Bad Guy Jay Sommers/super show/USFW/axolotl

[Jay Sommers Reptiles]

Actually all I see here is yet ANOTHER 3 way chest beating, ego speaking farcebook drama unfolding.
TBH it is getting difficult to even look at the BOI these days as it appears to be the same old same old every other thread.
Different aspects maybe but that is about it.
And no, this is not intended as a slight against any of the three main protagonaists but honestly just HOW many BOI threads do we really need from you guys?

If it was a legal state/transaction they why say "don't get caught with them"? As for years ago what's difference? My probs were years ago also Jay. Is there a statute of limitations we are talking here? The prob is you open your big mouth, expect people not to reply and when they do, you play the victim. Again, passive/aggressive.

Yes I opened my mouth. In defense of a child who is getting bullied, called names insulted etc. How dare I! I guess I have whatever I get coming to me???
Yes im so passive aggressive to be sticking up for a child. I guess I should have kept my mouth shut .

 

[KyleB]

After reading the recent post made by Mike Matson and Barry Lambert I can say I will never do business with these two individuals.

Thank you Fauna for providing a BOI so we can be informed on who to avoid.

"Talking ill of others is a dishonest way of praising ones self" I learned that in 1st grade, guess some people were absent that day.

 

[jrsexotics]

If you have proof I brought axolotls into the state post it. And just know that I have before you. And there were reasons for it. And fully compliant with law enforcement.

Jay the proof is in the messages and context.... What was I suppose to do? Record a transaction on my phone or something.

There is plenty of info in those messages showing that you were willing to bring them to me and or willing to ship them to me. You brought them to the show and had them under the table. I picked up 6 of them from you. Time to stop lying Jay. You were caught in it

Jay you can have a few of your friends post that they won't do business with us Ect. That is expected. I have not shared this thread anywhere else. It may hit my social media pages if you keep going on. I have 17,000 followers between Facebook and Instagram and not a problem with letting this spread of you would like.

I offered to not post anymore and take the high road. You are encouraging me to do more

 

[Jay Sommers Reptiles]

Spread it all you like mike. Another threat won't bother me. I haven't had any friends at all post anywhere on here on my behalf. Unlike you I don't need back up. I am strong enough to stand on my own.

 

[jrsexotics]

Ok Jay

 

[WebSlave]

Jay the proof is in the messages and context.... What was I suppose to do? Record a transaction on my phone or something.

There is plenty of info in those messages showing that you were willing to bring them to me and or willing to ship them to me. You brought them to the show and had them under the table. I picked up 6 of them from you. Time to stop lying Jay. You were caught in it

Jay you can have a few of your friends post that they won't do business with us Ect. That is expected. I have not shared this thread anywhere else. It may hit my social media pages if you keep going on. I have 17,000 followers between Facebook and Instagram and not a problem with letting this spread of you would like.

I offered to not post anymore and take the high road. You are encouraging me to do more

i have to admit that I am not part of the cell phone generation, so excuse me if these questions just sound dumb to all of you who are.

How long ago did these messages take place?

Is it typical for people to keep all of their phone/text messages for several years?

If it is not typical, then why were those particular messages retained?

Honestly, I thought people changed cell phones fairly often and even having one several years old was kind of unusual. Go figure.....

 

[Spectrum Reptiles]

i have to admit that I am not part of the cell phone generation, so excuse me if these questions just sound dumb to all of you who are.

How long ago did these messages take place?

Is it typical for people to keep all of their phone/text messages for several years?

If it is not typical, then why were those particular messages retained?

Honestly, I thought people changed cell phones fairly often and even having one several years old was kind of unusual. Go figure.....

I believe these were FB PM messages. They stay put unless someone were to erase the conversation history.

