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Selling unhealthy wild caught animals at shows...

Carl, you make some very good points.  I too feel there is far to much importation of several species, especially species  that we know won't do well once they get here (adult balls, forest hingebacks, etc.)  I would have to disagree w/ you about the care of amazon tree boas.  It has been my experience that they are quite easy to care for, in fact they require less "work" than even a common burmese python.  I think most people think they difficult because of their "skinny" apearance, which can be greatly exacerbated by a little dehydration (a condition most animals experience during the importation process).  But of the hundred or so I have dealt w/ I have had only one death and right now I have one that is a bit of a picky feeder.  Other than those two examples every single one have been great eaters and have adjusted to captivity quite well.  They never really tame down but many people don't mind that about them.
Now back to cb vs. wc.  I think we can agree that there are certain species that SHOULD not be imported.  But there is very little we can do to stop that.  Until Cites stops the exportation, I feel it  is better that the animals come here, where they have at least a shot at being reproduced in captivity, rather than somewhere else where they would simply be dinner.
You state that few of the imported animals would make it into captive breeding programs, and that may be true.  However, w/o importation and wc allowed expos NONE of them will, and we will be left w/ the gene pool we have now.  And we all know the problems a limited gene pool represents.  One-eyed albino boas, one-eye black-head pythons, zoos putting down Komodo Dragons because they are already "represented" in the gene pool?!?!?  In fact many of these animals are in as much if not more danger in their home country than they are here, (apparently turtle meat tastes pretty good), so why not bring them over here and at least give them a shot?
I'll give one more example then await your reply, even right here at home we see restrictions on collecting on certain species.  Yet at the same time we see the absolute destruction of their habitat allowed everyday.  Here in FL two great examples are the Eastern Indigo and the FL Pine snake.  You can't touch an indigo w/o federal permits.  You can own only one FL pine.  In both cases the animals are restricted because of #'s in the wild.  I own a male FL pine and my wife owns a female if we breed them the instant the eggs hatch we are in violation of the law.  I asked them, "well can't I just breed them and give the babies to you (Fish and Game) for release?"  Their answer no!  We go for hands-off type protection while at the same time giving the animals no shot at making it in the wild because of habitat destruction.     <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>   How long do you think it would take the herp community to reproduce and raise, to breeding age 1000 indigos in capitvity?  I think it would be a whole lot less time than what it takes in the wild, don't you?
 
i strongly believe that more imported animals need to wind up in breeding programs, but of course more animals are imported to go straight into the hands of a kid, and wind up buried in the yard a week later...great service to the reptile world.  

it is also difficult to reward the people that work very hard to captive breed some of the imported species when they have to sell their cb animals for dirt cheap due to the amount of cheap imports on the market that show up even at cb shows.  i remember doing a cb only show with by cb mali uromastyx.  two other tables had imported malis (even though it was a cb only show) and someone complained to me about why am i charging $60 when they can go over to the next table and get one for $25.  i state that mine are cb, they say well, so is everything in this show.  she went home with an import (thinking it was captive bred) and proceeded to tell other vendors how expensive my pricing was and how could i get away with charging that much.  and to tell you the truth--i really dont even break even charging $60 for babies with a species that needs a lot of space, a ton of heat, and only lays one relatively small clutch a year.

as for your indigo issue, you cant breed and release without years and years of study.  there can be a world of potential damage done to wild populations with your captive bred snakes being let loose. there are people working on similar studies with numerous endangered species all over the world, but it takes a lot of time.  perhaps you could petition fish and game to allow you a breeders permit instead and these snakes could be donated to zoos or something.  i'm pretty sure (not positive) people are able to do that out here in NM with protected species of horned lizards and grey bandeds--we are not allowed to release them of course.

great posts everyone.

