Josh Sharp - [email protected] - Terrible Cage - One to Avoid

[SPJ]

I am posting this experience so anyone who may have thought of giving this guy a chance and trying out his new line of cages will avoid getting what I recieved not only in a very poor quality cage but also in a very poor customer service attitude.

Below are the details and photos regarding this transaction. Save your money and a headache. DO NOT DO BUSINESS WITH JOSH SHARP. There are far too many cage manufacturers out there that deliver quality products and have good customer service to choose from.

It all started when I recieved an email stating that the cage I bought had shipped on Oct 18th.
I received an email from UPS stating with the tracking number.

On Oct 31st, I contacted him asking where the cage was that was supposed to have been shipped on the 18th.

Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 06:51:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Steve Jordanides" <[email protected]> Add to Address Book Add Mobile Alert
Subject: Re:
To: [email protected]
Well I took a chance with a new caging manufacturer and it still has not shipped as promised. I am requesting a full and immediate refund of the paypal payment.


Tracking Number: 1Z 55E 33R 03 9524 505 7
Type: Package
Status: Billing Information Received
Shipped To: SEYMOUR, CT, US
Shipped/Billed On: 10/18/2007
Service: GROUND
Weight: 28.00 Lbs

Tracking results provided by UPS: 10/31/2007 9:46 A.M. ET


[email protected] wrote:
Hello, Sorry about that. I was told that I would recieve your part on the 17 but never did. Finally got it today Will ship out monday. If there is something I can do for your toubles let me know. I can only get my parts from one place. They deal with big RV companies that order 1000s of parts a month. I'm just some guy looking for a couple parts a week.
Josh

I also initiated a paypal dispute to try and resolve this. I was not going to have this drag out like my last attempted cage purchase. I closed the dispute once he confirmed UPS picked up the cage and it was now in fact on the way.

To: [email protected]
Subject: Re:
Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 12:58:00 -0400
From: [email protected] Add to Address Book Add Mobile Alert
I'm really sorry about all of this i work about 50 hrs a week and my wife goes to college and my grandma watches my 2 yr old. my grandma got put in the hospital on friday. My wife cant miss her college so i have to watch my kid. I know that none of this is your fault and i'm not tring to make you feel sorry for me. Just lettin you know whats going on.
Josh


-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Jordanides <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 12:44 pm
Subject: Re:


Done. It's closed.
I am skeptical of cage manufactures since my horrible experience with the last cage order.
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103501


[email protected] wrote:
ups picked it up today

The cage arrived yesterday. Upon taking it out of the box, I took photos and sent him the following emails.

Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 15:50:57 -0800 (PST)
From: "Steve Jordanides" <[email protected]> Add to Address Book Add Mobile Alert
Subject: Fwd: Cage Arrived - Reply ASAP!!!
To: [email protected]
And the lip inside that runs across the bottom and side behind the doors is also jagged.
All of this needs to be finished so an animal being put into the cage won't get cut on jagged edges!

Steve Jordanides <[email protected]> wrote:
Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 15:22:55 -0800 (PST)
From: Steve Jordanides <[email protected]>
Subject: Fwd: Cage Arrived - Reply ASAP!!!
To: [email protected]

I have attached another picture of the track.

Steve Jordanides <[email protected]> wrote: Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 15:16:44 -0800 (PST)
From: Steve Jordanides <[email protected]>
Subject: Cage Arrived - Reply ASAP!!!
To: [email protected]


The cage arrived today.
I am NOT happy. Attached are some pictures of the shoddy workmanship.
This cage is terrible.
I will be expecting a reply ASAP on how you plan to rectify this.
I have been MORE than patient with the shipping delays and took a chance with a new seller and it looks like it bit me in the ass.
Here are the pictures.
Both doors are very sharp. The edges were never gorund after being cut. The handle grips are also very sharp. Once again not ground to break the sharp edges.
The track on the top is messed up. I tried putting it back in place but it appears it was riveted wrong and I cannot move it to the position it is supposed to be in.
The screen on the top is sagging between the rivets and the cutout all around it has chatter and rough edges sticking out. Once again, not finished off properly.

Photos of the problems can be found here.
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v440/SPJ01/cage/

I recieved this reply regarding the terrible quality of this product.

To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Cage Arrived - Reply ASAP!!!
Date: Tue, 06 Nov 2007 12:19:32 -0500
From: [email protected] Add to Address Book Add Mobile Alert
Well....
The listing does not say that the edges of the doors or the gruve are rounded. No one else has said anything about that. I'm not going to spend another hour deburing all the edges on the cage. The track was on there perfectly when it left my possesion. If ups threw the box around, thats not my fault. The screen, you think that an animal can get out of that. The screen is on there for ventalation, lighting, heating and to keep the animal contained. Its not on there for looks. Unless your putting 100lbs light on there, the screen should do its job. I have over 100.00 in just the materials, about 3 hours of my time. Oh and the box it came in was 10.00. Sounds like to me I lost my ass on this. On top of that I have to deal with this bullshit. Do you think that there is a reason that vision charges 260.00 for a cage like this. You got yours for 125.00 Wow thats over half off. If you want to pay for the shipping. You can ship it back and I'll put more rivets in it and debur the sharp edges.

