kingsnake.com Bad Business practices.

[Wraith]

You are very naive if you believe that. Your average run of the mill tweaker usually is in possession of hundreds when they are arrested. Your more sophisticated criminal has access to thousands or tens of thousands. It's quite easy to get the information.

Just so they could use them to buy a couple of classified accounts on some website and sell a couple hundred dollars worth of nothing before they get caught ? (assuming they could get that far... people do wait for checks to clear, and people do report stolen credit cards). I would think someone who was seriously into that side of thievery would go in a different direction than trying to set themselves up as a fly by night herp seller.

 

[bigman466]

Now that is not true. They have always responded to me within a day or two - NOT WEEKS - unless you are emailing the wrong person. You don't email the site coordinator or ceo or photo gallery person about classified stuff... you email the classified abuse coordinator about classified stuff.

And as to it all boiling down to making more money.. please explain that to me. One does NOT have to pay to become a registered business on the site. There is no money involved. And don't say it's all the money coming from those few people with multiple businesses having to buy extra accounts for each business, that's BS.. that particular policy has been in effect for some number of years.

Well thats good that you never had any problems with KS.Iam happy for you. It wasn't the same for me.An I know for sure I emailed te right people.As for as the money part every business owner is out to make money, if not why have a business.

 

[homegrownherps]

Well thats good that you never had any problems with KS.Iam happy for you. It wasn't the same for me.An I know for sure I emailed te right people.As for as the money part every business owner is out to make money, if not why have a business.

I can tell you one thing...if you email them, and have the slightest attitude , they aren't going to waste their time getting back to you.

 

[mrbommarito]

Homegrown – Thank you for reinforcing what I stated earlier.

No one is owed any special treatment but those companies that stay professional even through the worst discrepancies are the ones that people respect the most.

Most of us have had disagreements with companies whether it is in regards to opinion, money or services. Some arguments you will walk away from thinking nothing was accomplished and some arguments, regardless of you are a jerk or not, because of professionalism and customer service skills, you will leave that argument satisfied.

This is the norm for companies now, practice good interpersonal relationship skills and you will always be able to manage different personalities at your business to keep and provide a positive experience for all.

Kingsnake will never be this!

That is why the possibility is there for someone to build a site that can rival theirs. I mean, can someone honestly tell me it can’t be done? I’m sure the path is not easy but neither is breeding reptiles. Building a site that would rival Kingsnake would also have GREAT financial rewards and can you imagine how many connections you would build?

 

[homegrownherps]

Homegrown – Thank you for reinforcing what I stated earlier.

No one is owed any special treatment but those companies that stay professional even through the worst discrepancies are the ones that people respect the most.

Most of us have had disagreements with companies whether it is in regards to opinion, money or services. Some arguments you will walk away from thinking nothing was accomplished and some arguments, regardless of you are a jerk or not, because of professionalism and customer service skills, you will leave that argument satisfied.

This is the norm for companies now, practice good interpersonal relationship skills and you will always be able to manage different personalities at your business to keep and provide a positive experience for all.

Kingsnake will never be this!

That is why the possibility is there for someone to build a site that can rival theirs. I mean, can someone honestly tell me it can’t be done? I’m sure the path is not easy but neither is breeding reptiles. Building a site that would rival Kingsnake would also have GREAT financial rewards and can you imagine how many connections you would build?

I think you mis understood my statement.

If you email them with a problem, and deal with in a professional manner you will get a response from them. But if in dealing with your problem you come across with an attitude, you will most likely not hear from them.

And they ( just like anyone else ) shouldn't have to deal with anyone having an attitude. Hell...were supposed to be "professional" right ?

They run their sight they way they see fit , either you like it or you don't.
If there are people out there that can do better, nothing is stopping them from starting their own site.

 

[WebSlave]

That is why the possibility is there for someone to build a site that can rival theirs. I mean, can someone honestly tell me it can’t be done? I’m sure the path is not easy but neither is breeding reptiles. Building a site that would rival Kingsnake would also have GREAT financial rewards and can you imagine how many connections you would build?

I believe that the evidence answering your question is literally all around you.

 

[Wraith]

Most of us have had disagreements with companies whether it is in regards to opinion, money or services. Some arguments you will walk away from thinking nothing was accomplished and some arguments, regardless of you are a jerk or not, because of professionalism and customer service skills, you will leave that argument satisfied.

http://market.kingsnake.com/tos.php#10

Please keep in mind that by registering and using our sites and services, you are agreeing that you have read, and will abide by, our Terms of Service. PetHobbyist.com reserves the right the right to edit, move, or remove any advertisements posted to our classifieds at our discretion.

