Bad Guy Charles Looney Blue Venom Reptiles and Jessica Daniel and John Owens Triple Jreptiles

[cjsreptiles]

I wouldn't buy from either party. Although I am leaning towards believing the sellers (op). I do get the bad vibe from Charles and his accomplices. I would definatly like to see the vet report when it's available.

 

[mckelish]

I have let Charles and Jessica know abiut this thread but from what I have read about this on FB that 1500 gram female you sold ended up weighing just under 1200 grams so in less than 40 days that snake lost more than 300 grams. You should post the pics of those text that are going around on FB.

I have taken the time to admit there were errors and faults on Heather and my own behalf. There were two snakes at the time we believed to be female. One that was 1600 grams and one that was 1400 grams. When Heather was texting Jessica she mixed up the two females and gave her the other's weight. The snakes weighed 1290 grams and 1842 grams once back in my possession. Charles says the snakes weighed 1100 grams and then four days later 1180 grams, however he didn't give a weight about the other snake. The snake didn't actually loose 300 grams.

Are you serious? this is a joke if you clearly read ..oh you cant...hmm wnder why megan????..... I blocked you from my personal facebook account because i dont feel that we are or should be friends anymore, it that simple and its just facebook? who cares if yopur blocked from someones page?!?! .......if you where able to continue to read the post I PUT TO FACEBOOK, the conversation carried on between me and a woman who owns animal resucue and it talks about dogs, birds, cats , etc. other animals on CRAIGSLIST that are being done wrong. we are no longer disscusing your childish behavior that has taken place ALL OVER FACEBOOK! another reason why i blocked you is so i would stop getting notifications to my cell that you guys was posting more lies. -_-' and i beleive its my choice as it is with yours to choose who i have and who i dont have on my soical networking account. its facebook who cares?......

My statements about Facebook have nothing to do with my desire to be friends with you. I think it's worth pointing out that you want to continue to run my name through the dirt right in front of my face, in groups we both belong to, and ignore me so I do not have a chance to defend myself. I haven't ignored you, Charles, nor anyone else who has opposing ideas from me. I have not stopped Charles from commenting on my own personal album of the events. I cannot continue to read the post in question because shortly after this was posted you ignored Heather as well. I'm sorry you feel that I am posting all over Facebook that you are a liar. I have not posted anywhere since November 24th, Saturday the day all this happened, on a post you started on a public forum. Charles has made a point to post something every day, making sure to bump it to the top. Yesterday you posted about how awful I treat my snakes. However I am the one that needs blocking because of my postings? I have uploaded every photo evidence that has been available, even the ones Charles posted to be as fair as possible.

....before any of this was ever started we gave you the chance to make the sell right an hour after we got the animals in question.....

The transaction was made right within 24 hours, five days ago.

....no point in reading her whole post lol in the very begining she is already lieing about what was done

If you are not going to read what I wrote how can you respond? If you take the time to read through the post you will see that I only state what happened. I haven't said that we were right about the transaction. I have said that the continued efforts between you and Charles to smear my name and accuse me of animal cruelty have gone over and beyond the simple transaction. You are both now accusing me of criminal offences.

....After much pressure from the FBI on face book and some local reptile threads they finally gave a full refund. After the shady deal and all the lies she has bombarded me, Jessica and john we feel it is our duty to the herp community to leave a permanent record in place as to help any future herpers from falling victim to them....

....They pretty much prove the case against them theirselves. The pictures they posted and all the comments they made make their strings of abusive lies evident. They have been told by many already that the fauna boi is not going to be as easy on them as everyone else has.

Charles, the refund wasn't given because of any pressure. As I stated we were unsure how to proceed in this situation and were speaking to people on how to handle it. We decided that it was in our best interest, and the snakes interest that we take them back. The only way to prove without a doubt that the snakes are in no way sick is to take them to the vet which is scheduled for Friday November 30th at 4:00 pm EST.

...just one more misdeed in a long string character assaults by these two all in attempts to avoid A) Taking responsability for all the misrepresentations of their animals. B) giving back the money they swindled their customer out of and B) Admitting to their lies and just covering them with more lies. Deal with these two at your own risk and thank goodness for fauna so we have a place to make permanent record of people like this to protect each other and fight back against fraud..

We have taken responsibility for everything that has happened. We have given back the money to Jessica and John, within 24 hours of the transaction. I have yet to see what I have lied.

....She actually challenged me on FB to produce these texts that she would not admit to. When I did a few days later she just added them to her stuff with no explanation. If fauna can get one out of her I will be shocked....

I asked you to produce the texts Charles. You were not texting, you were texting Heather, which is why I didn't have the texts. She erased all her text messages without realizing she would need the texts. I can't post what I don't have. However now that you have posted those pictures I have added them to the album to be fair. You have compete freedom to comment on the album, which you have done.

