JeffB apparently doesn't like me having KINGSNAKES.COM...

[JungleHabitats]

Rich

I to agree with your efforts in trying to show Jeff how it takes a "Bigger man" to say sorry and try to get past somthing that IMHO Jeff should have never taken it to in thr first place. This industry is plenty big enough for the both of you to have you rightfull places in it .I like/ed Kingsnake for what it offers in the realm of classifieds and honestly i have gotten more feedback from classifieds that were / are run there then here . But over the last several weeks i think that Jeffs moderators have began takin more drastic steps in which to piss people off so that they decide to leave that site or to give them 1/2 a reason to ban and drop there accounts im not sure which of the two are true but one is i feel confident of.While i still have an account there i am feeling more & more that when april rolls around they will not be getting my renewal to there accounts. I am just fed up they way you get treated there when your not dumping several hundreds if not thousands of dollars into his site ... your basically NOTHING to them . so Rich in my eyes id rather have someone like you as a friend and someone to do buisness with then someone who doesnt appreciate your buisness

 

[KelliH]

Good job Rich. *KelliH pats Webslave on the back*

 

[KNOBTAIL]

RICH, i read your open letter to Jeff and

I must tell you, its a little late, and as a matter of fact, I personally believe whatever little hope you may have had in attempting to ease the tensions, between you and Jeff, were thrown out the window when you antagonized Jeff with Kingsnakes. What did you think was going to happen? You understand Jeffs positon with Fauna, and yet you persued a flame by almost making a mockery of his site, and allowing others on this site to add to that flame. Now you want to be his friend! You want to let bygones be bygones. ! You have the audacity to attempt to sign up at Jeffs site thinking that all is forgiven!

Ive been watching this now for over a year. What disturbs me is your flim flopping back and forth. Jeff does not need you, probably does not like you or your site. You see what he can do and has done ,with even the mention of Fauna or anything related to you or your site. So do the right thing, put this to rest, leave this guy alone, dont antagonize him, or make a situation worse than it already is. JERRY TRESSER

 

[JungleHabitats]

Jerry with all due respect

I think if ANYONE has audacity to do anything it would be Jeff.If i am wrong was it not him that started this by banning any mention of Richs sites ?? All because someone said something about Jeff that in all likelyhood was 99% if not 100% true? See Jeff doesnt let or want ANYONE to bring attention to viewers of his site that there are people there that WILL & DO screw people out of money for nothing in return. And i honestly think more people would be less condeming of Jeff if his TOS was for any person that screws another be it not sending what was paid for or be it a sick animals that was sold as healthy.To put a immeadiate stop on the accounts and not let them post items for sale UNTILL there dispute was cleared up. and use his 3 strike rule as a source of punishing the scammer and not the buyer if they screw three people then there off the site plain & simple. I fully can understand why Jeff may have got his diaper twisted on his ass by Rich owning kingsnakes.com but as people have stated he should have had the foresight to PROTECT his site by buying that name when he did kingsnake.com . But he didnt so he was pissed at hiself for letting be available and then when he saw rich owned it he flew hot and went to what he did .. i have to ask why he did not pursue the person that owned it before rich to purchase that name ? Yeah the BOI has its many soap operas in it but when you look at the big picture id have to say thissite alone has done MORE FOR THE BUYERS then kingsnake has or could ever do. Rich knows what he is doing in respect to this site and he knows that freedom of speech is a right that EVERYONE is entitled to. Jeff on the other hand rules with a Iron fist if you dare try to warn pople there wether its against TOS or not you will be silenced and fast .. why is he so fast to protect the guilty and punish the person who is wronged ?. I think if Jeff would have allowed people to speak up for there rights and the right to confront the person that wronged them he might have gained a little more respect.But i guess it doesnt matter to people who have not been scammed ??? thats probably because they came and checked with the BOI before making a purchase .

