• Responding to email notices you receive.
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    Yeah, I know. They are a pain in the butt. But they pay the bills to keep my server running. Just a fact of life, I am afraid.

    Want to get rid of them? Simple. Just become a Contributor level member or above and they will be gone. -> Please click HERE."

    Is that too much for me to ask of you to keep this site running? Well, sorry about that. I too wish I could get everything for free. But alas.....

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    Google Adsense ad revenue for December, 2025 was just $30 over the cost of the lease for the server running this site. So, in effect, the money providing the incentive for me to continue running this site is coming SOLELY from the paid memberships and sponsorships here. Which honestly ain't much....

Bad Guy Fire and Ice Dragons (Terri Sommella)

The only thing the OP really has to worry about is whether he gets his monies worth... There's no doubt he'll get his dragon, but there's a possibility it might not be "all that with a bag of chips"

Especially in our current marketplace. I am looking on Fire and Ice dragons site right now and compared to the current market their prices are stupid. They have a relatively nice citrus (200-250 maybe) priced at 500 plus shipping. Not to mention (i will have to research to find where I read this at) but they have been known to doctor photos.

I feel for the OP in this situation because I do not see anyway that the dragon received will be a 400 dollar dragon in todays market.
 
I really hope you get the dragon you want. I purchased from Fire and Ice 3 years ago and everything went perfectly. I did purchase a baby that was already ready to go though (also holdback quality).
 
I had asked for pictures out of curiosity and from some of the other feedback that was posted here. She states that the babies are in constant shed so she doesn't do pictures.

I am an understanding person. I do understand that things happen, but I really do feel as though I am getting the run around from her.

Hi Folks, I was just made aware of this and so am responding to each item. Thanks for your patience.

As to the statement above, this person first asked for a pic yesterday. I told him I would be happy to take a pic, sent him stats and told him that, 8 grams was normal weight for the dragon at 4-5 weeks. This morning, I emailed him stating that the dragon is in shed. So he had a few choices. He could either wait for the dragon to come out of shed and receive a pic at that time, direct me to choose another dragon or ship this dragon as is. It was up to him. I have not heard back. Regards, Terri, Fire and Ice Dragons
 
I really hope you get the dragon you want. I purchased from Fire and Ice 3 years ago and everything went perfectly. I did purchase a baby that was already ready to go though (also holdback quality).

Thanks for the nice words, Kristi. You have no idea of how much we appreciate it. We have been in business for 12 years and judging from the testimonials we receive, I believe 99% of our customers are happy, not only with our dragons but also our service before AND after the sale. Other than our site which posts as many of our testimonials as possible, there is no board where happy people post nice comments. Unfortunately, anyone can post on this board whether the statements are true or not.

Regards,

Terri, Fire and Ice Dragons
 
Especially in our current marketplace. I am looking on Fire and Ice dragons site right now and compared to the current market their prices are stupid. They have a relatively nice citrus (200-250 maybe) priced at 500 plus shipping. Not to mention (i will have to research to find where I read this at) but they have been known to doctor photos.

I feel for the OP in this situation because I do not see anyway that the dragon received will be a 400 dollar dragon in todays market.

Bryan,

As you are also a bearded dragon breeder, I hope readers will take your comments with a grain of salt. Adam is a recognized photographer and his photos are shown as the dragon looks in real life under optimal conditions. If people have well bred, high-end animals and the dragons are set up correctly, those dragons, too, would "glow in their cages" as one customer commented on our Citrus after visiting our facility (see home page testimonial at www.fireandicedragons.com). In that case, there is no need to doctor photos. Our lines speak for themselves.
As to pricing, I have had industry associates and even customers say our prices, for what we offer, Pedigreed animals, shopping lists, follow up service, etc. are very reasonable. In fact, we talked about raising our prices. People who have no time invested in the industry are charging what we charge or more. Since we have not raised our prices in 10 years, perhaps it is time. We will see.
Regards, Terri Sommella, Fire and Ice Dragons
 
I am sorry that many of you do not agree with this thread. My intention was not to jump the gun and throw someone under the bus just for the fun of it. I have a geniune concern from a fairly large breeder.

I guess if all else fails, someone can learn from my mistake and not pay for something before it hatches. I do think however that many of you would share my concern if you had a were in a similar position.

Josh, You knew going in what the wait time was. We are a small, exclusive breeder not a high volume warehouse operation. If you want a hand-picked dragon that is in demand, you wait. As mentioned in the email I sent you last night, your order was originally for a Red from Pandora's clutch, but then you changed the order. You were told then that the Citrus was to hatch about 6/7. So by selecting a clutch hatching later, obviously you would have to wait. Then you post on this board because you don't have your dragon 3 weeks later? Even if you did have some legitimate concern, you should have spoken to me first rather than posting here. I am very accessible and bend over backwards to help. - Terri, Fire and Ice Dragons
 
Sometimes it just takes a little post on the BOI to get a person to do the right thing. Hope everything works out.