 

[Jay Sommers Reptiles]

This was 3 years ago to my knowledge. They were retained not by me. I think it's actually facebook I deleted them. But to answer...
Probably to be used as a manipulative tactic at a later date. The threat to post on facebook matters nothing to me. All I ever cared about was the way Cher felt after a video was made trashing her and subsequent comments that frankly made me sick to my stomach. Remember she is 15 years old. People may say it's not my business to get involved? Tell that to the parents of the last child that committed suicide, when nobody stepped in.
It's everyones business. And if doing so brings me under attack so be it. I will stand up for what's right no matter what consequence it brings to me.
And as for Barry lambert?? His beef with me is that I told someone I stay away from him(my words verbatim) when they used him as some convoluted reference for credibility. That's it. These two are in a tag team match against me because I bruised their ego? I have no idea. I have been doing this for over 20 years. I do most of my business out of the country because the hobby in the US hasn't evolved to have enough interest in rare and obscure species.
And as for Barry's ridiculous thread about me and my naultinus?? Well I have a screen shot of me posting my docs already to shut him up months ago on a facebook "boi" type page. So when he started that thread about me saying he's never seen the docs it was completely disingenuous and a flat out lie.

 

[Fangthane]

This was 3 years ago to my knowledge.

The first date shown is 1/3/14. If you were in possession of, and/or selling axolotls in a place where they're prohibited, it's definitely a strike against you. The message stream does appear to make a good case for the idea that that's exactly what was going on. Not good.

That being said, I can't help pointing out the sheer hypocrisy of mike matson being the one to lay down that card - not only because it shows that he also had no problem possessing something he shouldn't. In one of the numerous accounts he created with a false name to bypass his ban, he openly admits to possessing/selling animals that were also not legally owned in his own location, which, as of 2010, he claimed was still Washington State.

As far as living in Oregon I have never. I left Washington state in 2011.

Dated 9/19/2010

Don't try to insult me with a rude comment. I've have 8ft water monitors,alligators. crocs and over 14 venomous snakes over the years along with hundreds of other animals. I'm not afraid of the animal and its not too big. I'm selling the nile because I don't want it anymore. Rather sell it to someone who will put it on display to the public or in a breeding project.

You really shouldn't judge someone before you know them.

 

[Jay Sommers Reptiles]

Actually the first date is in 2013.

 

[jrsexotics]

Welcome to Facebook. Where only when chosen messages can be deleted. Otherwise they will remain there as long as the account is open.

i have to admit that I am not part of the cell phone generation, so excuse me if these questions just sound dumb to all of you who are.

How long ago did these messages take place?

Is it typical for people to keep all of their phone/text messages for several years?

If it is not typical, then why were those particular messages retained?

Honestly, I thought people changed cell phones fairly often and even having one several years old was kind of unusual. Go figure.....

 

[Fangthane]

Actually the first date is in 2013.

So much for my ASSumption they would have been posted chronologically. Although, the 5-week difference doesn't appear to be particularly noteworthy, or really change anything.

 

[jrsexotics]

I will address this.

if you did your research more. Google better you would learn that I dropped shipped species from wholesalers when I was 18-21. So, the alligators were not in my possession but at a wholesalers.

The first date shown is 1/3/14. If you were in possession of, and/or selling axolotls in a place where they're prohibited, it's definitely a strike against you. The message stream does appear to make a good case for the idea that that's exactly what was going on. Not good.

That being said, I can't help pointing out the sheer hypocrisy of mike matson being the one to lay down that card - not only because it shows that he also had no problem possessing something he shouldn't. In one of the numerous accounts he created with a false name to bypass his ban, he openly admits to possessing/selling animals that were also not legally owned in his own location, which, as of 2010, he claimed was still Washington State.



Dated 9/19/2010

 

[Fangthane]

if you did your research more. Google better you would learn that I dropped shipped species from wholesalers when I was 18-21. So, the alligators were not in my possession but at a wholesalers.

Possible, but your glaring lack of credibility makes it extremely debatable. However, it does nothing to negate the admissions you made, which I quoted.

No mention of wholesalers here:

I've have 8ft water monitors,alligators. crocs and over 14 venomous snakes over the years along with hundreds of other animals.

Alligators, crocodiles and many venomous snakes are no-nos in Wa. No matter how one looks at it, you're a liar. Probably time to don your cap and go back into the corner.

 

[LauraB]

Jay, just out of curiosity, when exactly did you leave KS for California?

 

[JayBoa1372]

I feel that all I see on the BOI is threads pertaining to one of you three. It's like a political smear campaign going on.

With that being said, it's not a good thing to break the law pertaining to restricted species. Regardless on what side of the transaction you are on, one should not take part. Our hobby has been facing threat for years and transactions like these do not help our case.

