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Bad Guy RodentPro- Zoonotic disease warning

I'm not trying to be all gloom and doom, that letter is dated today, and this happened in May. Maybe the chances of one person contracting this illness is extremely small, but if you're that one person, it's kind of a big deal. Do they know that those 14 people and their mice have not spread the illness? A two month lapse is unacceptable in my opinion.

Noelle
 
So unless any of you were among those 14 contacted by the CDC you have nothing to freaking worry about - get over yourselves. you are not going to die from the proverbial plague.

Adrian, you are being a bit harsh here. How could any of RPs customers know this before they posted a statement? I am with Tim. They could have released this statement when the investigation was either ongoing or after to put peoples fears and rumors to rest.
 
I called RP this morning and they confirmed it was them , i spoke to Casey who works there. He would not go into detail and took my number for someone to call me back . I suggest you call them youself to confirm.

So it looks like even if one called, one did not get the same kind of information that was contained in the letter.
I'm with Tim, a statement would have cleared a lot of confusion.
 
The thing is, they knew and did nothing until it was brought to the public. How do we know that they're telling the truth now? Suppose the mice they buy get mixed with other supplier's mice or their own? Suppose one of the workers, there were 14 of them infected, mixed them up or spread it to other previously uninfected mice?

There's a whole lot of what ifs and why didn't theys. Had I been a customer of theirs, I wouldn't be now just because of the cavalier way they handled this. It's no big deal until it's you butt rubbing cheeks with death.

It just leaves a bad aftertaste and a complete lack of trust.
 
How do we know that they're telling the truth now? .

Good point. The poor way they have handled this incident doesn't promote trust (at least for me) in any document that may be making the rounds.
 
For the record the only cases of this virus being spread human to human involve organ donors and receivers, and mothers and fetuses. There are no known cases of an infected human transmitting the virus to another human.
 
For the record the only cases of this virus being spread human to human involve organ donors and receivers, and mothers and fetuses. There are no known cases of an infected human transmitting the virus to another human.

So you know, for a fact, that none of the 14 infected people at RP were infected by other humans?
 
I received the letter referenced earlier from RP today which states that, according to the CDC, only 14 customers were impacted by virus-laden mice and all were contacted by the CDC itself.

Some may feel that RP is deceiving us with this public letter. Others might see a conspiracy in it. My concerns have been put to rest by it.

I think that some of us need to calm down. The near "rush to arms" mentality I've seen in some posts give me more cause for concern about the health of our industry and its hobbyists. It's sad to see a snake try to eat itself.

I have no ties to RP and don't know a single person who works any any RP facility.

Scott
 
ok.. this was just posted by Jeff @ kingsnake.com on facebook.

http://www.kingsnake.com/rodentpro.jpg


Basically, it's a photo of a letter by RP official statement to customers. RP was NOT the one that was infected. It was one of the several companies that sell TO THEM. Because RP has many brokers they could continue to ship out orders to people using stock from these other places. Only 14 customers were determined to have possibly received contaminated stock from the infected supplier and those customers had been contacted by CDC. So unless any of you were among those 14 contacted by the CDC you have nothing to freaking worry about - get over yourselves. you are not going to die from the proverbial plague.

I got this letter today, whoop-t-doo, it says less than we already know at this point.

Of those 14 customers that purchased live rodents, none were notified by Rodent Pro.

Of those 14 customers at least 1 resells rodents to other pet shops, and had comingled their stocks with the Rodent Pro stocks.

Just because the BOI has yet to uncover the full extent of the outbreak does not mean that everybody is good to go.

Remember you are going off of the information released by a company that waited a month and a half to acknowledge anything happened at all. As well as the delay they are less than fothcoming about the full extent of the issue and whom should be concerned.

Maurice Pudlo
 
I'm not trying to be all gloom and doom, that letter is dated today, and this happened in May. Maybe the chances of one person contracting this illness is extremely small, but if you're that one person, it's kind of a big deal. Do they know that those 14 people and their mice have not spread the illness? A two month lapse is unacceptable in my opinion.

