Heavy parasite load found in ball python from Ed Clark

[SPJ]

Ed's "Gifts that keep on giving".

Now he will offer to send a can of PAM free of charge to Emily.


Ed, were these captive born and bred holdbacks like she was supposed to get or were they imports? If they were CBB were they ever in contact with imports?

You will want to make sure no other animals go out until this can be determined if there is cross contamination or not.

 

[SPJ]

Hey Ed, did you advise this buyer to have a fecal done just to be on the safe side?


From KS - posted by rcgray

Hey all, I got three new ball python morphs this morning from three different people to go into my collection for future breeding.
I got a male spider, female pastel, and female cinny.
I also wanted to give a good note/recomendation to all 3 people that I got these aniamls from.
The 07 spider male came from David Van Houten
The 07 pastel female came from Susan Sentman @SSNAKES
The 06 cinny female came from Ed Clark

All three were easy to work with and answered all questions I had prior to purchasing, and after recieving the aniamls this morning they were honest and right on target.
I will try to post pics in a few days after there settled in

On another good note, I am getting a male pastel, female mojave, and male bumblebee tomorrow!!! I cant wait
Then on the 6th of October I get my male mojave, and male albino, cant wait for those either!!!

 

[monkeywrench133]

Jim's right, this is a diaper load. Tell me, do you, as a matter of routine, have a fecal done immediately on every animal you receive?

Yes, actually I do. I usually schedule a vet check within a few days of the animal's arrival ahead of time. Never more than a week.

 

[LadyOhh]

The bottom line is, Emily could have and probably should have done the fecals when she got the snakes.

I completely agree with Clay that hindsight is 20/20.

This does not give anyone the right to jump on Emily for that. She is doing right by this, absolutely.

Ed, however, is not...

 

[Wilomn]

The bottom line is, Emily could have and probably should have done the fecals when she got the snakes.

I completely agree with Clay that hindsight is 20/20.

This does not give anyone the right to jump on Emily for that. She is doing right by this, absolutely.

Ed, however, is not...

Where oh where IS mr. clark?

It seems he's ever-present when he is following someone else's trail and yet, here, where he has some VERY serious allegations to answer to, he is conspicuously absent.

Seems rather cowardly to me.

Does anyone else see this as cowardly?

I mean a guy with as big a voice as mr. clark has surely couldn't be afraid to answer a few simple questions about his dealings. Could he?

Oops, silly me. It's his M.O., method of DAILY OPERATION to AVOID any questions that answering might cast a negative pall on him.

Way to go mr. clark, way to go. Yet another EXCELLENT recommendation to those who have bought and paid for moderation to allow ANYONE in their ranks. Yessir, no need for any kind of screening or evaluation at all.

Guys like you, mr. clark, make this WHOLE site, not just the mini-mods, something to laugh at.

You should be ashamed of yourself and your behaviour, mr. clark.

ASHAMED.

 

[tim8dena]

honestly i think this could have been settled easier then this..i can see both sides to the matter..yes these animals have been in her collection for 10 months..she could have gotten a sample done but didnt...these in fact could be cbb as ed states..he did have mites at one time and corrected the situation..i do beleive the parisites could have came from the mites at one time..animals could have been shipped the same day he shipped out ch or imports and the bags touched each other prior to going into correct shipping boxes...

there are many possibilties here..i dont think it needed another bash ed in the boi thread but emily felt ed was not responding quick enough to her..even now ed does little to stop this attack..perhaps he feels he is in the right here and i can see where he would feel that way...no i am not siding with ed or emily......

i feel emily should have given a few more days for ed to try to figure something out for her...she was not asking for anything from him only wanting him to know..therefore she thought she was protecting others..but still the boi can be painfull and costly for sellers..now many will question whether to buy from ed over the next few weeks based on assumptions...
emily states she has kept these animals seperate from any contact etc..we are human and we do screw up ocasionally..this could be the case as well..there is no way to prove this nor any way to prove the contamination came from ed


ed i feel you should have been more aggressive with her..you could have prevented all of this by answering a few more questions etc..there is a possibilty they came from you..after all you do handle imports as well..a mite or unwashed hand etc could have spread..i dont think ed would have purposley sold you infected animals...


so where are we now..

ed gets bashed again!!!!! emily gets bashed for bashing ed!!!!!!!!

cant we get along people!!!!!!!!!..i honestly feel half of the comments were those who have personal issues against ed not due to the fact these animals were contaminated..

most breeders give 24 hour live arrival guarentee...not 10 month..the breeder can not guarentee whats happens for 10 months in the future...

to blame ed or emily is not fair..but who will lose the most out of this..not emily i assure you

thats my 2 cents

tim

 

[Keith Northrop]

Hey.....Wheres Ed when you need him?

