Matthew @ Monster Cages-BAD GUY

[Pavo]

OK I am not taking a side here but as I recently started buying cages, I looked into all this, and decided to go with Vision cages.

Now, on to my thoughts:

As a consumer, I would be greatly alarmed at 6-8 weeks being stretched out so long. Even with the customer changing their mind on shipping, he was contractionally obligated to complete all cages as they had been paid for.

Next, he offered to hold on to everything until the order was completed. He decided to stop working on the cages. Therefore in my experience he can not charge storage.

Now, while the customer did go back and forth on desires after learning of such a increase of 2 times the original quote for shipping. Matt also had a part in the stalling by not completing his contract. Plus if I read it right the customer actually overpaid by about 300 dollars, thus to be used against shipping.

********************************************

If Matt had finished the goods and then started his storage or holding back I could see it, but for now Matt you need to complete your contract, and suck up the difference. And the customer needs to complete the contract by paying the max'ed out quote for shipping by paying the remaining 500 dollars give or take.

Just my 2 cents.

John Ross

 

[crotalusadamanteus]

In the future, something I have always done, is print the TOS on the day of the deal. It's dated, and has the web site printed on the bottom. Anything later addd to the TOS should not affect an already agreed upon transaction. That's just wrong. I wouldn't honor it either. (storage fees)

So is asking for the 3% paypal fee. If you need that 3% that badly, than you add it into the price of the cages. That would be BEFORE the deal is done though.

The emails are full of promises made and not fullfilled. Pictures several times, but always an excuse, and shipping the cages kept getting delayed. You had over $5000 of her money. With all the delays, and excuses, I'd want to see them too before sending MORE money for shipping that you should have ate because of all the delays. It is not you clients fault there was a shortage. Did you try to let her know about this? NO! She had to ask you in order to even find it out.

I think you owe her the cages, or her money back in full. I don't think she should have to pay for shipping at all. The delays were not because of her, but the supply shortage according to you. And the storage fees, that's a frikin joke. I think I'll be going with Jeff for My caging.


Rick

 

[Suncoast Herpetological]

Matt

This one is not cut and dried but it is pretty easy to take an equitable stab at it. There is definitely some contributory blame from the buyer on the delay. However, the majority of that is your doing.

My solution is this. The seller pays shipping up to the original quote of $800. She is credited with any overage that she has paid towards the cages as part of that $800 figure. You eat any difference in the shipping above that amount.

Kelly

Asking for a refund after your personal issues hit was way out of line. You were not in any way entitled to it based on his TOS

Matt

I agree that you should not have to sell cages and come out of pocket for the shipping. However, fair is fair. Shoulder your rather large chunk of the blame and write it off as cost of doing business and a learning experience. You are not coming off good here after those Emails.

 

[GuinnyOne]

Matt

This one is not cut and dried but it is pretty easy to take an equitable stab at it. There is definitely some contributory blame from the buyer on the delay. However, the majority of that is your doing.

My solution is this. The seller pays shipping up to the original quote of $800. She is credited with any overage that she has paid towards the cages as part of that $800 figure. You eat any difference in the shipping above that amount.

.

The new quote was for under $1300 and he himself stated that he gets a 62% discount when he ships.

I didn't really think it mattered after 4 months to ask for a refund, no matter what my personal issues were. I felt like I'd been screwed and he still didn't have the cages done. I'm sure that there is a lot more on his terms page now than there was when I read them over before the order was placed. I know that the "storage fees" are new. There were only a couple paragraphs on his terms page and that included payment methods and the 4-6 week time frame for orders to be filled. I asked for photos and time to expect the cages to be completed a month before I decided to ask for a refund...to no avail.

 

[Suncoast Herpetological]

The new quote was for under $1300 and he himself stated that he gets a 62% discount when he ships.

Kelly

I am reasonably sure that the $1,300 quote is inclusive of his discount.

I you have a $300 credit with him now on the cages, the additional from you would only be $500 to get all of the cages shipped in my scenario. Matt would be responsible for the overage. His initial estimate was not qualified as being time sensitive.

Matt definitely went way over his timeline but you did contribute to that a bit.

If Matt is willing, I think my suggestion is fair.

What is your response Matt?

 

[Suncoast Herpetological]

BTW Matt...the storage fee issue is total crap in this instance.

 

[TripleMoonsExotic]

I can't get over the price of shipping these 2-3 pallets...

I'm getting five 4x2x2 w/ stand shipped on a single pallet for under $200 (from a different cage manufacturer). So with that priceing, even with the 8 footers, that would put it around $600-800.

Maybe a different carrier needs used?

