Has this ever happened to you,,?

[Golden Gate Geckos]

Seamus might have been a bit hard on the beaver because of his passion for all of us that keep animals [herps]

John, perhaps you are unaware that I am also "all of us that keep animals [herps]"

let me ask you all this do you want someone [with athority] coming into your house [going on hearsay from perhaps a neighbor or some one you ticked off] and raiding your whole collection because they said it was un sanitory or they said you have protected animals?????????????????]

John, NONE of us want our collections raided, and I have a sneaking suspicion that is exactly what Seamus is afraid of... after reading through his home page I am forming the opinion he probably does keep illegal and/or vemomous herps. In his AOL profile, he says his hobbies are snake anti-venom! If that is the case, then it is reptile keepers like him that break the law that are responsible for all of the legistature, NOT a concerned Leopard Gecko breeder who reports a deplorable situation the the management in a Petco store.

To quote Seamus himself:

The obvious response to my above comments is to state that they are a worst case scenario and the likelhood of those events occuring as stated is so minute as to be disregarded...

While it's unlikely that it would reach that point, the sole reason that it might be stopped is because there are good, knowledgeable and honest herpers out there who will fight against the proposed advances of anti-animal legislation tooth and nail

In the unlikely event that something like that would happen, I would be right there fighting with the other honest herpers.

I do NOT think that what Marcia did is going to send my to close my blinds and lock my doors because the animal police are coming my way.

Thanks! I am not worried about that either!

everything he is saying is based on the verbage that since Marcia did this we will all have jack-booted government investigators at our doors if our permits arent filled out or the bearded dragon is on your shoulder.

Exactly! I really had no clue just how powerful I am! If I am so instrumental in changing the country's legislature on owning reptiles, it would seem to me that people like Seamus would be doing everything in his power to butter me up and get on my "good-guy' list instead of calling me "a liar, stupid, evil, a very bad person, in the same camp as PETA, HSUS and that wretched... word that isn't allowed... Kraplin, ignorant, a PeTA style lunatic, a rabid drooling anti-human pro-money activist, identical to Kaplan, deceitful, a lying, two faced psuedoherper, spouter of meaningless drivel, rabid fanatical sign waving, deviant socio-political, the antithesis of what's good for the industry, and foolish" (to name a few.)

I find it interesting that Seamus is allowed to continue to verbally abuse and attack me, and others in different threads on Fauna, without receiving any 'points' for his behavior like anyone else would for lesser offenses. I have had several emails and private messages from forum members that are reluctant to post anything because of Seamus' continued abuse of anyone he disagrees with. These forum members (including myself) have attempted to report his antagonism to the the moderators without any action being taken.

Personally, I feel that this entire Fauna website that Rich has so deepley been comitted to is detremented from funtioning the way it could by inhibiting it's members from being active in it by allowing people like Seamus to behave the way they do.

 

[Uffern]

Some of you say that Seamus was attacking Marcia, but that none of you attacked Seamus.

this is someone just spouting off or someone with actual working knowledge due to experience............. i seem to believe my first choice.

consider the souce. and not responde to a person as disrespectful and apparently not worthy of an intelegent response or your time

the wisdom you continue to hand out to us mortals.

you seem to know everything,,, is there anything you don't know..?

with your arrogant, know-it-all, judge and jury, dictatorial rhetoric

I am growing weary of your infantile tantrums and false sense of magnanimity. I regret to inform you that the entire universe does NOT revolve around you or your foul mouth. It must be very lonely for you to live inside that big BLACK HOLE.

Shameus

Looks like hypocrisy to me.

I agree with Seamus. What happened was not a victory for you, or for the animals. It was a victory for PETA and HSUS and all those like them, and a victory for them is anything but a victory for pet owners everywhere.

 

[WebSlave]

Just for the record, I put this SOUND OFF!! forum up here because I felt it would be a good place for people to let off steam about things that just piss them off or have to get off their shoulders. I fully expected that some threads may very well get heated with conflicting opinions. I don't think it could help but become that way in some instances.

This forum is offered "as is". I am not acting as a nanny here. People whom partake in discussing issues in public places really should be able to handle such things if that is what they are going to do. From what I have seen here, this is pretty tame compared to some things I have had to break up on the BOI, and I certainly do not have the time to step in everytime someone's toes may get stepped on.

Of course, I will not allow anything to get too extreme, but for the most part, what has been experience thus far in this forum is par for the course.