 

[bluevenom]

Its hatd to beleive you would feel that way. But evryone sees things from a didderent angle. From my angle I was lied to and then called a liar. The snakes were not sold at least way off as advertised. The female advertised at 1600g was 1180. and the bigger one was male. Now the this one was hands down the thinnest BP I have ever seen. And all they did all day was say we were all liars and the one was not a male and the other not thin. If you were in my shoes you may take it all differently. If I sold you a female that turned male or you were unhappy with any thing purchased from me you would not have to ask twice for a refund.

 

[Cat_Eyed_Lady]

I Might give the OP a chance but there is no way in Heck that I would deal with the 'buyers' and their peanut gallery spew throwing friend.

 

[bluevenom]

I have taken the time to admit there were errors and faults on Heather and my own behalf. There were two snakes at the time we believed to be female. One that was 1600 grams and one that was 1400 grams. When Heather was texting Jessica she mixed up the two females and gave her the other's weight. The snakes weighed 1290 grams and 1842 grams once back in my possession. Charles says the snakes weighed 1100 grams and then four days later 1180 grams, however he didn't give a weight about the other snake. The snake didn't actually loose 300 grams.



My statements about Facebook have nothing to do with my desire to be friends with you. I think it's worth pointing out that you want to continue to run my name through the dirt right in front of my face, in groups we both belong to, and ignore me so I do not have a chance to defend myself. I haven't ignored you, Charles, nor anyone else who has opposing ideas from me. I have not stopped Charles from commenting on my own personal album of the events. I cannot continue to read the post in question because shortly after this was posted you ignored Heather as well. I'm sorry you feel that I am posting all over Facebook that you are a liar. I have not posted anywhere since November 24th, Saturday the day all this happened, on a post you started on a public forum. Charles has made a point to post something every day, making sure to bump it to the top. Yesterday you posted about how awful I treat my snakes. However I am the one that needs blocking because of my postings? I have uploaded every photo evidence that has been available, even the ones Charles posted to be as fair as possible.



The transaction was made right within 24 hours, five days ago.



If you are not going to read what I wrote how can you respond? If you take the time to read through the post you will see that I only state what happened. I haven't said that we were right about the transaction. I have said that the continued efforts between you and Charles to smear my name and accuse me of animal cruelty have gone over and beyond the simple transaction. You are both now accusing me of criminal offences.

Charles, the refund wasn't given because of any pressure. As I stated we were unsure how to proceed in this situation and were speaking to people on how to handle it. We decided that it was in our best interest, and the snakes interest that we take them back. The only way to prove without a doubt that the snakes are in no way sick is to take them to the vet which is scheduled for Friday November 30th at 4:00 pm EST

.

If this is true why didnt you tel us you just wanted to make sure how to handle the issue instead of taking the time to say we were faking the fact the female was male and the other was under weight. You went to great lengths to say we were making it up and not saying anything about making it right until now

We have taken responsibility for everything that has happened. We have given back the money to Jessica and John, within 24 hours of the transaction. I have yet to see what I have lied

.

You still have not admitted you had made a deal to trade with me and still calling me a liar.

I asked you to produce the texts Charles. You were not texting, you were texting Heather, which is why I didn't have the texts. She erased all her text messages without realizing she would need the texts. I can't post what I don't have. However now that you have posted those pictures I have added them to the album to be fair. You have compete freedom to comment on the album, which you have done.[/QUOTE

]

This is funny because you can see that you posted text messages off her phone all around the ones that show she had a deal with me. She just accidently erased all the ones that show we had a deal. And you have yet to explain the text messages were she is saying she is meeting me. You now admit they are their and still leave out an explanation. If you would admit the truth that we had a deal instead of saying I am making this up you would be doing the right thing and I would applaud you in doing so. You know good and well I have been sticking up for what is right and maegan if you were done wrong and I was right their to see it I would have done the same for you.

 

[bluevenom]

I Might give the OP a chance but there is no way in Heck that I would deal with the 'buyers' and their peanut gallery spew throwing friend.

I have been doing this a long time and never been in a bad deal in 15 years I have made hundreds of deals and all have been great. I have never come accross anyone like these with the nerve to tell outright lies. I have always been honest in every deal. If you were at the receiving end of the lies they told you would be upset also.

 

[Cat_Eyed_Lady]

If you were so grand? I would have heard of you. I, also have been around a long time. Plus, the deal between the OP and the girl and her fiance has Nothing to do with you. You might feel slighted by the fact they dont want to deal with you but I can understand why they wouldnt. Also, you say they lie and say they take bad care of their snakes?? But.. who was the one who hung a snake up by its tail on a cool morning outside just for a pic?

