Inquiry: GoLizards.com

[Dawnrenee2000]

A pet store that I frequent has been getting in some really unhealthy animals recently and say that they are coming from golizards.com. The redtail boas they have brought them are malnourished, lethargic, underweight, and just plain sickly and when asked to replace they are bringing more sickly looking ones. Some of the corns sold to the store are so small I seriously doubt they are feeding yet and the lizards look thin too. Has anyone received animals from GoLizards.com? Have they been in good health? I get the impression that business wise these people are very nice but the quality issue is of concern.

Dawn R. Powers
Olathe Kansas

 

[Shanlyn Williams]

Hello all,



My name is Shanlyn Williams With Shady Creek Pets & Supplies. We are a retail and wholesale company out of Oklahoma. I deal with Jason of golizard.com on a regular basis. I have never had any trouble with any of the animals received from Jason. The boa's he had sold to the store in question were originally from me. I have had several reports from other dealers that the boa's I supplied them with were regurgitating after feeding and not putting on weight. Some have died and we have replaced every one who has requested a replacement. None of the boa's, while in my care had any problems. We a sell ton of herps weekly and have a very low replacement rate. As for the corns and lizards I did not sell them to Jason. All I know is that I have never had any problems getting his animals to feed or to live for that fact. With the herp biz different reptiles change hands several time before reaching the end consumer. It is hard to point fingers at who's fault it was or who did what or didn't do. It is the individual responsibility of each person to make sure there animals are healthy before selling them. I think Jason is a stand up guy and if there is any problems, they should be addressed to him personally before brining it to the BOI. Starting threads like this typically turns into a pissing contest if you know what I mean.



Shanlyn

 

[Dawnrenee2000]

Thanks for your information and response. Please note the "questioning" tone of my message, and as I said I hear they are good people but the animals which I held in my own hands were in terrible shape, so it leads to wonder where things are wrong and why sick animals would even be given to a pet shop to sell.

It sounds like poor circumstances and poor judgement made by some good intentioned people from all I have figured out and it was brought here as an Inquiry to find out what their reputation was. Thanks again for your feedback and explanation on the sick boa's.

Regards
Dawn R. Powers

 

[Jason Thurber]

Hello all, I think Jason is a stand up guy and if there is any problems, they should be addressed to him personally before brining it to the BOI. Starting threads like this typically turns into a pissing contest if you know what I mean.



Shanlyn

In all fairness, who are you to grant immunity? What,....you do business with /through him, so anyone with anything to say about him should keep their mouths shut? Just cut out the middle man, go to the wholesalers yourself, and you won't have to worry about his practices reflecting on yours.

 

[Jason Thurber]

Has anyone received animals from GoLizards.com? Have they been in good health? I get the impression that business wise these people are very nice but the quality issue is of concern.

Dawn R. Powers
Olathe Kansas

I have and never would again. He (Jason Cruse) sold me what was supposed to be a 'feeding' het for piebald ball python that he had advertised on kingsnake. I paid him about $950 and a standard phased glider for that animal.

After about a month of continuous efforts, the snake finally ate a small mouse.....and then it died........ Very frustrating.

I wanted a replacement, was due one due to the misrepresentation on Mr. Cruse's part and was offered a "discount" on one that hadn't even been born (or bred as far as I know) yet. This was about as acceptable for me as it would have been for anyone else that's on this board.

In my opinion, he and his wife are hacks (anyone living in the K.C. area knows where the REAL Kansas City Reptile Show is and it isn't some sorry little gathering that has more parasites to offer than hosts on Reeder Rd. in Kansas).

They need to find another way of making money, because their hearts aren't with the animals or the people they sell them too.

Anyway, I filed a complaint with kingsnake and included a copy of my report to the IFCC and although I am still trying to get something done about it through the IFCC, Mr. Cruse was granted a strike against his kingsnake account and I encourage anyone that's had similar problems with Mr. Cruse to do the same if their transaction was through kingsnake.