Ignorance can not be claimed as a reason for accepting an illegal species, especially if you were actively "drop shipping" you would be aware of the species you could not keep. (Mike)

Being an active member in the reptile community, you should have also known the restrictions and it's evident you did by making the statement to not get caught. Fish and Wilflife is the reason you have permits for the species you are allowed to keep, they are the reason certain species are allowed to get imported. Regardless of your feelings of their agents, they benefit you in that aspect. That should warrant a respect for them rather then to speak about them in a way. That also does not look good for our hobby. (Jay)

In my opinion everyone involved in these recent chest puffing, ego filled threads needs to step back for a minute and evaluate yourselves. It's been proven that neither of the 3 (Barry, Jay, Mike) have ever been truly devoid of an issue. Everyone makes mistakes, everyone acts out of character at some point, but it's up to those to acknowledge and correct these mistakes.

Finally, my consensus is that you should all figure out what needs to be done to correct your mistakes and be role models in the hobby. Help advance the reptile hobby and be outstanding members of the community. While it does take time to repair reputation and build trust, people are willing to forgive if the effort is put in.

Just my 2 cents...

 

[Kristi23]

I'm not sure that it proves anything, but when I ordered my axolotl from Jay, it was not shipped from California. I can't remember where exactly. Maybe Kansas or someplace in the midwest. But it definitely wasn't from California. This would have been 1-2 years ago now.

 

[Jay Sommers Reptiles]

Jay, just out of curiosity, when exactly did you leave KS for California?

My facility is in Kansas still. That's where the bulk of my animals are.

I had a restricted species permit to bring axolotls into California and I even sold some to a few universities and to the sd zoo where I am an authorized vendor. Or was at the time. Furthermore I was involved in two seperated issues I can not discuss here and I have corroborating emails I can not post because it's communication between me and California fish and game agent and a usfw sector director in Sacramento.

In fact I shipped axolotls into California a few times legally.

 

[Jay Sommers Reptiles]

I feel that all I see on the BOI is threads pertaining to one of you three. It's like a political smear campaign going on.

With that being said, it's not a good thing to break the law pertaining to restricted species. Regardless on what side of the transaction you are on, one should not take part. Our hobby has been facing threat for years and transactions like these do not help our case.

Ignorance can not be claimed as a reason for accepting an illegal species, especially if you were actively "drop shipping" you would be aware of the species you could not keep. (Mike)

Being an active member in the reptile community, you should have also known the restrictions and it's evident you did by making the statement to not get caught. Fish and Wilflife is the reason you have permits for the species you are allowed to keep, they are the reason certain species are allowed to get imported. Regardless of your feelings of their agents, they benefit you in that aspect. That should warrant a respect for them rather then to speak about them in a way. That also does not look good for our hobby. (Jay)

In my opinion everyone involved in these recent chest puffing, ego filled threads needs to step back for a minute and evaluate yourselves. It's been proven that neither of the 3 (Barry, Jay, Mike) have ever been truly devoid of an issue. Everyone makes mistakes, everyone acts out of character at some point, but it's up to those to acknowledge and correct these mistakes.

Finally, my consensus is that you should all figure out what needs to be done to correct your mistakes and be role models in the hobby. Help advance the reptile hobby and be outstanding members of the community. While it does take time to repair reputation and build trust, people are willing to forgive if the effort is put in.

Just my 2 cents...

You realize what you are telling me is I don't have the right to speak as I wish in a private communication? How does my private conversation affect the reptile hobby in any way.it doesn't until someone posts it online. It has zero relevance to anything. Furthermore it was not directed at any specific agent it was a vague off color joke. I mean it was clearly a joke. And also I am quite sure there have been a few usfw agents talk about me just as badly.
It's not like I made a video about usfw agents and posted it on my facebook page.
I guess at this point I should just not open my mouth at all in private communications with people for fear of it being used against me at a later date??

 

[Jay Sommers Reptiles]

I'm not sure that it proves anything, but when I ordered my axolotl from Jay, it was not shipped from California. I can't remember where exactly. Maybe Kansas or someplace in the midwest. But it definitely wasn't from California. This would have been 1-2 years ago now.

It's hard to say. I had a facility in Arizona for over a year. However arizona passed a law banning transgenic animals so I had to move those back to Kansas City metro.