snakes he tried to sell
4. You know what he "all of a sudden" had.
5. You even knew his schedule "He was even the only one there a month before when another albino retic got missing."
6 Out of the blue you ask about insurance..................that is not a question I ask of any breeder or retailer......at least I don't make a habit out of it that I know of.

Someone "KNOWS" way too many details about "everyone" else

So how did you know the guy was the only one there "a month ago"
 
He happens to set traps on the day the break in occured.


I better get a hold of Miss Cleo and get some lottery numbers.
 
1. Albino retic went missing
2. He suddenly had 10 other snakes.
3. He decided to sell 2 normals because he needed money
4. The next day the store got robbed.

1 & 2 together can makes sense. (He sold it and bought 10 albino burms)
3 & 4 together can make sense. (He needed money and decided to rob the store)

but 1 - 4 does not flow to well in my feeble little head.
 
Be interesting to see what comes out of all this crap. Hopefully nothing that will harm anyone, but it is awefully ODD. :(

Another observation, and I may be wrong, but wasn't someone from this company all over the other threads about them? Where are they now? Not one word from anyone. Personally, I would go out of my way to get the info out to as many people as I could if I were in their shoes.

I was hoping to have them join in because I really am curiouis about these traps and why they did not work. Hell, all it would take is a video camera and we KNOW that did not exist......that would make it too easy to solve this.
 
Well, I am an insurance broker, and though I specialize in over-the-road trucking insurance, I used to sell livestock coverages too. I wrote policies on high dollar horses and cattle, but the same principles apply to all livestock pursuits.

If you wanted to insure a specific animal against mortality or loss by theft, you would have to supply all of the evidence of its scheduled value (genetics, fair market value assessments, etc.), and you would also have to establish a clearly defined documentation of all pertinent issues dealing with that animal (purchase date, purchase price, husbandry practices, veterinary examinations, sale date, sale values, etc.). All of this is expensive, of course, and that is why almost no individual snakes are insured. It makes sense to jump through all of those hoops for a multi-million dollar racehorse, but even a piebald BP is not really valuable enough to justify such in most people's judgments.

Another way in which you could insure your animals, though, is to buy coverages for product replacement value, just like you would if you were a rocking chair factory. In this instance, you would be insuring your total inventory of product (snakes) rather than any specific individual. Then, if you have a loss, the insurance companies generally look at the loss as a percentage of loss fromt he total operation, and then those percentages are applied to the limits of coverages available. So, if you lost 40% of your stocks' value, you would be able to recover up to 40% of the total for which you had insurance. It allows for a continuation of coverage for the business side of things, without being tied up on issues like which individual snake is worth more than another. However, because mortality is simply the cost of doing business with live animals, I would highly doubt that it would be covered, and such a policy would only apply to theft losses.

Now, I am not saying that either of these scenarios are an exact fit for whatever type of coverages the people involved may have had (if any at all!). However, if coverages were in force, I would suspect that they would closely resemble one or the other. If the only animals that were stolen were covered under individual policies, as in the first example, I would think that they were actually stolen (by whom is another issue), because mortality would have been just as effective, and much easier to submit for reimbursement. If, however, the whole store's product was covered, and only the most expensive animals were taken, those may be dead or stolen, and the claim for a theft would most likely be the ONLY way to be reimbursed.

Quite frankly, given the lying that has been shown to have come from those involved before, I wouldn't believe anything they said on this issue at all.

Hope this wasn't anywhere near as boring to you all as it seemed to me as I typed it! :D
 
Thanks, Darin.
It may seem boring to you, but for the ignorant (myself included) when it comes to insurance it brings some light to the possiblities here.
I was talking to a friend of mine this morning about this very thread. He, at one time, owned a reptile shop here in Arizona. He was telling me the very things you mentioned in scenario #1 that he would have had to go through and HE opted not to do so.
As far as #2, that may not be too benefitial to someone attempting a scam though. Lets say you have 10 snakes and you lost 3. Depending on the overall value of the snakes, percentages could bring down the recovery amount and you may not even recover the amount that was lost. I guess this would make more sense if I used hard numbers, but do you all see my point?

