Need Help!! Jeffrey Grass has burned me good!

[Suncoast Herpetological]

Fudge is something you eat. Period.

Truth is NOT a lie.

A lie is NOT the truth.

They are MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE. (unless you're a lawyer or politician)

I will NOT cut you slack if you lie or fudge or whatever you want to call it and if I find out about it I'll call you out on it.

Experiance in life in general has led me to believe that someone who will "fudge" about something today, will have an easier time LYING about something tomorrow. Homey don't play dat game.

Couldn't have possibly said it better. If you are to sensitive to tolerate being called a liar.....tell the damn truth!

 

[Dan Scolaro]

Perhaps neither of you understand it, or want to understand it, and want to show on this forum that you do not understand it to back up your previous postings, however that is fine with me and only proves my point from before. However still, I think its best to understand it to be a fair evaluator of a complicated situation.

OK, what else can we do to help this guy who was robbed? Look up more definitions in the dictionary?

 

[Suncoast Herpetological]

Perhaps neither of you understand it, or want to understand it, and want to show on this forum that you do not understand it to back up your previous postings, however that is fine with me and only proves my point from before. However still, I think its best to understand it to be a fair evaluator of a complicated situation.

I think I join pretty much everyone who read the above by saying.......huh?

 

[Dan Scolaro]

The guy just tried to convey that there is no difference between a lie and something that is fudged. That is fine, however I do not agree. And it is OK to not agree. I believe there is a difference, and some people might not understand that. Regardless, that is fine and its also fine to have a conversation and not all people have to agree on everything. However such, if you kill everyone for an insignificant and irrelevant lie or fudge, you are going to get what is on this forum. Minimum or sever lack of participation. And that is why everyone I know will not come here because they will be attacked for what they say, regardless if it is a lie, truth, or even if it was about yesterday's weather. I mean, it seems here that if you make a statement and someone does not totally agree, they automatically attack and make a federal case out of it. Well, in life, almost no one agrees, and how the heck to do progress with an investigation with all this disagreement going on?

I completed dozens of Judge Advocate General (JAG) investigations from deaths to slipping on the floor and in those circumstances, yes, you would consider only the facts and make recommendations on the facts. However on a public forum, your going to scare the hell out of anyone who wants to post something that they think was bad to them if all their words are subject to such scrutiny. I understand that Wes sees things either black or white and I am also the same in my personal matters, however that approach is difficult when considering your helping someone with a problem. Neutral may be better.

 

[turtlepimp]

I need the best practices and advice from anyone who has been in a similar situation. Jeffrey Grass ([email protected]) has burned me for $400.00 and I want to know if I'm out or is there a way to approach this situation that would lead to the refund of my money.



I bought a Cawley Red male bearded dragon from him about 6 months ago off of Rept-Bid and the transaction was successful. I recently inquired about a breedable Chris Allen red female that he had been auctioning on Repti-bid that wasn't selling. His reserve was set at $280.00 plus shipping and I offered him $280.00 shipped. We both agreed on the deal but before I payed him I asked him about any other red females he might have available. He sent me a group picture of hatchlings (4-6 weeks old) that he had and I asked him for his best price on 2 young red females in that picture plus the Chris Allen female and we agreed on $400.00 shipped. I paid him immediately and it took him almost a week to ship out after I made payment and I did not recieve what we talked about. He sent me 2 females that were around the 3 month range that were not of good quality. One of the females he sent had a tail nip, and a limp arm and the other had a chewed tail. They were both lacking in color and did not look red. He admitted that the wrong package was shipped out and that 5 different packages were shipped that day. He said he would get back to me when he found something out. I waited all weekend for him to respond and I e-mailed him several times on Friday, Saturday, and Sunday to let him know that I just wanted my money back. I got something totally different than what I paid for and that I was sending the dragons back to the return address. The package was sent via U.S.P.S. express mail as they were sent to me. He didn't pick up the package and the post office is currently holding it for 5 days and they will send me back 2 dead dragons. Over the course of this transaction he probably typed me 5 e-mails that were very vauge and gave me the impression that he didn't care. His responce e-mails to my legthy inquiries were answered in a one or two sentence responces that left me hanging and upset. He has yet to refund my money including shipping back to him like I asked because he sent the wrong product or sent me the right dragons.