Everyone who has been in the reptile business for awhie has their scars from bad deals. It goes with the territory, sadly. Its how its handled after that, that speaks volumes and you sir are the biggest rooster I ever heard. My goodness! Its all over and done! Get over it already! Let ppl read and make up their own minds. We All have that right.

I have been on the receiveing end!! Look up the BOI thread I started about a bad guy and how I handled it! Its Way different than this he said she said high school argueing and who can scream the loudest contest!

Also... on a side note. Charles... there is a spell check feature. Your mispelling are abit wack and I am not even a spelling nazi. Thanks!

 

[Lucille]

I have been doing this a long time and never been in a bad deal in 15 years I have made hundreds of deals and all have been great.

Are you friends with Dan Scolaro? He said something similar frequently whenever others called him out on a transaction.

 

[bluevenom]

I just read through everything from the FB link. It's a bit of a mess, but my gut tells me that the buyer and her party are doing their best to cloud the issue by utilizing the dazzling display of technique. Words are being tossed around, like "anarexic"[sic], "sick", "cruilty"[sic] and "emaciated".

I'm not seeing any protruding spines or any other reason to consider the snake anorexic. Just because you say something, doesn't automatically make it true.

This BP is way under weight and the skinniest I have ever seen and i have seen thaousands over the years




I just get a very slimy used car salesman vibe from TripleJ and crowd, especially Charles. Dude seems to think he's a real smooth-talker and likely believes he's much more clever than he actually is. Again, just my gut feeling about them.

At one point, Jessica claims that she didn't know about this other deal that the seller had with Charles, yet Charles goes out of his way to point out how they were all having a laugh over it, before the transaction took place. Both statements can't be true. So what does that mean, Charles? That's right; one of you lied.

up to a certain point jessica was somewhere else and It was me and john speaking about this in the begining. She was informed later. This was stated somwewhere.

She also states that she was apparently explicitly told that the bump was a "calcium deposit", however, Meagan clearly acknowledges to Charles that she believes it's actually a live-feeding scar. Seems odd that she'd be forthright with one potential customer, yet try to be deceptive with another one. Not only that, but it seems like a safe assumption that Jessica would end up knowing anything that Charles did, considering their background games.

The calcium deal has never even been the issue but keeps coming up because it was there and called different things along the way.

Until Charles can post concrete proof that Heather absolutely agreed to the Hog Isl. trade, I don't see much point in harping on about it. And, even if you can prove it, I think it's only slightly damning for her. Maybe certain conspiracy theorists are just rubbing off on me; however, even if you do prove it, considering that you and the buyer had things going on in the background, I'd almost be willing to see it as just more petty incentive for launching a possibly undeserved and premeditated smear campaign. You've really flip-flopped over how much you wanted the snakes from Meagan. First you were nagging to work out a trade, then you suddenly don't really need or want them. This whole thing reeks of sour-grapes-based retaliation that you've seemingly chosen to egg on whenever possible.

Yes at first I would have been very interested in a trade fore a healthy female adult. They needed it more than me and it is no big deal to me as I make deals on a weekly basis. And currently take care of hundreds in my breeding project. So it meant more to them than me.

One thing I couldn't help noticing about the "sick" snake: your pictures depict a fairly flaccid snake that's just hanging straight down from your hand. I can't help thinking that it's noteworthy that the "sick" snake is the only one that was photographed outside. On that day, the maximum temperature in your area was 74 degrees Fahrenheit. It seems that this all went down in the A.M.? If that's the case, it would likely have been even cooler than that. Take the snake outside in a shaded area on a fairly cool day, and that could easily explain it's lethargy

.


The snake being thin is the point.






I'd think that the VP of any herpetological society would know of the correlation between temperatures and a cold-blooded animal's energy level. How many of us have bought an ostensibly docile snake at a reptile show, only to realize that it's more spastic once it's at home and sufficiently warmed up? Food for thought..

You choose to call attention to the buyer's apparent lack of experience, but it in herpetology to spot something that's "on deaths door". Just seems really odd that something looked good enough to buy, after having directly interacted with it, but is suddenly half-dead an hour later, after it's put into yourdoesn't take a degree hands.

They advertised the snake at 1600 grams and they had it for 40 days. This is what I saw and it was quite shocking to me.

As I said, it's a bit of a mess. Worst case scenario: everyone involved belongs on The List, although, I'm not sure I'd go that far, yet. As it stands right now, if I had to make a choice, I think I'd rather deal with the seller than anyone in the buyer's camp. Not that the seller should get a free pass, as the weights were off and the one animal was mis-sexed. Also, if the chewed tail wasn't disclosed, that's a no-no.