I don't have the time to go back and forth with the friends and/or family of the 'topic' of this thread, as I have animals to take care of.
In other words, don't assume that I am lying or was the one in the wrong just because I don't sit here for hours going back and forth with anybody that may want to argue in his favor. I am just sharing my experience and you can take it and anything else that may be said about it for what it's worth.

 

[Dawnrenee2000]

Thank you for your feedback Jason. Actions that repeat themselves such as delivering poor quality animals are something that I feel is important to be aware of. And as for the little reptile show on Reeder, sounds like you have been to one before and not been too impressed. It is a rather small show but it's nice to have Rodent Pro come into town for it sometimes so I don't have to pay shipping for my feeders

Regards
Dawn Powers

 

[GoLizards]

GoLizards

Hello there-
This is Kelli with GoLizards. I will briefly touch on a few points on each matter here. We have addressed all concerns with the pet store and as always went above and beyond to make our customers happy. That is all taken care of and just to make sure we paid 2 visits up there in the same day and talked with the manager. To the Dawn, I can assure you that it may not be fair to assume when you have never fully dealt with us in person. We have already taken care of the situation.
Secondly, I like Jason Thurber do not have all day to monitor this but wanted to stand up for us and our business. We have been in business for almost 6 years now and really strive on customer service..... ask around!
Jason as for you and your thrashing comments along with threats to my family and livelyhood that we have dealt with is unacceptable.
We told you that you had gotten a cheaper deal than advertised because of the fact that it wasn't eating as much as we would have liked. We then offered to keep it and get it eating more (however long that would take) and then get it to you. You said you weren't worried and took it anyways. We also said we would continue to work with you and get you another etc.... You then turned into threatning and scare tactics and come to find out you have screwed many many people doing similar things.
As far as the KC Reptile Show you had been going for quite some time so it must not have been too bad huh.???
We have had a great turn out and love doing it. We love the animals and the people. So don't try and guesstimate what you think is going on or why we do the show. We won't get into your business tactics or lack there of.
We did get the sugar glider from you and the poor baby smelled like smoke so bad it could hardly breathe. We are a clean smoke free facility and take care of each and every animal like it will always be our own.
We do take pride in what we do and we always will. That is a very part of our business - customer service! Just ask around!!
Thanks for all who continue to support us and if you have any questions or concerns please address us at [email protected].
Thanks again,
Kelli
Golizards

 

[KCRD.com]

attacks on the show.......

Jason-

I think it's in poor taste to not only attack the show but to also attack the other vendors at the show by stating that "all of the animals are sick or parasite invested". As a regular vendor at this show I take this as a personal attack on me and my business, please think through your posts before flying off the keyboard and making rash posts. I would also be careful about trying to slam respectible business owners on a open forum when I know for a fact that there are a few other large business owners that have had similar problems with you with their reptiles.

 

[varnyard]

Kelli, AKA GoLizards, stop me if I am wrong, but have I dealt with you before?

 

[varnyard]

I know I have dealt with Jason Hormann AKA Boasnkc. He is a awesome guy to deal with. Jason, remember the Flagyl? You also go by KCRD, correct?

As for the sick animals, I dealt with them and was quite happy with what I recieved from him. But it was not a live animal.

 

[Jason Thurber]

Jason-

I think it's in poor taste to not only attack the show but to also attack the other vendors at the show by stating that "all of the animals are sick or parasite invested". As a regular vendor at this show I take this as a personal attack on me and my business, please think through your posts before flying off the keyboard and making rash posts. I would also be careful about trying to slam respectible business owners on a open forum when I know for a fact that there are a few other large business owners that have had similar problems with you with their reptiles.

Shotgun affect. It wasn't directed towards anyone but Kelli and Jason and I don't think anything that's being said is reflecting poorly on anyone but them.
If you were offended though, I apologize.