Dana
 
Dana, great reply.  However I think you made a point I was trying to earlier.  The public, (the guy w/ the cash in hand), either doesn't know or doesn't care about the difference between cb and wc.  All they care about is the $.  Utopian idealism aside, money is what drives this industry.  If you, the producer, can't make the public understand the difference between your product and the product at the booth next to you, then you won't last very long in the business.  
It's like the difference between a Geo Metro and a BWM.  Sure most of us would rather own the B'mer, but the fact of the matter is, the Geo will get you from point A to point B just as well for $25000 less.  And that's the reason not everybody drives a BMW.  There are those in this industry that do sell animals the same way that BWM sells cars, PRESTIGE.  Serpenco, Bill Love, Bob Clark, etc.  the animals on the table are just corn snakes, or whatever, but there are people willing to pay more for them because they are "Love stock," or "Clark stock."  These companies have convinced their buyers that their product is worth 50-<img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>% more than the "same animal" two booths down.  So I think it's your job, the exhibitor, to convince the public about your Mali.  It's not the promoters job to ban other vendors, so you can sell them, and it's not the other vendors job to raise their prices or do their own breeding just so you can compete.
I raise corns just like Bill Love.  I do shows just like Bill Love, sometimes I even do the same shows as Bill Love.  I charge about $15 for a snow corn, Bill charges about $25.  To some customers buying from "BILL LOVE" is worth the extra $10, they spend their money w/ him.  To others, those who just want "a nice snake for their kid or their classroom" at the best price possible, it is ok to save $10 and buy it from me.  And to still others who just want any cheap snake, the wc corn on my table for $10 will do just fine.  So why block that snake at the door?  So Bill can sell more?
 
HI BRIAN,
I HAVE TO AGREE WITH YOU ON THIS. TAKE THE MALAGASY
EXAMPLES GIVEN, AT THE RATE OF FOREST DESTRUCTION
IN MADAGASCAR (CURRENTLY 80% HAS BEEN DESTROYED) THE NATIVE HERP/MAMMAL POPULATION WILL BE DESIMATED
IN THE NEXT 20 YEARS. IN THE LAST 10 YEARS ROUGHLY 10
LEMUR SPECIES ALONE HAVE GONE EXTINCT-FOREVER. THE
ONLY CHANCE MANY OF THESE ANIMALS HAVE IS BEING BRED IN CAPTIVITY TO ENSURE SURVIVAL OF THE SPECIES. YES
ITS VERY SAD , BUT AFTER A SPECIES REACHES THE BREAKING POINT THEY MOST LIKELY WILL NOT RECOVER THEIR NUMBERS ON THEIR OWN. NOW ALBIET THERE ARE WAYS THAT MANY OF THESE CAN BE SAVED WITHOUT CAPTIVE BREEDING, BUT GETTING THE NATIVE VILAGES TO SEE THAT HAS THUS FAR BEEN FEW AND FAR BETWEEN.  I DO
AGREE THAT IMPORTING THESE DEMINISHING POPULATIONS
ONLY TO END UP IN THE BEDROOM OF A 10 YEAR OLD IS NOT
THE WAY TO GO;HOWEVER, IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT MOST THAT ARE THAT RARE (IE.-MALAGASY AND AUSTRALIAN SPECIES) USUALLY ARE OUT OF THE PRICE RANGE THAT PARENTS, KIDS, AND NOVICE ARE WILLING TO PAY - EVEN BEING OFF THE BOAT IMPORTS. (AFRICAN IS A CHEAP EXCEPTIN TO THIS)
 THERES REALLY ONLY TO WAY TO INSURE THE SURVIVAL OF
A SPECIES, CAPTIVE PROPOGATION AND IN THE WILD CONSERVATION. ONE SIDE OF ME SAYS - LEAVE THEM ALONE
AND DO ALL YA CAN TO KEEP THEM HEALTHY IN THE WILD!!!,
AND THE OTHER SIDE OF ME SAYS - ITS TOO LATE FOR CONSERVATION, THEY WILL BE EXTINCT IN 10 YEARS, PULL THEM ALL OUT OF THE WILD NOW WHILE THERES A GOOD DIVERSIFIED GENE POOL SO WE CAN MAKE SURE THEY WILL
FLURISH IN CAPTIVITY LONG AFTER THEIR NATURAL HABITAT
IS GONE~!~!!
 WHICH WAY IS THE BEST WAY FOR THESE DWENDELING SPECIES?? WHO KNOWS FOR SURE. ONE THING I DO KNOW IS
THAT CAPTIVE BREEDING WITH A GOOD GENE POOL WILL ENSURE THE SPECIES IS WITH US AFTER THEIR HABITAT IS GONE. ON THE OTHER HAND IT BRINGS TEARS TO MY EYES
TO SEE THE EMPTY TREES AND FOREST FLOORS OF THESE
SMALL NATURAL HABITATS THAT ARE LEFT.
 I SUSPECT THAT THIS ISSUE CAN BE DEBATED TILL THE NEXT MELINIUM. I DO THINK THOUGH THAT IF YOU THINK THESE SPECIES SHOULDNT BE PULLED FROM THE WILD-THEN
YOU HAD BETTER BE DOING SOMETHING ABOUT IT TO HELP
CONSERVE THEM IN THE WILD. IF YOU THINK ITS OKAY FOR THEM TO BE PULLED FROM THE WILD THEN BREED BREED BREED!! EITHER WAY TO ME MAKES SINCE.  AND WHICHEVER SIDE YOUR ON - DONT YOU DARE THINK YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO COMPLAIN UNLESS YOUR DOING SOMETHING ABOUT IT!
ONE THING THAT BUGS ME TO KNOW END ARE THOSE PEOPLE
THAT CAN SIT ON THE COUCH ALL DAY LONG AND COMPLAIN
ABOUT EVERYTHING. THEN WHEN YOU ASK THEM WHAT THEY
ARE DOING ABOUT IT , THEY SAY "HUH?".
 THERES A SAYING:
EVERYDAY DAY IN AFRICA A LION WAKES UP. HE KNOW THAT
HE MUST RUN FASTER THAN THE SLOWEST ANTELOPE OR HE WILL STARVE TO DEATH.
EVERYDAY THE ANTELOPE WAKES AND KNOW HE MUST BE
ABLE TO RUN FASTER THAN THE FASTEST LION.
EITHER WAY, NO MATTER WHO YOU ARE, WHEN YOU WAKE UP-YOU BETTER BE RUNNING!!!