She did, however, end up issuing a refund once she was convinced that she'd made mistakes. That alone shows more integrity than I'm seeing from the other side of the fence. That perceived lack of integrity is based on my own interpretation of how they've conducted themselves, some of which is admittedly based on my gut feelings. Something as big as my gut shouldn't be lightly ignored.

If I have seemed out of line I can stand up for it without being forced to. After so many lies being told like I was faking the snake was male over and over for hours and many other lies I was very upset and rightfully so. It was hard to beleive I was being treated as such and If I was to harsh and all agree then I accept that.

Gotta love these little FaceBook cliques. And people say us BOI-dwellers are drama queens...

Most of my posts were replies to other posts. And I dont beleive anything said should be an excuse for their actions. If I overreacted in my posts I appologize. I am still waiting for them to stand up and tell the truth. If they are big enough to do so I congratulate them. as I do for them giving the refund.

 

[bluevenom]

If you were so grand? I would have heard of you. I, also have been around a long time. Plus, the deal between the OP and the girl and her fiance has Nothing to do with you. You might feel slighted by the fact they dont want to deal with you but I can understand why they wouldnt. Also, you say they lie and say they take bad care of their snakes?? But.. who was the one who hung a snake up by its tail on a cool morning outside just for a pic?

Everyone who has been in the reptile business for awhie has their scars from bad deals. It goes with the territory, sadly. Its how its handled after that, that speaks volumes and you sir are the biggest rooster I ever heard. My goodness! Its all over and done! Get over it already! Let ppl read and make up their own minds. We All have that right.

I have been on the receiveing end!! Look up the BOI thread I started about a bad guy and how I handled it! Its Way different than this he said she said high school argueing and who can scream the loudest contest!

Also... on a side note. Charles... there is a spell check feature. Your mispelling are abit wack and I am not even a spelling nazi. Thanks!

Sorry about the spelling. Not used to posting here and I am multitasking. lol
And If I handled what happend to me badly I appologize for that.

 

[bluevenom]

Are you friends with Dan Scolaro? He said something similar frequently whenever others called him out on a transaction.

No. lol sorry again If I handled what happend to me badly. never been in a bad deal ever and hope to never again. Thanks for the posts. If it does happen again I need to know how to handle it.

 

[triplejreptiles]

everyone is enlitiled to their own opinions. i personally along with my fiance feel screwed over by these two and the deal was done money was given back. whatever there is no truely fixing the feeling of being burned by another herper and for those who agree with "the sellers" your
entilted to do so HOWEVER, the next time you make a deal and it goes sour and you get burned by your "seller" and you wanna give a respone on fauna to prevent others from having the same trouble you will be feeling what the three of us are feeling now. we all agree that the deal is over but we do not all agree about how the deal was handled and i for one will keep telling people if they ask what happend i will tell them the truth and as you all did they can take it how ever they feel is right. there is no way that john and myself could have traded the "female snake" out for a male and make the other female snake so sickingly skinny within the time it took us to get from crestveiw walmart to charles's house the complete HOUR we had the snakes. and megan if you feel that you and heather are so innocent i again ask you why didnt you set up a refund when it was asked for before all this crap got started???? whey did you call me after heather told you what was going on, why did you call me and countinusly apologize and tell me that a full refund would be given then a couple minutes later your girlfriend heather send me txt saying that it was over and the deal was done and that was it and we was not getting a refund and the only reason you put anything on fauna is because charles was saying he was going to do it and if i understand correctly we still plan on doing it just to get our side out and everyone can have their own opinions on the situation. we will make many ore deals on snakes and we will have better deals than this one. we will be more cautious about who we deal with and perhaps you should to. we will post our side and people can make their own decisions and no we are not changing our company name because of what happened,as you mentioned we was going to, i will admit we made poor choices and wont be doing buisness with you two again and we may have lost potential clients but there are many more people in this world who will see how we treat our animals and we will build a reputaion for ourselfs and it will be built with honesty and intergity and customer loyality and friends made. not by putting our customers down and dyning them a refund when asked....

again everyone is entitled to their opinions and comments and we can take constructive critisim c= [/I][/B]

 

[bluevenom]

I agree. This all started with the raw deal. If we would have said nothing and came straight to fauna We would be getting much different responses about the very same deal. I have seen people get handled way worse here then they were on FB. All the same just opinions being posted but it is all straying from the subject that this is really about. They did not want to give a refund and made it clear they would not. The FB posts made it happen and only that. And we would have got the same results if we came here first and said hey look at what they are doing. They would have gotten many posts saying give a refund. Now the whole BOI is being centered around the FB back and forth. All this is going to do is make them feel they can treat customers like they did and get away with it.

 

[Cat_Eyed_Lady]

I want to ask... Since you had the snakes such a short time. Why did you feed them as soon as you got home?? I thought most ppl give newly bought snakes abit of a settleing period? I would be very fearful of a regurge. Especially since you say the one was so thin.

