Need Help!! Jeffrey Grass has burned me good!

[Arnold8169]

Katrina,

By Jeff's own account he sent those dragons back without ever getting conformation to ship them. You just don't ship animals unless the receiving party has agreed to accept them. PERIOD. You just don't do it.

He said he sent emails for three days with no reply and then said screw it I am shipping them back anyway. That is BS. PERIOD. The rip off guy may have been in a wreck, his mother may have died, anything could have happened..... or he could have been ignoring the emails, like I suspect. Either way it does not matter though. You do not ship helpless animals unless both parties have agreed and arrangements have been made. PERIOD.

I knew he was reading my e-mails. The reason I know this is because before I sent the money he would respond almost immediately every time. I knew he saw what I sent him. I asked him numerous times for a contact number.

Jeff Janes

 

[Arnold8169]

Why? Nobody says what he says is not true.
He is only being questioned about what he did on his end.

He is in business in this hobby and says, "the post office did not tell me it is illegal not to mark my box" Come On.

I was going to cut a little slack here and actual rewrote my first post when I previewed it because I thought it was a little harsh. Now he is accusing people of being in league with the seller. Get a grip.


Let say everything said on his part is true. He still shipped illegal and in the email he posted he said he got the wrong product.


That is how he looks at it. He treated them like a product.

Okay, when you develop a personal relationship with shippers you trust and they ask you every time what weird item are we shipping today and you disclose it to them they have the opportunity to tell me to write it on the box. In my experience by writing "live animals" on the box I have had most of those packages arrive later in the same day, or early second day.

Katrina is right, the U.S.P.S. is favored by many in this area simply because of their great customer service. I watch several shipments arrive with live animals on the box and have seen them drop toss and literaly throw packages on my doorstep. U.S.P.S. has been the only company out of DHL, UPS, and Fed-Ex that actually requires and asks for signature confirmation on a consistant basis.

Jeff Janes

Jeff Janes

 

[shrap]

And I bet that particular scam artist is reading this and will do it again within a month. Heck why not? Between the lines, he has so much support from so many readers.

Dan,

I truly see the points you, Wes and Katrina are making, I really do. And I agree that the buyer did nothing wrong.... other than ship without a shipping agreement in place. That is all that anybody has said.... some more emotionally than others.

But to make a comment that many of us are supporting the seller is BS. If he was to show up in this thread the same people that has questioned the buyer about his one poor choice would be going after the seller with both barrels cocked for the many bad things he did. And you KNOW it.

That comment by you was completely FALSE and nothing more than a cheap shot. Sad....

 

[Arnold8169]

I wouldn't say I have a cold heart. Actually, it would be a warm heart considering the fact I couldn't get those dragons stuffed in a box for 8 days out of my head all night. Cold hearted to the people(seller and buyer) who caused their undo suffereing? Yes. Maybe I shouldn't have name called but I simply wrote down in words what alot of people were thinking. I should try to be more politcally correct I suppose.
Do people who treat animals like a "product" like someone else said, get me upset...Yes.
Do people who put money value before the saftey and well being of any animal get me upset, Yes.
Animals can't speak for themselves. They can't knock on the box and say hey postman, we are thirsty and hungry in here. They can't grab a pen and write on the box, easily, Live Lizard. They can't call on their cell phones to the post office they are being held out and say hey buddy, there are live critters in here and we really want out.
A human can do all this. And neither party involved did.
So that has me "cold hearted" and wanting to crucify those invovled in this. Regardless if this is a scam or not. It is the Dragon's welfare not the $400 that has me very bothered.

I do not emotionally invest in my "critters" for this reason. A hobby or passion becomes a form of business when money is made that's why I reffered to them as a product. I took the business deal route with this guy because I thought it was the professional thing to do. I have a few animals that I am attatched to that I concider loving pets and others that I don't name and don't get emotionally attatched to so that when it's time for them to go it makes it much easier.

Jeff Janes

 

[Dennis Hultman]

Okay, when you develop a personal relationship with shippers you trust and they ask you every time what weird item are we shipping today and you disclose it to them they have the opportunity to tell me to write it on the box. In my experience by writing "live animals" on the box I have had most of those packages arrive later in the same day, or early second day.