THis really is baffling. Not sure what the motive would have been IF INDEED there was something fishy going on.
 
Thank you...

After starting my own retail facility 5-6 years ago, I had many questions about the insurance end of it, I only managed to talk with two companies (both declined) and sadly within the first year and a half I closed shop due to three break-ins in a few short months...the last one got me pretty bad. So the information you provided is greatly appreciated.

Back to the subject at hand...all I have to say is...
"yea, what he said" refering of course to THE Ritchie Luna :)
He's pretty much covered all of the bases for me, good questions!! Can we get a good answer??
 
I just want to thank almost everyone on this thread for totally showing disregard or respect for someone that was just trying to help. Thanks I don't care what anybody thinks. You are just a bunch of jerks who like to gossip, and get involved in matters that don't even concern you. As for the people that were half way nice to me, thanks. I hope we can do business one day, when most of these guys have long faded. I hope the police do find out who did it, and just because I never seen a piepald in person don't mean I've never heard of one. This is just one of the idiotic, oxymoronic, litterally ignorent replies that I have had to subject myself too. I can't belive I even wasted my time looking for competent people to conversate with.
 
I'd say this is at least Tom McKenna's concern, as well as anyone else who has current business dealings with them. But, at any rate, if you can just tell us the name of this employee who stole the snakes, I'm sure we can stop gossiping about it.

Erin Benner
 
I think that is a fair question. I may be wrong, but I would bet that the 'authorities' did not say you couldn't talk about this. It would be different if it were in a court of law. Even if they did, I would call it a 'scare tactic' as there is no judgment against anyone at this point for talking. Law officials go on tv daily asking for people to come forward if they hear this or see that. In fact, as people talk, more and more info is gathered to help resolve issues such as these. That has been proven more often than not on this site, just wait and gather what people say, the truth always comes out regardless if the person wants to admit it. That is what is wonderful about this site. Unlike a court where you have a lawyer/judge deciding what is admissable, here it is all admissable, people end up stumbling over their own tongues and the truth is told........HOW WONDERFUL IT IS!!!

Kerry,
I was reading your last post and thought it was quite nice. Not sure who was good (being thanked) and who was not, but you throw in these little lines that just blows the whole thing apart. That post would have been very nice without the last sentence and the third sentence. As for the second to last, nobody forced you.
You say that people are involved in things that don't concern them. Interesting! How are you any more involved than any of us? Going by what you say, you are simply a supplier, no more, no less. How does that make you 'involved'? Not attacking you here, but just curious as to what the difference is.
 
I am not at liberty to post someones name on the internet. It would not be fair to the ongoing investigation. I don't know you from Adam, and I don't understand why someone from Ohio would need to know. With the exception of this buckeye. I am sure that I will talk to the police soon, I will ask them if they think I should post it.
I have talked to Tom, he has his snakes, and so far everything looks good. I told tom that I would help him any way that I could if he got ripped off. Toms a nice guy. I saw his post on another site, and offred my help.
 
Whoa-whoa-whoa...