Being Abusive/Belligerent/Argumentative to Staff - All of the services we provide, whether in classifieds or forums, we provide as a service, and grant you the privilege to use them. If you violate that privilege, either knowingly or unknowingly, we may contact you and ask you to stop. If you persist or become abusive, belligerent, or argumentative with an employee, we have the right and the ability to revoke your classified account and other site privileges and cancel your services.

Our employees are doing their jobs and being abused is not part of the job. No customer or business pays us enough money to be abused, and we have no time to deal with abusive individuals or companies. There are now a number of people who have lost their access by being abusive. If you receive a warning about an ad or a message board post, or find your ads or posts missing, think twice before you hit the send key.

 

[mrbommarito]

While the site here is great, and you will find smaller names as myself and medium size breeders and dealers but I have yet to see many of the top names in the reptile business visit this site. I also believe that more people move their animals through Kingsnake then they do here.

Don't get me wrong, I like it here mainly because people are free to express their opinion without having retributions but there can always be improvements made.

Like I stated before "no one is owed special treatment". I know that Kingsnake does not have to go out of the way to satisfy anyone. I was not saying that they should be forced to. Everyone has the right to give as much of them as they want. Just like the guy that goes to work and only does what is required and believes that he/she should get promoted because they have been there a long time and then comes in a new guy with great communication skills and gets promoted fairly quickly. People who refuse to give much of themselves are usually the ones that do not get promoted to management, after all how are they going to effectively going to communicate with so many different personalities?

If business logic has showed us anything is that companies ran by persons with great communication and understanding are the ones that fare the best.

Since Kingsnake wants to conduct business in their fashion, which they are entitled to, then they will go as far as people will allow them. Right now they are the main because they were one of the first in a hobby so recent. However, with the hobby growing and with so many entrepreneurs looking in our direction it is a matter of time before someone realizes, hey I can do what they do plus give a little more.

My point is not to tell people not to visit Kingsnake, everyone has different standards. However coming from a management background, I don’t agree with. I don’t agree with the “this is the way it is and if you don’t like it then **** off” approach. Maybe they will learn to open a Dale Carnegie or Stephen Covey book and learn to conduct business at its best.

 

[mrbommarito]

Since people were getting technical on the Kingsnake TOS, I just found out that my account was suspended. Can someone please tell me how posting an opinion in a forum on another site violates the TOS?

Those guys are a joke! I lost even more respect for them now. I hope someone builds a site that takes money out of their pockets so that they realize they can't bully people around.

 

[bcherps]

I totally understand KS TOS(which they don't always follow), and I will have to agree that abuse should not be part of thier mod's job. However, I feel that asking them to explain thier actions, and stand up for thier threats to the customer is not abuse.

KS just feels that all questions about them, thier TOS, or thier major backers is abuse, and then they ban you to silence you.


Thanks
ben

 

[JETZEN]

why bother with the

EVIL"ks.com"EMPIRE? their classifieds are not better than anyone else's.
I spent hours and hours looking thru their ads and have seen the same ads with the same animals over and over again.
I've made lots of purchases thru their ads in the past and all of them worked out fine.
But since i'm constantly finding out bad things about the EVIL"ks.com"EMPIRE from now on when someone asks me where to find reptiles for sale i'm gonna tell them to try anywhere except the EVIL"ks.com"EMPIRE.
And i'm also gonna tell them don't do biz with the EVIL"ks.com"EMPIRE sponsers.
Beats me why so many breeder/dealers feel so dependent on the EVIL"ks.com" EMPIRE maybe they're just too lazy to try something new.

J.Sommerfield
ex evil empire member

 

[Double "D" Reptiles]

Seems to me yet another case of overzealous "big brother" types in this business who also think that the US entered into armed conflict in Iraq because Saddam Hussein was responsible for 9/11. It would seem much easier to work from disclaimers as a portal for providing sellers a forum than to worry so much about collecting all of this information about people and/or businesses.

This whole thing seems to have been "Clintoned in the Bewbies!" Guess that's why I've not gotten a kingsnake account yet. Also explains yet another reason why the wife and partner refuses to ever again live in the state of Texas. Must be nice to be making enough money from your hobby businesses that everyone can afford to jump through hoops everytime "the big boss man" wags his fingers. Someone rips you off, go after them, not the site where you saw the ad. Guess that's another argument for having too danged many sue-happy lawyers and not enough for them to do otherwise.

<shakes head and goes off to bed with a migraine starting from reading all of the stupidity of others trying to enforce their state's laws on residents of other states with different laws.>

 

[Dennis Hultman]

If you email them with a problem, and deal with in a professional manner you will get a response from them. But if in dealing with your problem you come across with an attitude, you will most likely not hear from them.