 

[Stardust]

On this one Marcia, I hope Webslave steps aside somewhat. He has indeed overlooked a lot of what Seamus has said, and we as the peon readers and bunt of Seamus' sometimes rather cruel and crude remarks should be addressed with no points either. After all this is the "sound off" forum. And we are STILL doing it without name calling or cateragizing (sp).
In fact, at the risk of a point or two or five or ten. I will say that I think Seamus put you in a category. His own personal .. I hate mK, peta ect category. That just shows the childness of it all. Can't continue a debate without it or name calling. NO OFFENSE< JUST A EXAMPLE............ It would be like me not liking what John says and instead of just talking it out with him, like I did, I just put him in a category like Seamus would.... and said something like......... you must be a fag for sticking up for Seamus because that is what they all do........ I DID NOT SAY THAT, I chose to speak out nicely yet voice my opinion.

 

[Stardust]

Well Richard, I did not write any of those quotes you gave. Nor do I think they are very attacking. Go to iguana forum where I wanted to try to get people who own them to start talking and see what was written there. Probably why no one goes there.
Sorry Webslave, I was writing at the same time you posted, glad to here that this is truly a sound off forum, because everyone needs to every now and then.
Richard, do you also agree with all of which Seamus has called her? How was it a victory? Did she make any new laws I am unaware of? What? OMG is she a politician incognito behind her gecko? Or is it a fake looking gecko and she is with PETA? hmmmm.
Come on, talk about drama.

 

[robin d.]

ya know

speaking of points and favorites and what not.....

a while back i got points for calling Seamus a self proclaimed genius or something or another, i cant exactly remember anywho.......

said it was a personal attack....

whatever
what makes me any different from him and the way he has been attacking Marcia? it's a personal attack , right?
yes i think places like this need to be "policed " in a sense BUT playing favorites or whatever you want to call it or perhaps turning a blind eye, [like Seamus seems to want to do with animals in diplorable (sp?) conditions] is wrong.
oh well whatever

 

[Dragondad]

Hypocrisy

Richard you know you can call it what you will. But at least I don't refer to anyone as stupid or resort to name calling of any kind. I am not going after his character either John. Didn't call anyone a cheat, liar or thief. Bottom line is Seamus has no problem letting the world know what he thinks. Up to and including calling people names who disagree with him. I think its about time for someone to ask the question who is this person and what credentials does he have to call anyone stupid. So I am going to ask the questions same questions that have been asked and ignored.

We know you are from MA and currently living in CO you say you keep herps but have not provided details.
So I am curious what do you keep Seamus?
How long have you kept herps?
How old are you and what is your formal education?
Why is it that everyone who disagrees with you is labeled as a Peta member or Kaplan like?
And since we are on the subject why do you hate MK so much?
Shall we start an MK thread so we can hear this too....

Just out of curiosity I just left a brand new Petco here in MI been open less than a month. It amazing that with all the terrible things that Marcia did to them they still opened a new store and guess what it sells animals. Oh my I about fell over faint on the spot. I figured with the Peta support and all its secret members running around trying to shut them down I would find nothing but dog food bags.

As far as how this thread started yes I have seen some pretty bad things in pet stores. When I can I try to point out mistakes or to help. But Richard and John my question is this...

HOW MANY ANIMALS HAVE TO DIE AT THE HANDS OF AN UNCARING STORE BEFORE YOU WOULD STEP IN AND CALL SOMEONE? Come on guys answer......

Seems I have seen threads of this nature before and everyone says call the local human society or call so and so. Marcia did what a responsible hobbyist should do tried to educate and when it became apparent that it was going to be ignored or shut out for continued profits provided info to the proper authorities. Keeping in mind that whatever laws were sited were in place. She didn't make new ones just helped provide info to stop a bad situation. And for this she is called stupid, ignorant, a secret PETA member (the last one has got to be the worst)probably worships the ground Kaplan walks on too. Oh Marcia how could you...LOL



Stardust said it best everyone needs to stop lumping people into the little labels when they disagree with what they have said or done.

I will go on record again and say. Marcia did the right thing. You can disagree or agree but don't try to label me as something I am not because you disagree.

 

[WebSlave]

Robin - read my post again, this time a little slower.

 

[Stardust]

Webslave, There would haven't been just a wee bit of sarcasism in that lone sentence would there be? Sense of humor perhaps?

 

[Stardust]

Robin, you were on the BOI, now this is SOUND OFF. More goes here than there. So unwind, take a load off, sit back and have a good time!

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

Keep the discussion civil, please. I do expect some discussions will get VERY heated in here, but they will not be tolerated if they get too carried away. I don't have a problem with deleting entire threads in here if I find it necessary.Thanks. WebSlave

Webslave, could you please give us your definition on "civil" and "carried away?"


Thanks.

 

[WebSlave]

I sure am glad to see that you all think I have unlimited time to patrol all of these forums.

And Marcia, in response to your question, NO, I will not. And you know darned right well that no one else could either. It will be different for everyone reading the statements.

