Bad Guy Chris Teem is a Fraud - Dart Frogs

[SmackoftheGods]

Chris Teem, running the business Rainforest Herps, is a fraud.

Many people have been having issues with him in the dart frog hobby. In the past two months he's taken a number of orders for bugs, plants, and frogs. He has been very adament about receiving the payment and yet has failed to deliver on all counts, even to people who once considered him to be a friend. He is always ready with an excuse as to why he had to postpone shipping again, or why he suspects USPS has been unable to deliver our goods. To the mods of Dendoboard he has been insisting that he is taking care of his customers, but every person I've spoken to has had to file a claim through Paypal in order to receive their refunds, has not received a single personal form of communication from Chris Teem, and has had all of their calls in an attempt to discuss a resolution screened. Chris Teem has cut off communication with a vast majority of his customers.

He is also suspected to still owe his webdesigner for his site, owe certain froggers for frogs he has, but has not paid for, and trying to sell rare frogs that are not his, but was entrusted to keep.

I recommend not falling into the same con that the rest of us have.

For more specific details I recommend viewing the following threads:

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/thunderdome/72997-rant-about-transactions.html

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/vendor-feedback/69106-rainforest-herps-rcteem.html

http://dartden.com/the-soap-box-f26/different-granny-lines-baru-and-quepos-t5309.html

http://www.frogforum.net/testimonials/9295-rainforest-herps-rcteem.html

- Jake Mallory

 

[David Scarboro]

Are You

A Moderator on any of those forums? Have you had a transaction go bad with him personally? Any Communication? Or, are you (with your first post) just reporting???

 

[JudyC]

Hi Jake,

This thread will go MUCH more smoothly and be far more productive in getting the message out if you will share the details of your personal transaction with Chris Teem.

Give a time-line...who contacted who...what was purchased and for how much...when/how was payment sent....and share all copies of e-mails, private messages, texts, etc, used to communicate with him regarding this transaction.

Third party allegations don't go over too well.

 

[JudyC]

Another option...if Jake doesn't have a personal transaction with this guy....is for him to spread the word about this thread to the people who HAVE had bad transactions...so they can come here and get the facts out properly.

 

[TheFragginDragon]

......but every person I've spoken to has had to file a claim through Paypal in order to receive their refunds, has not received a single personal form of communication from Chris Teem, and has had all of their calls in an attempt to discuss a resolution screened. Chris Teem has cut off communication with a vast majority of his customers.

He is also suspected to still owe his webdesigner for his site, owe certain froggers for frogs he has, but has not paid for, and trying to sell rare frogs that are not his, but was entrusted to keep.

Anonymous third party quotation's are not allowed in the BOI, you need to state who these people are.

 

[SmackoftheGods]

Okay. The links that I provided give a rather detailed account of many people's dealings with him and I'm simply trying to spread the word. However, I will copy (and perhaps add a little more detail) my personal tranasaction from the first link I provided:

I purchased four bromeliads from Chris Teem on August second. This was a transaction with a third party involved. This third party wanted to combine shipping with me since he knew I was looking at bromeliads.

Chris was very intense on being paid ASAP, however, never during the process of our transaction did I feel like the same urgency was being applied to getting our order out.

After two weeks - after payment sent - of not hearing anything I PM’d Chris:


Quote:
Originally Posted by SmackoftheGods
Hey Chris,

I haven't heard anything from (third party), so I figured I'd come straight to the source. Any news about those broms you're supposed to send out? I was under the impression that they were going out yesterday, but I haven't heard anything from anyone. Any news would be great

- Jake

Quote:
Originally Posted by rcteem
I didn't ship them yet as (third party) told me he was going out of town...I really need to talk to him too as soon as possible.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote:
Originally Posted by SmackoftheGods
Hi Chris just a follow up,

I've tried getting in touch with (third party) a couple of times since last you and I spoke. Currently he is incommunicado.... It happens sometimes... or maybe I was wrong and he _is_ still out of town. I don't know. However, I know that I've got an escudo tank and (third party) has a Cristobal tank that we're trying to finish and at least for me one of the few remaining things is a few large broms. While I'm confident that (third party) will be home by the time the bromeliads arrive, if you feel uncomfortable shipping to him you are more than welcome to ship to me. My shipping address is:

To this I received no response.