To sum things up with facts:

I made payment via pay-pal of $400.00
He admitted he shipped me the wrong package
I shipped the package back
I have no dragons or money at this time
He has not agreed to refund my money or send the dragons back

What can I do to get my money back? Will filing a claim with pay-pal get results? I believe some of the money came directly from my bank account so should I dispute the charges? Will calling local law inforcement in his zip code (48442) help? Is their anything I can do?

Any help that you can give me will be greatly appreciated!

Jeff Janes
[email protected]
(931) 249-1119

Oh yeah,there was an underlying question.Jeff,there is little you can do except file a complaint with Paypal.Regarless of how you shipped,you still did not recieve the items you paid for.No matter what the PETA packers might say,this was a buisness transaction,clear and simple.You are penniless,as well as dragonless.

Jeff,I would like to thank you for where this thread has gone.Without guys like you,this post might have only gotten the four or five replies that it deserved.Fauna is always entertaining reading,but there must be a loser.And if those that would burn you fail to reply,than you become the wicked.Sorry,it is simple human nature.

 

[BallPyFan]

First, let me back up several pages to Dennis' comment. NO, this isn't a glowing endorsement of the post office LOL It's just that FedEx and UPS have messed up THAT MUCH here. Approporiate posts are on the shipping forum. Two weeks ago UPS sent their district and regional managers to my house to sit in my den and get their butts chewed out for what their braindead driver did. Then, I am quite sure they got their ears chewed off and a few phone lines melted when the seller got hold of them as she said she has had numerous problems with UPS in ***THIS SPECIFIC LOCATION*** Since I only do ball pythons, I have a mission to accplish before I start selling and shipping: Get these two shipping companies into shape or be forced to use Delta for normal ball pythons...hmmm.

Dan, Jeff did receive advice from me on how to get his money back from Paypal. I called him instead of posting on the board because it was just easier (being int he same town). I told him to file a complaint, save each and every email he received from the seller, provide Paypal with the tracking number to prove he sent the animals back (Paypal WILL call them "the product") and if the seller tries to dispute the claim Paypal will generously freeze his account. I also told him to give the seller the heads-up about this post since it was the fair thing to do. In hindsight I probably should have posted all this just in case I missed something or for future reference when others do a search and are also looking for help. I was also military, and learned the value of documentation when I successfully chaptered a problem child soldier who had beaten two previous chapter attempts due to lack of proper documentation. Best advice before getting into a deal and sending money is "Document, document, log, document, record, document." Make sure everything is understood, what warranties and guarantees are in place, what factors may void them, and what recourses are available if problems arise, be it shipping errors, freak weather, acts of nature, or medical emergencies.

And Wes, I have to admit I was rolling when you quipped about YOU being the one to advocate thinking before hitting submit! LOL

 

[Dan Scolaro]

Katrina:

Now that is the answer here.

If someone else analyzed another sentence of mine, I was going to drink a beer, piss my pants, and call it quits. Thank goodness you didn't.

I wonder why that type of valuable information is not already posted somewhere here before threads go 50 pages? Kingsnake.com has all those links to agencies however no real advice for the seller or buyer when a deal goes sour or even worse, when someone is feeling robbed? Maybe they do and I overlooked it there and here?

I hope Jeff gets his money back and gets the dragons back and can raise them up.

 

[brucestephenson]

You missed three commas in the previous post Dan.

 

[riverjop]

Katrina:

Now that is the answer here.

If someone else analyzed another sentence of mine, I was going to drink a beer, piss my pants, and call it quits. Thank goodness you didn't.

I wonder why that type of valuable information is not already posted somewhere here before threads go 50 pages? Kingsnake.com has all those links to agencies however no real advice for the seller or buyer when a deal goes sour or even worse, when someone is feeling robbed? Maybe they do and I overlooked it there and here?

I hope Jeff gets his money back and gets the dragons back and can raise them up.

Dan go should have been goes!

 

[riverjop]

HA!...made ya look!

 

[Wilomn]

Dan go should have been goes!