Katrina is right, the U.S.P.S. is favored by many in this area simply because of their great customer service. I watch several shipments arrive with live animals on the box and have seen them drop toss and literaly throw packages on my doorstep. U.S.P.S. has been the only company out of DHL, UPS, and Fed-Ex that actually requires and asks for signature confirmation on a consistant basis.

Jeff Janes

Jeff Janes

Ok, Fine and Dandy
But it is illegal like it or not. Now that is the only time I have ever heard a glowing report about the post office.

 

[Dan Scolaro]

Sam:

No cheap shot was intended, no shot at all was intended, perhaps a shot glass and a bottle is what is needed in this situation?

I said "between the lines" indicating that this post has gone 13 pages and the customer is still explaining why he did not put a freking label on the box. And "between the lines", what kind of support is this customer really getting? If not support for him, then "between the lines", its can appear for the other party.

Of couse I know that all agree that the seller is wrong.

 

[shrap]

I knew he was reading my e-mails. The reason I know this is because before I sent the money he would respond almost immediately every time. I knew he saw what I sent him. I asked him numerous times for a contact number.

Jeff Janes

How do you KNOW though if he does not respond to them? You can't.

Jeff, I am truly not bashing you. I just hope you understand that sometimes things do happen that can cause people to not be around and that you should not ship unless you have made arrangements with the receiveing party. For the animals sake. Florida last year is a perfect example. There were a lot of upset people because they was not any promised shipments coming in/going out and no communications. The hurricanes in case you are wondering what I am refering to. Things do happen.

Now in your case I do believe the guy was just ignoring you, but there is no way to be sure. Better safe (for the animals) than sorry. I hope you understand where I am coming from.

 

[Dennis Hultman]

Dan,
But to make a comment that many of us are supporting the seller is BS. If he was to show up in this thread the same people that has questioned the buyer about his one poor choice would be going after the seller with both barrels cocked for the many bad things he did. And you KNOW it.

That comment by you was completely FALSE and nothing more than a cheap shot. Sad....

Agreed, one hundred percent.

Jeff,

I did state earlier that if everything you said is true, You were screwed so do not think anyone is forgetting about the seller here.
NOT At ALL .

 

[Arnold8169]

Sorry, hit the submit button too soon.

To continue-

The buyer did everything right, except recieve acknowledment from the seller that he knew the dragons were coming back

HOWEVER, look at the dates. The seller KNEW the lizards were sitting at the post office THE DAY AFTER THE BUYER SENT THEM. There can be no doubt that anything that happened to them is the FAULT of the seller. HE KNEW they were at the post office and he LEFT THEM THERE.

THE SELLER IS THE ONLY ONE IN THE WRONG HERE.

The buyer could have used a different shipper, he could have waited forever to hear from the seller, he could have avoided all of this if he had gotten a phone number first. All of that is irrelevant.

The seller ROBBED the buyer. The seller KNEW the lizards were sitting at the post office ONE DAY after the buyer shipped them.

Am I the only one that sees this?

I wanted to send them back exactly how they were shipped to me so he didn't say something about the way they were shipped back. I did act somewhat on impulse due to a previous situation that I experienced where I was shipped a male dragon instead of a female in which the sex was guaranteed and his responce was "sorry, you've had the dragon in your possesion for 2 weeks now and I can not count on them being in the same condition". I figured it's one thing to take my money, but would he be so cruel to deny the shippment of one of his own dragons that he bred? Maybe the one with the limp arm had some sort of contageous disease or something. That is the only was I can fathom his actions.

Jeff Janes

 

[shrap]

Sam:

No cheap shot was intended, no shot at all was intended, perhaps a shot glass and a bottle is what is needed in this situation?

I said "between the lines" indicating that this post has gone 13 pages and the customer is still explaining why he did not put a freking label on the box. And "between the lines", what kind of support is this customer really getting? If not support for him, then "between the lines", its can appear for the other party.

