(Inguiry)Rare Pythons

[The BoidSmith]

To the "misterious supporter"

..."This whole thread and forum as many forums out there "Especially with regards to Ball Pythons" are there for the sole purpose to promote certain breeders or friends and more importantly, trash the competition!

Notice how 9 out of 10 bad guy threads on the BOI are with regards to Ball Pythons? These guys are in it for blood!

If you are not one of them, you are against them! Once they set you in their targets, they will drive it home and keep driving until they trash your name in every internet site in hopes they will damage any shot you have of sales and competing!"...

The reason why there is so high a proportion of bad guy threads on ball pythons is not because "we are in it for blood", it is because there's a huge number of dealers and pseudobreeders that "are in it for a quick buck" and using any illegal possible artifice.

Thanks

 

[ToshaMc]

Just out of curiosity -

1. Is there anyone that thinks that the "anonymous" email is real?

2. Is there anyone that would consider a guy with three base morphs and 200 WC females competition? I mean really, my 6 year old has a better collection than that.

Just curious.

 

[The BoidSmith]

Just out of curiosity -

1. Is there anyone that thinks that the "anonymous" email is real?

2. Is there anyone that would consider a guy with three base morphs and 200 WC females competition? I mean really, my 6 year old has a better collection than that.

Just curious.

Well, if it's not real let it be a message for Chris. Regrettably, it seems that had this not been exposed, it would have been not only competition (such as TSE was in the past for a while), but another "black eye" to the rest of the ball python breeders that take this seriously. Everytime that a money-making scheme such as this succeeds it's one step backwards. And in spite of what some think it not only pertains to ball pythons but also to boas, milk snakes, and any other morphs out there.

 

[varnyard]

Bobby has always been eager to jump into a discussion, and throw out these baseless accusations, why should now be any different. Bobby thinks that by acting like Don Quixote, he somehow builds a facade of credibility. He would be better served by thinking before speaking. I agree with the quote above, and believe Bobby Hill will never change his moronic thrashing about.

Well since you cannot seem to use self contol yet again, I warned you this time for going off topic. Lets stay on topic Bob, shall we?

 

[Wolfy-hound]

Since Chris admitted he had seperate "books" for the Genetic Engineering.. and the totally ridiculous picture.. mention of the Forbes article...
Could anyone see a really NICE scam for investors?
Look! The next BIG thing! Ball python Morphs! With my genetic engineering, you too can be a part of this great investment opportunity.
I've been beating my brain trying to think of why he'd have the genetic engineering thing..
So far, I'm not sure I've really seen anything to suggest that this individual has done ANY legimate good business. Even the POT-GROWERS don't think he does good business!
While I will give people benefit of a doubt, this has gone as far as it could go towards scamming people without actually having anyoen get scammed(yet).
Bad bad bad idea to try to scam folks in the herp hobby, with the BOI around to expose you.

 

[David Reid]

Well, if nothing else, based on what I have read so far, the word shady comes to mind. I am not going to go so far as to accuse Chris of gearing up a fake Het scam, but I would never send him a dime.

Quick buck and Ball breeding do not go together.

Dave

 

[Suncoast Herpetological]

Well, if nothing else, based on what I have read so far, the word shady comes to mind. I am not going to go so far as to accuse Chris of gearing up a fake Het scam, but I would never send him a dime.

Quick buck and Ball breeding do not go together.

Dave

This guy blazed past shady years ago. He is full force Dark Side to quote the Jedi Dorks

 

[Laura Fopiano]

I am guilty!! I did call him!!

I also explained that he looks bad at this point, that was last night before all of this new juicy stuff. I explained to him, that he can post all of the pictures he wishes to, but it helps him little if at all, because none of us has ever seen this Chris J. Hell we don't even know if there ever really was a Chris J.

And I was really in hopes of clearing this guys name, I really was. But my God, how much proof is needed to nail the coffin shut?

I will also say this; you know he is referring to parsley when they say a pound of product.

I also heard someone is going to have a huge sale on gravid WCs!!

And one last thing, Chris, it is fine that you used my name and told everyone I called you. But do not take that for support in your wrong doings, that will never happen!!

I also spoke with Chris on the phone. I was actually the first one to call him.

He is very new to this industry, he has bought animals from some questionable folks at best, he has a lot to learn about quarantine, feeders, and husbandry.

He was not arrogant or boastfull, he admitted his short comings to reptile breeding and feeders. He didn't know about ASF's or the potential dangers of live vs. f/t. He is eager to learn and I told him that research is his greatest asset at this point.

I made many mistakes when I was new, the mistakes that I made were very costly emotionally and financially. I shared my own personal tragedy with Chris with the hopes that he can learn from my mistakes.

I believe that the pm's and emails are real. Chris has no idea who Justin Miller is and I suspect that the others wish to remain anonymous.

Only time will tell if this young man will make it in the business or not. I will always offer help to new folks in the hobby that are seeking help, others did it for me, that's the least I can do.

 

[Cat_72]

Laura......I'm all for helping those new to the hobby, those that are in it for the RIGHT REASONS.