Noelle

This is not CSI fake reality... you don't run tests with a snap of magic fingers in the space of a 1 hour show. If you are exposed and are among the small percentage to become infected the disease could go one of two ways... you are infected and don't get sick or you are infected and don't begin to show symptoms (usually vague ones at that) until at least 1-2 weeks after infection. In other words, being infected doesn't guarantee you would/will become symptomatic (i.e. physically sick with the meningitis). So it's a waiting game to see if anyone gets sick or not and attempting to run tests on those who might have been exposed but didn't "get sick" to see if they were indeed infected or not. Usually people are not clinically diagnosed with LCMV until almost a month after infection. So if it took a month for the first sick person to get diagnosed and more time to test other people exposed, and more time to track the potential source of infection and more time to confirm the infection source, and more time to track down and contact those that might have received contaminated shipments and more time to find out if they are infected or not and then to initiate decontamination procedures, etc. 3 months is really NOT that long to deal with a situation.

Considering LCMV is an uncommon illness in spite of a notable percentage of the mouse population being carriers and human infection rate is low. Normally when there is an above average cluster infection rate from LCMV it's usually centered around people who work in LABORATORIES on a daily basis with rodents where exposure levels are much HIGHER than the normal human being. The people here who got infected in this incident.. guess what - they were working in a rodent breeding facility and were in direct daily contact with thousands upon thousands of rodents and therefore hyper-exposed to the virus from fresh feces, urine, saliva, and airborne contaminates and even then only a handful got symptomatically sick.

Those who do get sick with LCMV, unless there are some outstanding complications (like compromised immune systems), are rarely going to die. I would say if you had to get infected with a form of meningitis, then a mild form of aseptic meningitis like LCMV is probably the better route to go compared to the really nasty bacterial types or even the viral types you can develop when infected with listeria or west nile.

RP and CDC did what they did, contacted the people that needed to be contacted and took the actions that were deemed necessary to deal with the situation first. Making apologies to everyone else that were not technically affected by the situation came second.

I would say put your time and paranoia into worrying about other more serious illnesses that you can potentially catch far more easily from your reptile pets (directly or indirectly)... diseases with a much higher infection and/or mortality rate such as Salmonella and E coli Campylobacter, Pseudomonas, tuberculosis and don't forget various protozoans, ticks, and fungi and lord knows what else that is out there.
 
another comment on whether frozen mice are "safer" - they are NOT. I don't want to go too far OT, but think this needs to be stressed as it keeps coming up.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3374428/

this is a report of a study done, where researchers screened wild mice from a given area and asked people submitting the mice to freeze them. I would also say that many bacteria can pretty easily survive freezing. freezing is a pretty effective way to kill eukaryotic cells, but doesn't work as well against bacteria. I base this on my education and experience; I have a BS in Microbiology and have worked as a senior public health microbiologist.

should you be paranoid? no. I pull my frodents bare-handed and thaw them in the sink. I just use plenty of soap, hot water, and disinfectant, and if I had any open skin wounds I'd put gloves on first.

I still think RP handled this poorly. if I were pregnant I'd be unbelievably upset. this is about THEIR choice to determine MY risk level.
 
All of the above is true, but not relevant to what I'm saying. I saying, Rodentpro knew they had a problem in May. As a precaution and courtesy to all of their customers, they should've issued a statement immediately, even if it indicated further testing was being done. They didn't know in May how many would get sick, or how long it would take to prove out, but they knew it was there. Either way, this is likely to cost them some customers. Why not do the right thing and take the high road? Could you live with yourself if one single person died specifically because you were covering you butt? I couldn't.

Noelle
 
The information should have been put out there from the get-go, so people could assess the risk and decide for themselves if it was something they were comfortable with.

Some folks aren't going to care, and some folks are going to feel uneasy about it. (I'm in the latter group.)

It may not be a serious illness to a healthy adult, but that doesn't excuse the company from disclosing this sooner.
 
This is not CSI fake reality... you don't run tests with a snap of magic fingers in the space of a 1 hour show. If you are exposed and are among the small percentage to become infected the disease could go one of two ways... you are infected and don't get sick or you are infected and don't begin to show symptoms (usually vague ones at that) until at least 1-2 weeks after infection. In other words, being infected doesn't guarantee you would/will become symptomatic (i.e. physically sick with the meningitis). So it's a waiting game to see if anyone gets sick or not and attempting to run tests on those who might have been exposed but didn't "get sick" to see if they were indeed infected or not. Usually people are not clinically diagnosed with LCMV until almost a month after infection. So if it took a month for the first sick person to get diagnosed and more time to test other people exposed, and more time to track the potential source of infection and more time to confirm the infection source, and more time to track down and contact those that might have received contaminated shipments and more time to find out if they are infected or not and then to initiate decontamination procedures, etc. 3 months is really NOT that long to deal with a situation.