Back it up a little bit, please. You're taking all this so personal. Maybe I missed something, but I don't remember you getting verbal attacked by anyone. If I recall, you came out of the gate calling people names, cursing, etc...then you cooled down and it seems we all got along pretty good after that (for a minute anyways) now, you made a few statements earlier, then freak out whenever someone simply asks for details. What is up w/ that??? I doubt if your last post was directed towards me and if it was, whatever I said to make you feel outraged I apologize for...it's dire that most of us in this hobby at least try to get along for obvious reasons. This board is an excellent tool for everyone that buys/sells/trades via the internet, it actually has helped resolve many of deals that may have soured, and I've been coming here since the original, and I really don't think it's a playground for 'bullies', but rather an open air arena (free to the public) where anyone and everyone can voice their opinions, ask questions, ANSWER them, share experiences, and in the end ELIMINATE the bad guys. People are allowed to 'question' questionable scenarios...it's all out of concern for the well being of the hobby...that's it!! It's not to bash, or call names...and in defense of most of us that frequent the BOI , if it seems we might seem short, or blunt, or borderline aggressive in our replies, I promise you it's mostly for good reason (or at least with good intentions) and after being a member here for quite some time, I've personally witnessed the 'magic' here. Take it for what it's worth, but the bottom line here is, I think we (as forum users)want everybody to visit & enjoy this site, because it IS a constructive tool for all of us, we just want the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth...just cool down, come on back, and let's ALL get with the program.
 
Kerry...

The above reply was written and submitted before I saw your last one...so I was still under the impression you were ticked off. Hope that explains the most of it :)
 
The link to this site was just emailed to me and thought I would post it here (well, in this case I posted the thread).
Kerry, I must say, you sure know alot about this guy for someone who lives in another state and just sells snakes to him.
Just so your head does not overinflate, you did not "start a fued on Fauna", the scpetics were already here long before you got here, Kerry. For the others, you will see what I am talking about when you read the below thread.


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#1 08-28-2003, 01:04 AM
noleary
Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 1

carolina reptile exchange

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Have been offered a good deal. Wanted to maximize the potential for not getting screwed. Any one hear of Carolina Retile Exchange? Anyone dealt with them?

Any other advice or feedback?

Thanks,


Neil O'Leary

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#2 01-20-2004, 04:52 PM
S&HExotics
Super Moderator Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 23

I would like info on them also purchased a few snakes through them heard good about them but the snakes was held up by Airborne they said but I heard that before from Kevin Peters and never got them just want to hear any feedback

Thanks
Tom

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#3 01-20-2004, 04:58 PM
Kerry Bragg
Moderator Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 33

The guy has a retail store. He does ship alot of things. What are you buying off of him? I was just there the other day. I probably saw it. If he seems to be selling cheap. He just had $72000 in snakes stole from his store. They only took 5 snakes. He probably needs the money. I can't really say about his shipping techniques, but I buy things off of him once in a while. He seems to be honest.

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#4 01-20-2004, 05:07 PM
S&HExotics
Super Moderator Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 23

I was buying a pair of Mangroves from him yellow and black and I heard he had stuff stolen. But he told me mine wasn't in that just high end stuff

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#5 01-20-2004, 05:09 PM
Kerry Bragg
Moderator Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 33

Yeah. I was there when he packed them. He said he was hipping them Mon. If I'm not mistaken. Those are some pretty lax snakes. They are nice.

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#6 01-20-2004, 05:12 PM
S&HExotics
Super Moderator Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 23

Well that makes me feel a little better. They was suppose to be here today but no go Airborne held them back. You see the animals? I was worried I was being taken

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#7 01-20-2004, 05:15 PM
Kerry Bragg
Moderator Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 33

Yeah I saw them. They are nice. One was shedding. They are nice sized too. They are pretty docile snakes. You ever worked with them?

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#8 01-20-2004, 05:17 PM
S&HExotics
Super Moderator Join Date: Sep 2003
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A little but this is my first pair of my own. Well at least I feel a little better now. Except I went into my office waiting for them for 4 hours no pay and no show

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#9 01-20-2004, 05:22 PM
Kerry Bragg
Moderator Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 33

That sucks. I hate when that happens. It's probably cold as <font color=red>[bleep]</font> up there too. I know for sure he packed them. I helped bag them. The snakes seemed calm. He free handled them about 3 feet away from me. They were ok, till they started warming up a little bit. Then he made sure he got them in the bag quick. Those are some big snakes. I don't do hots, or venomoids, or anything. But I like to watch someone else.