 

[Jason Thurber]

"Hello there-
This is Kelli with GoLizards. I will briefly touch on a few points on each matter here. We have addressed all concerns with the pet store and as always went above and beyond to make our customers happy. That is all taken care of and just to make sure we paid 2 visits up there in the same day and talked with the manager. We have already taken care of the situation.."

As is asked of everyone on this board, prove that you made it right.

"To the Dawn, I can assure you that it may not be fair to assume when you have never fully dealt with us in person."

Perhaps you should take your own advise when you make conclusive statements about my transactions with other people. The only people that I've ever had trouble with are people like yourself. Liars. It's always been with a wholesaler or, worse yet, broker that couldn't be honest about the condition of the animal or animals that they were sending me.

"Jason as for you and your thrashing comments along with threats to my family and livelyhood that we have dealt with is unacceptable."

You should bare in mind that the only reason libel suits aren't filed about 99% of the time is due to the fact that an out of state case will run you around $40,000 and 99% of the time, the guilty party lives out of state.
You know you aren't too much more than a stone's throw from me, so you better watch how far you go with those lies. Lies are exactly what I expect from you and your husband, but they should be no more than entertaining and that was a very harsh indictment. I never threatened you, Jason, or your family, period. If you can, once again, prove it. If you use e-mail to do so, include everything (headers). If you have it recorded on a telephone conversation, transfer it to an mp3 and let's hear it.

"We told you that you had gotten a cheaper deal than advertised because of the fact that it wasn't eating as much as we would have liked."

That's funny. Your ad read " This is an awesome '05 Het Pied Female produced by Tim Emerson. She has a neat pattern and will make very nice babies. She is feeding on rat pups. Get a jump start on breeding. We are selling this female for only $1,100.00 Shipped!!"
Why did you market the animal as a feeder then? You have proved yourself a liar.
Also, I got a cheaper (excellent choice of words) deal as far as the money goes, because of the glider. I am a USDA licensed 'breeder' and business owner of 6 years and also demand money or credit for my animals.

"We also said we would continue to work with you and get you another etc.... "

No,......as I said before,.....I was offered a "discount" on one that hadn't even been born (or bred as far as I know) yet. Jason said he was sitting on some eggs at the time. I really shouldn't even give you credit for offering me a discount on an animal that I shouldn't have had to pay for anyhow, because no solid offer was ever made.

"You then turned into threatning and scare tactics and come to find out you have screwed many many people doing similar things."

Once again, I never threatened you or used scare tactics. That's make-believe. I mean come on. Why would that big strong man of yours be afraid of little old me? It was 5 yrs. in the house, not 10 yrs.

"As far as the KC Reptile Show you had been going for quite some time so it must not have been too bad huh.???"

I went their once as an act of support for you and the family that I supposedly threatened, was there about an hour (I can only look at seven or so tables of imports for so long) and left.
Before Jason of ClassicDum's got sick of hearing complaints by attendees and stopped promoting it.
The real one folks, by the way, is held by the Kansas City Herpetological Society twice a year. In the spring and fall. In my opinion, Jason and his wife just acknowledged the fact that it was a success and that we weren't calling it the Kansas City Reptile Show and figured that if they called their show by that name, they could confuse some people into thinking that they were attending the real thing (which can be found here... http://www.angelfire.com/mo/serpentman/fall_show_06.htm )

"We have had a great turn out and love doing it. We love the animals and the people."

What would the message be if you said otherwise? People aren't as stupid as you think.

"So don't try and guesstimate what you think is going on or why we do the show."

I don't have to guesstimate. I've been going for quite some time now, remember? You just caught yourself lyin' again.

"We won't get into your business tactics or lack there of."

You can't. I wouldn't sell you animals. They would probably end up sicker than a dog, sold to someone, and I would end up getting e-mails about them from someone that I didn't even sell them to.

"We did get the sugar glider from you and the poor baby smelled like smoke so bad it could hardly breathe."

The smell emitting from your lines of b.s. is taking my breathe away. After years of searching by 100's of glider owners, I have found something that will cover up their scent and it is a Marlboro light?
Okie-dokie. I'll have to forward this to some of the glider breeders. 'They' will find it amusing. Third lie.