I finally got confirmation Monday, August 22, from the third party that Chris had shipped our bromeliads out and that expected arrival would be that Wednesday or Thursday. Saturday rolled around with no bromeliads so I sent Chris a PM:


Quote:
Originally Posted by SmackoftheGods
Hi Chris,

I'm writing just because I feel like I'm lacking details.... I haven't heard from you about whether my broms have been shipped or not, nor have I heard when they should be arriving. I've spoken with (third party) a few times this week and my understanding is that you shipped them on Monday, but as of last night they still had not arrivied. I have confidence that you will get the broms to where they need to be, safe and healthy, but I suppose I'm looking for some reassurance from you. _Did_ the broms go out on Monday? And if they did, did you happen to get a tracking number for them? It would be nice to know where they are, and if USPS screwed up it would be nice to have some proof that it's their fault (I don't imagine that broms are particularly fond of 7 days of darkness and 100+ degree weather).

I guess I'd just like to know what's up. I look forward to hearing from you,

- Jake

To this I received no response.

As the time limit for me filing a claim via paypal was running up I felt it was time to take action and I sent an e-mail:


Quote:
Originally Posted by SmackoftheGods
Chris,

I've sent you multiple PMs on Dendroboard and have received no response. This makes me a little nervous and a little unhappy. I have no ill-will toward you, and will not have any after this transaction. However, I do feel I should do you the courtesy of informing you that failure to respond to my inquiries in a timely manner will result in a dispute claim via paypal and negative feedback left on Dendroboard. I do apologize for the more severe tone of this e-mail, but the fact is I sent you your payment for these bromeliads almost a month ago and I have heard nothing from you regarding them. The only thing I've heard has been from (third party) who says you said the broms were shipped out last Monday. It has been over a week from when you supposedly shipped them and we haven't seen anything.

- Jake

I feel like I’ve been perfectly reasonable. However, every other time I’ve had plants shipped to me they’ve arrived within a week of my payment. This is my only Dendroboard transaction that has ever gone awry.

The links I provided will refer people to more stories of more scams (what proof I can provide), however, I've posted around those threads and told people to come post here.

Is this a little better?

- Jake Mallory

 

[SmackoftheGods]

Anonymous third party quotation's are not allowed in the BOI, you need to state who these people are.

I didn't quote anyone, I gave the general understanding of what has been said. It's not my place to speak for another person (not that I think many of them would mind), but as I said, I'm trying to get others to come here and post their experiences so that it won't be "anonymous third party quotations."

 

[wyldwurm]

I didn't quote anyone, I gave the general understanding of what has been said. It's not my place to speak for another person (not that I think many of them would mind), but as I said, I'm trying to get others to come here and post their experiences so that it won't be "anonymous third party quotations."

You can only speak about your own personal transaction, any other "suspicions" need to be brought out by the people he owes or scammed. Posting that he may owe a friend isn't allowed. That is a third party quotation.

 

[SmackoftheGods]

Okay, you guy wanna use a loose definition of the word "quotation" then that's fine. No where did I use quotation marks, nor did I use the word "quote," but that's fine, I'll play by your interpretation of the English language... even though my supposed anonymous third party quotations are all substantiated by the links I provided in my original post. Give me twenty-four hours and I'll get some others to come over here and post their experiences so it won't be a "third person quote."

 

[JudyC]

Maybe it would be more accurate to say "third party accusations" rather than "quotes"...but the principle is the same.

The BOI would be useless if folks were allowed to simply come here and say, "I have heard from people that JoeBobBreeder is a lying thief! Don't do business with him!"

I realize that you did provide links as some means of backing up what you say...but forums can die...threads can disappear...posts can be edited...links can become dead. Those that run the BOI have no control over what happens or what is said in those outside threads. Matters brought to the BOI need to be addressed AT the BOI.

I'm sure you'll be able to convince the appropriate parties to come here and do their part to help get the word out as needed.

 

[frogface]

He is also suspected to still owe his webdesigner for his site, owe certain froggers for frogs he has, but has not paid for, and trying to sell rare frogs that are not his, but was entrusted to keep.

