KelliH
doesn't drink the koolaid
You know, after some thinking tonight, I have come to agree with you.
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High End Herps (Inquiry)
- Thread starter TailsWithScales
- Start date
You know, after some thinking tonight, I have come to agree with you.
HerpVenue
New member
I saw that Dave.
Funny thing is, on at least one of the snakes.... you could tell you had the original (wider view)
And he had the cut up view.
Don't worry about him suing you. He can't. He can't provide his real name to the Judicial system
Funny thing is, on at least one of the snakes.... you could tell you had the original (wider view)
And he had the cut up view.
Don't worry about him suing you. He can't. He can't provide his real name to the Judicial system
monkeywrench133
zealously apathetic
Dave Lawson said:I have read several pages in this thread and I sit here wondering why people buy from or even talk to HEH?Several years ago I posted pics of some of the morph Burms and retics that at the time I had, some of you may remember them anyway, one of the snakes was of a solid brown retid with a very wide white stripe going down its back. Well on K.S. last month people were posting pics so again I posted this pic and HEH claimed that he was buying this snake from Beau Lewis. I told HEH that that snake was dead and frozen in my freezer. This man claims to be buying, bought or already owns most of the snakes that I have or have had. I posted a pic of my Black Burm and again HEH claims to be buying the very same snake and said I did not have it. I had Ben Rodgers post a pic with me holding the snake. Shortly later I got a call marked "private" the man on the phone claimed to be David and he then threatened me with a law suit if I did not stop posting photos of "HIS" snakes.
I to have fun and to post I pic of him holding the Black burm or the retic. I have yet to see it and I have posted other pics. I do not think we will ever see a pic of him holding anything. The man goes to the zoo or doctors photos but owns nothing.
Bobby, this is what Ritchie was refering to.
Dave Lawson
New member
He is just talking smack. I know as well as he does that he is a liar.I think that there is enough people that saw those snakes in my hands to prove who owned them. 
Hell he has been ask hundreds of tmes to post a photo with him holding one of these milllion dollar snakes and so far no pics.
Hell he has been ask hundreds of tmes to post a photo with him holding one of these milllion dollar snakes and so far no pics. 
Bill & Amy
Harley Rider
I hope that anybody that actually sent them resumes, didn't provide them with their social security #'s. 
monkeywrench133
zealously apathetic
Bill & Amy said:I hope that anybody that actually sent them resumes, didn't provide them with their social security #'s.
Anyone who did should keep a very close eye on their credit report.
Gecko_Den
New member
Bill & Amy said:I hope that anybody that actually sent them resumes, didn't provide them with their social security #'s.
Resumes should never include a SS#. That can be provided after the employee is hired.
We never made it that far, the first few emails reeked of fish. I hope everyone else seen the warning signs too.
I also agree with Dave Lawson, I don't even think he has the first fee for a lawyer, let alone to take it all the way to court.
I also agree with Dave Lawson, I don't even think he has the first fee for a lawyer, let alone to take it all the way to court.
They were logged in last night after nearly a week away from this site. It would have been nice if they would have answered some of the questions that have been posted.
Regards
High End Herps Inc
Coming Soon! :)
My last post
I suppose it’s time to respond to this matter. This will be my final post in this thread.
Where to begin.
First thing I’d like to make clear is that I in no way harbor any animosity toward the handful of folks in this thread that set out to make us look bad. I reckon that the few individuals that began making the outrageous accusations about High End Herps Inc honestly believed that they were right in their assumptions that we were those other folks that apparently did wrong to them in the past. Since they apparently felt they were doing the right thing I can’t in good conscience condemn them for it. Even if I don’t like what they've done.
Usually, 99 times out of 100 on this board there is a very good system for rooting out genuine scammers and I still believe in it and still support it fully, even though we fell victim to its very rare occurrence of failure to operate 100% properly. I think for such a system to operate properly it must embody a very high level of objectivity and be devoid of any extreme bias.
