Reptster.com experience with show sponsorship not good

[Southern Wolf]

No , it won't be deleted nor was there a reason to think or insinuate it that it would or might be. I warned you to not use the moniker " Ripster " outside of one area on the forum. If that has your panties in a bunch , not my problem. In the future , try not to read too much into what is asked. The Bush League is not nor does it have a BOI and the rules there are different in some ways than here.

Neither Steven nor Reptster is being protected at the Bush League and Steven has openly answered questions asked of him. Regardless of my feelings on Reptster , I nor the Admin or other Mod , are inclined to let you or anyone else turn it into a pissing match.

Actually there was a reason... I have not been there that long and was refered by another breeder to that site.... and it seemed like most posts were PRO RIPster. No one was questioning parts of his posts that made no sense... except maybe Sammy. Maybe those members are unaware of what has transpired. But your right... .they dont have the BOI and thus another reason I chose to post it here as well.

As for the warning... Nothing I said went over the PG-13 rating that they are trying to adhear to. They may want to get used to the moniker... cause Im not the only one that is using it. Its probably just a matter of time (this is just speculation on my part and not the opinions of Rich or Fauna)

I have valid points and valid questions. Think about... .what they are spewing just doesnt wash. How am I, a very small time breeder, albe to get my discounts... but RIPster looses theirs... and is forced to cover the difference and payup in 30 days.

As for the pissing match... .all I want is some straight answers... dont blow smoke up my What they are trying to push just doesnt add up. If you want to take everything at face value that comes out of that camp... Fine....

Once again... why would FedX give up 4grand a day (hypothetical obtainable figure using my numbers in the previous post) if RIPster was on the up and up. WHY?

 

[GottaLuvHerps]

Sure, I'll be the one to say it...

On the Saturday after I started this post, at the very end of the show, Larry and BT said that they would no longer be supporting Reptster until this situation was settled. It should be right there on the archives, and I am sure many people heard it. I never mentioned it before, but it was said. I was quite surprised, as I know RR was a huge promoter of Reptster, but according to that show that night, they would not be supporting what they were doing because of the thread going on.
So, what changed (if anything)? It just seems to me that if they were NOT supporting Reptster, that maybe they would speak up a bit more about the situation considering how big they were about Reptster in the beginning.
No, I am not a member at BL, and am not planning on becoming one, as I am not a BP breeder, and see no reason to join except for the current thread going on. So, unfortunately, I will not be posting this there.
Larry and BT, please note that I am NOT saying you are supporting Reptster in any way, I just thought the tone of the thread was very pro-Reptster (except for a few), and I didn't think you would keep quiet about it on the forums since you didn't on the radio show.
Maybe I shouldn't even be bringing this up on this thread. Sorry if I am out of line.

 

[MDC_Ophiuchus]

No, I am not a member at BL, and am not planning on becoming one, as I am not a BP breeder, and see no reason to join except for the current thread going on.

A little off-topic, but just FYI, you are by no means required to be a breeder of anything to join the BL forums. They welcome anyone.

 

[GottaLuvHerps]

A little off-topic, but just FYI, you are by no means required to be a breeder of anything to join the BL forums. They welcome anyone.

I guess I should have stated this better. I meant that the forum seems to be focused on BPs and the BP market from what I have seen, so I guess the better way to put it is that I just would not fit in as a lizard person for the most part. It was in no way meant in a bad way towards BL at all. But thanks

 

[BryonsBoas]

When I took on the job as Mod on BLBC , I gave everyone a clean slate. The members there are of their own mind , just as here , as to whether they will support them or not. Not every member there is a member of Fauna nor do I imagine every member has heard of , participates or uses the BOI here. If anyone wants to paint the BLBC in any light , it would be nice if they took into consideration that not every single herp keeper knows of or uses fauna. Nor does every herp keeper feel the need to follow the crowd either way.

Other than that, any questions about the BLBC and how we handle things on our site can be taken there. I apologize to Rich & Fauna that it has gone this far here.

 

[WebSlave]

I apologize to Rich & Fauna that it has gone this far here.

Thank you. I'm hoping I don't have to use the OFF TOPIC hammer here.

 

[BryonsBoas]

Thank you. I'm hoping I don't have to use the OFF TOPIC hammer here.

If you do it won't be because of me. My apologies again.

 

[jayefbe]

I'm sure some of you have already seen this...

So while David is taking credit for UPS considering to ship snakes, apparently UPS was planning on it all along and it was Pro Exotics doing all the hard work. I'm not surprised that David's trying to take credit for UPS' change of heart.

http://www.proexotics.com/ups_shipping.html

 

[TripleMoonsExotic]

I'm sure some of you have already seen this...