So as I said before, here this forum is, "AS IS".

 

[Uffern]

HOW MANY ANIMALS HAVE TO DIE AT THE HANDS OF AN UNCARING STORE BEFORE YOU WOULD STEP IN AND CALL SOMEONE? Come on guys answer......

I actually teach people at Petsmarts and Petcos how to properly take care of the animals and house them. I don't get in anyone's face about litigation or media. Someone said that educated pet store employees today are educated target cashiers tomorrow. I used to work at a pet store. Reptile Warehouse, in Ga. I now teach others at other petstores how to care for the animals. You know what? While most of them may end up being over educated Target cahsiers, some end up being educated Petco managers. Useless to teach them, huh?

One other thing, you say how many animals have to die before you call someone. What happens to the animals that are bred but not sold because you called someone? Are they magically better and live a happy life since they never got shipped to the store? Or do they still die, just as painfully, no matter where they are shipped, or even if they are not shipped?

Go to iguana forum where I wanted to try to get people who own them to start talking and see what was written there.

Seamus insulted some iguana people? Is that right? I guess that makes all the aggressiveness and passive aggressiveness towards Seamus okay. Didn't your mother ever tell you that two wrongs don't make a right?

Marcia did what a responsible hobbyist should do tried to educate and when it became apparent that it was going to be ignored or shut out for continued profits provided info to the proper authorities.

If you are potty training a kid and at the end of the first day he craps in his pants, do you give up? Marcia gave up. Perhaps if she had continued to educate them, better care at the store would have begun to stop problems before they started. Those same animals that are not being sold at those stores now are dying elsewhere, at other stores, or at the breeder's. If she had continued to teach the store employees, maybe those lizards and such would be alive and healthy today. But they are not. What has she really accomplished? She definitely has not helped the animals at all. All she has done if give PETA and others like them one more arguement to use in their fight for banning reptiles and pets in general. I believe she had good intentions, but intentions are meaningless when there are results. The result here is that PETA and HSUS are one little step closer to their goal, and that the animals are still dying and sick. Dragon dad said that they are still opening new stores. Obviously, this has affected Petco in no discernable way. It has not helped the geckos become healthier. It has not stopped poor care in pet stores. All it has done is give animal rights activists one more thing to shout about at their rallies.

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

So as I said before, here this forum is, "AS IS".

OK! Well, it sounds like the rules don't apply to the SOUND OFF! Forum... anyone want to start a new thread called 'Who is Seamus?' or 'Double Standard Free-For-All?' or 'Open Season for People That Aren't Perfect?'

 

[Stardust]

Oh Richard, or if you will MM. Round and round we go, I seem to remember meeting you at a telemarketer forum. LOL
Mixing potting training a toddler to educating a corperation. LOL Now that IS good.
But I wont get into that now, I will just address about the iguana's because that is what i wrote. Glad you brought my Mother into it, she told me to fight for what is right, she told me to speak my mind, and if someone EVER hits me, do NOT turn the other cheeks and make damn sure I make my hit a harder one!
Now with that out of the way, I am not taking my aggressions out because of that, well not all of it . I am just putting all that he says and how he speaks to other in in in in one category. Yes, I am categorizing Seamus' words into one. I am saying Marcia did not deserve what he said to her. And you MM, shame on you to be on a telemarketers side because that is your softness, but not on the side of someone who is being called names.

 

[Dragondad]

Both ways

Come on Richard you can't have it both ways. If Petco has not been affected in any discernible matter then the breeders are still shipping the industry is still going forward. Or am I too assume that the stores you train in don't have reptiles anymore??
I guess they just got a few more that were destined for San Fran area right

If the industry is grinding to a halt because of the actions of Marcia then I guess you have no one to teach. So which is it. Did she kill the industry or are we just going forward.

Remember people no new laws were put into place. Nothing in the structure of CA code was changed do to her actions. I want someone to explain how she has damaged anything??? The fact that PETA is waving signs due to this incident doesn't make what she did wrong, these people would wave signs over something else if this wasn't there.

Richard wake up and quit looking for the evil.

Petco wasn't harmed the industry wasnt harmed and dont try to tell me anything about the possibility. Possibility and probability are two different things just ask any gambler or statistician

 

[herpcondo]

You know what i think the best part of all of this is...
Since we have been talking about Seamus,,, he has not replied to this thread..... Ahhhhh Freedom at last from the All Knowing Seamus.

 

[Dragondad]

LOL

I noticed that Joe.

At least we have time for the cold ones!!

 

[herpcondo]

Amen to that Dragondad!

 

[Stardust]

Joe, I dont think we have freedom, but for the time being we dont have such long posts we fall asleep! I have no doubt he will be here, and am well looking forward to it. I also like the little break too