"We are a clean smoke free facility and take care of each and every animal like it will always be our own."

Literally maybe, but on the level you are far from smoke free and as far as I'm concerned, you have made it real obvious.
How do you care for every animal like it will always be your own when you're a known drop shipper? Too bad they don't sell credibility in a jar, ain't it?

"We do take pride in what we do and we always will. That is a very part of our business - customer service! Just ask around!!
Thanks for all who continue to support us and if you have any questions or concerns please address us at [email protected].
Thanks again,
Kelli
Golizards"

Smell the smoke and run or get burned!

 

[Jason Thurber]

Have no idea how, but I missed this part.

"I would also be careful about trying to slam respectible business owners on a open forum when I know for a fact that there are a few other large business owners that have had similar problems with you with their reptiles."

Correction...... You 'don't' know for a fact.
Did you disagree with what your friends wife was trying to say when she said "I can assure you that it may not be fair to assume when you have never fully dealt with us in person."

What she means is unless you were there, part of the act, or have tangible proof, you don't know what the hell went down. That's with anything.
Democracy doesn't have a bedtime, even on the BOI.

 

[DThomas]

Hello there-
This is Kelli with GoLizards. I will briefly touch on a few points on each matter here. We have addressed all concerns with the pet store and as always went above and beyond to make our customers happy. That is all taken care of and just to make sure we paid 2 visits up there in the same day and talked with the manager. To the Dawn, I can assure you that it may not be fair to assume when you have never fully dealt with us in person. We have already taken care of the situation.
Secondly, I like Jason Thurber do not have all day to monitor this but wanted to stand up for us and our business. We have been in business for almost 6 years now and really strive on customer service..... ask around!
Jason as for you and your thrashing comments along with threats to my family and livelyhood that we have dealt with is unacceptable.
We told you that you had gotten a cheaper deal than advertised because of the fact that it wasn't eating as much as we would have liked. We then offered to keep it and get it eating more (however long that would take) and then get it to you. You said you weren't worried and took it anyways. We also said we would continue to work with you and get you another etc.... You then turned into threatning and scare tactics and come to find out you have screwed many many people doing similar things.
As far as the KC Reptile Show you had been going for quite some time so it must not have been too bad huh.???
We have had a great turn out and love doing it. We love the animals and the people. So don't try and guesstimate what you think is going on or why we do the show. We won't get into your business tactics or lack there of.
We did get the sugar glider from you and the poor baby smelled like smoke so bad it could hardly breathe. We are a clean smoke free facility and take care of each and every animal like it will always be our own.
We do take pride in what we do and we always will. That is a very part of our business - customer service! Just ask around!!
Thanks for all who continue to support us and if you have any questions or concerns please address us at [email protected].
Thanks again,
Kelli
Golizards

Since "Jason Cruse" is listed in the name field for the "GoLizards" login, you need to include your FULL name on each post Kelli. This is a requirement to post on the BOI and posts are subject to deletion without it.

 

[GoLizards]

To our defense......

I am just going to post this last reply in our defense. I don't have time to sit and watch this all day.
I can assure that we are great people with only great intentions- that is just what type of people we are and how we do business.

Our reptile show is wonderful, so are the vendors, and the people that come. It is not the herp society, we don't "trick" people into thinking that, and we have not been around for 20 some years. BTW didnt you mention to me that you had been there more than a few times.......? With that being said all of the "haters" need to mind their own business. Which brings me into my next topic.