I hope this thread reads not like "The Rise and Fall of the Third Riech"
All over a parasite............HaHaHa...

 

[Wilomn]

there are many possibilties here..i dont think it needed another bash ed in the boi thread but emily felt ed was not responding quick enough to her..even now ed does little to stop this attack

i feel emily should have given a few more days for ed to try to figure something out for her...she was not asking for anything from him only wanting him to know..therefore she thought she was protecting others..

emily states she has kept these animals seperate from any contact etc..we are human and we do screw up ocasionally..this could be the case as well..there is no way to prove this nor any way to prove the contamination came from ed


ed i feel you should have been more aggressive with her..you could have prevented all of this by answering a few more questions etc..there is a possibilty they came from you..after all you do handle imports as well..a mite or unwashed hand etc could have spread..

so where are we now..

ed gets bashed again!!!!! emily gets bashed for bashing ed!!!!!!!!

cant we get along people!!!!!!!!!..i honestly feel half of the comments were those who have personal issues against ed not due to the fact these animals were contaminated..

most breeders give 24 hour live arrival guarentee...not 10 month..the breeder can not guarentee whats happens for 10 months in the future...

to blame ed or emily is not fair..but who will lose the most out of this..not emily i assure you

thats my 2 cents

tim

Tim,

It's not about getting anything, you have tangented off here.

It makes NO difference what guarentee anyone does or does not give, nothing was asked for, this is NOT about gurarentees. If it was, even I would tell Emily she was SOAL.

THIS is about honest representation and responsibility and one particular individuals habitual inability to do that and take it on, respectively.

Emily wants NOTHING from mr. clark. Once you actually realize that, then all of the talk of guarentees and time limits and what she should have done, becomes moot.

She trusted mr. clark when he told her that she would not find cleaner animals than his, that he was trading her CAPTIVE BRED AND BORN HOLDBACKS from his own breeders.

She is simply stating that she, as with some others, was not given the truth by mr. clark.

It's as simple as that on her end.

mr. clark now, his lack of response, his knowing/not knowing which snakes they were depending on whose post he's replying to, he total inability to take any responsibility for this, that speaks to the type of person he is.

THAT is very important to many people. With all the Regius breeders out there, why do business with a known liar when you can find good honest breeders to give your money to?

mr. clark brought this on himself by his treatment of Emily.

 

[tim8dena]

Tim,

It's not about getting anything, you have tangented off here.

It makes NO difference what guarentee anyone does or does not give, nothing was asked for, this is NOT about gurarentees. If it was, even I would tell Emily she was SOAL.

THIS is about honest representation and responsibility and one particular individuals habitual inability to do that and take it on, respectively.

Emily wants NOTHING from mr. clark. Once you actually realize that, then all of the talk of guarentees and time limits and what she should have done, becomes moot.

She trusted mr. clark when he told her that she would not find cleaner animals than his, that he was trading her CAPTIVE BRED AND BORN HOLDBACKS from his own breeders.

She is simply stating that she, as with some others, was not given the truth by mr. clark.

It's as simple as that on her end.

mr. clark now, his lack of response, his knowing/not knowing which snakes they were depending on whose post he's replying to, he total inability to take any responsibility for this, that speaks to the type of person he is.

THAT is very important to many people. With all the Regius breeders out there, why do business with a known liar when you can find good honest breeders to give your money to?

mr. clark brought this on himself by his treatment of Emily.

again i understand your point as well..i guess bottom line is ed just respond and clear this up and everybody move on..if not then ed i guess it will be your own fault..no point in losing more customers over something this simple

tim

 

[rabernet]

emily states she has kept these animals seperate from any contact etc..we are human and we do screw up ocasionally..this could be the case as well..there is no way to prove this nor any way to prove the contamination came from ed

If the rest of Emily's collection tests negative, and the animals from Ed test positive, would that not lead to just one conclusion? That the animals came from Ed with this parasitic load?

She also breeds her own feeders, so if it came from feeders, one would have to assume her entire collection is infected as a result, and my understand is that this is not what she's experiencing.

 

[cookreptiles]

I do produce my own feeders and my entire rat colony has been treated with Ivermectin as a precaution. Regardless, my vet said that the tapeworms this snake has are not any sort of parasite that could have come from a feeder animal or other mammal.