GOD BLESS TO ALL!
BEN SPARKS
C.R.C. <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>  <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>  <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':p'>  <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'>
 
my point with the mali example was that the show was advertised as cb only, so the customer believed that everything in the show was cb.  i was selling cb malis for $60, two other tables were selling wc for $25-35.  because of the promotion of the show, the customer did not believe that wc animals would be allowed in and just thought i was overpricing for the same quality animal.  i could not convince her without badmouthing the promoter and other vendors (saying they were misrepresenting their animals and breaking the rules of the show), which i didnt feel right about doing.  

of course, not being a big name means you have to charge less...i could never charge dragons den prices for my beardeds even if they have the same coloration, just because of their name.  i have no problem with that.  but the import vs cb situation is different.  

all i meant is that when promoters call a show "cb only" and then i have to go in with cb animals to compete against wc prices, without the public understanding, it is very difficult.  i think this was a point Kelli was making as well.  i have no problem with people selling wc quality animals at shows, i just wish that the advertising was honest so i have some sort of backing or credibility for my prices--that way i could be a lot more convincing about why i am charging more.

i will admit that the public needs to open their eyes a bit.  i would think it would be pretty easy to tell the difference between a fat cb baby uro compared to a dehydrated import.  anyways, it was just meant to be one example.  i'm sure the ball python example is a better one (wc balls at cb only shows).

