NY reptile ban has been signed into law!

[thesnakeman]

That's unfortunate. Oh well, Ive been on this soap box for about three years now. I guess I'll just pitch a tent. But I'll never shut up! When the politicians ban all our snakes, spiders, and what not,...you'll here me say, "I told you so". PJAC isn't going to do it for us. It's not what we need. What we need is sponsorship from the owner of this website, the owners of kingsnake.com, bigappleherp, lllreptile, and so forth to wake up and smell the friggin coffee!!! Then cough up some serious bucks, and hire some dawgawn lawyers.
T.

 

[The BoidSmith]

It takes far more effort to oppose something than it does to work in favor. Fighting the reptile ban (or any other pet for that matter) going on in several states is probably not the best solution. We need to make the argument about how breeding, keeping, or studying reptiles might benefit the general public and/or the reptiles themselves (Example: conservation programs). Regrettably, trying to win by stating it’s our legal right will not accomplish it. In the end the opinion of the majority will prevail (as it's also their legal right!), and regrettably reptile lovers are not the majority. Even within different reptile species there are efforts by groups that are worthy of praise (turtles/tortoises), and that we don’t see among other groups. Furthermore, I agree that reptiles should probably be discussed as a different group altogether, and not under the “umbrella” of an organization that deals with other more “conventional” pets like for example the American Fancy Rat and Mouse Association (AFRMA)

Here is the breakdown of the US pet population and a comparison to a couple of years ago:

• Cats - 90.5 million (77.7 million in 2003/2004)
• Dogs - 73.9 million (65 million in 2003/2004)
• Birds - 16.6 million (17.3 million in 2003/2004)
• Reptiles - 11.0 million (9 million in 2003/2004)
• Small animals - 18.2 million (16.8 million in 2003/2004)
• Saltwater Fish - 9.6 million (7 million in 2003/2004)
• Freshwater Fish - 139.0 (185 million in 2003/2004)

In short, “reptiles” as a group is only close to 7% of the total population of the three leading categories (cats, dogs, and birds).

Regards

 

[thesnakeman]

Dan,
I'm not saying we have the "legal right". What I'm saying is that the folks who are making money in this industry, need to belly up to the table with some lawyers, and get organized. A good lawyer can always find away to fight. To suggest that we just go with the flow, in my opinion is absurd. If the folks with money would get together, ie;Big Apple, LLL, and the major big name breeders, and hire some legal council, they might be able to find a way to influence things. If they don't try,...they surely won't succeed. And if things continue the way they have been,...those big money makers will simply go extinct. I know that mainstream America doesn't give a hoot about us, or our snakes. I know they love their cats and dogs. I love my cat too! I know they think we are all nuts. Which is all the more reason to get all the herp societies around the country to join the "National" Herp Soc., and start making ourselves heard. And you said, "It takes far more effort to oppose something than it does to work in favor." So why don't you just get on board with this, and let's start pushing together, in the right direction! If not, this hobby will dwindle away to just about nothing. It will just keep getting more and more difficult to buy, sell, ship, and keep herps in this country. And as long as there is a Humane Society, we will have a mortal enemy sworn to, and working to destroy what we love. As long as they exist, they will be trying to put an end to the herp trade. So as long as they are doing that, we should be doing something to counter their actions. And with a National Herp. Soc., we can sound off with one LOUD voice! And we can educate the public on a National scale. We can present our own educational media campaign to counter what is being done by the humane society. We can present herp ownership in a positive light. We can teach one another how to be safe, responsible and professional. Or we can stand around with our thumbs up our asses, arguing about why we should or shouldn't do it, while they slowly, systematically make it illegal to keep herps in this country. Haven't you seen the T.V. commercials from the Humane Society? I have. They hired that short fat guy from NYPD blue to do commercials telling people not to keep reptiles. They say that herps don't make good pets. They continue to lobby in our U.S. congress for more laws to ban herp ownership. JEEEEZ people,....WAKE UP!!!! Stop arguing against the idea of a National Herp Soc., and get on board! In the Army we used to say,..."Lead, follow, or get the F out of the way!" But I'll simply say, if we don't stop arguing about this, we are doomed. I don't have the $ to do this myself. That's why the folks who are making money need to start investing in the future of this business, by hiring some lawyers, and uniting all the Herp Socs around the country into a National Herp Society. If the big money makers in this industry will get the ball rolling, I'm sure folks will join. And then this thing can snowball, and grow, and spread, and do some good. But we have to put some pressure on the big money operators in this industry. Somebody needs to explain to them that it's in their best intrest. And don't hand me this b.s. about how we have no legal right to keep herps either. That's just an excuse to do nothing. And the maximum effective range of an excuse is ZERO METERS! We don't have a right to drive either, but we all have cars, right? We don't need a legal right. We need big money players in this industry to get busy. Peter Kahl, Gus Renfro, Bob Clark, just to name a few more. A few years ago, gays didn't have a legal right to get married, but they sure do now. At least in some places, and it's comming to your neck of the woods too! A couple years ago, I didn't have a legal right to carry a concealed weapon, but I do now. Why? How? Time, and pressure. That's all it takes. And right now, the only people applying pressure are the nuts in PETA, SPCA, and The Humane Society. So in short, we can either get busy livin, or get busy dyin.
T.

 

[The BoidSmith]

Anthony,

You made good points. Due to the nature of my work (animal production) I deal with animal right activist’s day in and day out. Although they are a problem, it’s the misinformed and uninformed general public that is probably even more of a threat. Counteracting what animal groups say is not that difficult, as there’s a lot of nonsense being said. It’s only a matter of showing the general public what the truth is. One thing to keep in mind though is that our rights end where our neighbor’s rights begin. Regrettably, if 96% of the population is not into keeping reptiles we are clearly at a disadvantage. If we try to fight this reality before explaining why keeping reptiles is important puts us at a real disadvantage. In my opinion there’s no lawyer that can get you out of that one. They will gladly accept the challenge though !

Regards.

 

[Scott Ashton]

Unfortunately, depending upon the situation (pending legislation), opposition may be the only recourse.

As far as deep pockets go - I agree that corporate sponsors need to step up to the plate, but this is all of our problems and we all need to contribute accordingly.

Since the public gets many of their perceptions from well-organized groups such as PETA, there needs to be a well-organized effort on behalf of reptile enthusiasts/hobbyists in order to not only respond to the fear, uncertainty, and doubt that is perpetrated by PETA and other organizations, but also to be proactive in educating the public.

-Scott Ashton