In this case, the obvious bias and obvious mindset of those few that thought they were right about us is what has caused this thread to go the fanatical, out of control route that it has. There was no objectivity on their part, only blatant bias and the folks that have followed their lead were likewise equally yet wrongfully influenced and thus equally biased in their opinions. None of this was based on anything factual and no proof of bad business on our part was ever presented. All of this was based upon the assumption that we were guilty from the very start. But I defy everyone reading this to find a single dissatisfied customer or a single dishonest deal, anywhere. A single sick snake from us. A single customer that didn’t get what was in the pictures they got. These can’t be found because they don’t exist. But none of that seemed to matter in this deliberate, one-sided, very biased, often vicious attack against us, our business and our credibility.
Even though I feel that this small but well organized “Anti-High End Herps Inc” group had only the best intentions in ridding the herp world of “another bad scammer”, I feel that what they have done and how they went about it was very wrong and obviously very biased. The following is an account of the different accusations leveled against us that were very quickly proved to be wrong.
At first claims were made that we didn’t have the snakes we say we have. That we only had babies, or no snakes at all. Then when an unbiased member stated that he saw many of them in person and that there were “literally hundreds” and that the tour of a facility “took a couple of hours” these accusations seemed to fall to the wayside.
Then it was claimed that we abuse our snakes and treat them badly by overfeeding them. One poster that had/has an unbiased mind of his own pointed out that the meal we fed the snake in question was less than 1/3 her body weight and that it was a very common percentage of food in terms of meal size. Another poster said that upon seeing our quarantine facility in person that all of our animals were cared for exceptionally well and is “the best he has ever seen”. At this point the accusations of abuse either ceased or the unbiased posters were attacked and attempts to discredit them were made.
Next the pictures of our animals were attacked. Accusations that we take normal albino burmese and tweak the colors so much as to invent our albino hybrid rock burmese out of an ordinary snake. This is one of the most laughable of all these ridiculous and unfounded charges against me and our company. But as outrageous as it is I must address it as it impugns our very offspring, which is unacceptable. After such accusations were made a member that has seen our hybrids IN PERSON posted that they are “amazing” and are “radiant even from across the room”. This absurd issue concerning picture doctoring was not dropped and pictures of my borneo bloods were attacked and questioned and it was insinuated that I doctored them. Again, folks that actually owned these bloods before me and even the very person that produced them came and stated that these bloods actually look even better in person and that any distortion was due to the excessive flash from the camera.
And the most absurd accusation of all, that I am somebody else. This one is a doozy. And all because someone I hired to set up my website bought a property from another herper that lived by them that these other fellas don’t like. They probably also bought crickets for their bearded dragons from their local pet store but that doesn’t make me the owner of the pet store. Lordy, I could go on but sarcasm isn’t my strong suit.
A picture of the guy they say I am was put up and those that have met me in person verify that it is not me. mr. Owens, a moderator here verified that the picture is of the other person by saying "Yep, that's Damon! I've seen him before" and therefore helping to seal that issue once and for all.
Attempts were made to discredit Dan Magano but he is an unimpeachable person and those despicable things said to him alluding that he was dishonest are beneath contempt and those folks owe him a very sincere apology. I just met him when he drove his very cherished pet snakes down to me from Connecticut, a two thousand + mile drive to ensure their well being. I only was able to spend a few hours with him before he was forced to return but what I learned of him in that time I liked very much and he is a very good and honest person. Very likable. If I ever am fortunate enough to become close friends with him I will feel privileged indeed. But to attack him outright for trying to lend unbiased accounts of actual facts to an outrageous thread filled with lies and assumptions shows the true character of many of the folks here. They shun facts but continue to perpetuate lies and assumptions. Those that took part in that attack on Dan and other unbiased folks should be ashamed of themselves. I doubt they will though. Conscience doesn’t appear to be their strong suit. They disparage folks and cause them pain and then move on to the next post without a care for what harm they might have just done to a good, innocent person. Anything goes, right? Well I say wrong, and it must stop at once.
As far as not responding to the silly inquisition here by the small handful of folks with an obvious negative mindset, I don’t owe any of them any explanations or answers. They are not my customers, nor have they ever been my customers and I doubt they ever will be my customers. Nor are they Superior Court Judges with me standing before their court with a legally issued subpoena in my hand. Just who exactly do they think they are? Lol. I don’t mean this in a bad way but they are nobody to me.