Dana
 
Okay, good points are kinda made on both sides.  I have to agree with Dana on this, and this is part of the point I tried to make earlier.  By selling your cheap imports for so much less than those who WORK to keep a CB population going, you make the ones that are truly committed to the animal look like greedy pigs for charging more than you.  And ESPECIALLY when you do this at what is supposed to be a CB show.  In other words, the vendor that does that is flat out lying to the customer, but since capitolism promotes competition(or is it the other way around;) ), it is okay to lie to the customer to make the sale.  
We will use your car analogy...
The person WANTS a Geo.  They go look at brand new ones at a dealership, but the used Geo at Lou's Used Cars is cheaper.  So they buy the Geo from Lou, but Lou is dishonest in representing the car and the engine completely dies in a week and the car is useless.  That is okay because it promoted capitolistic competition, am I right?  The buyer got completely screwed and lied to, but that is okay according to your thinking, am I right?  
Please don't think I am trying to bash you or anything, I am just trying to get a handle if that is the way you are thinking or not, because it seems that way to ME at least.  
And as I have stated before, there is NO problem with selling healthy established WC animals, but selling fresh crappy imports super cheap doesn't do ANYONE any good.  And also as I stated, if the seller honestly represents the animal as fresh WC, that is one thing and it is buyer beware, but then again, why are you selling FRESH imports to somebody(especially when it is a kid who doesn't know better)?

Also, there are reasons why wildlife officials don't just want you breeding animals and turning them loose.  The biggest of which is disease.  That is part of why Gopher Tortoises are in alot of trouble.  Back when it was legal to keep them, people would catch one and throw it out back in the pen with their sulcattas/leopards/whatever and the Gopher picks up some funky disease.  Well, for whatever reason, the gopher tortoise or its offspring are released back into the wild, and whammo(a scientific term mind you <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'> ) gophers start dropping like flies from some previously unkown respiratory disease.  Also, what if you attempt to repatriate the snakes to an area where they do not naturally occur?  Why do you think red-eared sliders are being pulled from lakes in the extreme northern US?  They don't belong there, but they were put there unnaturally and are surviving and outcompeting other native species.  

Aaah, ranting again.
 
AS YOU ALL HAVE SUMMIZED I THINK EVERYONES IN AGREEMENT THAT:
C.B. SHOWS SHOULD BE EXACTLY THAT-CAPTIVE BORN AND
PREFFERABLY BRED, AND DEFINELTY IN THE US. BREEDERS CAN NOT AND SHOULD NOT BE EXPECTED TO COMPETE WITH
"IMPORT QUALITY" ANIMALS.

IF A SHOW IS C.B. / W.C. THEN ALL VENDORS SHOULD REPRESENT THEIR ANIMALS HONESTLY AND IF YOU SEE SOMEONE WHO OBVIOUSLY IS NOT REPRESENTING HIS/HER
ANIMALS HONESTLY OR CORRECTLY - GO TO THE PROMOTERS
AND REPORT. IF YOU DONT HAVE THE BRASS TO DO THAT THEN (IN MY OPIONION) YOU SHOULDNT COME WHINING HERE. LIKE GRANDMA SAYS-IF YA CANT TAKE THE HEAT GET OUT OF THE KITCHEN.

WHAT ORIGINALLY STARTED THIS THREAD WAS A MAN WHO
BOUGHT A GTP FROM A VENDOR AT ONE OF THE TEXAS SHOWS. THE VENDOR TOLD THE MAN STRAIGHT OUT THAT IT
WAS A WILD CAUGHT SNAKE. THE BUYER DIDNT GET THE VENDORS NAME, BUSINESS CARD, CARE SHEET ETC.... AND
THEN STARTED COMPLAINING ON A FORUM ABOUT HOW THE VENDOR SHOULDNT HAVE SOLD THE SNAKE TO HIM. I HAVE A FEELING THAT THE BUYER IS A GROWN MAN AND CAN MAKE GROWN UP DECISIONS ALL BY HIMSELF. AND IF HE WOULD HAVE SIMPLY CONTACTED THE VENDOR, THE VENDOR WOULD HAVE GONE OUT OF HIS WAY TO MAKE SURE HE WAS SATISFIED.