We do the right thing because it is the way we conduct business. I suspect that breeders who do not do the right thing, don't care what is posted on this board. Regards, Terri Sommella
 
Bryan,

As you are also a bearded dragon breeder, I hope readers will take your comments with a grain of salt. Adam is a recognized photographer and his photos are shown as the dragon looks in real life under optimal conditions. If people have well bred, high-end animals and the dragons are set up correctly, those dragons, too, would "glow in their cages" as one customer commented on our Citrus after visiting our facility (see home page testimonial at www.fireandicedragons.com). In that case, there is no need to doctor photos. Our lines speak for themselves.
As to pricing, I have had industry associates and even customers say our prices, for what we offer, Pedigreed animals, shopping lists, follow up service, etc. are very reasonable. In fact, we talked about raising our prices. People who have no time invested in the industry are charging what we charge or more. Since we have not raised our prices in 10 years, perhaps it is time. We will see.
Regards, Terri Sommella, Fire and Ice Dragons

I'm sorry but looking at the gallery on your site, your photos (some more than others) stand out as being "enhanced". One in particular has a high saturation and a ton of noise and grain in the photo (more than the others). Also the shadow of the dragon is an odd color. Even with a crappy camera you can't get something like that without messing with it a bit. I don't doubt that dragons can be that bright, I've had one in the past that was like a highlighter but I do not trust the photos on your site.
 
I was concerned after this email but understand things happen. She followed up by telling me that it would be another 4 weeks before the dragons would be the correct weight and size for shipping. Now if you have an animal that is only 5-6" in eight weeks, something is not right.

All of this is totally incorrect as is the "many unhappy people posting on this board" about our dragons comment. Where do you get this??? As you can see, josh first contacted me about this on the 19th. here is the actual email. I think it is clear this whole post is bogus.

On Mon, Jul 19, 2010 at 1:27 PM, wrote:

Hi Josh,

Good to hear from you. This should clear up the questions you have.

First, we could not possibly ship the Citrus the end of June if the clutch hatched on 6/7. That would mean shipping 3 week old dragons. We ship at 10 grams or more and after 2 sheds. Usually, we start shipping a clutch at 4 weeks of age (weather permitting). That way, we know what the dragon is shaping up like and which are the best in the clutch. Perhaps you are thinking of the Pandora clutch which would have been ready to start shipping on 6/7. If you recall, you changed your mind and went instead for the Citrus from Mia x Photon which hatched later.

There is also the issue of weather. We have had very few days where we can ship anyone's dragon in the past 3 weeks. This week again it is over 100 degrees. As I am sure you have heard on the news, this is the hottest summer on record. No one could have foreseen this when factoring in timeframes to ship. However, if you want us to ship your dragon in temps above safe, please let me know. As long as you assume full responsibility, we will ship your dragon.

As for size and weight, no problem. All you have to do is ask. If the dragon is out of shed, we can send pics, too, upon request. I will send your dragon's stats when I go to the facility this afternoon. If your dragon is out of shed, I will let you know about pics, too.

Sound good?

Regards,

Terri

Josh did not reply, he posted here but to what? Was there anything in this email that warranted a post on this board? When he asked for a refund he threatened us with all of this bogus posting. But we would not change a company policy as a result of a smear campaign and threats. Why would we reward someone like that? We have decided to brave it out. The fact is our policy is posted online. Everything is out in the open. It is the customer's responsibility to read it.
 
Terri,

I will be posting the email here shortly where you stated that the clutch will begin shipping at the end of June. The issue here is that I am getting back and forth information as to why there is a delay. Please understand that I understand the weather situation. That was above and beyond anything you can control.

You charge a premium price for your animals. I think that it is only fair to assume that as a paying customer, I would get premium service. I really don't think that I am out of line to request pictures and status updates. Per your original email, you have three types of dragons, normal, hold back, and collectors. You had stated that there is one collectors per clutch (top pick that is the most colorful) and 2-3 hold backs. From the pics of your breeders, you should be more than willing to show off pictures of your hatchlings for your customers to see.
 
I was concerned after this email but understand things happen. She followed up by telling me that it would be another 4 weeks before the dragons would be the correct weight and size for shipping. Now if you have an animal that is only 5-6" in eight weeks, something is not right.