So while David is taking credit for UPS considering to ship snakes, apparently UPS was planning on it all along and it was Pro Exotics doing all the hard work. I'm not surprised that David's trying to take credit for UPS' change of heart.

Interesting. But are we sure this isn't related to Reptster? It just seems really odd that they both are saying they are waiting on shipping tests and should know something by end of 2008...

I'm curious though...Being that Reptster's whole deal is to skip each shipper becoming actually Certified...How is it that any package testing done by UPS for David is going to do any good for everyone else? So David proves that he can ship correctly, what about the others going through the account?

 

[jayefbe]

From what Robyn has posted on the ball python forum in ks, it sounds like UPS is just thinking about having a similar program to FedEx in which a certification process is involved. I'm going to quote Robyn directly from the post on ks:

I have seen various discussions online on the UPS-live snake shipping issue, and I just wanted to clear something up. Pro Exotics is the charter member of the UPS non venomous live snake shipping program, and I don't know of any other members.

Lots of folks could claim credit, I guess, but that doesn't make it true. We have done the work, and we are very excited about getting UPS to open up the non venomous snake shipping market in the reptile hobby.

This program has been rolling for a while now, and will hopefully be completed this year. This is the start of something big.

It doesn't look like Reptster had anything to do with this.

 

[TripleMoonsExotic]

Great, thanks for the info. That would be awesome if they did an actual certification process like FedEx. I'd certainly give them a spin.

This additional information makes sense as to why UPS had representatives at Daytona. Makes more sense that they'd be there due to the work of an established breeder/company over a fledgling company (Reptster).

 

[jayefbe]

I agree. I'd definitely be happy with more options to ship reptiles with. Plus, the ability to work DIRECTLY with the shipper rather than through a third party preferred. Robyn also gives UPS high recommendations in a follow up post.

My thought on how reptster fits in is that he just happened along as UPS was already considering to change their stance on the shipment of reptiles, and took credit for it. I'm guessing things went sour with FedEx and David decided to jump ship to UPS and try to spin things his way.

This is just my impression, but it also seems as though Robyn made these posts in response to all the reptster-UPS talks making their rounds on the forums. It looks as though they were frustrated by David's attempts to take credit for the hard work and negotiations they've been making with UPS for what sounds like some time now.

 

[btaylor]

Sure, I'll be the one to say it...

On the Saturday after I started this post, at the very end of the show, Larry and BT said that they would no longer be supporting Reptster until this situation was settled. It should be right there on the archives, and I am sure many people heard it. I never mentioned it before, but it was said. I was quite surprised, as I know RR was a huge promoter of Reptster, but according to that show that night, they would not be supporting what they were doing because of the thread going on.
So, what changed (if anything)? It just seems to me that if they were NOT supporting Reptster, that maybe they would speak up a bit more about the situation considering how big they were about Reptster in the beginning.
No, I am not a member at BL, and am not planning on becoming one, as I am not a BP breeder, and see no reason to join except for the current thread going on. So, unfortunately, I will not be posting this there.
Larry and BT, please note that I am NOT saying you are supporting Reptster in any way, I just thought the tone of the thread was very pro-Reptster (except for a few), and I didn't think you would keep quiet about it on the forums since you didn't on the radio show.
Maybe I shouldn't even be bringing this up on this thread. Sorry if I am out of line.

Yep - It's in the achieves...Just curious though - Why would you be surprised to see our support for Reptster end after this mess? It's quite obvious that things didn't add up with David's story to say the least...When Reptster first came out with the whole FedEx shipping program we thought the concept was a great tool for the industry...You know - For the shippers who weren't verified that had to fib about what they were shipping...Add on the free boxes and 20% discount - We thought it was great so we promoted it...I used the program myself to ship out around 20 animals and I never had a problem with FedEx - My packages were never late or lost - No problems whatsoever...After this whole mess came to light it wasn't hard to figure out that continuing to promote Reptster was not the right thing to do...I said on the show that I could not, with a clear conscience support Reptster if this is how David handles business...We still hold that stance...As a matter of fact it's looking like we're going to take it on the chin from ol Dave too...Long story short - We had a Reptile Radio table at Daytona...I had to leave by noon on Sunday to drive home...Larry left later Sunday afternoon to catch his flight home...We wanted to leave our banner up all day Sunday so David said he would ship our banner and banner stand to us...Guess what? Still haven't got our banner and stand...So we're out around $500 - I guess that's the punishment we get from Reptster for doing the right thing and ending our support...To be honest - I haven't keep up with this thread after the first 150 pages and hadn't even really looked at the thread on the BLBC - I figured it was the same old thing as over on the BOI...People that know us - Really know us - Know we don't and won't support bad business - Not on the show - Not on the forums - Not anywhere...So no - Our stance has not changed about Reptster...If anything it's gotten worse - Hell we can't even get the guy to answer his phone to see what's the deal with our banner and stand...I added my 2 cents on the thread over at the BLBC after I read this thread tonight - Feel free to add yours too...The biggest shock to me was Robin's post about PE's UPS pilot program...I believe Robin said he wasn't aware of another company working with UPS...Huh - Imagine that...