A perfect example of someone right now that shouldnt be allowed to post ads IMHO is Jon's Jungle... because he has had someones $ since October 13th and that person has not recieved what they paid for .. and Jon even spoke up in a thread about him to say there animals were going out aprrox two weeks ago ... and that person has yet to receive his paid goods... Now is that fair???

 

[pcsmicro]

Well, When I bought some domains a while back prior to the dot com fallout I would buy all domains I had concern about .com .org .net etc. I don't think they have a leg to stand on. If so all the large companies would sue everybody whom had similar names. Unless they have exclusive trademarks etc. I don't see where there is a legal leg to stand on. Just my opinion. A Network geek



Douglas

 

[Roger Jolly]

Actually, although I hate legal mumbo jumbo, I have just spent a very entertaining hour or two reading about the issues in this thread. I have a whole file of stuff I am going to forward to webslave they he will probably find of interest to forward to an attorney.

Try this one out for size:

1209.03(m) Domain Names [R-2]
Internet domain names raise some unique trademark issues. A mark comprised of an Internet domain name is registrable as a trademark or service mark only if it functions as an identifier of the source of goods or services. Portions of the uniform resource locator (URL) including the beginning, (“http://www.”) and the top level Internet domain name (TLD) (e.g., “.com,” “.org,” “.edu,”) function to indicate an address on the World Wide Web, and therefore generally serve no source-indicating function. See TMEP §§1215 et seq. regarding marks comprising domain names. TLDs may also signify abbreviations for the type of entity for whom use of the cyberspace has been reserved. For example, the TLD “.com” signifies to the public that the user of the domain name constitutes a commercial entity. In re Martin Container, Inc., 65 USPQ2d 1058, 1060-1061 (TTAB 2002) ("[T]o the average customer seeking to buy or rent containers, "CONTAINER.COM" would immediately indicate a commercial web site on the Internet which provides containers."). See also Goodyear’s India Rubber Glove Mfg. Co. v. Goodyear Rubber Co., 128 U.S. 598, 602 (1888) (“The addition of the word ‘Company’ [to an otherwise generic mark] only indicates that parties have formed an association or partnership to deal in such goods . . . .” and does not render the generic mark registrable).

If a proposed mark includes a TLD such as “.com”, “.biz”, “.info”, the examining attorney should present evidence that the term is a TLD, and, if available, evidence of the significance of the TLD as an abbreviation (e.g. “.edu” signifies an educational institution, “.biz” signifies a business).

Because TLDs generally serve no source-indicating function, their addition to an otherwise unregistrable mark typically cannot render it registrable. In re CyberFinancial.Net, Inc., 65 USPQ2d 1789, 1792 (TTAB 2002) ("Applicant seeks to register the generic term 'bonds,' which has no source-identifying significance in connection with applicant's services, in combination with the top level domain indicator ".com," which also has no source-identifying significance. And combining the two terms does not create a term capable of identifying and distinguishing applicant's services."); In re Martin Container, 65 USPQ2d at 1061 ("[N]either the generic term nor the domain indicator has the capability of functioning as an indication of source, and combining the two does not result in a compound term that has somehow acquired this capability."). See also Goodyear, 128 U.S. at 602 (the incorporation of a term with no source-indicating function into an otherwise generic mark cannot render it registrable). For example, if a proposed mark is composed of merely descriptive term(s) combined with a TLD, the examining attorney must refuse registration on the Principal Register under Trademark Act §2(e)(1), 15 U.S.C. §1052(e)(1), on the ground that the mark is merely descriptive. See TMEP §1215.04.

Similarly, if a proposed mark is composed of generic term(s) for the applicant’s goods or services and a TLD, the examining attorney must refuse registration on the ground that the mark is generic. See TMEP §§1209.01(c)(i) and 1215.05.