Most of what I know is second hand. Chris Teem and I were frog buddies and this situation is making me feel terrible. I do have some limited first hand knowledge that I'll share. Also, the links that Jake posted have the 3rd parties testimonials regarding all of this.

There were some rare and expensive frogs that I took care of for a while. They were brought to me by Chris. He was frog sitting them for another fella. He gave me the first name of the guy who owned them and said the guy would be coming back to NC to pick them up in October. Chris picked up the frogs from my house sometime around the second week in August. I did not know the owner of the frogs and the owner did not know that I had them. A week or so ago, I got a PM from the owner, asking if I had his frogs. He had tracked me down through the grapevine and was trying to figure out where his frogs were. I have heard that Chris has tried to sell these frogs but I have no direct knowledge of that.

The other situation that involved me was regarding a trio of D tinctorius Lorenzos. Not a rare or particularly expensive frog, but, hard to find and somewhat coveted. I had 2 males and Chris purchased 2 females and a male from another frogger. Chris and I traded one of my males for one of his females. Chris then sold his 3 frogs. We did the trade in March, 2011, I believe.

Last week, I spoke with the original owner of the trio of Lorenzos and learned that Chris never paid him for the frogs. He traded and sold frogs that he never paid for. When Chris originally 'bought' the frogs, and I asked him why they were being sold, as they are difficult to find, he said the seller had a financial emergency and needed the money. That makes it even worse, IMO.

I still have my ill gotten female Lorenzo, due to the kindness of the original owner, who has allowed me to keep her.

I don't know what documentation I can produce for any of this, as it was mostly all done between 'friends', in person or over the phone.

I'm sorry Chris. I don't know what to think. I'm really very sad about it all.

 

[frogface]

A week or so ago, I got a PM from the owner, asking if I had his frogs. He had tracked me down through the grapevine and was trying to figure out where his frogs were.

Just wanted to update. I heard from the frog's owner tonight and he said he has received most of his frogs from Chris.

 

[mavortium]

Re: Rainforest Herps (Robert Chris Teem)
Negative Experience

Purchased his vanzolinii froglets on July 23rd (paid immediately). Cost was $425.

He told me he was going out of the country and couldn't ship until he returned on August 2nd. Sometime around August 5th I messaged him to ask what was going on and he changed his story. He told me he was moving everything to Washington DC. This excuse was given for several weeks. Not sure how one spends a month moving and disregards customers.

Since that time I have kept asking and asking for the frogs, he would either ignore my messages or give me a day of the week he intended to ship, but wouldn't come through (this happened several times). He even got me to call him on the phone and we proceeded to have a nice conversation, but 2.5 weeks later no frogs.

I demanded my money back but that message too was ignored.

I initiated a dispute with Paypal a few weeks ago and he has yet to respond. He never responded to their inquiry. The dispute elevated to a claim. Again he did not respond to paypal. They then reimbursed me themselves for the money that was defrauded from me by Robert Chris Teem.

I will not be dealing with Robert Chris Teem again and I would urge anyone else thinking about it to avoid him.

 

[tclipse]

Feedback- Negative

Transaction date: 8/14/2011

I purchased a "probable pair" of Solarte from Chris on 8/14, along with some cultures.

As far as the cultures go, he said he did not have them but would be going to NC the following Saturday and could pick them up then. After that Saturday, he did not have them and he said he would have them this past weekend. I was scheduled to pick up the cultures from him today, but instead asked for a refund based on the Solarte transaction, which I will explain in a second. The communication would have been non-exisistent if I had not gotten in touch with him. I don't feel like it is the buyer's responsibility to seek out information on their transaction, they should be kept in the loop by the seller if things are delayed.

Originally, Chris told me that one frog was an adult, and the second was 7-8 months+, and that he had them for several months before selling them. Both when I received them and later via PM, I mentioned that the 'female' looked either male or very young... no response on that front. I found out today (from the person who sold the frogs to Chris) that the older frog was 6 months, the younger frog 4 months (too young to sex as a female), and he had acquired them just two weeks earlier. When I spoke with him today, he claimed that he thought it was 1 adult and 1 @ 6 months, which differs from what he told me originally at the beginning of this paragraph.

Chris posted that transaction in vendor feedback on Dendroboard for the seller, the transaction date was 7/26/11 and the post date was 8/12/2011.. I left the quote out because I assume the seller does not want his name involved with this.