Jason Thurber, oh Jason Thurber. I will not give you the benefit of the doubt and sit and ramble with you. You tried to screw us and 99.9% of the people that you deal with. Yes, my husband is a large guy, no, he is not scared of you and wasn't going to threaten or badger people as you do. And as far as your comment about 5-10 years - I don't think we want to get into your criminal record on the BOI. As in previous emails you have threatend us- PERIOD. Here is one of the first quotes I found that came to from you. " I'm serious and I'm prepared..........on every level. "(QUOTE)
That is one of the many and I don't have all day to post all of that. I have other things to do.
I do have witnesses that the gliders we got smelled like they had just finished a pack of marb. lights (I think that is what you said you smoked) It was horrible and quite sad. I would hate to see what the other animals live like. Yes, we do have drop shippers and we do broker some animals. We have not ever denied that. We do also breed quite a bit ourselves too. After doing more research your are on other forums for other animals and lets just say "scamming" and "screwing" are used a lot when reffering to you!!
The point here is with the pet store and that matter. That has been resolved and is taken care of. The deal with you is never ending- you are always scamming and badgering.


As far as Varnyard Herps, Bobby- I honestly don't remember if you have delt with us. Jason would know for sure as he is more of the one people talk to.


Thanks,
Kelli Cruse
GoLizards

 

[theturtleshop]

To the BOI,

I have receieved and sent reptiles to Jason at golizards and I have never had any problems. We have been doing business on and off for the last 3 years and he has always been honest with me. I often send him reptiles before recieveing payment-a practice I only do with one other person. He always sends me a check in the mail the day I send him the animals. As for his stock, I've never personally had problems with anything from him. I have had long conversations with him about his animals and know for a fact that he takes care of his animals. I just wanted the BOI to know my experiences with Golizards.

Sincerely,

Andrew Yau
The Turtle Shop

 

[KCRD.com]

I think the point has been made......

The original agenda of this post has been addressed and dealt with by GoLizards. As far as my dealings with them goes, I have literally done several thousands of dollars worth of business with Jason & Kellie and I wouldn't hesitate to do more. The source of the sick animals has already stated his part and the problem has been fixed.

As far as the ash tray smelling Sugar Glider goes; she smelled more like Marlboro Reds to me but what do I know, I don't smoke, well any more. Kellie was able to clean her up and get her smelling more like a glider should. I get a little sensive to these sorts of things since I lost a Bearded Dragon that came in smelling like a bowling alley. If you're going to smoke do it away from the animals especially if you plan to sell them to others.

 

[Jason Thurber]

The original agenda of this post has been addressed and dealt with by GoLizards. As far as my dealings with them goes, I have literally done several thousands of dollars worth of business with Jason & Kellie and I wouldn't hesitate to do more. The source of the sick animals has already stated his part and the problem has been fixed.

As far as the ash tray smelling Sugar Glider goes; she smelled more like Marlboro Reds to me but what do I know, I don't smoke, well any more. Kellie was able to clean her up and get her smelling more like a glider should. I get a little sensive to these sorts of things since I lost a Bearded Dragon that came in smelling like a bowling alley. If you're going to smoke do it away from the animals especially if you plan to sell them to others.

Gee, you wouldn't happen to be friends and even what some people would call business partners with Jason and Kelli would you?

Just so the people that are inexperienced with gliders know......
they have scent glands and those scent glands work very well. Cigarette smoke, especially the smoke from ONE cigarette that was smoked in a vehicle with the windows rolled down, cannot be detected on a glider.
Their scent isn't as heavy as that of a ferret, but you'd have just as much luck smelling cigarette smoke on a ferret as you would a glider.
Like I said, I smoked one cigarette on my way to meet this not-so dynamic duo and I don't smoke in the facility. I am very adamant about that.
This is just another tactic being used and another example of their ignorance in regards to the animals that they're working with (illegally). You want to smell something funny? Make a deal with these roup scoops and when you meet up, stand next to an open window on their mini-van.
I didn't want to bring their kids or their ability to care for them into this, but the smell (and they brought smelly to the table) of human fecal matter was overwhelming.

 

[Jason Thurber]

In regards to "FauxLizards", this will be my last reply as well......promise.

"I am just going to post this last reply in our defense. I don't have time to sit and watch this all day."

Then don't. Make it to where everybody doesn't see "golizards" on the list of people viewing this thread every time they look at it.