It has been stated that I have added other snakes to my collection since acquiring these snakes from Ed and I had replied that the only 2 snakes I have added are ones I just got in Daytona a few weeks ago. I would like to mention that I did acquire one other snake 3 days after acquiring these females (just trying to be completely honest here, and that had slipped my mind). That snake was just a few weeks old at the time and quarantined separately from the females I got from Ed; he is thriving and currently weighs more than they do.

 

[ladywhipple02]

The point of the thread isn't to prove if Ed owes Emily anything. She recognizes the fact---and has stated forthrightly---that she should have gotten the animals tested after she received them. She recognizes the fact that this was her mistake.

But, most of the proof points to Ed sending her these animals when they were already sick. If Emily has not had any problems with her collection before this, feeds from an internal resource---that had no previous problems---and has tests that come back proving that only the snakes Ed sent her are sick... seems pretty conclusive to me.

It also seems fishy that only Emily is willing to post vet tests, while Ed remains silent. I would think he would be plastering clean bills of health all over the place to prove that the animals he sends out are healthy.

Emily is merely attempting to send out a warning... any animals you received from Ed, get them tested. The evidence is backing her up... it might be a wise decision to heed the advise.

 

[cookreptiles]

in case anyone wants to see it, here is a copy of the vet report:

 

[Wilomn]

in case anyone wants to see it, here is a copy of the vet report:

Before someone picks it apart, it says the birthdate of the snake is the 14th of this month.

It's no doubt a clerical mistake but you should make note of the actual birthdate and any other inaccuracies sooner rather than later.

 

[brucestephenson]

honestly i think this could have been settled easier then this..i can see both sides to the matter..yes these animals have been in her collection for 10 months..she could have gotten a sample done but didnt...these in fact could be cbb as ed states..he did have mites at one time and corrected the situation..i do beleive the parisites could have came from the mites at one time..animals could have been shipped the same day he shipped out ch or imports and the bags touched each other prior to going into correct shipping boxes...

there are many possibilties here..i dont think it needed another bash ed in the boi thread but emily felt ed was not responding quick enough to her..even now ed does little to stop this attack..perhaps he feels he is in the right here and i can see where he would feel that way...no i am not siding with ed or emily......

i feel emily should have given a few more days for ed to try to figure something out for her...she was not asking for anything from him only wanting him to know..therefore she thought she was protecting others..but still the boi can be painfull and costly for sellers..now many will question whether to buy from ed over the next few weeks based on assumptions...
emily states she has kept these animals seperate from any contact etc..we are human and we do screw up ocasionally..this could be the case as well..there is no way to prove this nor any way to prove the contamination came from ed


ed i feel you should have been more aggressive with her..you could have prevented all of this by answering a few more questions etc..there is a possibilty they came from you..after all you do handle imports as well..a mite or unwashed hand etc could have spread..i dont think ed would have purposley sold you infected animals...


so where are we now..

ed gets bashed again!!!!! emily gets bashed for bashing ed!!!!!!!!

cant we get along people!!!!!!!!!..i honestly feel half of the comments were those who have personal issues against ed not due to the fact these animals were contaminated..

most breeders give 24 hour live arrival guarentee...not 10 month..the breeder can not guarentee whats happens for 10 months in the future...

to blame ed or emily is not fair..but who will lose the most out of this..not emily i assure you

thats my 2 cents

tim

My ball pythons that I purchased from Ed at the same time are in perfect health. I actually have to cut back on the amount of rats, because they will get overweight from eating too much. My friends bring their cameras to have their pictures taken with Ed's balls.

Most of the accusers here have an axe to grind on Ed for his moderating duties or are competiters out to eliminate Ed from the business picture. They have not even begun to prove that any parasites have come from Ed at all. They have not even proved that the parasites in the picture came from an Ed Clark snake. Give us all a break. So far, this has been nothing more than a necktie party hyped by whack-jobs and sociopaths.

 

[cookreptiles]

This is true--apparently they just put in the date of the exam instead of the date of birth. If this is a serious problem I can get another copy with the correct DOB, but I think this is sufficient?

 

[KelliH]

OK, how about a hypothetical question. What if someone (Emily or someone else) posted on the BOI that they purchased some snakes from Rich Z, and that they had had a fecal test performed 10 months after they received the animals which was positive for tapeworms, or coccidia or whatever. You can substitute the names David Barker, Bill Love, Ralph Davis or even Kelli H for Rich Z. Do you see where I am going with this? The direction this thread took would be sooo different than it is now. Most people (I am betting everyone) would be singing a different tune, and that tune would sound something like, "It's been almost ONE YEAR since you acquired those animals, and there is no way to prove that the parasites came from _________'s collection. How do we know that the parasites came from your own animals? You SAY that none of your other snakes have parasites, but how do we know you are telling the truth? How do we even know those are the same snakes?..." and Etc. The reason so many are taking the side of Emily is that they don't like Ed. I don't know if I like him or not, I don't know him, but many of the reactions to Emily's post seem a little bit hypocritical to me.