Charles, thanks for that. Kudos to you for admiting that you learned something and taking the harshness from your reply.

 

[bluevenom]

They said they took them home warmed them up and offerd food that night The one needed food bad. Again I thought this was over also but 5 days later saw the posts to the pictures maegan was displaying on her FB page. I did get upset reading them and Responded harshly. Maybe if she cosidered it over she would not have had it up on her FB wall 5 days later.

 

[Fangthane]

This BP is way under weight and the skinniest I have ever seen and i have seen thaousands over the years

That's the skinniest BP you've ever seen, after having seen thousands? Yeah, sure. I'm sure you wouldn't exaggerate to support your already weak claims...no, not you.

up to a certain point jessica was somewhere else and It was me and john speaking about this in the begining. She was informed later. This was stated somwewhere.

Nice try. On the day that the transaction took place, Jessica posted on FB saying:

can not believe what happened today! It was fraud! We didn't know they had already made a deal with Charles Looney.

Not only is she disavowing having known about your alleged deal, but she said WE didn't know. So, while you're tying to say that somehow she didn't know what both you and her fiance knew about, she's saying neither of them knew. Unless you'd like to try to present some obscure defnition of "we". Another one of those pesky lies that you like to point out. Odd thing is, that the ones I'm seeing are coming from your side of the fence.

The calcium deal has never even been the issue but keeps coming up because it was there and called different things along the way.

Another one of your attempted exaggerations. It was called two different things along the way: calcium deposit and live feeding scar. Both of which were clearly stated by the seller before the sale. It's not like its existence was a surprise. You guys are harping on something that was clearly called attention to before money ever changed hands.

Yes at first I would have been very interested in a trade fore a healthy female adult. They needed it more than me and it is no big deal to me as I make deals on a weekly basis. And currently take care of hundreds in my breeding project. So it meant more to them than me

Interesting. It was no big deal to you "at first", but you were on her for a month trying to get a trade done. Your tune didn't suddenly change until the morning of the transaction. Even before the deal was done, you were setting the stage for their being issues with the snakes. Suddently implying potential health issues with snakes that you'd been actively pursuing for quite a while. Interesting coincidence, that...

The snake being thin is the point.

So, NOW the point is that it was thin? What happened to it being on "death's door"? Interesting that it's suddenly not the point that a cold snake doesn't have the energy to lift itself up. And you're trying to portray the seller as someone who covers lies with other lies.. You flip-flop worse than a cheap pair of sandals. Once a very plausible explanation is given for the snake's lethargy, the point suddenly changes.

Again, I say, it's very interesting that someone who lauds his own level of knowledge would take a snake into the cool shade and make a point of calling attention to it's weakness. To me, it shows a complete willingness to put an animal at risk just to make some petty and non-existent point.

They advertised the snake at 1600 grams and they had it for 40 days. This is what I saw and it was quite shocking to me.

Nice attempt at changing the context of the discussion. You had originally said that

Here she is trying to give credit to a beginner looking at a picture of a ball python as a valid health review

. It's to that quote that I was responding. It's interesting that you'd like to portray the buyers basically as idiots who know nothing, but you apparently feel comfortable selling to them. Either you actually feel they know enough keep a snake healthy, and thus enough to spot a half-dead snake, or you simply don't care about handing your animals over to people who don't know enough to properly keep them. You can't have it both ways.

If I have seemed out of line I can stand up for it without being forced to. After so many lies being told like I was faking the snake was male over and over for hours and many other lies I was very upset and rightfully so. It was hard to beleive I was being treated as such and If I was to harsh and all agree then I accept that.

Oh, I think you're right in line. In line with the behavior of someone who can be trusted just about as far as you can be picked up and thrown. Your little poor me routine isn't cutting it. As far as I can see, YOU are the basis of every single bit of drama in this transaction. Based on my already low opinion of you, I suspect that you decided to make sure this sale was doomed even before it took place. And based on my almost equally low opinion of the buyers, I have to think that they were fully complicit in your little game.

Most of my posts were replies to other posts. And I dont beleive anything said should be an excuse for their actions. If I overreacted in my posts I appologize. I am still waiting for them to stand up and tell the truth. If they are big enough to do so I congratulate them. as I do for them giving the refund.

That's a very convenient stance for you to take. Especially considering my belief that, out of everyone involved, you're the absolute worst. Your own chosen course of action set the stage for everything else. You were calling Meagan a liar and a douch[sic] right off the bat. Given everything you've brought about, I think it's a credit to the seller that she did choose to remedy the situation so quickly. You've given cause for pause on numerous occasions. A refund was issued the following day, yet you and your lackeys still can't resist the kid games. I think the "Bad Guy" that's right next to your name is well-deserved.