"I can assure that we are great people with only great intentions- that is just what type of people we are and how we do business."

If that were true you wouldn't have to attest or "assure" everyone. David Nieves donates ALL the profits made from his show, the real Kansas City show, to reptile conservation efforts. What exactly do you do with your profits, great one?

"Our reptile show is wonderful, so are the vendors, and the people that come."

Kelli, it is obvious to layman that you are trying to direct negative energy towards me through the vendors and attendees of your 'Always-Save' version of the real K.C. reptile show. You aren't the strategist that you think you are.

"It is not the herp society, we don't "trick" people into thinking that, and we have not been around for 20 some years."

No, you are not with the herp society. I feel that you tried to trick people into believing that they were attending the real thing though. I don't believe you'll be around for 20 some years either. Your 'show' has probably received more bad reviews/complaints in the few years that you've been putting it on than David Nieves' show has in the 20+ years he's been hosting it.

"BTW didnt you mention to me that you had been there more than a few times.......?"

'If' I did, it was only due to your husband being so pushy about attending it (he is like a door to door solicitor, you can't get him to shut up about what he's trying to sell and leave). Which brings me to another point,......If the show is such a success, then why is he so pushy about it anyway (in terms of getting people to attend)?

"With that being said all of the "haters" need to mind their own business. Which brings me into my next topic."

What's this about "hater's"? This 'is' the board of inquiry and inquiring minds want to know!

"Jason Thurber, oh Jason Thurber. I will not give you the benefit of the doubt and sit and ramble with you. You tried to screw us and 99.9% of the people that you deal with."

You made out with well over $1000 of my money (there were two and one of the snakes did survive) and, now that I think about it, two perfectly healthy sugar gliders, which I'm pretty sure are doing fine (if they weren't, you would have used it in your 'arsenal'), you sold me a het for pied that, by your own admittance, wasn't feeding as was stated in your ad on kingsnake and I tried to screw you? I think you two people are the 'screwy' ones.

"Yes, my husband is a large guy, no, he is not scared of you and wasn't going to threaten or badger people as you do."

He crosses me as someone that, out of fear, not diplomacy, will choose flight over fight. Hence making me out to be some kind of bully incase I decided to lay out any of those scary thoughts in his head. He could say "See, I told you he was nuts."


"And as far as your comment about 5-10 years - I don't think we want to get into your criminal record on the BOI."

First off, that was a joke in reference to all the implications that you have and continue to make about me being some kind of hardened criminal. Post my record. I don't care. I was busted with some grass when I was about 21 and that's the worst thing that you're gonna find on me. There is no record of theft, sexual misconduct, or violence. You know,.... I too have an account with intellius? What's it gonna pull up on you 'n' Frenchie?

"As in previous emails you have threatend us- PERIOD. Here is one of the first quotes I found that came to from you. " I'm serious and I'm prepared..........on every level."

You failed to mention that that was a reply to Jason and the "just come preparred (his spelling, not mine)" comment that he made in his e-mail to me. Come where, by the way? To his show? Prepared for what? Was he going to pay some people to try to whip me or something?

"I do have witnesses that the gliders we got smelled like they had just finished a pack of marb. lights (I think that is what you said you smoked) It was horrible and quite sad."

If you're eyes are brown, I can tell you why.

"I would hate to see what the other animals live like."

They live like queens and kings. That's why the one's that you got from me are still alive.
I have carried a license with and my facility has been and is inspected by the USDA on a regular basis. I've never had one write-up. That reminds me. Have you gotten licensed yet or are you still selling exotic mammals illegally. A breeder or dealers willingness to not break the law seams to have a huge impact on their reputation with the members here.
I've read posts where people were getting their ass' chewed out for shipping through the USPS because it's a federal crime. Well, so is breeding and selling sugar gliders without being licensed by the USDA and you know that.

"Yes, we do have drop shippers and we do broker some animals. We have not ever denied that."

How can you care for the animals you sell as if they were your own when you don't even come in contact with them?