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#10 01-20-2004, 05:24 PM
S&HExotics
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Thanks for the info Kerry makes me feel alot better but well fell even better when they get here hehehe.

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#11 01-20-2004, 05:27 PM
Kerry Bragg
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hehe yeah, I bet. Good luck. I hope it all works out. I'm sure it will, this all seemed too ironic. lol

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#12 01-20-2004, 09:08 PM
S&HExotics
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Hey Kerry we was posting back and forth about Carolina Reptile Exchange earlier today now I read some stuff on FAUNA that makes him look like a piece of <font color=red>[bleep]</font> so I truely hope your right. I was burnt before and If i get it again I will get a lawyer even if it cost more then the animals this time!!!! Damn now Im so pissed and unshore of what is going on. Plz email me and if you can help with any extra info on them plz I just feel me getting burnt yet again. =(

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#13 Yesterday, 03:06 PM
Kerry Bragg
Moderator Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 33

Well, If you don't get them. I will help you as much as I can. I started a freaking feud on fauna just by mentioning the guys name. I'm not sure what I can do for you other than ask him about it. I can and most likely would stop doing business with him all together, if he rips you off.

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#14 Yesterday, 07:41 PM
S&HExotics
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Posts: 23

Well he called me today I got a tracking number and it is a good number so maybe I jumped the gun. I will know tomorrow when they get here or not then I will leave good or negative feedback on that.

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#15 Today, 03:45 PM
S&HExotics
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I got the snakes today and they was what he said and seem very health just a little cold from ride but seem fine now next hurdle is if they eat like he said I will be very happy

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Page 1 of 2 1 2 >
 
Well, it's entirely POSSIBLE that my powers of understanding the English language have deteriorated to the point of a total lack of comprehension, but this just doesn't make any sense to me, folks!


On page 6, Kerry wrote, "I'm not trying to defend anbody. I don't know what has went on in the past. But I held those piebalds the night they were stolen."


However, on page 14, he says, "I hope the police do find out who did it, and just because I never seen a piepald in person don't mean I've never heard of one."


Now, it may be that there is a reasonable explanation as to why Kerry has written two completely contradictive statements here, but the fact is that these two statements cannot both be right. He cannot possibly have held those piebalds the night they were stolen AND have never seen one "in person" [sic] at the same time. Those two statements are completely contradistinctive from one another, and while they may both be false, they cannot both be true. I would like to hear something from Kerry to explain what's up with all of this.

I am not accusing you of anything Kerry, but as an old-timer here on the BOI, whenever someone brand new jumps in the middle of a thread, making brash statements, attacking others, and contradicting himself ... well, let's just say my suspicions increase exponentially!
 
So far. THe simply snakes guy is involved because a close friend of his was wronged. I am involved because when I talk to the police, and answer questions that they ask. I feel involved. I was asked not to talk about it. I think I've gone way to far already. As far as the post I made. Sorry if I blew it, I can see me brown nosing with the best of them, and still have people pointing fingers. besides I really do feel that I was subjected to uncalled for ridicule, and if someone posts something stupid to try to undercut me. It's my right to point it out
 
What does the posts from herptrader prove except for I am a nice guy.
I never backpeddled or overlapped anything. The two posts you cut are from diffrent ones. In one I explained I held the snakes the night before they were stolen. This is true. Then I said in another post just because I never seen a piebald in real life doesn't mean I've never heard of one. This is a stamement towqards the guy that incinuated in another post that I was lieing. Please don't be like the rest and scan for matierial that might be something, and then post it with out actually reading the entire post. If everyone here would read every post word for word. It will explain itself.
 
By the way, what are your suspicions? I only bad mouthed people that bad mouth me. I never contradicted myself. Whatever you may think. You simply cut and paste sections of a post and expect it to tell the entire story. I can't wait til this is all solved. You will all see what is really going on. I am who I say. and I am telling the truth. but will still scoff, because that's the way it is.
 
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