Almost forgot - (Sorry Rich) The BLBC is not only about BP's...I do Jungle Carpets, Woma Pythons, Borneo's, Hog Island Boas, Corn Island Boas, Sabogae Boas and Panamanian Boas...Even Crested Geckos - So I'm a lizard person too... Larry's even hooked on the Leos...LOL...The BLBC is about reptiles from Leos to Corn to BP's to Boas and everything in between...Good luck and if your show ever needs a little free promotion - Drop us a line - We'd love to do what we could to help you out thru Reptile Radio...

 

[crotalusadamanteus]

This was taken from a members quote on another forum regarding this subject...

I normally stay out of these but this time I will chime in..First off I am not sure if it is Pro-Exotics or Reptster who has got the ball rolling but it is indeed rolling. My wife and I ship(Anything but herps, they go Fed-Ex) out of a U.P.S. store down the road and they know us pretty well and they received an e-mail a couple weeks ago letting them know they where considering the possiblity of snakes and how the stores should handle the situation if it was to happen. So my guess if the Franchise Owned UPS Store has info about it so should the hubs.

So apparently, if the money looks like it's gonna be there, UPS just might be making a change in their policies.

That could be good for a lot of people, or could be bad due to UPS handling practices, ie drop and run tactics.

 

[GottaLuvHerps]

Interesting. But are we sure this isn't related to Reptster? It just seems really odd that they both are saying they are waiting on shipping tests and should know something by end of 2008...

Steph, the thing is, Reptster just announced this whole deal with UPS and their special deal the past little bit, we do not know how long PE has been working with them. Does anyone have any idea? I have a big feeling PE has been working with them a bit longer than Reptster, as Reptster was too wrapped up in the FedEx deal to concentrate on anything until the FedEx deal went sour.

So, I guess, no, we aren't SURE it isn't related to Reptster, but I guess taking in to account the character of the 2 companies and the people involved, I would have to side with the idea of PE being the one to work with them first, and Mr. Young just sort of taking credit for something. Just my opinion though.

 

[homegrownherps]

Steph, the thing is, Reptster just announced this whole deal with UPS and their special deal the past little bit, we do not know how long PE has been working with them. Does anyone have any idea? I have a big feeling PE has been working with them a bit longer than Reptster, as Reptster was too wrapped up in the FedEx deal to concentrate on anything until the FedEx deal went sour.

So, I guess, no, we aren't SURE it isn't related to Reptster, but I guess taking in to account the character of the 2 companies and the people involved, I would have to side with the idea of PE being the one to work with them first, and Mr. Young just sort of taking credit for something. Just my opinion though.

I had a conversation with David on the phone, a few weeks BEFORE this thread was started. He mentioned that he was working with UPS to allow the shipping of snakes. I mentioned to him that if they did decide to allow snakes to be shipped, that I would set up an account with UPS to see if I would receive better rates/service than what I already get with FedEx. He said that if they did start shipping snakes ...Breeders/hobbyists would only be able to ship snakes if they went through RIPster, and that individuals would still not be able to ship snakes.

 

[GottaLuvHerps]

I had a conversation with David on the phone, a few weeks BEFORE this thread was started. He mentioned that he was working with UPS to allow the shipping of snakes. I mentioned to him that if they did decide to allow snakes to be shipped, that I would set up an account with UPS to see if I would receive better rates/service than what I already get with FedEx. He said that if they did start shipping snakes ...Breeders/hobbyists would only be able to ship snakes if they went through RIPster, and that individuals would still not be able to ship snakes.