Ed HAS sent out snakes in the past with mites, and all but admitted that they came because he did not quarantine some newly received animals.

I'm sure that no one posting in this thread has ever had mites in their collection, and everyone posting in this thread practices strict quarantine procedures every time. Come on, let's be real here my friends...

 

[ladywhipple02]

My ball pythons that I purchased from Ed at the same time are in perfect health. I actually have to cut back on the amount of rats, because they will get overweight from eating too much. My friends bring their cameras to have their pictures taken with Ed's balls.

Most of the accusers here have an axe to grind on Ed for his moderating duties or are competiters out to eliminate Ed from the business picture. They have not even begun to prove that any parasites have come from Ed at all. They have not even proved that the parasites in the picture came from an Ed Clark snake. Give us all a break. So far, this has been nothing more than a necktie party hyped by whack-jobs and sociopaths.

Have you had them tested? Are you 100% positive that they aren't carrying something internal???

 

[ladywhipple02]

OK, how about a hypothetical question. What if someone (Emily or someone else) posted on the BOI that they purchased some snakes from Rich Z, and that they had had a fecal test performed 10 months after they received the animals which was positive for tapeworms, or coccidia or whatever. You can substitute the names David Barker, Bill Love, Ralph Davis or even Kelli H for Rich Z. Do you see where I am going with this? The direction this thread took would be sooo different than it is now. Most people (I am betting everyone) would be singing a different tune, and that tune would sound something like, "It's been almost ONE YEAR since you acquired those animals, and there is no way to prove that the parasites came from _________'s collection. How do we know that the parasites came from your own animals? You SAY that none of your other snakes have parasites, but how do we know you are telling the truth? How do we even know those are the same snakes?..." and Etc. The reason so many are taking the side of Emily is that they don't like Ed. I don't know if I like him or not, I don't know him, but many of the reactions to Emily's post seem a little bit hypocritical to me.



I'm sure that no one posting in this thread has ever had mites in their collection, and everyone posting in this thread practices strict quarantine procedures every time. Come on, let's be real here my friends...

Kelli,
Going back to the beginning of this thread, most people were saying EXACTLY that about Emily. But she has provided evidence and Ed has not.

I also feel that any of the names mentioned above would have posted clean bills of health as soon as there was an accusation... not said, well, "I'll check into it."

I, too, have no particular feelings towards Ed. I have never dealt with him, and never talked to him.

 

[Wilomn]

OK, how about a hypothetical question. What if someone (Emily or someone else) posted on the BOI that they purchased some snakes from Rich Z, and that they had had a fecal test performed 10 months after they received the animals which was positive for tapeworms, or coccidia or whatever. You can substitute the names David Barker, Bill Love, Ralph Davis or even Kelli H for Rich Z. Do you see where I am going with this? The direction this thread took would be sooo different than it is now. Most people (I am betting everyone) would be singing a different tune, and that tune would sound something like, "It's been almost ONE YEAR since you acquired those animals, and there is no way to prove that the parasites came from _________'s collection. How do we know that the parasites came from your own animals? You SAY that none of your other snakes have parasites, but how do we know you are telling the truth? How do we even know those are the same snakes?..." and Etc. The reason so many are taking the side of Emily is that they don't like Ed. I don't know if I like him or not, I don't know him, but many of the reactions to Emily's post seem a little bit hypocritical to me.



I'm sure that no one posting in this thread has ever had mites in their collection, and everyone posting in this thread practices strict quarantine procedures every time. Come on, let's be real here my friends...

Kelli, I kind of resent this.

Sure, my dislike of mr. clark is well known.

But that has NOTHING to do with the facts presented by Emily.

Had it been rich or the barkers or even you, presented as it was here, with your reputation the same as mr. clarks, I would have done exactly as I did.

mr. clark has hurt himself in the past by lying and being a fool. This affects the way he is seen in the future and the amount of credibility any statement by him is given.

I don't care, not in the big picture, who is involved. If you just take the essense of the problem, snakes with parasites that do not often, almost never, occur in captive bred animals, add in the fact that they were obtained as holdbacks from a personal set of breeders, then that they may have been imports, well, do you see why there is little credibility on mr. clarks side here?

Had rich said they were his, then that he wasn't sure, then just shut up and run away, I'd say exactly to him what I've said to mr. clark.

It's not about who, not for me, but about what and how and why.

I thought you knew me better Kelli, I really did.