BOTTOM LINE TO ME IS, WE ARE ALL GROWN ADULTS WHO DO THESE SHOWS. IF YOU DONT HAVE THE BRASS TO GO TO
THE VENDOR OR PROMOTER WITH YOUR CONCERNS THEN YOU
SHOULDNT BE SELLING. IF YOU WERE WALKING DOWN THE STREET AND SAW A HALF DEAD DOG LAYING THERE, OR A LADY IN DISTRESS, WOULD YOU JUST KEEP ON WALKING HOME SO YOU COULD TELL YOUR SPOUSE ABOUT IT? OR WOULD YOU STOP AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT  IT? I THINK EVERYONE NEEDS TO BE PROACTIVE AT THESE SHOWS.  WE
HAVE TO BE THE EYES AND EARS WHEN THE PROMOTERS CANT BE.  
I'M THE SAME AS MOST, I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH ANYONE
SELLING WC, CH, CB, CBB AS LONG AS ITS REPRESENTED THAT WAY. AND PROMOTERS DO NEED TO TRY TO KEEP AS CLOSE AN EYE ON THE VENDORS AS THEY CAN - ESPECIALLY
NOTORIUS ONES.
WELP, THATS MY RAMBLINGS FOR TODAY.
GOD BLESS TO ONE AND ALL
BEN SPARKS
C.R.C.
 
Rob, you're almost on my wave-length, but here's what I'm talking about.  Lou honestly represents the car (used, or in the case of an animal wc) and it is sold as is.  The buyer saves himself money and knows going in the car is used and sold as is.  Maybe the car makes it, maybe it doesn't.  If the engine blows, (or the animal has a problem), the customer can then use some of the money they saved to fix the problem.  It's the customer's job to know the difference and make the decision.  Not the town council in Lou's city of business.  
Dishonesty blows the whole equation, that's not what I'm talking about.  I don't agree with the idea of cb. only shows.  Or cities where you can't buy a used car. <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':p'>

Dana, don't take this the wrong way, but if the customers couldn't tell the difference, was there really $35 worth of difference there?  Most of the Malis I work w/ (wc only) do absolutely great in captivity).  And I also agree w/ Ben that if you didn't complain then, you don't get to now.  You paid for tables at a "captive born only" show, and the promoter failed to delivery those conditions, so you HAD a legitimate complaint.  But if the customer goes to Lou's and buys what Lou tells him was a new car and then finds out otherwise.  It's the customers job to give Lou a chance to or make Lou fix that situation. <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>
 
i did mention concern to people "in charge" in this particular situation--(though probably not in the ballsy way you guys would approve of), i just didnt feel right about doing it to a customer--i felt it would make me look bad to badmouth other vendors to a potential customer.  
of course, sometimes the promoters dont care and scoff at you for even mentioning anything--thinking you are being petty.  caring more about the $ from the vendors than the animals being sold (isnt it usually the ones that have paid for 6 tables that are selling the crap).  wasnt there a discussion about vendors actually being threatened that if they do the DFW show--in protest or not, they would no longer be allowed to do other shows?  unless you live in florida, as a vendor you are really limitted to the number of shows that you can do...you try not to burn too many bridges and be a polite businessperson.  you need the venues. technically, it is probably better for the consumer to voice complaints to promoters--they might listen more.

and as for having no business "whining" here about it, well, isnt this a discussion (a rather good one too in my opinion)--and if we can come to certain agreements within groups as breeders/dealers, arent we more likely to get somewhere? i have certainly been made more aware of certain issues by following this thread.  perhaps the fact that the quality of shows seems to be diminishing is in part due to the fact that breeders/dealers do not discuss these issues publicly. i know for me, this discussion has made me more willing to make issue at shows--less for my personal gain and more for the market and public (sounds cheesy but true).  personally, it has never really bothered me that much to compete against imports at a cb only show--as i said before, dont we know as vendors know that cb only doesnt really mean cb only--i just took it as the way things are (until i got involved with this thread, lol).  the only animals that i breed that i run into this problem are not major money makers anyways so i'm not as hurt as others may be in a business sense.  not too much for me to complain about on a personal level--but now that i'm fired up about it... this is really more about the ethics of shows for the consumers, education, and for other breeders who deal with a lot of geckos and snakes that are also imported.  people working to breed animals that are heavily imported should be applauded, they are certainly not profitable.  just represent them honestly--dont call your darn show cb only if it's not.