Of couse I know that all agree that the seller is wrong.

I see where you are coming from, but you do not see me knit picking Jeff. I had one gripe and believe whole heartedly in my gripe.

As far as support for the customer, I think everyone here has said that Jeff the seller was in the wrong. Yet It is kinda hard to question and completely persecute someone who has not been here to tell their side of the story. I think it always best to save the real artillary until we hear both sides. It is only fair.

With that being said, as the facts are at this point Jeff The Seller is a scam artist and needs to be exposed for what he is.

 

[Arnold8169]

Everyone,

First I just want to say I've dared the seller to come defend himself, even called him a chicken. All the negative feedback I have recieved has at first pissed me off, but now I'm very hurt. This is supposed to be the place to go for help, at least I thought. I've been taken for over $400.00 and I ask for help and I get defamed by being called several names. The focus has not been directed toward helping me, but more toward lets pick apart his side because the sellers not responding because he simply has no case. Lets find flaws in his side of the story,(the honest to God truth) cut him up, and pour salt in his wounds.

Maybe being in the Restaurant business I expect the customer to be treated differently. I run a successful restaurant business that thrives on repeat guests, word of mouth, and consitently good service. If someone complains about something I refuse to accept money for it and do whatever it takes to make things right. I approach complaints as an opportunity to aquire yet another loyal guest, not lets here them bi$ch, slap them in the a## and hope they never return. I empower all of my people with the same philosiphy because statistics show that if you leave an experience positively your likely to tell at least one friend and if you leave feeling like you had an awful experience you tell at least 5 people. In the herp trade you have very few people pleasers and more it's my way or go elsewhere.

When someone says sorry I got the packages mixed up, you don't want an excuse, you don't want an explination you want it to be fixed and as fast as possible. You make it right each and every time because that's just what you do!

If I sell an animal on here I am going to offer a variety of options. If they want to pay half the cost of most shippers to go through the U.S.P.S. then hey, they are the ones taking that risk. I would never tell anyone, no I'm going to ship using U.P.S. because I think they suck. I might strongly urge them to use another shipper and explain my experiences.

I don't know, I just feel like it should be a given that I have accepted the fact that the dragons have been lost before I posted this thread and wanted to re-coop my loss and move on. I got the package, wondered what the h$ll he sent me (I will follow up with pictures to show the nip and chewed tail) and immediately knew what he needed to do and I assumed (yes I know what this means) that he would try to handle this how I would have if I made an honest mistake.

Jeff Janes

 

[Dennis Hultman]

If I sell an animal on here I am going to offer a variety of options. If they want to pay half the cost of most shippers to go through the U.S.P.S. then hey, they are the ones taking that risk. I would never tell anyone, no I'm going to ship using U.P.S. because I think they suck. I might strongly urge them to use another shipper and explain my experiences.

Jeff Janes

No you are taking the risk to. You do not understand the law.

Ok, Let me knick pick something here.
First Let me again say again I am sorry you were scammed but to say you should be aloud to address the situation and not be questioned about your
actions is not fair either.

Just like this quote I am now going to nick pick.

After telling you that it is against the law not to mark the packages you still spit quotes out like this.

To ship an animal in a package not marked and through the post office against the law.

You just said I am going to urge my customers to use USPS knowing it is against the law and to hell with the rest of you. I do not care if I effect this business by my illegal activities.

Now is that what you just said?

 

[shrap]

Jeff, most of the people on here are not trying to give you a hard time and pick you apart. I know I am not. I just hate to see animals suffer needlessly and expressed my opinion that you should not ship without both parties making arrangements. If you want to say I am pouring salt in your woulds by expressing my opinion about that then that is your choice. Although it was not my intent.

We all thank you for exposing this guy. So don't think we don't. And please do not walk away thinking wrong about this place. People here are equal opportunist. ANY wrong they see they are going to say something about it. All wrongs, not just some.

I truly hope you get your money back, Jeff. I wish you the best and I hope you stick around.

 

[Arnold8169]

It is NOT what I just said!

