doug-ferrin
New member
Jake Terry was advertising a proven male butter on Kingsnake in May of this year.
I inquired about the snake, and on May 14, I Paypaled $865.00 for the snake and shipping.
On May 17th, after I had paid, Jake informed me that the snake had a small rub from trying to breed so much. Here are his words from his May 17 email: “I just today saw this, He has a small ruvb on his tail, my vet says its from trying to contantly breed, he rubbed it raw in a small area. I have a 3 day course of an antibiotic and steroid to help it repair. He is still looking for girls.”
Jake
On May 19th, in the email letting me know he had shipped the snake, Jake said: “I took and through him in with a normal girl last night to get him ready for breeding again, I took him straight out of the girls tub, who he had obviously bred with and into the shipping box. He should be good to go!”
Jake
Jake sent the snake, and he arrived on May 20tth. I did notice the cloacal area had an unusual-looking cyst, and a spot of around 1/8-1/4 inch of raw abraded tissue was evident. I had a vet tech look at this, and he will substantiate my statement.
I placed the butter with a female Mojave that had been receptive to a male spider in previous weeks. No breeding was observed. The injured spot did not change. Subsequently the Mojave female ovulated, so that window of breeding was closed. I continued to feed the butter male to condition him for the upcoming breeding season. The male ate several times without a hitch. So far, so good I thought.
Then on July 24th, I placed him in with a female that did not breed this year. I had tried a fire male with her periodically, without success. Within half a day, the butter was courting. I did not observe any tail wrapping, but there was courtship on his part. I waited another full day, and still courting. I left them together that night, and then next morning, noticed that he was on the opposite side of the cage. I took him out and looked at his vent area. It looked like a bloody piece of hamburger was sticking out. I took a picture of the area and sent the picture to Jake on July 26th.
Since emailing Jake the picture, I have discovered he knew this problem was more serious than he told me, and that his vet told him that the snake should not be bred until later this year, or even until next year. Additionally, Jake has alternately denied responsibility, offered to refund the money, accused me of breeding the male to numerous females, reneged on the offer to refund the money because it has been two months, etc. I even called Jake once, but his dad said that he was too upset to talk to me on the phone. It has also come to my attention that Brock Wagner (soory to have to drag him into this), the person who sold Jake the butter, has been letting Jake use a lesser platinum male for free, since he felt bad that the butter had prolapsed and couldn’t breed! Jake never told me that!
Jake has offered to give me a pick butter hatchling if one is produced this year. I fact I originally suggested this. At one point I did change my mind because the clutch is not even laid yet. Honestly, if Jake had not so shamelessly lied to me, I would probably go ahead and agree to that. But what if none are produced, and I am in the position of trying to get a refund months later? I think I would have an even harder time the more time that passes.
So I want to return this male to Jake, and receive a refund. I have offered to pay the shipping myself. In the meantime, I am keeping the prolapsed/abraded tissue moist with Neosporin. I am afraid to take the snake to a vet, because I not only will be stuck with a vet bill for a snake that in my opinion will not be breed able any time soon (and maybe never), but I am also not confident that if the snake were to die as a result of a medical procedure, that I would ever see another dime from Jake.
I will attach some emails in an additional posting, as well as a picture of the snake. You will see that Jake is all over the place about this.
To restate my case for clarity: Jake sold me a snake with a defect that would have only become evident upon breeding the snake. Jake knew the snake would be in danger of re-injuring itself when bred. Jake did mention that there was damage after receiving payment, but did not disclose the true damage or danger. Jake has said that he would, and then that he would not refund my money. His vet told him that the snake should not be bred at all this year, but Jake told me the snake was ready to go right away. His latest statement is that he will not refund the money based upon the fact that I have had the snake for 2 months. I think I am due a full refund.
So Fauna community, do you think i am out of line expecting to be reimbursed?
I inquired about the snake, and on May 14, I Paypaled $865.00 for the snake and shipping.
On May 17th, after I had paid, Jake informed me that the snake had a small rub from trying to breed so much. Here are his words from his May 17 email: “I just today saw this, He has a small ruvb on his tail, my vet says its from trying to contantly breed, he rubbed it raw in a small area. I have a 3 day course of an antibiotic and steroid to help it repair. He is still looking for girls.”
Jake
On May 19th, in the email letting me know he had shipped the snake, Jake said: “I took and through him in with a normal girl last night to get him ready for breeding again, I took him straight out of the girls tub, who he had obviously bred with and into the shipping box. He should be good to go!”
Jake
Jake sent the snake, and he arrived on May 20tth. I did notice the cloacal area had an unusual-looking cyst, and a spot of around 1/8-1/4 inch of raw abraded tissue was evident. I had a vet tech look at this, and he will substantiate my statement.
I placed the butter with a female Mojave that had been receptive to a male spider in previous weeks. No breeding was observed. The injured spot did not change. Subsequently the Mojave female ovulated, so that window of breeding was closed. I continued to feed the butter male to condition him for the upcoming breeding season. The male ate several times without a hitch. So far, so good I thought.
Then on July 24th, I placed him in with a female that did not breed this year. I had tried a fire male with her periodically, without success. Within half a day, the butter was courting. I did not observe any tail wrapping, but there was courtship on his part. I waited another full day, and still courting. I left them together that night, and then next morning, noticed that he was on the opposite side of the cage. I took him out and looked at his vent area. It looked like a bloody piece of hamburger was sticking out. I took a picture of the area and sent the picture to Jake on July 26th.
Since emailing Jake the picture, I have discovered he knew this problem was more serious than he told me, and that his vet told him that the snake should not be bred until later this year, or even until next year. Additionally, Jake has alternately denied responsibility, offered to refund the money, accused me of breeding the male to numerous females, reneged on the offer to refund the money because it has been two months, etc. I even called Jake once, but his dad said that he was too upset to talk to me on the phone. It has also come to my attention that Brock Wagner (soory to have to drag him into this), the person who sold Jake the butter, has been letting Jake use a lesser platinum male for free, since he felt bad that the butter had prolapsed and couldn’t breed! Jake never told me that!
Jake has offered to give me a pick butter hatchling if one is produced this year. I fact I originally suggested this. At one point I did change my mind because the clutch is not even laid yet. Honestly, if Jake had not so shamelessly lied to me, I would probably go ahead and agree to that. But what if none are produced, and I am in the position of trying to get a refund months later? I think I would have an even harder time the more time that passes.
So I want to return this male to Jake, and receive a refund. I have offered to pay the shipping myself. In the meantime, I am keeping the prolapsed/abraded tissue moist with Neosporin. I am afraid to take the snake to a vet, because I not only will be stuck with a vet bill for a snake that in my opinion will not be breed able any time soon (and maybe never), but I am also not confident that if the snake were to die as a result of a medical procedure, that I would ever see another dime from Jake.
I will attach some emails in an additional posting, as well as a picture of the snake. You will see that Jake is all over the place about this.
To restate my case for clarity: Jake sold me a snake with a defect that would have only become evident upon breeding the snake. Jake knew the snake would be in danger of re-injuring itself when bred. Jake did mention that there was damage after receiving payment, but did not disclose the true damage or danger. Jake has said that he would, and then that he would not refund my money. His vet told him that the snake should not be bred at all this year, but Jake told me the snake was ready to go right away. His latest statement is that he will not refund the money based upon the fact that I have had the snake for 2 months. I think I am due a full refund.
So Fauna community, do you think i am out of line expecting to be reimbursed?