I do know when I spoke to Mr. Young in our very first conversation that he mentioned UPS coming on board with the shipping program, but nothing was mentioned about the snake shipping issue, as it honestly did not occur to me to ask because I do not ship snakes. The conversation was just that UPS was coming on board, how excited they were about it, and how it would be such a great thing to the community (which I agree with). So yes, Reptster was apparently/supposedly working with UPS back in at least July, maybe before, but the "FedEx nightmares" were priority at that time according to Mr. Young. I think I mentioned that conversation somewhere in the beginning of the thread, I am not sure.
I guess the question here is who was working with UPS about the snake shipping issue first? I think that was answered by Robyn - PE started FIRST. Just because they did not advertise it like Reptster is doing now does not mean, IMO, that Reptster should get the right to take the credit for starting the whole deal.
I don't know, call me jaded about Reptster for some reason, but I have a tendency to believe Robyn and PE a bit more than David Young, his mods at his forums, or any of his mouthpieces he has chosen to use.

 

[HappyHillbilly]

Who did what, and when?

I don't know for sure who did what, and when. I do know that Reptster mentioned working with UPS sometime back in July of this year. I don't know when ProExotics began their process with UPS.

Based on what I've read over the last few months I don't get the impression that Reptster has tried to take credit for getting UPS to open up to the whole community to ship snakes. I get the impression that they were doing so as an individual business adventure and not as a good for the whole community in general. I think Jim's (HomeGrownHerps) reported conversation with David tends to support my thoughts. "He said that if they did start shipping snakes ...Breeders/hobbyists would only be able to ship snakes if they went through RIPster,..."

ProExotics webpage linked a few posts up (http://www.proexotics.com/ups_shipping.html) states:
This pilot program will open the door for other breeders and shippers
to become UPS qualified to ship non venomous live snakes in the future.

We look forward to making this program a success, enabling other
breeders to ship non venomous live snakes using UPS — the best shipping company out
there.

Who started the process first? I don't know. It's possible both started on or about the same time and it's possible one began quite earlier than the other. Actually, I'm not concerned with who started it first, I'm looking more at their ultimate goals and concerns for the reptile community as a whole. Either way, though, I think that one or both programs could pave the way for us individuals to become certified with UPS.

The difference in each other's projected UPS ruling/decision date doesn't provide much help in who got the ball rollin' first. ProExotics stated: "...should be completed by the end of 2008"
Reptster recently gave the date of November 17.

That could be interpreted a couple of different ways to benefit one or the other.

The fact that UPS had a booth at the Daytona Expo makes me think that they were most likely already considering allowing snakes. I haven't heard anyone mention talking to the UPS Reps that were there. I sure would like to know the whole reason they were there.

It's time like these that we need outstanding leaders (well-respected, members in good standing) to represent the reptile community's general interest to be pursuing talks with UPS on the matter. But that's getting too far off topic for this thread, so I'll stop there.

To try to give an "on topic" summary of this post - Who started working with UPS first? What was their reason for doing so?

I can't answer the first question without a shadow of doubt, but the second question has been addressed.

One thing David has in his favor is evidence of the business potential of the reptile community to use an overnight shipping service that allows snakes. The evidence being in the form of shipments made through Reptster with FedEx. However, that evidence shouldn't be interpreted as shipping business/portal exclusive. Meaning that it's not representative of what only one company can do, but representative of what any other company, or the whole reptile community, can do.

Ya'll take care!
Michael Sanders
(HH)

 

[Dennis Hultman]

As a matter of fact it's looking like we're going to take it on the chin from ol Dave too...Long story short - We had a Reptile Radio table at Daytona...I had to leave by noon on Sunday to drive home...Larry left later Sunday afternoon to catch his flight home...We wanted to leave our banner up all day Sunday so David said he would ship our banner and banner stand to us...Guess what? Still haven't got our banner and stand...So we're out around $500 - I guess that's the punishment we get from Reptster for doing the right thing and ending our support..

Sorry to hear that, BT. It really goes to the main point of each of the individuals, businesses and shows that have come forward. No follow-through with his word.

 

[WebSlave]

I am sorry, I don't want to take this thread off topic, but I just do not understand this claim by UPS that some sort of exhaustive testing period is necessary for authorizing the shipping of snakes through their network. I know of one major shipper of reptiles, including snakes, that has been using UPS for quite a long time now, and heard rumors of others as well. The experience base already exists for UPS, so what else is there to test for?

If UPS makes discriminatory decisions on who can ship by them and who cannot, or actually continues to do so from existing evidence, that would be pretty irritating to many people, I was assume. If one company is granted the right to ship particular merchandise, and others are not with the same exact circumstances being applied, I would imagine that a legal challenge to such a policy might result.

But personally, even if UPS does now authorize the shipping of snakes through them, I would not choose them over FedEx. UPS kicked me below the belt a while back and I'm not likely to forgive nor forget that anytime soon.