The above quote is from the United States Patent and Trademark Office. Here is the link:

http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/tac/tmep/1200.htm#_Toc2666059

Webbie, check out the application form for a registered trademark. Its passed my bedtime or I would look into it for ya. If it has anything at all on there asking the applicant whether or not the mark they are using is a generic term, then you could dispute the trademark on grounds of perjury from Jeffie and gang. He probably spent a lot of money for that trademark registration, and it would really make him mad to have it nullified.

There goes his case!!! Jeffie does not sell kingsnakes. He sells services. This generic term is listed countless times on his own website as well as hundreds of other sites. Just as countless other sites sell the same services that he does from his, which are not commonly known as kingsnake or kingsnakes.

Read the stuff I am going to PM you. It's all in black and white. I would post it here, but it would put everyone to sleep. But anyone who it did not put to sleep would be amused at Jeffies claims, for sure.

 

[PAUL BOLLINGER]

LOL

Christmas came early for Webslave!
Good find Roger.

 

[KNOBTAIL]

ALLEN, i am sure everything you just

mentioned in your post is correct ! With regard to Jon, I am very surprised.

I also want to point out that I dont know Rich, and my dealings with Jeff are only a handshake when I see him in Daytona. I have had discussions with Jeff on several occassons, but never brought up the BOI. I can say this much with certainty. He is a nervous guy, sweats alot, is a heavy smoker, and in all likelyhood has this parinoid feeling that people are out to get him.

I also can tell you , that he has developed what he considers an empire that people respect and hate. When you see him, you can easily see why he is the way he is. His sense of insecurity becomes very evident. This is my impression of him. But I like him and think he is a good businessman. You and I both know that we would love to have the traffic he gets and probably the money that is generated from his site.

Once you hurt this guy, he never forgets. Once he is twitched the wrong way, he never forgives. He plays in his house by his rules, fair or unfair, if you venture into his domain, as right as you may be, he has people who will wipe you off the board. When you recognize this , you either play by his rules, or dont. Rich allowed people on this site to complain about Kingsnake. Rich also added some fuel by antagonizing Jeff with this Kingsnakes business. This site is the official Kingsnake, Jeff bashing site, and I think its a big mistake. People have a right to air their grievences, but maybe remarks about sites should have been placed outside of the BOI. Apparently, this did not happen, and now Rich wants to make amends. Their is so much bitterness there, poor business decisions by both, and such pettyness that this can never be resolved.

The best thing for Rich to do, at this juncture would be to stop communicating with him, let this arbitration reach its conclusion, and get away from Jeff .Otherwise, In the end it will lead to who has the deepest pockets, and as indicated before, Jeff does not negotiate, because he does not know how. JERRY TRESSER

 

[Blackwater Reptiles]

To Jerry Tresser....

Personal feelings for or against Jeff Barringer and Kingsnake.com (Neither have ever "harmed" me in any way), would you not say it is possible, and perhaps even EASIER for persons to conduct business without having to resort to fear and intimidation tactics to get the job done?

I've never met Jeff Barringer. I (apparently) haven't attended any of the shows at which he has been in attendance. If I were to meet him, I wouldn't have much to say, because as I said earlier, he has never done anything to me.... and if he had, I wouldn't take it to the grave with me.....

I understand the need for rules on the forums and for classified advertisers. I understand being a monitor on a message board and how annoying it can be to deal with people on the internet. But, I also understand compassion, fairness, honesty, respect and the need for people to be able to leave a dispute with their dignity in place. If a "customer" (that's what you are if you spend your money there.... not a "subscriber" no matter how they try to depersonalize it) violates the "Terms of Service" then I believe they should be warned and coached to conform to the terms of service... the rules.... IF the "customer" repeats the behavior that is in violation of terms of service, then warn again.... this time a little stronger language is in order, and coach-advise the offending customer on the correct way to follow the rules. If the TOS violator can't conform, then REFUND the balance of the contract and move on with life. The "reason" (I like to think of it as an excuse) given for poor customer service is that they're too big, busy, and overworked to deal with people professionally, and courteously.... something I cannot and will not believe. It only takes a moment more to be polite than rude....there is no excusing rudeness....