Considering LCMV is an uncommon illness in spite of a notable percentage of the mouse population being carriers and human infection rate is low. Normally when there is an above average cluster infection rate from LCMV it's usually centered around people who work in LABORATORIES on a daily basis with rodents where exposure levels are much HIGHER than the normal human being. The people here who got infected in this incident.. guess what - they were working in a rodent breeding facility and were in direct daily contact with thousands upon thousands of rodents and therefore hyper-exposed to the virus from fresh feces, urine, saliva, and airborne contaminates and even then only a handful got symptomatically sick.

Those who do get sick with LCMV, unless there are some outstanding complications (like compromised immune systems), are rarely going to die. I would say if you had to get infected with a form of meningitis, then a mild form of aseptic meningitis like LCMV is probably the better route to go compared to the really nasty bacterial types or even the viral types you can develop when infected with listeria or west nile.

RP and CDC did what they did, contacted the people that needed to be contacted and took the actions that were deemed necessary to deal with the situation first. Making apologies to everyone else that were not technically affected by the situation came second.

I would say put your time and paranoia into worrying about other more serious illnesses that you can potentially catch far more easily from your reptile pets (directly or indirectly)... diseases with a much higher infection and/or mortality rate such as Salmonella and E coli Campylobacter, Pseudomonas, tuberculosis and don't forget various protozoans, ticks, and fungi and lord knows what else that is out there.

Do not confuse the CDC walking into a facility and informing the employees of the issue with Rodent Pro informing anyone of the situation. Rodent Pro did nothing of the sort.

The official statement from Rodent Pro states in part, "The CDC determined that mice that may have been exposed to LCMV produced at that facility were shipped prior to diagnosis to fourteen of Rodent Pro's customers, all of whom have been contacted by the CDC."

Let me boil that down to what makes it important "The CDC determined ... have been contacted by the CDC."

Maurice Pudlo
 
ok.. this was just posted by Jeff @ kingsnake.com on facebook.

http://www.kingsnake.com/rodentpro.jpg


Basically, it's a photo of a letter by RP official statement to customers. RP was NOT the one that was infected. It was one of the several companies that sell TO THEM. Because RP has many brokers they could continue to ship out orders to people using stock from these other places. Only 14 customers were determined to have possibly received contaminated stock from the infected supplier and those customers had been contacted by CDC. So unless any of you were among those 14 contacted by the CDC you have nothing to freaking worry about - get over yourselves. you are not going to die from the proverbial plague.

Im sorry, I missed the 14 customers part. I am very concerned because I purchased MICE from RP in May AND my wife is Pregnant. To say I am concerned is a bit of an understatement.
Where did you get this information that the CDC contacted the people who purchased infected rodents. This would relieve MASSIVE pressure off my shoulders.
I dont know what I would do if my child was born with complications or my wife had issues because of a stupid Mouse order. Thank you.
 
Wraith -you seem to defend RP a lot in this thread, but i know this may be blown out of proportion , but what do you say to them not warning customers the moment the infection was confirmed ? I am sure if you or a loved one was potential at risk for this infection your tune would be different. I prefer to be on the side of precaution than be sorry .
 
Wraith -you seem to defend RP a lot in this thread, but i know this may be blown out of proportion , but what do you say to them not warning customers the moment the infection was confirmed ? I am sure if you or a loved one was potential at risk for this infection your tune would be different. I prefer to be on the side of precaution than be sorry .

That is exactly how I feel. My wife is 9.5 weeks pregnant with our first child. I would be devastated if my wife were infected.

I am not pissed about the disease. I am pissed I found out about this by BROWSING THE BOI!!!!
 
I just got done reading 20 pages of this and have a few thoughts.
I think that some people are over reacting even after it was shown that they arnt effected. With that said RP really dropped the ball. Like was stated before it was the CDC that found out and notified people not RP. I believe that RP only came out with this statment as a responce to the backlash. Also I find the letter a little fishy. Now I know that they have a few facilities and they also outsource. Now if you notice they try to put as much distance as they can from them and the problem as they could. I do believe that if it was some one they outsource to they would have stated that. Not to mention that it was 14 or their employees that had gotten sick saying to me it was one or their facilities. IMO RP should have come out with a statement long ago. If nothing else saying they are aware of the problem, They are fixing it and that thoes effected have been notified so If you havent been notified you are in the clear. I really do believe that this statment was made because they HAD to not because they wanted to.
 
Outside of RP, what are other options as far as ordering rodents? I have never ordered rodents b/c I have a local guy that breeds feeders, but he is moving. I hope this is an OK question for BOI.
 
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