Mom always said if it walks like a douch talks like a douch and looks like a douch.......Its probably a douch.

You went out of your way to say this a couple of times. I have to wonder if your mom was referring to you when she said it.

 

[bluevenom]

That's the skinniest BP you've ever seen, after having seen thousands? Yeah, sure. I'm sure you wouldn't exaggerate to support your already weak claims...no, not you.

Nice try. On the day that the transaction took place, Jessica posted on FB saying:
Not only is she disavowing having known about your alleged deal, but she said WE didn't know. So, while you're tying to say that somehow she didn't know what both you and her fiance knew about, she's saying neither of them knew. Unless you'd like to try to present some obscure defnition of "we". Another one of those pesky lies that you like to point out. Odd thing is, that the ones I'm seeing are coming from your side of the fence.

Another one of your attempted exaggerations. It was called two different things along the way: calcium deposit and live feeding scar. Both of which were clearly stated by the seller before the sale. It's not like its existence was a surprise. You guys are harping on something that was clearly called attention to before money ever changed hands.

Interesting. It was no big deal to you "at first", but you were on her for a month trying to get a trade done. Your tune didn't suddenly change until the morning of the transaction. Even before the deal was done, you were setting the stage for their being issues with the snakes. Suddently implying potential health issues with snakes that you'd been actively pursuing for quite a while. Interesting coincidence, that...

So, NOW the point is that it was thin? What happened to it being on "death's door"? Interesting that it's suddenly not the point that a cold snake doesn't have the energy to lift itself up. And you're trying to portray the seller as someone who covers lies with other lies.. You flip-flop worse than a cheap pair of sandals. Once a very plausible explanation is given for the snake's lethargy, the point suddenly changes.

Again, I say, it's very interesting that someone who lauds his own level of knowledge would take a snake into the cool shade and make a point of calling attention to it's weakness. To me, it shows a complete willingness to put an animal at risk just to make some petty and non-existent point.

Nice attempt at changing the context of the discussion. You had originally said that . It's to that quote that I was responding. It's interesting that you'd like to portray the buyers basically as idiots who know nothing, but you apparently feel comfortable selling to them. Either you actually feel they know enough keep a snake healthy, and thus enough to spot a half-dead snake, or you simply don't care about handing your animals over to people who don't know enough to properly keep them. You can't have it both ways.

Oh, I think you're right in line. In line with the behavior of someone who can be trusted just about as far as you can be picked up and thrown. Your little poor me routine isn't cutting it. As far as I can see, YOU are the basis of every single bit of drama in this transaction. Based on my already low opinion of you, I suspect that you decided to make sure this sale was doomed even before it took place. And based on my almost equally low opinion of the buyers, I have to think that they were fully complicit in your little game.

That's a very convenient stance for you to take. Especially considering my belief that, out of everyone involved, you're the absolute worst. Your own chosen course of action set the stage for everything else. You were calling Meagan a liar and a douch[sic] right off the bat. Given everything you've brought about, I think it's a credit to the seller that she did choose to remedy the situation so quickly. You've given cause for pause on numerous occasions. A refund was issued the following day, yet you and your lackeys still can't resist the kid games. I think the "Bad Guy" that's right next to your name is well-deserved.

You went out of your way to say this a couple of times. I have to wonder if your mom was referring to you when she said it.

YesI know you are coming into this late but I have already admitted I can not say if the snake is actually ill and can only say what I cann see and thet was that it is the skinniest I have ever seen.

Next jessics was talking about the fact that when she agreed to purchase the snakes she was not aware of the deal

Me being rude to them came after she called me a liar and laughed about the ordeal to me on the phone wich did disgust me.And I find it interesting that you say the worst thing I have done was express my low opinion of them yet that is exactly what you are doing right here but its ok for you. If I am not responding to everything you said in this post I will in a bit when I have more time.

 

[mckelish]

If this is true why didnt you tel us you just wanted to make sure how to handle the issue instead of taking the time to say we were faking the fact the female was male and the other was under weight. You went to great lengths to say we were making it up and not saying anything about making it right until now.

You still have not admitted you had made a deal to trade with me and still calling me a liar.

This is funny because you can see that you posted text messages off her phone all around the ones that show she had a deal with me. She just accidently erased all the ones that show we had a deal. And you have yet to explain the text messages were she is saying she is meeting me. You now admit they are their and still leave out an explanation. If you would admit the truth that we had a deal instead of saying I am making this up you would be doing the right thing and I would applaud you in doing so. You know good and well I have been sticking up for what is right and maegan if you were done wrong and I was right their to see it I would have done the same for you.

