Make The Hammack Fund permanent.

[Dennis Hultman]

Didn't really want to continue this thread, but I didn't want to ignore this either by not replying.

The auction forum will be removed as soon as all active auctions have ended. Perhaps they have already, I haven't checked. Anyone having need to copy the details of an auction in that section are advised to do so real soon. een, since I didn't have to mess with it very often.

Rich,
I would like to suggest that you leave The Hammack Fund open. If there is not a need for the Fauna Fund anymore my suggestion and it’s just a suggestion, rename the forum and leave it as a permanent place to help members in time of need. I am sure many members here would gladly help take care of such a forum.

 

[Chris@TSE]

Something like a Charitable Auctions section and auctions may be listed according to "cause"

Or such a section could just be created when the need arises rather than have it sit idle.....

Good suggestion Dennis.

 

[dragonflyreptiles]

I think it should go back to the fauna fund and when the time arises it can be changed again for arising needs.

I don't see why the fauna fund should go away just because some areas are now "pay per view/post"

I'm sure the past and current expenses of running such a site are still hitting the wallet of the webslave. People can choose if they want to donate to whatever cause is up, if it be fauna, a family in need etc.

 

[Chris@TSE]

I'd have to disagree. The fauna fund was started in the hopes of preventing Rich from having to turn parts of fauna into a pay-for-use type of site. Shortly thereafter despite our efforts it ultimately went that route. Many people were upset by this. I knew it would probably have to be done, I can only imagine the out of pocket expenses Rich encountered before.... But you cannot have it both ways. Those who contributed to the fund before said changes were rather upset knowing not only did they donate, but on top of it they had to pay to access the parts of the board they used to frequent. I have to admit, the more and more I think of it the more it angers me. Had I known that I would have been required to pay for such a membership after raising money for fauna I do not think I would have made the same choices I did. After speaking with quite a few people who put auctions up during this time period it seems many share the same sentiments..... It angered quite a few people and became quite the controvertial subject. I honestly didnt let it bother me too much, friends are here and that's what counts. What bugged me really was raising some cash to help fauna was one thing, but then having those very same people pay for a membership shortly thereafter seemed like a slap in the face. Why it has continued for so long afterwards is beyond me....

What's done is done though.... It's not like he's going to refund those who contributed and had to pay for memberships afterwards anyways lol

If its going to be a pay site, cool. It's a pay site. I really don't think it should be both ways....... But since I'm here to disagree I am certain Rich will take the opposite stance and reopen it after he chose to close it. lol

my .02

 

[leaftail]

I feel the same way as Chris does about the Fauna Fund, and for the same reasons. I was happy to donate when it was a free site, and now that it is a pay site, i will pay my membership but i am done donating.

But, I see no reason why the Fauna Fund should not continue for any of those members who feel differently. (Agree to Disagree, Agree to Disagree)

 

[dragonflyreptiles]

Good points Chris and I actually knew you would make them.

To me a donation is from the heart and is voluntary, so I don't see why the Fanua Fund can't remain as the fuana fund unless another situation arises that it would need to be directed to help someone in need. No one is obligated in any way to donate anything to anyone ever.

I know that you and many others donated to help offset cost before it became a pay site but the site is still free.

Paid membership is $10 a year for selected areas, members choose what level they want in extras but the "pay to view/post" in those few areas is $10, nothing of any volume really. And the site is still FREE unless you want access to those few restricted areas that are paid for.

To me the "pay per" was put it effect to defer multiple registrations from single parties, trying to make up so and so ID's to give themselves and others fake "good or bad goy" post and fake feedback.

 

[WebSlave]

Well I addressed this in another thread, but some people chose to continue harping on it, I guess.

The auctions didn't even bring in a fraction of what is needed on a continual basis to even just pay for the servers. MAYBE all of the auctions combined would have paid for one month's lease on those servers. Maybe. Plus it was nothing that was even remotely something I could count on month after month, much less use as any way of predicting what the future would be able to provide.

Actually, Chris, I guess your memory of why Lucille offered to do that (or perhaps you can determine her thought processes too) is better then mine. What I see in that opening thread when she started promoting that Fauna Fund says this:

The Fauna Fund is a gathering of good people who want to help Fauna by donating an item or service to be auctioned for the benefit of Fauna. The funds generated by these auctions help defray the high cost of new equipment as well as daily operating expenses, so that Webslave can continue to provide this very high quality site and the BOI for the benefit of ALL of us.

I don't see a thing, nor do I remember claiming, that the auctions will be able to carry the load for this site. Perhaps you have some info I have overlooked, however. It says "help defray the high cost", not "completely pay the high cost", not doesn't it? Please show me the figures you have determined that were high enough so that you think I should have been able to use that income as the sole source of funding for this site. I believe all of the auctions are still up there, but I'm not sure if Lucille deleted the old ones or not.