All of this is totally incorrect as is the "many unhappy people posting on this board" about our dragons comment. Where do you get this??? As you can see, josh first contacted me about this on the 19th. here is the actual email. I think it is clear this whole post is bogus.

On Mon, Jul 19, 2010 at 1:27 PM, wrote:

Hi Josh,

Good to hear from you. This should clear up the questions you have.

First, we could not possibly ship the Citrus the end of June if the clutch hatched on 6/7. That would mean shipping 3 week old dragons. We ship at 10 grams or more and after 2 sheds. Usually, we start shipping a clutch at 4 weeks of age (weather permitting). That way, we know what the dragon is shaping up like and which are the best in the clutch. Perhaps you are thinking of the Pandora clutch which would have been ready to start shipping on 6/7. If you recall, you changed your mind and went instead for the Citrus from Mia x Photon which hatched later.

There is also the issue of weather. We have had very few days where we can ship anyone's dragon in the past 3 weeks. This week again it is over 100 degrees. As I am sure you have heard on the news, this is the hottest summer on record. No one could have foreseen this when factoring in timeframes to ship. However, if you want us to ship your dragon in temps above safe, please let me know. As long as you assume full responsibility, we will ship your dragon.

As for size and weight, no problem. All you have to do is ask. If the dragon is out of shed, we can send pics, too, upon request. I will send your dragon's stats when I go to the facility this afternoon. If your dragon is out of shed, I will let you know about pics, too.

Sound good?

Regards,

Terri

Josh did not reply, he posted here but to what? Was there anything in this email that warranted a post on this board? When he asked for a refund he threatened us with all of this bogus posting. But we would not change a company policy as a result of a smear campaign and threats. Why would we reward someone like that? We have decided to brave it out. The fact is our policy is posted online. Everything is out in the open. It is the customer's responsibility to read it.

Wow Terri...I would welcome any proof that you have to offer that I was threatening. I really think that so far I have been playing nice. By no means was this a smear campaign. If you remember, I had sent you this email:

Terri,

I have been doing a bit of research and I am beginning to think that I am being taken advantage of. I have been a member of faunaclassifieds for a bit of time now and have put in extensive research. Every other breeder of dragons provides updates and pictures of the animal. Also if there is an issue with the dragons not being the correct weight and size by this time, there is something wrong with that batch of animals. Per your site, you do offer refunds. "Please note: No refunds are given on deposits for special order dragons or dragons held for International shipment before the dragon has shipped. Thank you". My order was not for a special order dragon or for international shipping. I am formally asking for a refund. Our original agreement was for the clutch that hatched on 6-7-10. You stated in the email that it would ship the end of June. It is quickly approaching the end of July.

I am asking that you please honor your guarantee for a refund. I wish to settle this amicably.

When I read that, I do not get any threatening tones. No vulgar language was used or any type of "you need to do this or else" type statements.

When I placed my order, I consider the purchase as a commitment to both parties. I had the commitment of getting you a payment as well as getting the supplies in order that you had said needed on your shopping list. You had the commitment as a seller to, within reason, provide me with hold back quality dragon. I also do not think that pictures were out of line.

How is providing me a refund, rewarding me? I am not asking for any type of free anything. I do not expect a refund and the dragon. I am asking you to honor your commitment and do the right thing.
 
Sounds like a case of "Buyer's remorse" to me!

and he STILL hasn't replied to Kelli's question... (just saying).

Not buyers remorse. I have purchased many of dragons on this site. I have also left good feedback for those folks. I will be more than happy to pm you some of the folks I have purchased from and you can ask them how their transactions with me went.

Here is the answer to Kelli's question:

[email protected]
toJosh Davis <[email protected]>

dateThu, Jun 24, 2010 at 9:43 AM
subjectRe: shipping

hide details Jun 24

We are still assigning Pandora's babies. I had you down for a female 295. Then if we did not have a hold back quality female, you said you wanted a Mia x Photon female. Correct? There was so many changes to your order, I want to make sure we have it right. Please verify your order and I can give you an approximate ship date.

Mia x Photon babies are only about 10 days - 2 weeks old so for this clutch it will be about 4 weeks. For Pandora's if we have one it will be a week or 2.


----- Original Message -----
From: Josh Davis
To: [email protected]
- Hide quoted text -
Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2010 11:37 AM
Subject: shipping


Terri,

Any guesses on when the dragon will ship?

--
Thanks,

Josh Davis
 
I was concerned after this email but understand things happen. She followed up by telling me that it would be another 4 weeks before the dragons would be the correct weight and size for shipping. Now if you have an animal that is only 5-6" in eight weeks, something is not right.