Someone like Chris, who is only in it because someone convinced him he could "make a hard and fast buck".....we don't need em.

He has repeatedly LIED on this thread, he LIED on his website....he's been shown to have piss poor customer service in his other business (which just so happens to be encouraging another illegal activity).....I could go on, but why? We have enough liars, scum, and cheaters already, I'm not going to encourage more.

 

[critical bill]

Quote:
Originally Posted by critical bill
Oh boy. He must be so proud of you, eh? I can just imagine.

Do what you love son and love what you do! Thanks for the advice and support Dad! I figured I'd go out and turn the family name to crap Dad! That's my boy! Thanks Dad!

Can you imagine what Dad says to the family when they ask about his son? So whats Chris been up to lately? Oh that kid is just a genius, he's manufacturing and selling stealth grow cabinets that are infrared resistant with charcoal scrubbers (to keep the smell of parsley down, wink), and that are virtually undetectable by law enforcement.

My gosh.

The only way this dude could take a step up from where he is now is if he became a pimp.

This is uncalled for and overly abusive. You should be ashamed of yourself.

"The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of the darkness. For he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you."

I been sayin' that crap for years, Chris. And if you ever heard it, it meant your ass. I never really questioned what it meant. I thought it was just a cold-blooded thing to say to a mammy mammer like you before you popped a cap in his ass. But I saw some crap this mornin' made me think twice. Now I'm thinkin': it could mean you're the evil man. And I'm the righteous man. And Mr. .45 here, he's the shepherd protecting my righteous ass in the valley of darkness. Or it could be you're the righteous man and I'm the shepherd and it's the world that's evil and selfish. I'd like that. But that crap ain't the truth. The truth is you're the weak. And I'm the tyranny of evil men. But I'm tryin, Chris. I'm tryin' real hard to be the shepherd.

 

[grandmagreen]

Quote:


"The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of the darkness. For he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you."

I been sayin' that crap for years, Chris. And if you ever heard it, it meant your ass. I never really questioned what it meant. I thought it was just a cold-blooded thing to say to a mammy mammer like you before you popped a cap in his ass. But I saw some crap this mornin' made me think twice. Now I'm thinkin': it could mean you're the evil man. And I'm the righteous man. And Mr. .45 here, he's the shepherd protecting my righteous ass in the valley of darkness. Or it could be you're the righteous man and I'm the shepherd and it's the world that's evil and selfish. I'd like that. But that crap ain't the truth. The truth is you're the weak. And I'm the tyranny of evil men. But I'm tryin, Chris. I'm tryin' real hard to be the shepherd.

That is one of my all time favorite movies.

 

[The BoidSmith]

Laura......I'm all for helping those new to the hobby, those that are in it for the RIGHT REASONS.

Someone like Chris, who is only in it because someone convinced him he could "make a hard and fast buck".....we don't need em.

He has repeatedly LIED on this thread, he LIED on his website....he's been shown to have piss poor customer service in his other business (which just so happens to be encouraging another illegal activity).....I could go on, but why? We have enough liars, scum, and cheaters already, I'm not going to encourage more.

Furthermore, Chris is not like the 13-year old girl of the other thread that killed a Taiwan beauty snake. He is a grown man with children, whose character has already been molded. That's the reason why even though having had previous problems with the law he had no qualms in knowingly using pictures from other breeders, to promote morphs he didn't have, with the intention to sell heteros he was not planning on producing.

Sorry Chris, but you can sugar coat it all you want but "that's the way the cookie crumbles"; and crumble it did. The give aways were several and are in the screen captions of your web-page. My question would be if you actually paid from your own pocket for the 200 females or if this is kind of a joint venture with other individual(s).

 

[littleindiangirl]

Somethings that don't make sense to me.

He said that he is an entrepreneur, and likes to get into things with a big bang.

He is looking to make a fast and hard buck. He spent time learning how to make a rack, he spent time asking people to let him be the middle man, he spent time making a very ambitious and highly overstated website. So overstated, he lied about his inventory, either here or on his web page. He lied about his sales, either here on on his web page.

What kind of businessman would put his money on the line without thoroughly researching what he was getting into?

He knew exactly what he was doing when he stole those pictures from other people's websites. He HAD to visit those pages to get them, and he had to of read about Ball pythons on those very same pages.

He claims he has been reading about Ball pythons, but he never came across any real pertinent information? BS

He knew he stole those pictures, because regardless of where they came from on google, they were in no way HIS ball pythons.

On his website he throws around claims to having an extensive collection of Ball python morphs.

On each ball python page, he claims to have access to a large and varied inventory for each morph.

He also claims on his web page that he sells to collectors, breeders and pet stores world wide!! Implying that he has already sold many ball pythons.

On top of all this, he made a claim to hatching out over 2500 ball pythons this year alone! (with 200 WC females mind you)

He is taking pre-orders on ball pythons now! (per website)

This just has stank all over it and tells me he knew exactly what he was doing. He was misrepresenting himself and his business as a large breeding "facility" (per website) of ball python morphs.