So to come here and defend rude behavior by saying "it's his site and he can do what he wants" is feeble at best, and completely unacceptable at worst.... I know that Kingsnake.com is the most popular Herptofauna site in the world. I also know that the mighty can fall quickly. It is said in the business world that we must watch who we step on as we travel up the coporate ladder, as they're the same people we meet on the way back down. I'm not saying that Kingsnake.com is headed for a fall.... it seems that they can do anything to anyone that they please over there -FOR NOW- but someday the hand that holds others down may be looking for a hand up, or a hand-out.... and the more people in this business that are turned off by the bullying and intimidation, the less likely it is that there will be anyone left to turn to when the mighty have fallen.....

I bet that if you could get the "big breeders" that keep that site operating to discuss (honestly) how they feel about that site there'd be some heated talk going on.... It's definitely a love-hate relationship.....

Anyway, I don't know if I made my point or not... I had one, I swear.... Bottom line is that is isn't NECESSARY to treat people badly to succeed in business.... so why do it????

 

[JungleHabitats]

Tom al i can say to your post is

YOU hit the Nail right square dead center in the middle.While yes Kingsnake is for now a force to be reckoned with the day will come when as was stated in a Internet news article "The biggest reptile site on the net , run from there living room" will also be the loneliest has been sitting in his living room. I firmly beleive that a buisness succedsor or fails by how they treat there customers , while it may not be a overnight event it does play a large part in where the buisness ends up. I to would like for the Big names that keep kingsnake afloat to voice there opinions of his ways.... but as you said they wont for fear of loosing there accounts. Aswell if when he bannishes persons from his site if he were to refund there monies i think there would be less bad feelings but 90+% of them are done away with and he keeps right on steamrolling along over the rest.

Jerry you said

This site is the official Kingsnake, Jeff bashing site, and I think its a big mistake. People have a right to air their grievences, but maybe remarks about sites should have been placed outside of the BOI

This may be true but however i dont think Rich is to blame for that as he has only done what he does for EVERYONE give them a fair and unbiased place to air/share there thoughts on person/s who have done something to be desrving of what has been said of or about them.Now how would Rich appear if he allowed people to come here and talk about people who have screwed another over over a snake, lizard or frog or some other items ... but then in the same forum NOT allow someone to talk about Jeffs & kingsnake. You know that if Jeff /Kingsnake is being talked about there is a pretty good chance that it is 99.9999% right. His actions have clearly shown that he thinks he is a GOD among us.And that if you dont play by what he calls rules and others call opression he will silence your opinions & thoughts.

 

[KNOBTAIL]

ALLEN, now dont get me wrong, because

nowhere in my post do I defend any of his actions. My argument is that Rich has placed himself in harms way. Jeff may have reached the point where he may make it VERY FINANCIALLY UNCOMFORTABLE, for Rich. I dont put it past him. This business about Kingsnakes is just the vechicle that Jeff may need to persue litigation. Although I dont know Rich, I do know that Rich may end up having to defend himself in some kind of action. As you can see, its already beginning, and where it may lead, we dont know.

Secondly, although your statements may be correct as well as the post before you by Tom, its not an idealistic world. Ive indicated before that Jeff is motivated by money. He will take whatever steps are necessary to protect his interests. You people on the other hand are talking about whats fair and what is not, freedom of speech and everything else that really have no relevance to my complaint. Rich had no business in bringing Kingsnakes to the BOI, nor the REPTI site in flashing colors. Granted , it may be Richs domain, but The Disney people once sued the promoters of the Oscars on TV for having a scetch about Snow White. It was a harmless , 2 minute satire, but the Disney people needed to protect their image and product. They did not care if they were not going to be the "good guys", their products are worth money! And so is the name Kingsnake. Maybe you are right . In the end you may get your wish if for some reason, Jeff leaves and is taken over by a kindler, gentler business, but for sure, their are more tears shed for the answered prayers than the unanswered ones. Be aware of the fact that I have nothing against Rich as I dont know him, But I honestly believe he could have gotten bettet results had he taken a more silent approach than putting this tread on the BOI. JERRY TRESSER.