This was my response back to him.

Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 09:48:56 -0800 (PST)
From: "Steve Jordanides" <[email protected]> Add to Address Book Add Mobile Alert
Subject: Re: Cage Arrived - Reply ASAP!!!
To: [email protected]
I don't care what it cost you or what it cost me. I paid you what YOU listed the cage for. YOU set the price, not me. You sent a subpar cage and I will make sure everyone considering a cage purchase knows about it. You need to provide quality or expect to lose sales.
Your attitude is terrible.
In addition to the sagging screen, the rivets holding the screen in place also stick thru the top of the cage about an 1/8 of an inch. That leaves several more sharp edges for an animal to come in contact with.
Since it's obvious that you do not care about producing quality products or making a customer happy, expect to see a full review of this transaction on the BOI so other people will see who not to do business with. There are plenty of cage manufacturers out there that will provide a quality product. You are not one of them.

It seems obvious from his email that he does not care about qulaity or his customers.
He listed the cage for $125 and $45 for shipping and $5 for insurance.
I paid him the $175 total. HE set the price. NOT me. Saying a got a cage for less than Vision charges is irrelevant. I bought a cage for Josh Sharp. Not Vision Products.

I doubt I will ever see any satisfactory resolution to this but if I can help one person save their money by not buying a cage from him, this posting will be worth it.

Maybe he will do the right thing and offer to make this right. He offered that once before to me but I doubt it was sincere.

 

[joepythons]

ouch

Steve sorry this stuff has happened to you .I am sure everyone appreciates you bringing this to their attention so others will not be treated this way also .

 

[SPJ]

Got a response. Maybe we can work thru this if we both remain calm. Time will tell. I am willing to be reasonable but only to a point.

Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 10:26:53 -0800 (PST)
From: "Steve Jordanides" <[email protected]> Add to Address Book Add Mobile Alert
Subject: Re: Cage Arrived - Reply ASAP!!!
To: [email protected]
I am going to remain calm and be rational. You could work with me on this instead of using what was and was not in the ad to justify things. I've been around a long time and expect a certain level of service and quality from who I do business with and expect my cutomers to hold me to a high standard as well.
I am more than willing to give you tips that would greatly improve the the cages to help it take off for you. The idea is great and that is why I bought one. The problem is the workmanship.
I can live with the chatter around the screen but the doors need to be ground, the lip cannot have rough edges and the rivets cannot stick thru into the cage.
These are potential hazards to the animals placed in the cage.
Even if you need to raise the cost a little, it would be worth it. People will pay for quality.
I can take off the track and reattach it with screws. I can also grind the glass and the lip. Likewise I can fix the sag on the screen and ground the rivets sticking thru the top of the ceiling. Thos problems can be corrected. If they are done before sending a cage out, you would have rave reviews. Word travels fast. Good and bad.
Do you see why I am upset? When a new cage is ordered, a breakage during shipping is one concern that could be a problem. Having to basically finish a cage when it arrives is not what a customer should expect.
I do not know what to do to resolve this. I will not pay for shipping back to you and then back to me to correct this.
I would take a full refund and have UPS pick it up on you to get it back.
I am also willing to finish it off but a glass company is going to charge me to grind the doors.
The ball is in your court.
I am reasonable.


[email protected] wrote:
I'll tell you what, If my cage project kicks off, I will send you one for no cost. It might take a While but i'll do it. I don't care If you tell everyone that my cages suck. I don't like to leave people hanging like that. You do what you need to do. Thanks.

 

[critical bill]

Another friggin genius in the hobby with the high desire to get rich quick by suckering honest folk.

Get him over here and I'll torture him real slow and painful for ya Steve. I can stretch it out for pages and pages....

 

[Serafim]

Dang Steve something with you and cages just isn't in the cards. Sorry to hear about another bad transaction. How did you hear about Josh? Do you have a link to his ad or site. I would like to see what he actually offers after hearing about what was delivered.

 

[Clay Davenport]

Post the pics Steve, if it's not too much trouble, so we can all see what you're talking about.
In the meantime, cal Rich at Reptile Basics for a cage. I'd guarantee that he'll take care of you in a timely manner.

 

[shrap]

Clay,

He posted the pics as a link in his initial post. You must have missed it.

Here it is: http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v440/SPJ01/cage/

 

[shrap]

Steve,

Sorry to hear this. One thing I learned long ago is that enclosures is one place you dont try to save money. Be it buying from a manufacturer or building your own, spend the extra money on quality products. They last a lifetime if you do.

 

[SPJ]

Gonna have to call Rich.
He has been extremely wonderful to work with when I needed supplies and flex watt wired in specific lengths, etc.
Marc at AP is also great.

Never had a problem but I bet if there ever was one, they would be the first to work to fix it.

I'm still waiting to hear back from Josh about my last email but I'm not getting my hopes up.