He has NO good answer other than, "I didn't know". He has stopped posting on the recommendations of private messages because he knows that anything he says is somehow going to be contradictory to what he had posted on his website (screenshots) and what he has already said here.

He is a liar in either respect, and his responses about his real intentions are very sketchy. I would never put a dollar towards someone I think will "make it right in the end."

 

[Wilomn]

There are a couple of possibilities.

He's either had detailed conversations with or is in fact, chris johnson.

He's working with joey capony.

 

[littleindiangirl]

People, I could go on all day about the ways his story doesn't add up. I've spent so much time seething about the sheer gall he has to blatantly lie to us when contradictory evidence is readily available online.

He has quit replying because he knows, HE KNOWS he lied and he was caught red handed.

What's the legal term of misrepresentation? FRAUD?

http://www.answers.com/fraud?cat=biz-fin
Fraud
n An intentional perversion of truth for the purpose of inducing another, in reliance on it, to part with something valuable or to surrender a legal right; deliberate deception; deceit; trickery.

 

[Otter_23]

So let me get this straight. He is brand new to the industry and got into because a "friend" suggested it? He doesn't know the dangers of live/ft or anything about quarantine? Yet he fully understands hets, co-doms, how to make racks with the use of heat tape and helix controllers? I would think that someone new has a more difficult time understanding the genetics and morphs than they do feeding questions. It took me asking many questions about building racks, what tape to use how to wire it set it and then figure out the different morph looks and genetics than it did to figure out basic husbandry. It just seems like a lot of playing dumb to me to build that trust people give when they are giving advice to a receptive audience. It took me awhile and a lot of posts to understand ball pythons and unless he has a mentor I haven't seen on any forums him asking questions, no emails from breeders how to best set them up, who to buy the supplies and stock from, what is the best way to try to make money in the industry etc...

Hypothetically speaking if a guy (for this purpose we will call him CJ) screwed a bunch of people and got ran out of a business with a lot of people after him hooked up with say a high school buddy who had hooked him up earlier with a fake id, and that guy with the fake id told his buddy how much money he can make with his scam. Then CJ explains how the scam works and tells him that he can do it as well and CJ will stay behind curtains leading him but also profitting off the scam again. CJ says we will go under your name because noone knows you. CJ also says you need a lot of normals and you need to start building your client base up to make you appear much bigger and trusted by having a nice website with lots of impressive claims. CJ than says stay calm if you are called out, play dumb because they know me but not you. We will need a few actual morphs to show pictures of so noone will question buying hets even though we are selling 500 from one father. It will help strengthen our credibility if we have a few actual morphs. Maybe even sell a few actual morphs so that some prove out at the beginning, we can make a lot of money at this, I have done it before. This is all hypothecital of course. I will say the guy on the far right looks familar and it seems strange that if you own a business with only 15 workers you wouldn't be able to remember their names and that they may conveniently be in jail already.

In the end the truth is I wouldn't spend a dime on this guy no matter what.

 

[The BoidSmith]

Mark,

Your scenario is possible although when I was thinking about a joint venture I was not thinking about CJ, you have a point though, that can't be dismissed. My only doubt is if CJ would really be that dumb as to go about it this way. He knows very well how something like this would be scrutinized from the get go. The only thing this would have taken to make it more believable was to have purchased a few morphs and start smaller. Purchase half a dozen high end males of different morphs that would be ready to breed in a few months and grow them. Of course they could have purchased ready to breed males but that would have been a far greater investment. The problem with buying baby morphs though is how do they then explain having 1,000 babies born in within the next 30 days. One thing I agree with you though is that there's someone else in the background (maybe a couple). Someone that knows about the market and that he has a reason for not wanting the people to know him to be associated with this "Chris". Although I have my suspicion of who he (they) might be I'm not going to throw baseless accusations.

On a different topic though. Does anyone know if Millennium Morphs is such a big importer of gravid females that someone can call them and ask for 200 and they would have them available and ready to ship? Does anyone import 200 gravid females at one time hoping to sell them individually before they drop the eggs? My guess is that these were probably placed as a special order. Maybe someone in the ball python market knows who is the largest importer of gravid balls that's close to the Niagara Falls. I can't believe that these were shipped Delta or FedEx overnight. This shipment was probably picked-up or delivered in person in a vehicle.

Thanks

 

[The BoidSmith]

Maybe someone in the ball python market knows who is the largest importer of gravid balls that's close to the Niagara Falls. I can't believe that these were shipped Delta or FedEx overnight. This shipment was probably picked-up or delivered in person in a vehicle.

Well my question was answered earlier in this thread, it's obvious Millenium Morphs, with an 8 hour drive from Niagara Falls.

Now, Millenium Morphs deals with high end morphs (judging by their nice website). It's hard to believe they would house 200 tick-infested WC gravid balls in their facilities. Nevertheless they advertise selling WC gravid females in KS. Still IMHO it has to be someone else in the NY vecinity that housed them before they were dropped or picked-up.

 

[hhmoore]

Don't look at me

 

[hhmoore]

he did say that that the Kick brothers would know him......