Furthermore, I do not respond to threats, I do not respond to intimidation, I do not respond to blackmail, I do not respond to belittling and I don’t respond to degradation. All of which can be found in this asinine thread. I also don’t respond to negative posts by troublemakers with a mindset to only make me look bad or do me or my family or my business harm. That would be pointless and would only lend merit to their vacuous, impotent rhetoric.
And don’t get the impression that I am whining or moaning here. All of this is perfectly fine and I can take a good thumping like any real man and walk away from it intact. It was what it was and I am no worse for wear. Just because a small handful of bad-intentioned folks say I am a bad guy don’t make it so. Heck, 20 people can get together and agree to post that they saw me walking my hogs on Main street wearing a pink dress and stiletto heels. But that don’t make it so.
I will continue to run and build High End Herps Inc to its pre-destined proportions and will continue to breed and produce beautiful, healthy animals and I will continue to conduct honest business and provide pristine animals to my customers. Forever. None of this will have any negative effect on me or our company. Our pristine track record of only happy, satisfied customers will continue on into the future and forever. I know that the vast majority of people that read this ridiculous thread will have unbiased minds and will never believe any of this nonsense in a million years but even the few that do believe it will never see a single post anywhere saying, “The snake I got from High End Herps is sick!” or, “My snake from High End Herps died!”, or “I sent payment to High End Herps and they still haven’t sent me anything!” it won’t happen because we only do honest business. The very reason why not a single bad business deal can be presented in this whole entire absurd and pointless fiasco built on speculation, rampant paranoia and blatant assumption.
This factual track record of our good, honest business dealings is what I stand upon. I defy anyone, anywhere to present even a single bad business deal on our part. And seriously, don’t ask me to prove my good dealings by offering up a string of my customers to come here and "testify" on my behalf. The burden of proof is not upon me to prove that I’m a good businessman. The burden is upon my overly biased accusers to prove that I do bad business. And they have failed to do this. And they cannot achieve this since it would take finding bad business deals. Which don’t exist.
Furthermore, even IF I was of a mind to present my customers to prove my honest dealings [which I am not] they would likely be attacked and demeaned by this nutty lynch squad [no offense] that has a purely mob mentality the same way Dan Magano and others were treated. The folks that have spoken on my behalf thus far have been belittled, degraded and even called liars. Just because they offered up a position or facts, or opinions contrary to the collective mindset of the tiny handful of accusers. These are all good people that came here of their own free will to share what they know. I did not ask them to come speak for me.
Good people were treated very badly for having a contrary view and it’s despicable and unacceptable, but nobody is talking about this. Good folks should NOT be condemned for having a different opinion or view. That’s just wrong. It’s un-American. What happened to debate, democracy, freedom of speech and freedom of thought? The collective mentality here has been one of intimidation to oppress any opposing thought or opinion. Not very American if you ask me. I’m sure I am not alone in saying that that behavior must stop at once.
There's nothing more to say. If the individuals speaking out against us wish to continue to bash us that's fine. Take it as far as you like. I have said my piece.
David Beauchemin
I suppose it’s time to respond to this matter. This will be my final post in this thread.
Where to begin.
First thing I’d like to make clear is that I in no way harbor any animosity toward the handful of folks in this thread that set out to make us look bad. I reckon that the few individuals that began making the outrageous accusations about High End Herps Inc honestly believed that they were right in their assumptions that we were those other folks that apparently did wrong to them in the past. Since they apparently felt they were doing the right thing I can’t in good conscience condemn them for it. Even if I don’t like what they've done.
Usually, 99 times out of 100 on this board there is a very good system for rooting out genuine scammers and I still believe in it and still support it fully, even though we fell victim to its very rare occurrence of failure to operate 100% properly. I think for such a system to operate properly it must embody a very high level of objectivity and be devoid of any extreme bias.