Looks like I'll be sanding, grinding, and screwing things together to get this thing to be useable and not have parts that can injure and animal sticking out all over.

I'll post the pics. I wish I could figure out the macro but hey, why change my steller record of taking sucky pictures now.


Here is the screen top.
Sagging and chatter around it. The rivets also stuck into the cage about an 1/8 of an inch leaving several sharp points that an animal could come in contact with.

Here are the doors and the lip. VERY sharp edges on the glass doors and where the handle groove was gorund and the black plastic lip needs to be smoothed out. Again, not only things and animal can get cut on but I gut a "papercut" by running my finger down the edge of the door (I know, not smart but I was checking to see how sharp it was).

Here is the track. The door won't slide all the way over since it is sticking out and crooked. I tried to force it back into place but it will need the rivets taken out and then screwed back in lined up properly.

It's not all that visible in these pics but there are scratches and dings all over the cage itself. Even the tracks are dinged where the rivets went in so that needs to also be smoothed to allow the doors to slide smoothly and without scratching.

All in all, I was not happy with the quality at all.

 

[SPJ]

Steve,

Sorry to hear this. One thing I learned long ago is that enclosures is one place you dont try to save money. Be it buying from a manufacturer or building your own, spend the extra money on quality products. They last a lifetime if you do.

You can say that again. I figured I'd give this guy a chance and the price was really good. I should have known better.

 

[Clay Davenport]

I did miss the link to the pics, but it's handy to have them here anyway.

From the looks of it, you seem to have bought the first cage he's ever made. That's a crap job of workmanship. I can't believe he actually asked money for something that poorly done.
If he actually intends to make a go of the cage building, he's going to have to put some serious practice time in to perfect his building skills. I don't know anyone who would have been happy with that cage.
I've built a lot of cages over the years, but if I'd built that one for myself I'd have trashed it and considered it a practice run and tried to do better on the next one.
Makes you wonder, is that the caliber of cages he uses for his own collection, assuming he keeps snakes. That looks more like something that would be made by someone who has no experience with keeping them, based on the obvious dangers inherent in the design.

 

[critical bill]

I'm not a rocket scientist or anything...but wouldnt it have better to rivet the screen from the inside out? It just seems like common sense.

 

[Gary O]

Steve it does not even look like he did anything but cut the glass. I see little bits of glass all around it.

WTF............

What is it with you and cage people lol. Did you make someone made lol?

 

[SPJ]

Steve it does not even look like he did anything but cut the glass. I see little bits of glass all around it.

WTF............

What is it with you and cage people lol. Did you make someone made lol?

Yeah, there are bits of glass inside the cage on the floor as well. It needs to be seriously cleaned to get rid of the glass slivers.

I don't know about cages. I have great luck with racks but try and buy a cage and well........this is what I get.

 

[liquidleaf]

That's what really pisses me off. "I'm not going to spend another hour deburring"...

My husband is a machinist. We've toyed with the idea of machining PVC cages, but the cost margin is so close, and there are so many other manufacturers already in the market, that it would be tough competition.

But as a machinist - deburring is a MUST before providing a finished product that will be touched by human hands (much less LIVED IN by pets)... That statement shows pure laziness.

I also work with glass as a hobby (stained glass) - and if he took the time to grind those handles in, it would've taken exactly 5 more minutes to grind the sharp edges off the doors and another 3 minutes to rinse off the glass chips.

LAZY.

Same thing in my eyes as someone who made and sold a wooden baby crib and said "I'm not going to spend another hour sanding off the rough splinters".... Please.

 

[BryonsBoas]

My kids built better crap than that when they were 2 out of Lincoln Logs. Everything from the cage to his responses and customer service sucks sooo much ass. You oughta shove him in it and let him find all the sharp edges crawling out of it.

 

[SPJ]

If I cut my finger gently rubbing down the sharp edges, I would hate to see what a snake or lizard would do to their face pushing against it hard to try and get out.

He hasn't respoded yet so if I don't get an answer by tomorrow about how he is going to fix this situation, I wll file a paypal complaint for a refund. He can foot the bill to ship this thing back to him.

The more I look at this cge, the more upset I am getting. It would need a lot of finishing before I would think of putting an animal in it.

I went to pop out the doors and found another problem. They aren't even cut right. They are not cut square.

I need to stop ooking it over. Each time I do,I find something else that is wrong.

This is not the cage you want to send out when you are ust starting out in the business and you really don't want to tell your customers you don't feel like wasting our time finishing off the cages before shipping them out.

This guy is supposedly a mold maker by trade. I would hate to see his other products. I have a feeling that he had no idea how to make a decent cage but saw a chance to make some cash making cages and figured he would try it.

 

[SPJ]

Now he is selling these on Ebay. He hasn't had an ad on KS since I first bought this.
He makes it sound good in the ad and the cage he uses as an example looks decent.
Talk about bait and switch.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Snake-Lizard-Ge...yZ116422QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

[critical bill]

Hey Steve....do you have a link to the original ad?

 

[critical bill]

never mind.....that link is good enough.