I spoke with Chris on the phone and let him know that I feel I was flipped a pair of frogs that were far too young to be sold as a probable pair, and for that reason I wasn't comfortable waiting any longer for the cultures and wanted a refund for them. It has been two weeks since then and still no refund, even though he said he would.

I would not recommend doing business with Teem.

 

[tclipse]

Most of what I know is second hand. Chris Teem and I were frog buddies and this situation is making me feel terrible. I do have some limited first hand knowledge that I'll share. Also, the links that Jake posted have the 3rd parties testimonials regarding all of this.

There were some rare and expensive frogs that I took care of for a while. They were brought to me by Chris. He was frog sitting them for another fella. He gave me the first name of the guy who owned them and said the guy would be coming back to NC to pick them up in October. Chris picked up the frogs from my house sometime around the second week in August. I did not know the owner of the frogs and the owner did not know that I had them. A week or so ago, I got a PM from the owner, asking if I had his frogs. He had tracked me down through the grapevine and was trying to figure out where his frogs were. I have heard that Chris has tried to sell these frogs but I have no direct knowledge of that.

The other situation that involved me was regarding a trio of D tinctorius Lorenzos. Not a rare or particularly expensive frog, but, hard to find and somewhat coveted. I had 2 males and Chris purchased 2 females and a male from another frogger. Chris and I traded one of my males for one of his females. Chris then sold his 3 frogs. We did the trade in March, 2011, I believe.

Last week, I spoke with the original owner of the trio of Lorenzos and learned that Chris never paid him for the frogs. He traded and sold frogs that he never paid for. When Chris originally 'bought' the frogs, and I asked him why they were being sold, as they are difficult to find, he said the seller had a financial emergency and needed the money. That makes it even worse, IMO.

I still have my ill gotten female Lorenzo, due to the kindness of the original owner, who has allowed me to keep her.

I don't know what documentation I can produce for any of this, as it was mostly all done between 'friends', in person or over the phone.

I'm sorry Chris. I don't know what to think. I'm really very sad about it all.

I spoke with the owner of the Lorenzos and Chris also still owes him for a pair of Blue Jeans he received in December... not sure if there are any other frogs involved but he did say the total was $1200.

 

[SmackoftheGods]

Just wanted to update. I heard from the frog's owner tonight and he said he has received most of his frogs from Chris.

I received a text about thirty minutes regarding the same thing and that is confirmed. Bryce (don't know his last name... that's as specific as I can get) received a majority of his rare frogs in the mail this morning. The status of the rest of the frogs owed is still unknown....

 

[Shadera]

Okay, you guy wanna use a loose definition of the word "quotation" then that's fine. No where did I use quotation marks, nor did I use the word "quote," but that's fine, I'll play by your interpretation of the English language... even though my supposed anonymous third party quotations are all substantiated by the links I provided in my original post. Give me twenty-four hours and I'll get some others to come over here and post their experiences so it won't be a "third person quote."

I think it has some to do with the fact that most forums don't require full names and locations on profiles/posts which does make them pretty anonymous to people outside that community.

Also, all but the last link require a login to even view the threads. I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm not gonna go through the hassle of signing up for a site I'll never visit again just to see a thread or two.

Whatever is going on, hope y'all get it worked out.

 

[SmackoftheGods]

I think it has some to do with the fact that most forums don't require full names and locations on profiles/posts which does make them pretty anonymous to people outside that community.

Also, all but the last link require a login to even view the threads. I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm not gonna go through the hassle of signing up for a site I'll never visit again just to see a thread or two.

Whatever is going on, hope y'all get it worked out.

The second link requires the first and last name of at least the Vendor being discussed.... I'm unaware of any need to login, but that's because I'm a member of those forums so I'm typically logged in anyway. It still doesn't change the fact that they are there and are verifiable. Also, if you're not going to be buying dart frogs or supplies for dart frogs chances are you won't be doing business with Chris anyway (unless he moves into another section of the herp hobby). I posted on this forum because Dart Frogging is a very niche-like hobby and in the event that Chris Teem _does_ decide to move into another aspect of the herp hobby I wanted to be able to reach a broader range of hobbyists.... I felt like I was hopefully doing the herp hobby a favor, although you wouldn't think so based on a number of the comments in this thread.