In this case, the obvious bias and obvious mindset of those few that thought they were right about us is what has caused this thread to go the fanatical, out of control route that it has. There was no objectivity on their part, only blatant bias and the folks that have followed their lead were likewise equally yet wrongfully influenced and thus equally biased in their opinions. None of this was based on anything factual and no proof of bad business on our part was ever presented. All of this was based upon the assumption that we were guilty from the very start. But I defy everyone reading this to find a single dissatisfied customer or a single dishonest deal, anywhere. A single sick snake from us. A single customer that didn’t get what was in the pictures they got. These can’t be found because they don’t exist. But none of that seemed to matter in this deliberate, one-sided, very biased, often vicious attack against us, our business and our credibility.
Even though I feel that this small but well organized “Anti-High End Herps Inc” group had only the best intentions in ridding the herp world of “another bad scammer”, I feel that what they have done and how they went about it was very wrong and obviously very biased. The following is an account of the different accusations leveled against us that were very quickly proved to be wrong.
At first claims were made that we didn’t have the snakes we say we have. That we only had babies, or no snakes at all. Then when an unbiased member stated that he saw many of them in person and that there were “literally hundreds” and that the tour of a facility “took a couple of hours” these accusations seemed to fall to the wayside.
Then it was claimed that we abuse our snakes and treat them badly by overfeeding them. One poster that had/has an unbiased mind of his own pointed out that the meal we fed the snake in question was less than 1/3 her body weight and that it was a very common percentage of food in terms of meal size. Another poster said that upon seeing our quarantine facility in person that all of our animals were cared for exceptionally well and is “the best he has ever seen”. At this point the accusations of abuse either ceased or the unbiased posters were attacked and attempts to discredit them were made.
Next the pictures of our animals were attacked. Accusations that we take normal albino burmese and tweak the colors so much as to invent our albino hybrid rock burmese out of an ordinary snake. This is one of the most laughable of all these ridiculous and unfounded charges against me and our company. But as outrageous as it is I must address it as it impugns our very offspring, which is unacceptable. After such accusations were made a member that has seen our hybrids IN PERSON posted that they are “amazing” and are “radiant even from across the room”. This absurd issue concerning picture doctoring was not dropped and pictures of my borneo bloods were attacked and questioned and it was insinuated that I doctored them. Again, folks that actually owned these bloods before me and even the very person that produced them came and stated that these bloods actually look even better in person and that any distortion was due to the excessive flash from the camera.
And the most absurd accusation of all, that I am somebody else. This one is a doozy. And all because someone I hired to set up my website bought a property from another herper that lived by them that these other fellas don’t like. They probably also bought crickets for their bearded dragons from their local pet store but that doesn’t make me the owner of the pet store. Lordy, I could go on but sarcasm isn’t my strong suit.
A picture of the guy they say I am was put up and those that have met me in person verify that it is not me. mr. Owens, a moderator here verified that the picture is of the other person by saying "Yep, that's Damon! I've seen him before" and therefore helping to seal that issue once and for all.
Attempts were made to discredit Dan Magano but he is an unimpeachable person and those despicable things said to him alluding that he was dishonest are beneath contempt and those folks owe him a very sincere apology. I just met him when he drove his very cherished pet snakes down to me from Connecticut, a two thousand + mile drive to ensure their well being. I only was able to spend a few hours with him before he was forced to return but what I learned of him in that time I liked very much and he is a very good and honest person. Very likable. If I ever am fortunate enough to become close friends with him I will feel privileged indeed. But to attack him outright for trying to lend unbiased accounts of actual facts to an outrageous thread filled with lies and assumptions shows the true character of many of the folks here. They shun facts but continue to perpetuate lies and assumptions. Those that took part in that attack on Dan and other unbiased folks should be ashamed of themselves. I doubt they will though. Conscience doesn’t appear to be their strong suit. They disparage folks and cause them pain and then move on to the next post without a care for what harm they might have just done to a good, innocent person. Anything goes, right? Well I say wrong, and it must stop at once.