 

[JungleHabitats]

some interesting reading

Ok on the page that Jolly Roger linked to i have been reading for what seems like a year now lol and came across these ...


1212.02(i) Section 2(f) Claim with Respect to Incapable Matter
If matter is generic, functional or purely ornamental, or otherwise fails to function as a mark, the matter is unregistrable. See, e.g., In re Bongrain International Corp., 894 F.2d 1316, 1317 n.4, 13 USPQ2d 1727, 1728 n.4 (Fed. Cir. 1990) (“If a mark is generic, incapable of serving as a means ‘by which the goods of the applicant may be distinguished from the goods of others’ ... it is not a trademark and can not be registered under the Lanham Act.”); H. Marvin Ginn Corp. v. International Association of Fire Chiefs, 782 F.2d 987, 989, 228 USPQ 528, 530 (Fed. Cir. 1986), and cases cited therein (“A generic term ... can never be registered as a trademark because such a term is ‘merely descriptive’ within the meaning of §2(e)(1) and is incapable of acquiring de jure distinctiveness under §2(f). The generic name of a thing is in fact the ultimate in descriptiveness.”). See also In re Melville Corp., 228 USPQ 970, 972 (TTAB 1986) (BRAND NAMES FOR LESS, for retail store services in the clothing field, “should remain available for other persons or firms to use to describe the nature of their competitive services.”).


heres the VERY interesting read


1215.05 Generic Refusals [R-2]

If a mark is composed of a generic term(s) for the applicant’s goods or services and a TLD, the examining attorney must refuse registration on the ground that the mark is generic and the TLD has no trademark significance. Marks comprised of generic terms combined with TLDs are not eligible for registration on the Supplemental Register, or on the Principal Register under Trademark Act §2(f), 15 U.S.C. §1052(f). This applies to trademarks, service marks, collective marks and certification marks. In re CyberFinancial.Net, Inc., 65 USPQ2d 1789 (TTAB 2002) (BONDS.COM held generic for providing information regarding financial products and services and electronic commerce services rendered via the Internet, where bonds was the name of one of the financial products offered under the mark); In re Martin Container, Inc., 65 USPQ2d 1058 (TTAB 2002) (CONTAINER.COM held generic for "retail store services and retail services offered via telephone featuring metal shipping containers" and "rental of metal shipping containers").

Example: TURKEY.COM for frozen turkeys is unregistrable on either the Principal or Supplemental Register.

Example: BANK.COM for banking services is unregistrable on either the Principal or Supplemental Register.

See TMEP §1209.01(c)(i) regarding the test for establishing that a term is generic.



i have to go out but will return to continue on this matter

 

[Roger Jolly]

Rich had no business in bringing Kingsnakes to the BOI

Oh really, Jerry???

Someone in the business is harrassing another in the business, attempting to cause financial harm and that is not suitable material for the BOI???

Yes, kingsnake makes a lot of money, and likely have deep pockets, but maybe not so deep as people think. What is his overhead running that joint? But whatever the financial situation over there is anyone thinking about where his money comes from? Why lo and behold, it all comes from all of you! So this bs he is starting with legal actions is being paid for with your money. And he is going to escalate it, because he has your money to play with. Are you all comfortable about that? You can go on smiling about making those sales from Jeffies site with your paid accounts and you can just brush off his power ego and now what he is trying to do against a competitor??? What do you all suspect his ultimate goal is concerning webslave and faunaclassifieds???