Charles I think there was more than enough evidence to believe you would have done anything you could to fulfill your personal vendetta. I'm not sure how I went to great lengths to say you were making it up. I did was say that the fact that you are the one stating these claims and the one taking pictures did not convince me that there were issues. To your apparently surprise of me saying that I was wrong, I said on the forums that a partial refund was offered, then that a full refund was offered. I also stated that I was taking the snake to the vet to which you responded that you would be surprised if she got there.

There was no deal with you. I'm not sure why you are so convinced that there was an agreement to trade with you. I told you "no" twice. At best there was a loose agreement to check out what you had on Friday. There wasn't a time or an address of where to meet. There was no deal with you Charles.

The text messages I posted start on November 23rd. I didn't post anything that appears before this date unless the conversation was on Facebook. I posted your text messages that you say prove your point. Again not so sure why you think there is a deal. I told you no twice, and Heather told you that we would prefer to make a cash deal since the female hog island is the only thing we were interested in. You said you didn't want to and said you could figure something out. That is a two hour drive for her to "figure something out" with you.

I don't think you are sticking up for what is right Charles. Since this transaction you have done nothing but be a bully, threaten, and berate me and anyone who has supported me. You went as far as to say "...if anyone see any excuse for their actions and feel cutomers being new are at fault I think people may think twice about buying from you."

If we would have said nothing and came straight to fauna We would be getting much different responses about the very same deal. I have seen people get handled way worse here then they were on FB. All the same just opinions being posted but it is all straying from the subject that this is really about. They did not want to give a refund and made it clear they would not. The FB posts made it happen and only that. And we would have got the same results if we came here first and said hey look at what they are doing. They would have gotten many posts saying give a refund. Now the whole BOI is being centered around the FB back and forth. All this is going to do is make them feel they can treat customers like they did and get away with it.

You have threatened to post on the fauna boi continuously since Saturday. I'm sorry you feel that you that the replies are unfair because I posted first. You took the time to post on several forums the situation. Once Jessica Daniel ignored me so that I could no longer reply I thought it was best to state this someplace where I had equal footing to defend myself. I have already explained how the decision to issue a refund was reached, I'm sorry you feel that isn't the case.

Again I thought this was over also but 5 days later saw the posts to the pictures maegan was displaying on her FB page. I did get upset reading them and Responded harshly. Maybe if she cosidered it over she would not have had it up on her FB wall 5 days later.

I haven't posted on any forum, any defense on anything since Saturday. I haven't said anything in five days and wouldn't have done so but became tired of watching day after day you and Jessica having something new to say. You have posted something every day since Saturday about this transaction. The things I post on my own personal Facebook page are just that, personal. I haven't posted anything that wasn't posted someplace else.

 

[bluevenom]

That's the skinniest BP you've ever seen, after having seen thousands? Yeah, sure. I'm sure you wouldn't exaggerate to support your already weak claims...no, not you. :rolleyes

_

Like I had nothing better to do. If you think that BP is a snake in good weight you have no idea. Its not only my opinion how under weight she is but the opinion of many and it is fact. If she looks good to you bring her into your collection and take care of her. Someone who knows what they are doing needs to.

Nice try. On the day that the transaction took place, Jessica posted on FB saying:
Not only is she disavowing having known about your alleged deal, but she said WE didn't know. So, while you're tying to say that somehow she didn't know what both you and her fiance knew about, she's saying neither of them knew. Unless you'd like to try to present some obscure defnition of "we". Another one of those pesky lies that you like to point out. Odd thing is, that the ones I'm seeing are coming from your side of the fence.

You took this quote out of context. She is talking about the fact that she made the deal not knowing I had already made a deal on the snake.

Another one of your attempted exaggerations. It was called two different things along the way: calcium deposit and live feeding scar. Both of which were clearly stated by the seller before the sale. It's not like its existence was a surprise. You guys are harping on something that was clearly called attention to before money ever changed hands

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I am not harping on it. Everyone else keeps bringing this up so I respond. The part she did not disclose was the missing tail tip.

Even before the deal was done, you were setting the stage for their being issues with the snakes. Suddently implying potential health issues

Yes after being lied to already I was suspicious of her word on the history and quality of her animals because this was the most important thing in all this and up until this point took her word for everything.


with snakes that you'd been actively pursuing for quite a while. Interesting coincidence, that...

So, NOW the point is that it was thin? What happened to it being on "death's door"? Interesting that it's suddenly not the point that a cold snake doesn't have the energy to lift itself up. And you're trying to portray the seller as someone who covers lies with other lies.. You flip-flop worse than a cheap pair of sandals. Once a very plausible explanation is given for the snake's lethargy, the point suddenly changes.

Again, I say, it's very interesting that someone who lauds his own level of knowledge would take a snake into the cool shade and make a point of calling attention to it's weakness. To me, it shows a complete willingness to put an animal at risk just to make some petty and non-existent point

.