As far as not responding to the silly inquisition here by the small handful of folks with an obvious negative mindset, I don’t owe any of them any explanations or answers. They are not my customers, nor have they ever been my customers and I doubt they ever will be my customers. Nor are they Superior Court Judges with me standing before their court with a legally issued subpoena in my hand. Just who exactly do they think they are? Lol. I don’t mean this in a bad way but they are nobody to me.
Furthermore, I do not respond to threats, I do not respond to intimidation, I do not respond to blackmail, I do not respond to belittling and I don’t respond to degradation. All of which can be found in this asinine thread. I also don’t respond to negative posts by troublemakers with a mindset to only make me look bad or do me or my family or my business harm. That would be pointless and would only lend merit to their vacuous, impotent rhetoric.
And don’t get the impression that I am whining or moaning here. All of this is perfectly fine and I can take a good thumping like any real man and walk away from it intact. It was what it was and I am no worse for wear. Just because a small handful of bad-intentioned folks say I am a bad guy don’t make it so. Heck, 20 people can get together and agree to post that they saw me walking my hogs on Main street wearing a pink dress and stiletto heels. But that don’t make it so.
I will continue to run and build High End Herps Inc to its pre-destined proportions and will continue to breed and produce beautiful, healthy animals and I will continue to conduct honest business and provide pristine animals to my customers. Forever. None of this will have any negative effect on me or our company. Our pristine track record of only happy, satisfied customers will continue on into the future and forever. I know that the vast majority of people that read this ridiculous thread will have unbiased minds and will never believe any of this nonsense in a million years but even the few that do believe it will never see a single post anywhere saying, “The snake I got from High End Herps is sick!” or, “My snake from High End Herps died!”, or “I sent payment to High End Herps and they still haven’t sent me anything!” it won’t happen because we only do honest business. The very reason why not a single bad business deal can be presented in this whole entire absurd and pointless fiasco built on speculation, rampant paranoia and blatant assumption.
This factual track record of our good, honest business dealings is what I stand upon. I defy anyone, anywhere to present even a single bad business deal on our part. And seriously, don’t ask me to prove my good dealings by offering up a string of my customers to come here and "testify" on my behalf. The burden of proof is not upon me to prove that I’m a good businessman. The burden is upon my overly biased accusers to prove that I do bad business. And they have failed to do this. And they cannot achieve this since it would take finding bad business deals. Which don’t exist.
Furthermore, even IF I was of a mind to present my customers to prove my honest dealings [which I am not] they would likely be attacked and demeaned by this nutty lynch squad [no offense] that has a purely mob mentality the same way Dan Magano and others were treated. The folks that have spoken on my behalf thus far have been belittled, degraded and even called liars. Just because they offered up a position or facts, or opinions contrary to the collective mindset of the tiny handful of accusers. These are all good people that came here of their own free will to share what they know. I did not ask them to come speak for me.
Good people were treated very badly for having a contrary view and it’s despicable and unacceptable, but nobody is talking about this. Good folks should NOT be condemned for having a different opinion or view. That’s just wrong. It’s un-American. What happened to debate, democracy, freedom of speech and freedom of thought? The collective mentality here has been one of intimidation to oppress any opposing thought or opinion. Not very American if you ask me. I’m sure I am not alone in saying that that behavior must stop at once.
There's nothing more to say. If the individuals speaking out against us wish to continue to bash us that's fine. Take it as far as you like. I have said my piece.
David Beauchemin
David,
Did you read the posts by Dave Lawson? It seems that those deserve at least a comment or two.
Suncoast Herpetological
Lurking in the Shadows
David
As someone who has not really taken part in this thread and others relating to it, let me succinctly point out the reason why you layest post will actually do you more harm than good.
A mountain of strong circumstantial evidence gas been posted on this thread that would lead any logical person to believe that you and Damon Heynan are one and the same.
A number of statements made by you on your website gave been directly contradicted by both your own statements and the statements of others.
With the exception of Dan, no one has come forward out of the entire membership here to claim any sort of business dealing with you.
In the face of these three items, you come back with a lengthy post that addresses none of the questions, has virtually no substance, and is, in essence, nothing but a long advertisement for you business.