Also, I decided to look a little something up:

Quote: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/quote

1a : to speak or write (a passage) from another usually with credit acknowledgment
b : to repeat a passage from especially in substantiation or illustration
2: to cite in illustration <quote a similar case>
3a : to state (the current price or bid-offer spread) for a commodity, stock, or bond
b : to give exact information on
4: to set off by quotation marks

If whomever left me negative Karma would care to illustrate how I met any one of those definitions I'd be happy to recant my statement that I didn't quote anyone.

Feel free to compare that to:

Summarize: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/summarize?show=0&t=1316582599

: to tell in or reduce to a summary

Or synopsize: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/synopsize

to make a synopsis of (as a novel)

Or encapsulate: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/encapsulate

Either way, hopefully some of these other hobbyists who have had encounters with Chris will mitigate my "anonymous third-party quote." I did not intend to break any of the forum rules, but when a rule says I can't quote someone, I take the word literally and didn't.

 

[Clay Davenport]

Let's get over the semantics of what is and what isn't a quote. We don't need dictionary citations. The specific infraction is titled "Anonymous third party quotation". Included in this is accusations and information provided anonymously by a third party.
Every statement made on the BOI must be attributed to an actual person who is identified. Even though you didn't repeat what others told you verbatim in the form of an official quote, you still relayed their statements and experiences without them being identified.

If you have any further complaints about the infraction you received, take it to the feedback forum.

 

[botanyboy03]

This is a copy of what I wrote in the vendor feedback over at dendroboard. This is what happened to me

Transaction date: 8-11-11

Feedback negative

I answered an ad Chris posted around the 7th or 8th of August of a list of frogs he was going to have available at the Carolina Reptile and Exotic pets show in Raleigh on Sept 3rd and 4th. I was told the price on the Abiseo pepperis was 80 each or 4 or more at 70 each, so I decided to get a quartet. I had to wait a few days to send Chris money as I was about 3 or 4 days off from payday. He was insistent that I send money right away, which I was hesitant about, as it was a bit of time before the show, but I wanted to reserve the frogs. I decided to use paypal as I had a gut reaction to use this rather than a money transfer through my bank, as paypal seemed the safer option for sending money. Chris received my money almost immediately and confirmed that he would be at the show with them at opening on Saturday as he was vending.

I arrive at the show and there is no Chris, and he hadn't given me his number( now a huge red flag) and I was talking to some other froggers from here and the news was that Chris had been told that the venue was full and he was being refunded his booth space money, and that he was to arrive between 130 and 2 pm at the show. So I waited. He arrived around 2, told me that he had sideswiped a car in Richmond and that had taken some time, which I understand. But here was the deal, he hadn't been able to collect the frogs from the person who had bred them and that how was next weekend? I said I would let him know, as that weekend and this one are open house for my job at a high end mail order nursery in Raleigh, and that I would have to see what I can do. He promised to throw in a few more broms for my inconvenience.

I couldn't meet him last weekend, but I had texted him mid week after the show, and I received this response, the only one I have ever received from him

"I'll be coming down Saturday but I'll also be coming the weekend after that. Wanna shoot for the next weekend or want me to ship them?"

I responded with that this weekend would be the best and then nothing. I've tried getting in touch with him both via phone and via here and as of now, the PM I sent him on Friday hasn't been read yet.

I just filed a dispute with paypal to get my money back.
again. This was just the wrong way to handle this situation. There are plenty of other vendors with whom I would not hesitate to buy from again. So as of today, September 18th, I haven't received frogs I paid for almost a month and a half ago.

To add to this, I have escalated my dispute to a claim on paypal and am waiting to hear back from them. I have yet to hear back from Chris in the regards. I talked with the actual owner/breeder of the Abiseo Amereega pepperi and he said Chris Teem had come to him saying he had sold off 8 of his offspring for him and that it was not something the breeder really wanted, but that if Chris could get the money, then he would sell the frogs. Chris got my money, but the owner of the frogs did not ever see any of my 280 dollars.

I would never buy anything else from Chris. Its nothing personal, he was very nice to me to my face while he was not giving me my frogs.

Zac Hill