All of this is totally incorrect as is the "many unhappy people posting on this board" about our dragons comment. Where do you get this??? As you can see, josh first contacted me about this on the 19th. here is the actual email. I think it is clear this whole post is bogus.

On Mon, Jul 19, 2010 at 1:27 PM, wrote:

Hi Josh,

Good to hear from you. This should clear up the questions you have.

First, we could not possibly ship the Citrus the end of June if the clutch hatched on 6/7. That would mean shipping 3 week old dragons. We ship at 10 grams or more and after 2 sheds. Usually, we start shipping a clutch at 4 weeks of age (weather permitting). That way, we know what the dragon is shaping up like and which are the best in the clutch. Perhaps you are thinking of the Pandora clutch which would have been ready to start shipping on 6/7. If you recall, you changed your mind and went instead for the Citrus from Mia x Photon which hatched later.

There is also the issue of weather. We have had very few days where we can ship anyone's dragon in the past 3 weeks. This week again it is over 100 degrees. As I am sure you have heard on the news, this is the hottest summer on record. No one could have foreseen this when factoring in timeframes to ship. However, if you want us to ship your dragon in temps above safe, please let me know. As long as you assume full responsibility, we will ship your dragon.

As for size and weight, no problem. All you have to do is ask. If the dragon is out of shed, we can send pics, too, upon request. I will send your dragon's stats when I go to the facility this afternoon. If your dragon is out of shed, I will let you know about pics, too.

Sound good?

Regards,

Terri

Josh did not reply, he posted here but to what? Was there anything in this email that warranted a post on this board? When he asked for a refund he threatened us with all of this bogus posting. But we would not change a company policy as a result of a smear campaign and threats. Why would we reward someone like that? We have decided to brave it out. The fact is our policy is posted online. Everything is out in the open. It is the customer's responsibility to read it.

So I didn't reply?

fromJosh Davis <[email protected]>
[email protected]

dateMon, Jul 19, 2010 at 4:18 PM
subjectRe:
mailed-bygmail.com

hide details 4:18 PM (17 hours ago)

Terri,

I understand the part on the weather. I do not wish to have an animal shipped to me in temps that could be lethal. I want to be sure that the animal is happy and healthy when it is shipped. My concern here is that I am being told that the animal will not be the correct size to ship for another 4 weeks. This will put us middle of August for a dragon that hatched on 6-7-10. It worries me that perhaps the dragon has some sort of health issue that is causing the slow developement as you stated that the normal time to reach proper size is 4 weeks.

I would like pics and status updates if you would be willing please.

Thank you

As for not contacting you before July 19th, I can prove this false as well. I still wish to settle this as amicably as possible. I am again formally requesting a refund as this is not what our original agreement was. If a refund is offered, I will gladly consider the issue resolved and post here that you handled the issue.
 
Also Terri, per your site:

"Please note: No refunds are given on deposits for special order dragons or dragons held for International shipment before the dragon has shipped. Thank you. "

That is the only section you have on a refund. My order with you does not fall under either of these. So why is my request not being granted?
 
Bryan,

As you are also a bearded dragon breeder, I hope readers will take your comments with a grain of salt. Adam is a recognized photographer and his photos are shown as the dragon looks in real life under optimal conditions. If people have well bred, high-end animals and the dragons are set up correctly, those dragons, too, would "glow in their cages" as one customer commented on our Citrus after visiting our facility (see home page testimonial at www.fireandicedragons.com). In that case, there is no need to doctor photos. Our lines speak for themselves.
As to pricing, I have had industry associates and even customers say our prices, for what we offer, Pedigreed animals, shopping lists, follow up service, etc. are very reasonable. In fact, we talked about raising our prices. People who have no time invested in the industry are charging what we charge or more. Since we have not raised our prices in 10 years, perhaps it is time. We will see.
Regards, Terri Sommella, Fire and Ice Dragons

Are you kidding me
You are seriously saying that because I breed bearded dragons that my opinion does not matter. You are rediculous saying that. I have no hate or love for you or your company I am only stating what I know. I could care less if you do or do not make a sale and I certainly am not taking customers from you cause the people that would put 400 dollars down on a egg are not people that do business with me in the first place. I breed for high quality pets. I would never call myself a "professional breeder" like yall. And the fact that yall doctor photos is so obvious on your site that it is not even funny. Anyone with an ounce of photography background could call that one. You need to catch your tone and maybe talk to people like you would like to be talked to. If you have a problem with me or my comments I do not care but I will promise you this my post was truthful.

Pathetic.
 
I could be wrong here, and I am not trying to get in the middle of this, but it sounds like a case of mis-communication and a phone call would probably help a lot. Just my .2 cents.
 
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