I said that if they want their dragons shipped through the post office I will do so. It is legal to ship through them. I did not say I was or wasn't going to label my packages shipped through them so you are putting words in my mouth.

IF YOU HAVE SUCH A BIG PROBLEM WITH ME NOT LABELING THE PACKAGE FEEL FREE TO TELL ON ME!!

I realize (after I read and understand the exact law in detail) that it's my fault for sending a package not marked, and not to mention again that in my experience it was the safest way to go it has not at all effected the outcome of this situation. We are missing the big picture!

Jeff Janes

 

[Rockford]

good post...

Jeff, most of the people on here are not trying to give you a hard time and pick you apart. I know I am not. I just hate to see animals suffer needlessly and expressed my opinion that you should not ship without both parties making arrangements. If you want to say I am pouring salt in your woulds by expressing my opinion about that then that is your choice. Although it was not my intent.

We all thank you for exposing this guy. So don't think we don't. And please do not walk away thinking wrong about this place. People here are equal opportunist. ANY wrong they see they are going to say something about it. All wrongs, not just some.

I truly hope you get your money back, Jeff. I wish you the best and I hope you stick around.

I agree. You should have done things a bit different but hopefully you have learned a bit. I am still learning everyday. And the BOI is a great place to gather info before "taking the plunge".

I wish you all the luck in getting your money back. I don't want to sound pessimistic but I don't think this scammer is going to cooperate.

Take care-

Bthacker

 

[Wilomn]

jeff grass or grassi is a scumbag. The other jeff is just a guy learning a lesson.

Until we hear from the scumbag, it's time to let this go.

jeff the buyer got lucky, the dice rolled in his favor with jeff the seller acknowledging he knew the dragons were at the post office.

I suspect jeff the buyer learned a valuable lesson.

Time to move on.

 

[Dan Scolaro]

Jeff: Your only mistake ever in this matter was to think you could get a non-basis evaluation of your situation on this forum and you should have ended it after your first post when you said "Need Help!! Jeffrey Grass has burned me good!!"

Need help? OK, go to:

www.pethobbyist.com/support/complaint.html

File complaints to the proper authorities. It will make you feel much better.

Need dragons? My lemon female will breed this spring to a red male, so stand by for a pair of free babies.

Dennis: Although your attention for detail has good intentions behind it, it may inadvertently be contributing to why this guy is pissed off. Send your resume to the IRS. And that is meant to be a complement.

 

[Arnold8169]

Just wanted to drop another line to say I've contacted the webmaster at repti-bid because Jeffrey333 has posted several dragons up for auction and based on a recent negative feedback by a buyer that didn't receive his dragon he is just trying to scam money!

Jeff Janes

 

[ShannanD25]

I just wonder if the Dragons, sorry-PRODUCT, left in the box to die would be so sympathetic to your plight. Now you are hurt? Guess what, now the Dragons are probably dead. I choose to send my sympathy to them.

I would have to disagree about something regarding a buyers choice in shipping. Guess what, it is MY animal they are buying and I am going to ship MY animal to them the safest way. I am not going to offer them a CHEAPER option that may or may not arrive overnight with USPS. If they don't like that my animals welfare comes before their wishes then they can go elsewhere. That is the difference here. At least for me. This is not my full time job. So if someone starts griping about something such as shipping costs and why I won't ship cheaper I will tell them to go elsewhere. I won't kiss their rears to keep them around. I will always be professional with my customer up until they say something or do something that would endanger MY animal.

I hope the seller shows up here. I really do.

Jeff- Do you have any idea what it is like for an animal to starve to death, or dehydrate? Do you have any idea the pain and suffering you have inflicted? No, you defend yourself by saying well I emailed him and told him what I would do. And you never bother to even ONCE pick up the phone and call the post office in his town early on, when there could have been a chance to save them. You ship them off and it is out of your mind becasue they weren't the PRODUCT you ordered.

Please let the seller come on here. I am not being one sided in this. I have alot to say to the seller as well. I think everyone would.

 

[Wilomn]

Do we even know if they are dead yet?

Is there a tracking number or phone number available?

Let's get that fact right before shannon get's the cross fully braced.