People go to kingsnake.com because YOU people are advertising there. Not because Jeffie is running that site. People will go to whereever you are advertising. That is not brain surgery level thinking. Jeffie sees this and other sites as direct competition for your dollars, so don't believe for a microsecond that once he gets faunaclassifieds out of the way that he will then sit back and be content about those other competing sites not also being a threat. This is now the front lines in a very ugly battle. And the winner might very well be decided by how you people vote with your pocketbooks. Cause yes, this is going to cost money on both sides. Maybe a lot of money. Who are you going to help out??? What will the results of your voting be and will you be happy about that outcome??? Or are you just going to play mister neutrality and you don't care one way or the other as long as you can still run your business???

But from webslaves side of this discussion, yeah, Jeffie has a lot of money coming in from you guys. There is a plus side to that to his advantage. That fact may really get an agressive attorneys attention. What is the standard fee in a contingency case??? One third??? Has anyone added up what they think kingsnake.com is pulling in a year? Think that might get a hungry attorneys attention if he feels he has a client with a solid case???

No offense, Jeffie, but you are leaving yourself wide open for this. If webslave decides to get an attorney to fight for ownership of kingsnakes.com, he just may not stop there with the ball. You threw the first punch, you know. You have now exposed yourself as a credible threat and strong measures may be in order to counter that threat. Are you prepared to put your business on the line in this??? Do you feel you could defend against a credible claim of damages plus many people who could be called on to provide testimony of the way you have treated them??? Judges and juries can be heavily influenced by character witnesses, Jeffie, and how do you think character witnesses will portray you???

Yeah, yeah, I've heard that song and dance about someone able to do what the heck they want with their own site, so gimme a break with that noise again. People have a right to own a baseball bat and can swing it around all they want. But if they use it to purposely and maliciously attempt to damage another person, then they run afoul of the law. If a prosecuting attorney can convince a jury that Jeffies actions were done in an attempt to inflict financial hardship on webslave, witnesses can be produced who will state that the majority of their income is based on the goodwill of Jeffie and maintaining their account on kingsnake.com, as well as character witnesses telling of the way in which they were callously treated, what do you think will be the outcome in court??? Do you seriously think a court will find against webslave when the only defense Jeffie will be able to come up with is that he allowed people the freedom to post about Jeffie on his site? Especially when the bulk of evidence from witnesses will certainly indicate that everything said was the truth???

Yeah some naysayers are going to say webslave had it coming because of his part in the conflict. But keep this in front of your eyes: this all started because webslave refused to delete a thread posted by Adam Block. Perhaps this was just a trumped up excuse so Jeffie could block a competing site from his, because he didn't have anything else to go on as a violation of his TOS. But the point remains about who and what started this open feud.

By the way, when was the last time many of you clicked on that Make a Donation button??? If webslave does need to get an attorney to defend himself and this site, do you think the money the advertisers are paying here are going to cover that? Just count the number of advertisers and multiply that times $25 per month. How far do you think that is going to go? If he decides that he is just tired of putting out the time and money to give this site to you, are you going to be happy about seeing this site just folded up and gone???

Do you seriously think that if faunaclassifieds and the BOI gets trampled into the ground that anyone else will ever attempt to do this again?

Think about it. You may have some choices to make.

Personally, I have several auctions on Ebay that I will be using that money from to make a decent donation. Christmas time is a hard time for people to look beyond providing gifts for their families, but I don't think webslave chose the playing field.