Secondly, the auctions WERE still helping to defray the costs with every donation that came in. Plus I specifically placed the auctions off of the BOI which is the highest traffic area on this site so participants would get some prime time exposure as advertising in exchange for their taking part in the auctions. But that was worthless, I guess, to most people and not worthy of consideration. And I made no secret at all that I was just done with doing all the work I do with this site for free, and was making certain aspects of it as paid benefits in order to not only pay for the time, efforts, and expenses I expect to put into it, but hopefully try to recover all of the money I have spend over the years with it. I think I was pretty explicit that this was a do or die time for this site. I believe that is all on record, and you are entirely welcome to research those threads during that time period.

If anyone is pissed off that they did help with the expenses with this site, then I guess you feel that you haven't gotten your money's worth out of it. If you still don't feel that you are getting your money's worth here, then I don't know what else to offer you. It IS optional, you know. Certainly you won't die if you do not participate in this site.

Anything else you don't like about me and this site, Chris?

 

[Dennis Hultman]

My question was only asked based on the statement that the Fauna Fund was already closing.
If it is, I was just thinking we that it would be a nice thing to do.

 

[Dennis Hultman]

My question was only asked based on the statement that the Fauna Fund was already closing.
If it is, I was just thinking that it would be a nice thing to do.

 

[Chris@TSE]

Sigh...............

Do you ever get tired of hearing the sound of your own voice?
(Or reading your own words)

Someone states an opinion that differs from yours and let me guess? They are telling you how to run your site? Public enemy number one?! Get over yourself Rich.....

Someone differs in opinion. Whoopdie do.

I said it how it is, don't like it?! Tough, your novel changes nothing. You cannot argue a group of peoples feelings or thoughts on a matter. Are you going to go up to each and every person who feels this way and tell them they are wrong? Think thats going to work? Don't kid yourself.

I do not know what your problem is lately but you need to get over it. That nerve acting up again?! Did you miss the whole "Agree to Disagree" part or just choose to ignore it?! Yeah, thats what I thought.

Keep it open, close it, its your site. I'm not telling you what to do. I'm conveying an opinion. Deal with it.

It boild down to this:
I disagree with you. Other do as well. You cannot change that. It's not the end of the world. But hey, others agree with you I'm sure. Sleep better.

Agree to Disagree.

 

[dragonflyreptiles]

Dennis, you have very good intentions and ideas!

 

[WebSlave]

Sigh...............

Do you ever get tired of hearing the sound of your own voice?
(Or reading your own words)

Someone states an opinion that differs from yours and let me guess? They are telling you how to run your site? Public enemy number one?! Get over yourself Rich.....

Someone differs in opinion. Whoopdie do.

I said it how it is, don't like it?! Tough, your novel changes nothing. You cannot argue a group of peoples feelings or thoughts on a matter. Are you going to go up to each and every person who feels this way and tell them they are wrong? Think thats going to work? Don't kid yourself.

I do not know what your problem is lately but you need to get over it. That nerve acting up again?! Did you miss the whole "Agree to Disagree" part or just choose to ignore it?! Yeah, thats what I thought.

Keep it open, close it, its your site. I'm not telling you what to do. I'm conveying an opinion. Deal with it.

It boild down to this:
I disagree with you. Other do as well. You cannot change that. It's not the end of the world. But hey, others agree with you I'm sure. Sleep better.

Agree to Disagree.

No, but I am definitely tired of hearing yours. You apparently have a chip on your shoulder about both me and this site, as well as some of the staff here. Your actions, in my opinion, have been apparently aimed at being nothing less then antagonistic and caustic with the intent to try to damage this site. I have been as patient and accommodating to this sort of behavior long enough (certainly WAY longer then most people would have been with your crap) and that is NOW at an end. I believe that somehow you have gotten the impression that I need to put up with you on my own site. I'm not sure how you got that impression, but you are about to find out exactly how wrong you are about it.

Actually there was a whole bunch more stuff that I had written saying there's now a line in the sand about how you badger me or my staff, yada, yada, yada, but you know what? You're history here. I suppose you will log in as a visitor and read this when you see you can no longer access this site through your regular log in. But point blank, I've had enough of your crap. I don't know what your problem is, but it is now no longer my problem. Go be a problem somewhere else where maybe it will be appreciated and welcomed. Life is just too damned short for me to have to put up with the likes of you.

Oh yeah, send me a copy of your PayPal statement for your endowment membership and I will gladly refund the prorated amount of your remaining time.

 

[leaftail]

geez rich, overreact much? i disagree with you sometimes too. am i banned? just wanna know where i stand.