Really... 5 minuites in the shade is putting the snake at risk? that is absurd. At this point you have stated your opinion and will keep fishing to prove your point and I feel I am waisting my time trying to get through to you because you made your statement and you are going to stick by it no matter what.



.

It's interesting that you'd like to portray the buyers basically as idiots who know nothing, but you apparently feel comfortable selling to them. Either you actually feel they know enough keep a snake healthy, and thus enough to spot a half-dead snake, or you simply don't care about handing your animals over to people who don't know enough to properly keep them. You can't have it both ways.

You just called them idiots not me. They are beginners with great intentions who give their pets the best care. Thay made a mistake in this deal do to inexperience. You said that makes one stupid not me.

Oh, I think you're right in line. In line with the behavior of someone who can be trusted just about as far as you can be picked up and thrown. Your little poor me routine isn't cutting it. As far as I can see, YOU are the basis of every single bit of drama in this transaction. Based on my already low opinion of you, I suspect that you decided to make sure this sale was doomed even before it took place. And based on my almost equally low opinion of the buyers, I have to think that they were fully complicit in your little game.

poor me? lol wow come on now really. The girls brought all this on and they could have done what any real dealer would have done at anytime and tried to resolve the issue regardless of anything I said to them they treated their customer tike crap. When they were wrong and a refund was due they should have just done it.


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Your own chosen course of action set the stage for everything else. You were calling Meagan a liar and a douch[sic] right off the bat.

All this came after they lied to me and told jessica if anything is wrong with the snake it is her fault and she said she will not give a refund.. And said she did not beleive it was a male we were lieing. That is when I sent her a pic for proof and the negative comments.

A refund was issued the following day, yet you and your lackeys still can't resist the kid games.

After the refund I responded to nasty posts she had up on her FB wall. And still feel a record needs to be made of how we were treated. I still cant get them to give me any Class III permit information that they are legally dealing in reptiles. Turns out they are dealing illegally And it is these types of things that bring heat down on everyone. Now it is spread all over they are illegally dealing in pythons and in Florida all people hear is python and illeagal deals and it is hyped up. They dont know or care if it is just a ball python and harmless.

You went out of your way to say this a couple of times. I have to wonder if your mom was referring to you when she said it.

And once again I admitted to the fact I did not need to be name calling but somehow it is ok for you to do it here because whatever reason you have is a valid reason to do so? I have no poor me attitude. I would never go out of my way to harm someone. They did a shady deal and took it this far and I didnt keep quiet about it and rightfully so.

 

[Fangthane]

YesI know you are coming into this late but I have already admitted I can not say if the snake is actually ill and can only say what I cann see and thet was that it is the skinniest I have ever seen.

More backpedaling. So now you're admitting to having lied? That's a good start. First it was on death's door, now you can't say it's actually ill, just thin. You're a riot. Those of you who think you're smart, are pretty amusing to those of us who actually are. Keep on flailing.

Next jessics was talking about the fact that when she agreed to purchase the snakes she was not aware of the deal

Yet another lie. This text tells a very different story: "Everyone knew what was going on the whole time." You guys really should work harder on keeping your respective stories straight.

What deal, exactly? The one that there's nothing to prove was set in stone? Somehow, I doubt the validity of your chosen interpretation of Jessica's post, however, it makes no difference. It's yet another instance of misleading claims that do nothing but cloud the issue. If she had such a problem with your supposed deal, she could have backed out at any time. Since she apparently wasn't bothered by it, and continued with the transaction, it amounts to nothing more than harping on a non-issue to try to play the poor, innocent victim. I'm noticing a bit of a theme.

Me being rude to them came after she called me a liar and laughed about the ordeal to me on the phone wich did disgust me.And I find it interesting that you say the worst thing I have done was express my low opinion of them yet that is exactly what you are doing right here but its ok for you.

If she called you a liar, it's seemingly a very appropriate adjective for you. You've yet to prove that you aren't a liar. Good luck with that one, as you've already been caught in a few. Of course she laughed about it over the phone...total shocker that something you claim happened on a medium that can't be verified in any way. Expressing a low opinion is far from the worst thing that you've done. You've attacked and subsequently backtracked. More of the aforementioned flip-flopping. At this point, in my eyes, your word means mud. You're as inept at deflecting as you are at lying. As I said, everything points toward you being the sole cause of all the subsequent drama. It seems that your involvement doomed this whole thing from the start.

If I am not responding to everything you said in this post I will in a bit when I have more time.

Take your time and make up something better than what you've already come up with. You seemed to think that a little smooth talking was all it'd take to mesmerize the masses into buying your story. Think again. The BOI isn't some closed FB group where people are only interested in protecting their own interests, and those of their buddies.