 

[JungleHabitats]

well no doubt in whos side im standing with

I will stand firmly beside Rich in any choice he makes from here on out. And yes i do have an account with KS but it ends in April 04 as of yet ( far as i know ) its still active havent tried to access it in several days since i have spoke out who knows it to might be closed now . AS i had stated earlier Rich will be receibing my hardearned money ( and trust me its hard earned ) when i am able to do so right now times are hard and work is almost NON exsistant where i moved to ( for the love of god i hope it changes soon lol) im in my last dips of the bank account so finacially im not able to contribute anything but moral support sorry Rich. YEs i will continue to use my account with KS as long as its available because i feel since i have it paid untill April i deserve that right to use my $ .I WILL NOT be sending another dime to KS thats for sure from now own when finacially available Rich will get what i can when i can. Rich knows how to be fair , and be friends with 99.9% of the people here and even the ones he is not friendly to he is IMHO still fair. He knows how to put buisness where buisness belongs and let whatever feelings he has towards a person or about a person not get between him and his buisness ways . Rich again i applaud you for everything you do & stand for here to the herp community as a whole.maybe you should run for President ? lol

 

[KNOBTAIL]

ROGER, sorry I was unable to respond

sooner, but you are wrong! When Rich posted his first thread, Jeff had not committed any wrongdoing. He responded to Rich because Rich was offering a domain that could potentially be a problem for Jeff. Whether you agree with that does not meet the standards for starting a thread on the BOI. Rich could have very easily put that thread into another area, but Jeff did nothing wrong. Rich also if I am not mistaken offered for sale on the BOI Kingsnakes, which really should have been placed in the "sales area of this forum.

As you are very well aware their has been a substantial amount of threads on this whole business of domains, freedom of speech, what a bad boy Jeff is, etc. This thread, most certainly brought out all the Jeff bashers especially since Rich sent Jeff an email looking to resolve matters, and received no reply. Why do this! What Rich should have done, was kept this out of the BOI, wait until some decision was made from the arbitration board, and seriously consider what his next move was going to be. Instead he just antagonized Jeff even more.

I find it ironic on the one hand Rich found it necessary to bring this to everyones attention and accept the 100 or so threads, and then send an email looking to smooth things over.

Now you must understand, I am not a Jeff croney, and I am not taking his side when he does whatever he does as this is not what we are dealing with here, but in this particular instance, where his family has legal representation, and he is potentially financially capable of making Rich s life miserable, he may just attempt to do that. THAT IS MY CONCERN. Rich, although I dont know his financial situation, does not want to enter into these legal staircases. Jeff on the other hand seems to be well oiled and has the machinery already in place for any contingency. If Ive told you once and 1000 times more, he will take whatever steps are necessary to protect his iterests, and if it means loosing some advertisers along the way, then so be it, because their are 100 more waiting in line.
And yes, the BOI is irreplaceable , and yes Rich has done a wonderful service to the Herp trade of putting people on notice about these thieves who prey on well intentioned people, and yes I love the BOI as well, and have been an outspoken critic on many occasions, but this is a little bit different, these waters can lead to some unforseen difficulties for Rich. A behind the scene approach would have been the better avenue to take, then to wear this badge of courage by letting everyone know, " look what I received in the mail"

And finally Roger, Rich cant even get the people who advertise to pay him on time, or even pay him. This does not happen with Kingsnake. Because people are running to insure that they get their spot of glory on Kingsnake. So please, if you want to really help Rich, the answer is not to go after Kingsnake, or Jeff Barringer, but to prevent friends and people whom you really care for, from hurting themselves financially in a quagmire that can lead to more than they bargained for. JERRY TRESSER

 

[WebSlave]

Sorry, Jerry, but the facts of the matter seem to suggest a different conclusion:

When Rich posted his first thread, Jeff had not committed any wrongdoing. He responded to Rich because Rich was offering a domain that could potentially be a problem for Jeff. Whether you agree with that does not meet the standards for starting a thread on the BOI.

JeffB does not have indisputable control over all domain names that may be a potential problem for him.