 

[WebSlave]

geez rich, overreact much? i disagree with you sometimes too. am i banned? just wanna know where i stand.

You can't be serious? How much abuse from that guy do you think I am supposed to put up with? I had enough, plain and simple. Yeah, I know, not everyone is going to agree with this, but I'm used to that by now.

 

[DAND]

You can poke the bear only so many times before you get bitten.

 

[Jim O]

Rich,

I know that you are not about to reverse this decision and I wouldn't ask you to do that. Frankly, I doubt that Chris would come back anyway. But you should look at where this started and how it ended, and the ramifications of your decision.

Seems to me that Chris and you started to get into it more seriously during the Mack Snow fiasco and the suspensions that were handed out. Ever since then you two have been sniping at each other. You both have had the proverbial bee in your bonnets. Maybe Chris has been looking for this, I don't know. I can't read his mind and being a "martyr" may have been his objective. He certainly was provoking you, but your responses have generally been less than conciliatory.

Consider that Chris was an Endowment level member, an advertiser, had one of the highest rep point totals, and one of the highest feedback totals. It seems that judging by those last two items he was well thought of, and by the first two that he put his money where his mouth is to support your site.

Maybe a greater effort should have been made to ignore his needling, or perhaps to extend an olive branch yourself. His loss is a loss to the greater Fauna community in my not so humble opinion.

 

[WebSlave]

Rich,

I know that you are not about to reverse this decision and I wouldn't ask you to do that. Frankly, I doubt that Chris would come back anyway. But you should look at where this started and how it ended, and the ramifications of your decision.

Seems to me that Chris and you started to get into it more seriously during the Mack Snow fiasco and the suspensions that were handed out. Ever since then you two have been sniping at each other. You both have had the proverbial bee in your bonnets. Maybe Chris has been looking for this, I don't know. I can't read his mind and being a "martyr" may have been his objective. He certainly was provoking you, but your responses have generally been less than conciliatory.

Consider that Chris was an Endowment level member, an advertiser, had one of the highest rep point totals, and one of the highest feedback totals. It seems that judging by those last two items he was well thought of, and by the first two that he put his money where his mouth is to support your site.

Maybe a greater effort should have been made to ignore his needling, or perhaps to extend an olive branch yourself. His loss is a loss to the greater Fauna community in my not so humble opinion.

I understand what you are saying, however that is a two edged sword. By allowing the harassment I was getting from Chris to continue unabated, it is entirely possible the impression could have formed in some people's minds that if you spend enough money on this site, you can get away with just about anything. Quite frankly, I don't care how much money someone spends or how much time they spend on this site. I guess that is another benefit of the paid memberships that I had not considered. No advertiser is going to be able to get into a position where they are protected by the money they spend here. Advertisers will NEVER own this site because of the money they spend.

Yeah, I know sometimes people are just going to get carried away with themselves and my stepping in for any reason exposes me as a target for their hostility. Sometimes I will ignore the crap, other times I will make light of it, and still others I will return fire with fire. But I will only put up with it up to a point. You see, I really don't have to put up with it at all, but I do try to be fair about it. Someone could be just having a bad day and is taking it out on me. But when it becomes apparent that there will be NO end of it unless I put an end on it, well what would you do in my shoes?

I do not ask for, much less expect, respect from anybody. But I certainly am not going to put up with for long, obvious hostility and blatant disrespect from anyone on this site. Enough is enough. And I had had enough of Chris.

 

[leaftail]

You can poke the bear only so many times before you get bitten.

yeah but this bear was wearin a sign sayin "its ok to disagree with the bear, he won't bite you for that".

 

[DAND]

But...

yeah but this bear was wearin a sign sayin "its ok to disagree with the bear, he won't bite you for that".

Disagreeing is one thing. Disrespecting is something completely different. The few quotes below are not what I would call disagreeing but disrespectful and antagonistic.

I'll be sure to ask you when I want one of those snappy comebacks that sidestep a logical answer.

Any particular reason you're still fishing for something?! Perhaps I could offer you some new bait.... Something more interesting perhaps?! I doubt you'd show as much interest in mine as you have this however....

Next time, try using your head.

Do you ever get tired of hearing the sound of your own voice? (Or reading your own words)

 

[jglass38]

Wow, a bit harsh for sure. Chris is a good guy with a great reputation in the industry. Instead of you two taking it private and working it out, you chose to flex your muscle and make an example of him. In MY opinion, banning him is a big loss to YOUR site. You have a hair trigger response to people voicing their opinion if it differs from yours. Are we still in America? I realize its YOUR site, but maybe you should put yourself a level above the sniping instead of participating in it and thereby encouraging it. Once again, just MY opinion.