 

[Monster Cages]

When it comes to shipping assembled cages it is like shipping "sailboat fuel", lol. That is exactly how my agent at the logistics company stated it. Shipping using truck freight is not like shipping normal stuff there are alot of things that are figured into it. The class for shipping is also based on how the weight, height, and length play into things as well as fuel surcharge right now is 17% as of yesterday. Shipping broken down cages is alot cheaper by far. Taking into account how the size of this order is will result is 2 eight foot pallets and 1 four foot pallets, not four footers. On order this size the trucking companies have to use truck with liftgate as well as residential charge is very high then if it was smaller or went to loading dock.

Like i stated earlier that i will cover half of the difference of anything above the estimated $800 (example $1300, would result in me covering half of $500 difference which would be $250).

I will have her last 4 cages worked on cage next week once we complete the current order and before any others started. I will then look into the shipping set it all up and then expect that she covers the shipping up to $800 and then split the difference with me on the shipping. If she can't afford the shipping then things need to be figured out.

Thanks
Matthew Martin

 

[Pavo]

OK Matt, lets try this again.......

You took a order and gave estimate shipping, you even receive a (lets just call it) good faith prepayment of 300+ towards the shipping costs.

You also have failed to complete the products in a timely fashion. Not all your fault, but in the business world you made the contract you need to deliver or refund.

So, first my a recommend you complete the contracted items and then worry about the shipping.

See, you have been paid in full for the items, but yet they are not finished. Then if the customer can not pay for shipping on all make arrangements to sell what can not be afforded and deliver the rest. This would be the time for storage fees and re-stocking fees. And all monies made above and beyond that will need to be returned to the customer.

Ok time to go back to my lil corner of the world.

 

[Suncoast Herpetological]

When it comes to shipping assembled cages it is like shipping "sailboat fuel", lol. That is exactly how my agent at the logistics company stated it. Shipping using truck freight is not like shipping normal stuff there are alot of things that are figured into it. The class for shipping is also based on how the weight, height, and length play into things as well as fuel surcharge right now is 17% as of yesterday. Shipping broken down cages is alot cheaper by far. Taking into account how the size of this order is will result is 2 eight foot pallets and 1 four foot pallets, not four footers. On order this size the trucking companies have to use truck with liftgate as well as residential charge is very high then if it was smaller or went to loading dock.

Like i stated earlier that i will cover half of the difference of anything above the estimated $800 (example $1300, would result in me covering half of $500 difference which would be $250).

I will have her last 4 cages worked on cage next week once we complete the current order and before any others started. I will then look into the shipping set it all up and then expect that she covers the shipping up to $800 and then split the difference with me on the shipping. If she can't afford the shipping then things need to be figured out.

Thanks
Matthew Martin

Matt

That is going to be an expensive $250. If that is how far apart you are Matt, simply pay it and be done with this. I agree with the previous poster as well. A proper businessman would not delay completion of cages fully paid for another minute. If these cages are already cut and routed, the assembly and finish work should be pretty quick. Quit bitching about pocket change, take responsibility for your major part in this fiasco and finish and ship this woman's cages as soon as humanly possible. This one is at least 80% your fault

 

[Monster Cages]

[Matt

That is going to be an expensive $250. If that is how far apart you are Matt, simply pay it and be done with this. I agree with the previous poster as well. A proper businessman would not delay completion of cages fully paid for another minute. If these cages are already cut and routed, the assembly and finish work should be pretty quick. Quit bitching about pocket change, take responsibility for your major part in this fiasco and finish and ship this woman's cages as soon as humanly possible. This one is at least 80% your fault]

What are you referring to? There has been NO shipping paid on this order what so ever and she has indicated to me that she can't afford the shipping is the thing.

Matthew Martin

 

[Pavo]

In her emails posted to the site, it appears there is a over payment and that you even stated wait to complete paying for shipping until you had the actuals and the product was finished

 

[Suncoast Herpetological]

What are you referring to? There has been NO shipping paid on this order what so ever and she has indicated to me that she can't afford the shipping is the thing.

Matthew Martin

If she can't afford to pay any shipping than, I agree, that is not your problem. If she can come up with a total of $800 including any overage she paid on the cages then you should eat anything additional...plain and simple.

 

[Pavo]

According to the emails posted from the discussions between the two.

By Dec 15th, 2005 these amounts were agreed to and exchanged:

Total Bill (minus Shipping): $5485.00

Payments in the amounts of: $1000, $500, $2800, $1500...Totaling $5800.00

Now the last time I applied basic math, that ment $315.00 in overpayment/towards shipping. Unless the final payment was for $1185.00 instead of $1500.00?