• The domain name KINGSNAKES.COM was available for JeffB to reserve for nearly two years after he got kingsnake.com, which took place on February 8, 1997.
• KINGSNAKES.COM was reserved by by John Organiscak on December 1, 1998, and was owned by John for the following 4.5 YEARS.
• I got the domain name on May 29, 2003 in exchange for a debt. I then had it in my possession sitting in limbo as only a referral link to my own site for 5 months. In all that time, there was not a word about it at all from anyone about me having that domain name, my intentions with it, or any future plans I may have been entertaining about it.
• I placed the domain name on auction at ReptiBid on November 12, 2003, which signified publicly that I was interested in giving up any title to KINGSNAKES.COM, rather than pursuing the devlopment of the domain name as an active site.
• I received a copy of the ICANN complaint form which was sent from Austin, Texas on November 20, 2003. NOTE It does not take 168 days to do the paperwork and file an ICANN domain name complaint.

The details of why I used the auction board are explained elsewhere in this thread if you need to refresh your memory. Please note the detail that mentions that I had a FIRM offer for this domain name from Alex Hue, for which he made an offer for spontaneously, and without my offering it to him beforehand.

Those are the facts. You can make your own assumptions about the timing involved in the dispute filing. What was it that actually triggered the decision to file the complaint? Beats me.

As far as the suitability to my posting this situation on the BOI, I believe I am free to do what I want on my own site.

Alas, you all will have to decide for yourself, I guess, on what the definition of "wrongdoing" is.

As for JeffB able to make my life miserable? Perhaps you are right. Perhaps not.

 

[KNOBTAIL]

RICH, thanks for the response, and

you are absolutely correct, its your site and you can do whatever you want. I guess thats what Jeff does as well. I am not here to argue about the domain but about "potential liabilities" With all due respect to you, this is exactly what Jeff is looking for, and these threads that are implicitly condoned by you are nothing but a possible prelude for further difficulties that you may encounter from him or his attorneys.

I dont know nor do you at this juncture, what lengths Jeff may persue this. Its a fight that even if you win, the cost may be substantial. I wish I were your friend to tell you , lets put an end to this right now. But their are fair minded people out their who seem to be egging you on, providing all the necessary legal mumbo jumbo, telling you about the terror of Kingsnake and in the end my friend, your on your own!

I dont doubt for a second that your original intention was honorable, and you had every legitimate right to offer for sale KINGSNAKES. No problem their. But how this gets interpeted is another story, and apparently their is a history between you and Jeff, and he just looks at this as another attempt from the owners of Fauna to cause more problems for Kingsnake. I dont know what the outcome will be , but I am a prudent man and maybe a bit overcautious in my thinking. But sometimes from good experience, and I am reflecting upon myself, these things can come back to bite you in the ass. I have the marks to prove it. I dont want that to happen to you. A loyal participant. JERRY

 

[JungleHabitats]

Jerry

i think sometimes David needs to stand up to a " goliath" figure. With that i mean that if Rich genuinely(sp) feels he has something to go one and thinks its worth his effort to do so its worth it to him . I think i can speak for Rich in saying that NOT ONE SINGLE person here is forcing his hand or anything we say will make him pursue somthing he doesnt want to. If a person or persons back down from evey "big name out in the world the world will be a monoply driven system and that would inturn oppress all of the " smaller guys" and would cause the big name people to think with intimidation they will have no challengers. of anything that the big names want to keep us or you from having. Ithink sometimes we a humans will only take so much pushing into a corner before we decide to stand up for ourselves.And yes the arguement could be both Rich and jeff feel there in a corner and both want to be right . onething for sure SOMEONE will be right if it goes 12 rounds no doubt there Maybe rich doesnt have what you call deep enough pockets to pursue this but maybe he does .. maybe he feels that if he feels that he is right and wants to defend hiself that he may do what it takes to get himself there i dont know im not Rich's bank or advisor. But i do see it as jeff maybe ligitimely worried for something we all may not truely know.

 

[Adam Block]

Message deleted because of excessive profanity - WebSlave.

 

[JungleHabitats]

lol

Rich theres one one to add to the censor list lol

Adam lol u kill me .. in a good way