Actually Overton, he was correct in the way he used go.

I wonder why that type of valuable information is not already posted somewhere here before threads go 50 pages?

Since he was talking about threads, plural, go is just fine.

Had he said thread, singular, instead of threads, then you would be correct.

 

[liquidleaf]

I would not hold my breath waiting for the seller to respond.

Used to be that some scammers and wrongdoers WOULD respond and it certainly helped out the thread and anyone that was looking to see who to trust or not.

However, since you can only post if you pay now, those kind of people will simply not do it, or very, very rarely.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for cleaning up the BOI, I'm all for helping it out financially.

However I think a vital part of what made the BOI a great tool in weeding out the "loosers" has been lost.

The kind like "Jeff Grassi" will just not pay to repond ...They might have responded before, if nothing more then for the heck of it. But pay to do this? Doubt it seriosly..

Thing is - Webslave already made provisions for this. If a person is the subject of a BOI thread, they are given like a month (or longer if the thread runs that long) access to the BOI in order to defend their position, for free. Unless that point changed at some point during the discussion about rules.... but I don't think so. Because obviously that's an issue if someone bashes someone else who doesn't have paid member status.

 

[riverjop]

Actually Overton, he was correct in the way he used go.

I wonder why that type of valuable information is not already posted somewhere here before threads go 50 pages?

Since he was talking about threads, plural, go is just fine.

Had he said thread, singular, instead of threads, then you would be correct.

Ha HA! I know Wilomn, I was buggin him! LOL Don't tell him though!

 

[Wilomn]

Gosh darn it, pm me next time so I don't look like such a dope. LOL

It was tenses anyway, not singularities or plurals.

Gecko guys, who knew there were weirder senses of humor than mine?

 

[riverjop]

Wes, Weirder is spelled weeiider if you spell it weird!

 

[repfriend]

ok, funny

but can we PLEASE either get back on subject or wait for further info.

This is a real mess that happend here and personally I would like to see the seller get his, for letting those poor animals die and scamming the buyer.

The last few pages is enough to turn anyone off of following this story, I mean I'm all for having some fun, but reading through the last 10 pages or so was downright painful.

Isn't there anything that can be done to that Grassi dude?

Are there any updates about the dragons?

Does the buyer have any more info?

I feel for the poor babies, in a way i'm hoping that the lack of food and water might possible have caused them to go into some sort of brumation...although it might not be cool enough there.
That might be the only way they could have possibly survived the ordeal.

 

[Arnold8169]

Just an update for those of you making no sense going totally off subject!

He has not responded to any of my e-mails, I should see the dragons middle of next week, but I'm not optimistic, and I will not post on this forum until I hear further information about the dragons or the loser who robbed me.

I will also post if I have any questions toward any good or relevant advice toward this situation.

Jeff Janes

 

[ShannanD25]

Why aren't the dragons coming back to you sooner? I thought the PO was going to get them back to you this week yet when you called and told them what was in there? By next week that box is going to smell pretty bad unless they went into brummation. Is there anyway to call back to the PO and let them know someone needs to open the box and feed/water (if they are still alive). Legally could the PO do that?

 

[repfriend]

I would "think" that there are legal problems with this.

You can't just open someone's mail, not even based on phonecalls on what is in there...

I guess it would depend on the manager at that postoffice and if he would be willing bending the law, but they would set themselfes up for lawsuits, so I doubt it.

Legally, they HAVE to hold the mail for 5 days, then they can return it to the sender.

At this point I have a very deep anger and tons of disgust for the seller.

What an unimaginable low bastard he is, imho. He "knows" that there are two young dragons in there that aren't worth that much, one has nips, the other no color....so I guess he figures he has more gain by leaving them to die.

He will just "pretend" he couldn't make it to the postoffice for whatever reason......he has enough ideas for excuses based on some posts in this thread.

Makes me ILL.

 

[repfriend]

and...

after he will "pretend" he couldn't make it to the postoffice for whatever reason, he will go on saying how the BUYER did such a grave wrong, and how its the buyers fault, and therefore he doesn't owe him anything.

Plan all laid out, 2 dragons had to die for it.

Grassi, hope you get yours, and soon, too.