 

[Monster Cages]

Fed Ex Freight services

Rate quote # ND621 44628334
Date 08/30/06
Shipment terms Prepaid
Origin 55987 WIM WINONA, MN

Destination 95642 STK STOCKTON, CA

Transit days 3 Days

Description Class Lbs. Rate/CWT Charges
No Description 100 2200 126.96 $2,793.12
Less 62.0% discount ($1,731.73)
Sub-total $1,061.39
LIFTGATE DELIVERY - PPD $96.36
RESIDENTIAL DELIVERY CHARGE $68.00
Fuel Surcharge $222.89
Total net charges $1,448.64
Rate Tariff: *FXF 1000 04/24/06 LD 50629


That was just looked up for the shipping. Shipping estimate is just that, part of the delay is on her part also. I have no problem like i said completing the order but was always waiting before for her to pick which sizes she wanted on the 8 footers and never did choose either.

Matthew Martin

 

[Suncoast Herpetological]

No offense Matt but you just don't seem to get it. An estimate is supposed to be a reasonable educated guess at a future figure. You were off by 80% plus. You are grasping at straws trying to lay more than a minimal amount of blame for the delay on Kelly. You have had the use of $6,000 of her money for several months. These cages should have been completed within a reasonable time frame once full payment was received...they weren't. Act like a proper business and eat the overage. Yes, your profit on the cages is less but you will put this behind you and stop getting the crapkicked out of your reputation.

 

[TripleMoonsExotic]

When it comes to shipping assembled cages it is like shipping "sailboat fuel", lol. That is exactly how my agent at the logistics company stated it. Shipping using truck freight is not like shipping normal stuff there are alot of things that are figured into it. The class for shipping is also based on how the weight, height, and length play into things as well as fuel surcharge right now is 17% as of yesterday. Shipping broken down cages is alot cheaper by far.

My stack of cages are going freight & are assembled. So again, maybe you need to choose another shipper.

 

[Browning Herp]

I've tried to stay out of this but...

I need to chime in and let everyone know about my experience with Matt. This whole ordeal sounds all too familiar, and I hope that what I have to say will help future consumers make an informed decision in their search for cages.

In August of 2004, I placed an order with Matt Martin of Monster Cages. His prices seemed very good considering the custom work. He quoted me a timeframe of 6-8 weeks. I explained to him that it was imperative that I get these cages in time to let my female retics settle in for the upcoming breeding season. He assured me that they would arrive within 6-8 weeks, so I paid him up front so that he could buy the needed materials.

*side note*
I had originally come in contact with Matt after responding to an add he had placed on another website, for an 8K adult female purple retic that he was brokering for a gentleman down in Florida. I discovered that he also had two adult female Jampeas that I was very interested in buying. At the time I did not have the cages to house these animals, and so I went ahead and had Matt hold onto the 3 females while he was building the cages for them.

To make a long story short, Matt did not get the cages to me until DECEMBER of 2004!!! About 4 1/2 months after I had originally placed the order with him! When I got the bill for shipping I just about coughed up a lung. It was outrageous. I will dig up the receipts and post the exact amount later. At that point I just wanted the damn cages, and to finally wash my hands of Matt. The craftmanship on the cages was extremely bad... I almost cried when I first saw them. The plastic was warped, the edges were rough and uneven, the corners were sealed with caulk that didn't even adhere to the plastic... I was PISSED OFF

In addition to all of this, Matt wanted to cut corners and drop off over 10K worth of animals at his local municipal airport rather than drive the extra hour to Minneapolis. Mind you, this was WINTERTIME in MINNESOTA! When I let him know I had a problem with that, he raised his voice at me and basically threw a fit. I waited 4 1/2 months for my cages that I paid him up front for, spent a large chunk of change on retics that he was making a profit on, and that is how he reacted when I asked him to drop the cargo off directly with Delta!

Since everything arrived as late as it did, I lost out on an entire year's potential production with these three females. It was 2004/05 and I was going to pair them up with an albino tiger. Do the math. Fortunately I produced out of the purple female this year, but I figure I lost a lot of money on account of Matt.

Did I mention the snakes came with mites?

Cory Browning

 

[Browning Herp]

re:

I also wanted to mention that a neighbor of mine worked professionally with polyprohelene plastics for many years. When I showed him the cages all he could do was shake his head. Apparently, Matt doesn't know what he is doing because my neighbor said that it's wrong to work with the plastic as though it were wood... which is how Matt handles the material.

Since this whole ordeal, I have switched to Animal Plastics cages, and couldn't be happier.

 

[Browning Herp]

Meant to type polypropylene