"We do also breed quite a bit ourselves too."

I know. It's a scary thought. I hope you're raising them better than you're raising yourselves.

"After doing more research your are on other forums for other animals and lets just say "scamming" and "screwing" are used a lot when reffering to you!!"

There is only one forum out there that I am aware of and it has already been pointed out here.
I encouraged anyone that was interested to read it, as the owners have about as much credibility as you and your husband.
There isn't one person that posted on that forum that accused me of "scamming". I was simply being persecuted for having dealt with someone that had run a few games on other people. We (me and the owners of that board) are competitiors in business and they used it as an opportunity. I would venture to say that there isn't one person on earth that hasn't unknowingly dealt with a thief, rapist, murderer, etc. Your hands sin-free? If so, cast a stone. If not, shut up.

"The point here is with the pet store and that matter. That has been resolved and is taken care of."

You've still provided no proof as far as all that goes.

"The deal with you is never ending- you are always scamming and badgering."

What "scamming" entails to you and anyone else that I have had any bad dealings with is me getting upset over animals being misrepresented and me demanding a refund. They know who they are and they know that I save everything, so I will be surprised if any of the 1-2 people that I've had trouble with come forward with allegations like the ones you've laid on me.
What badgering entails to you and anyone else that I have had any bad dealings with is me responding honestly to an inquiry when "honestly" hurts.

Good day!
- Jason

 

[KCRD.com]

Just have to clarify some things here.....

1. Not that it's going to prove one side over the other, but there is no way on this planet or your's that the smoke smell that came from that glider was from one ciggarette. That is a mute subject at this point.

2. You are so behind on information regarding the "real" KC show you can't even talk praise about it correctly. David Nieves hasn't ran that show or even had anything to do with it for over 2 years now. It's put on by a conglomerant of members of the herp society. They do donate the proceeds to animal resuce and preservation, that's why it's a HERP SOCIETY SHOW! Jason and Kellie never said their show was a not for profit convention. When you do a show for profit, you take the proceeds, that's what they call a business.

3. For being a professional breeder of exotic mammals you sure don't know your laws very well. They aren't breaking any laws there slick, they have two pairs of Gliders. You are not required by USDA to have a permit until you have five pairs of a species. As far as getting a "clean bill of health" from the USDA inspections goes, it's easy to do when you know they are coming. Febreeze covers tobacco smoke pretty well.

4. You mentioned that I must be a friend or a "so called" business partner. Well that's partially right, they are good friends and I do help promote their shows, this is why your attacks on their kids come so hard to me. You are outside of your head if you think that they neglect their children. Jason and Kellie are probably to most aware and concerned parents I know. If anyone has children, you know that there is no controlling a childs; especially a baby's need to fill their diaper, thus comes a smell. If this was a controllable thing trust me more parents would do it. That was a pretty childish and low route to take. I guess when you run out of excuses that's the only way to go with your kind of mentality. Before you start on your, "Why are you getting invovled in this, it's none of your business rant", I'll go ahead with, it became my business when you started attacking my friends on a public forum.

If your aim is to get Jason so pissed that he knocks the crap out of you, then your going to be really unhappy with the results. He's not that kind of person, fortunatly he's more of the turn the other cheek kind of guy, unless you keep on his family and then you might get your wish. You come across as a kind of person that reminds me of a mosquito, you keep buzzing around until you get smacked, but then instead of smacking back, you run and get your attorney. Is that what you really want? You want Jason to crack your skull so that you can run and scream, HELP, HELP, the BIG BLACK MAN is ATTACKING ME! That's all you've said about him, how threating he was, and how big he was. Anyone that knows him, knows that Jason is the biggest pasivist when it comes to confrontation, he'll tell you that comes from maturity, I tell you that comes from wisdom. Thurber I'm glad you've presented yourself like the real man you are. That's the way a real man should act in public, like a spineless piece of crap that stands around and pushes others buttons until they crack.

Maybe you didn't have a beef with me before, but brother you do now.