I have to agree based on my own experience. A couple of years ago I went after a scammer that was banned from this site but was participating in the forums on KS. I disregarded the rules and posted information in the forums that was sure to have some repercussions. I knowingly violated their TOS and was immediately banned/suspended.

I didn’t send them a whine-o-gram. Instead, I responded in a professional manner and was treated in the same. The suspension was removed. I don’t have to agree with every rule on all the different sites that I’m a member but I do try to respect them. If I don’t, I fully expect to have some consequences. I deserved to be suspended based on the TOS violation, no matter if the rule I breached was believed to be fair or not.
It's not my site to make the determination.

As for the current changes, I can’t see how it could be a detriment to the site or the community at large. I can only see a benefit.

 

[Dennis Hultman]

While the site here is great, and you will find smaller names as myself and medium size breeders and dealers but I have yet to see many of the top names in the reptile business visit this site. I also believe that more people move their animals through Kingsnake then they do here.

Honestly, I have to say, So What? Even though there are active and semi active members that are "top names" in their species here,
many more do have accounts here and I see them reading threads off and on.

It's not like many of the big names spend a lot of time on any forums. Those that have their own forums have their hands pretty full and I don't expect them to be on forums answering basic husbandry questions.

Heck, I'll spend my funds with any of the small or medium size breeders on this site that have earned my respect any day over dealing with anyone else.

Don't get me wrong, I like it here mainly because people are free to express their opinion without having retributions but there can always be improvements made.

This to may have some relevance to your first paragraph.

 

[Dennis Hultman]

Dang! I hit summit before I was ready.

This too may have some relevance. In my personal opinion, I could see how many might not be willing to participate somewhere that at anytime, their business could be openly criticized.

I fully expect that a lot of the members that are small or medium size breeders here today, will be the big names of tomorrow. There are many here that have earned that respect from me anyway.

 

[Mangshan]

Hello Everyone,
I recently faxed my business license information to Kingsnake.com and my account was back up in a very timely manner. It was a quick and painless process.
A DBA IS a type of Business License....basically, Kingsnake's new policy allows customers to know that they are dealing with a legitimate person/Business.
If the customer is ripped off by a business, they should have some "recourse".
When dealing with an unknown or possibly fictitious person...if you get ripped off, you will not have much "recourse"...but instead... you may me left with "intercourse"
(That old "screwed" feeling)....lol....actually, not so funny.

I am glad that Kingsnake implemented this new system. Hopefully it will help people to decide more carefully who they are planning to do business with...Now you will have names of people to do your background check on the BOI...prior to spending your hard earned money. And you will know who is REALLY licensed and in business....rather than just involved in an obsessive hobby! LOL.

One complaint is that they deleted all of my advertisements prior to allowing me to fax my information to them. So I had to rewrite all the adds.
Perhaps this is not a big gripe....
But as a paying customer of theirs...perhaps they could have merely removed my posted ads from public view...instead of deleting everything in my account.
Then when my account was verified, I could have simply reposted the ads.

Kingsnake has been good to me and my business for the most part.

However, I do have some small complaints.
I do not agree with the policy that ALL prices of animals MUST be posted in the advertisement.
In my OPINION this can lead to market crashing. And immature devaluation of otherwise sought-after and valuable animals.
That is not good for anyone's business...including Kingsnake.com

Perhaps my biggest complaint about Kingsnake.com is that people are often afraid to state their gripes in a civil manner...for fear that their account might deleted and they could be banned from advertising on Kingsnake.com.
There should not be any fear of overzealous mods. Instead there should be open communication. This would allow Kingsnake.com....(and any other online business) to improve the quality of the service they are able to provide to their customers.
These are ONLY my OPINIONS. And I do not work for Kingsnake...
So I will play by Jeff's rules. The rules are no so difficult to follow.
Just play nice. If you have a suggestion....state it in a civilized manner.
Perhaps, with time, constructive criticism will be accepted and ideas will be shared with out the fear of loosing your "account holder" status.
I am sure that if you walk into ANY business and behave in a rude or abrasive manner, that business would have the right to refuse service.
Open communication means that BOTH sides must be open...to new ideas, criticisms, and complaints.....Just play nice...and everything seems to work.
Although I may not agree with every rule that Kingsnake implements...I still try to follow Jeff's rules....after all, it is HIS site.
If you want to advertise on Kingsnake....or anywhere else for that matter....just follow the rules.
Seems fairly easy to me.

Harlin Wall - WALL TO WALL REPTILES!
970-245-7611
(State Licensed and Dept of Agriculture Inspected Business since 1996.....
..... That's one year prior to the birth of Kingsnake!
.... and it was an obsessive hobby for many years prior to 1996!!!)