I consider myself to be honest ethical and logical. If someone were making the accusations against me that are being made against you and supplying the type of circumstantial evedence that has been piled up here, you can bet that I would quickly do what was necessary to demonstrate that they are wrong.
As someone who has not really taken part in this thread and others relating to it, let me succinctly point out the reason why you layest post will actually do you more harm than good.
A mountain of strong circumstantial evidence gas been posted on this thread that would lead any logical person to believe that you and Damon Heynan are one and the same.
A number of statements made by you on your website gave been directly contradicted by both your own statements and the statements of others.
With the exception of Dan, no one has come forward out of the entire membership here to claim any sort of business dealing with you.
In the face of these three items, you come back with a lengthy post that addresses none of the questions, has virtually no substance, and is, in essence, nothing but a long advertisement for you business.
I consider myself to be honest ethical and logical. If someone were making the accusations against me that are being made against you and supplying the type of circumstantial evedence that has been piled up here, you can bet that I would quickly do what was necessary to demonstrate that they are wrong.
Cat_72
Back from exile :)
Suncoats Herpetological said:
Unless, of course, you had no way of doing so, since there is no factual evidence to prove anything otherwise.
Cat_72
Back from exile :)
Heh, that quote was from "suncoast", not "suncoats".
Bad fingers.
Bad fingers.
Chameleon Company
New member
Well said John.
What a crock Damon/David. 90% of your manifesto deals with how you have been good to your current customers, none of whom can verify you beyond last year. Conversely, 90% of this thread is not about your current customers, its about identity, with volumes of evidence. That you have a sizeable colony seems to have been confirmed. Didn't happen overnight. Your website talks about "all the tough years", which would be more than the last two, yet you have no verifiable history past about the last 12 months. Did you build your colony all those years selling boids to crawfish collectors who emerge from the swamp once a year to make a purchase, then head back out in their john-boats ? Or did you just come walking out of the swamps yourself with this boatload of boids, learned about these new-fangled computers, and "poof" a business was born ? Are you maybe related to Jed Clampett ?
Maybe you have decided to mend your ways. Wonderful. All the folks you trashed in the past are supposed to forgive and forget ? I have known folks in the reptile business who can verify my existence every year going back to the 1960's. You don't have one legitimate entity, who is a known quantity, who will post here ?
What a crock Damon/David. 90% of your manifesto deals with how you have been good to your current customers, none of whom can verify you beyond last year. Conversely, 90% of this thread is not about your current customers, its about identity, with volumes of evidence. That you have a sizeable colony seems to have been confirmed. Didn't happen overnight. Your website talks about "all the tough years", which would be more than the last two, yet you have no verifiable history past about the last 12 months. Did you build your colony all those years selling boids to crawfish collectors who emerge from the swamp once a year to make a purchase, then head back out in their john-boats ? Or did you just come walking out of the swamps yourself with this boatload of boids, learned about these new-fangled computers, and "poof" a business was born ? Are you maybe related to Jed Clampett ?
Maybe you have decided to mend your ways. Wonderful. All the folks you trashed in the past are supposed to forgive and forget ? I have known folks in the reptile business who can verify my existence every year going back to the 1960's. You don't have one legitimate entity, who is a known quantity, who will post here ?
David,
If you are legit and the next big thing, why is it so hard to post your drivers license? I mean with the size of your operation you will surely do the big shows, so people are going to see you anyways right? Wouldn't they see you when you hand deliver their snakes? It is amusing to watch you side step the important questions and spin the rest.
If you are legit and the next big thing, why is it so hard to post your drivers license? I mean with the size of your operation you will surely do the big shows, so people are going to see you anyways right? Wouldn't they see you when you hand deliver their snakes? It is amusing to watch you side step the important questions and spin the rest.
Jim O
Careful with that axe...
I think that's perfectly plausible.Chameleon Company said:
Wilomn
New member
brian/damon/david/josh/hannibal's reply was a veritable capmaign speach; utterly deviod of any proof of anything at all, but lots and lots of paint, whitewash if my monitor is correct in its rendering but, nonetheless, stinking to HIGH HEAVEN of ROTTEN TUNA.
It was a nice try though.
It was a nice try though.