 

[JETZEN]

However, I do have some small complaints.
I do not agree with the policy that ALL prices of animals MUST be posted in the advertisement.
In my OPINION this can lead to market crashing. And immature devaluation of otherwise sought-after and valuable animals.
That is not good for anyone's business...including Kingsnake.com

Perhaps my biggest complaint about Kingsnake.com is that people are often afraid to state their gripes in a civil manner...for fear that their account might deleted and they could be banned from advertising on Kingsnake.com.


Harlin Wall - WALL TO WALL REPTILES!
970-245-7611
(State Licensed and Dept of Agriculture Inspected Business since 1996.....
..... That's one year prior to the birth of Kingsnake!
.... and it was an obsessive hobby for many years prior to 1996!!!)

Becareful they'll suspend you again and you'll have to kiss up to get re-instated.

J.Sommerfield

 

[Mangshan]

J. Sommerfield,

I have not ever been re-instated....
Because I have NEVER had my account revoked.
Although I may state an OPINION....I do my best to state it in a civil manner.
Being tactful is a skill that you might want to practice.

An apology, is not kissing up.....it is admitting when you are wrong, with true empathy for the other party's view....and then making sure that you do not again commit the same offensive behavior.

If having an account with Kingsnake is important to you....(important enough to come to the Board Of Inquiry) then perhaps you might want to re-consider the apology approach.
After all, I was only giving a suggestion that I thought might help you to get you account holder status re-instated.

I noticed that you only used a small portion of my post as a quote.
I am sure that the "powers-that-be" are wise enough to read my entire reply before casting any judgement. It is fairly obvious that I am sticking up for their new policy... that I am not condoning your behavior... as well it is fairly obvious that I am NOT kissing anyone's backside.
I have my opinions, but I share them in a civil manner.
I may not agree with all of the rules...but I will still follow ALL of THEIR rules.
That is the whole purpose of having TOS (Terms Of Service).
Although you might be posting here, in on a completely different forum....keep in mind that it is a PUBLIC forum. EVERYONE, who wants to listen, can hear you.

I mean.... you would not go to lunch with your boss and (while outside of the workplace)
say rude things aloud, about your boss, while in his presence....Would you?
Well...not if you valued the job.
Likewise, If you value your advertising with Kingsnake....an apology would certainly get you further than continuing to rant about YOUR mistake here.

Just my two cents...
Good luck. And I hope that you are able to get re-instated...if that is what you desire.

Harlin Wall - WALL TO WALL REPTILES!
970-245-7611

 

[JETZEN]

Hello Everyone,
I recently faxed my business license information to Kingsnake.com and my account was back up in a very timely manner.

Harlin,

what does all this mean??? "and my account was back up".If your account was not suspended,revoked or temporaily terminated? please excuse me for missing something.

And no, i have no interest in ks.com other than to snoop for cheap entertainment and to find out more bad things about it.

John Sommerfield
collector of common kingsnakes

 

[Mangshan]

Hello John,
Good question.
The short answer...
Kingsnake removed all advertisements from public view from ALL account holders who were advertising using a business name....and had not yet been verified.
I tried to use their on-line verification system ( a State by State System that is not maintained by Kingsnake)...but my Business Account Information did not show up on this system...a problem that seems to be quite common.
However, since I do own a State Licensed Business...I was able to fax a copy of both the current State Business License (Tax License) and a copy of the current PACFA license.
(PACFA stands for PET ANIMAL CARE FACILITIES ACT.
PAFCA inspects all animal keepers in my State, to insure that proper care is given to each species.
I had my annual PACFA inspection yesterday... and passed with excellent marks, as usual.)

On the same day that the paper license work was faxed to Kingsnake.com, they replied to me by email, to inform me that my Business Name Account Status had been verified, and I could continue posting using my business name.
My actual account was never revoked....as I could have continued posting using my own personal legal name.
Kingsnake just needed verification that I was indeed opperating a REAL BUSINESS.
The advertisements in my account, were however, all deleted....rather than just being hidden from public view....until I had a chance to fax the licenses.
This forced me to rewrite each advertisement....not a big deal really.

If you are wanting to advertise using a business name....it is simple and inexpensive to get a business name registered...and to file for an actual State Business License.
Then provide the info to Kingsnake....and thats it. Simple.
If you would rather not be an actual business owner...you can still advertise as a hobbyist, using your legal name...seems fair enough to me...

Payments accepted by Kingsnake for all advertising accounts are verified to make certain that the person who purchases the account actually exists...and is not a fictitious person...or stolen identity.
They are merely trying to protect anyone who makes purchases, using their site.
Hope that helped.
Take care,
Harlin Wall - WALL TO WALL REPTILES!
970-245-7611