I would like to think that our animals speak for themselves, but unfortunately, a lot of the general public who are buying their first reptiles or like to stay in the under $100 range, cant tell the difference between a cb fat baby uro and an adult wc dehydrated, parasite ridden one (especially if they are both represented as cb)--they just see that one is a baby one is an adult, gee shouldnt the baby cost less???  (i'll take pics for you next time, lol--and come on, your uros may be nice, but you know what the majority out there look like).  not to mention, what they look like up front in a deli cup, doesnt necessarily represent what kind of a pet they will be in terms of acclimation and adjusting, temperement, vet attention, deworming, etc.
how about the 12 year old girl buying a half dead 3 inch dragon?  or the skinny wc ball python that isnt eating?  we all know that the general public is quite uneducated when it comes to reptiles and health issues, and when it comes to cheap animals, the public seems to be blind.  just look at pet stores like petco--and those animals sell like hotcakes! the 3 inch dragon, non-feeding ball, etc shouldnt have even made it through the door of a show.  and no wc animal should make it into a cb only show.  i think we all agree with that.

dont we need to be part of the education effort as well--not see it as live-and-learn if you buy an animal and have a hard time with it--who cares, we got the money already.  if not us, who?  if you are selling an animal for $30 you should know you will likely sell to a kid, and please know enough about that species to help that kid out with the animal's care.
i know i give caresheets out to anyone who buys from me and do my best to help them with whatever they need to give their animal a happy and healthy life.  to me it matters what happens to the animal after it leaves my hands, my customers' happiness with the animal also matters. maybe i'm overzealous.

i think we are all mostly in agreement--honesty, no sick animals, etc etc... less drastic importing--more going to the breeders than the trash...
i still think a lot of interesting issues have been brought up in this thread.  

maybe i'm going overboard on certain things, i dont know.  

more ramblings from me
dana
 
WELL SAID DANA,
I KNOW IT CAN BE HARD FOR ALOT OF PEOPLE TO CONFRONT
OTHERS. THE WAY I LOOK AT PEOPLE DOING THE SHOWS IS
THIS:
YOU ARE IN IT MAINLY FOR THE MONEY
OR
YOU ARE IN IT MAINLY FOR THE ANIMALS.
ONE OR THE OTHER WILL COME OUT IN FRONT WHERE PEOPLES MOTIVES ARE CONCERNED.
IE..
IF I AM IN IT FOR THE MONEY, THEN THIS IS MY LIVELY-HOOD. I WILL NOT STAND BY AND LET A COMPETITOR TAKE
MONEY OUT OF MY POCKET BY KNOWINGLY DECIEVING THE
PUBLIC. I WILL STAND UP TO HIM OR ANYONE ELSE BECAUSE
HE'S KEEPING FOOD OFF MY 3Y/O'S PLATE!! I WILL NOT LET
THAT HAPPEN!
IF I AM IN IT FOR THE ANIMALS, THEN I AM GOING TO STAND
UP FOR THE ANIMALS. IF A VENDOR SELLS A HALF DEAD 3"
DRAGON TO A 10 Y/O , I AM GOING TO SAY "HEY MAN, WHAT
ARE YOU DOING GIVING THAT DRAGON A DEATH SENTENCE??"
EITHER WAY TRY TO STAND UP FOR YOUR RIGHTS AND THE
RIGHTS OF THE ANIMALS. DONT LET THE WORRY OF BURNING
BRIDGES COMPREMISE YOUR MORALS. IF I DECIDED TO DO
THE NEW DFW ALL C.B. SHOW AND A PROMOTER OF ANOTHER
SHOW TRIED TO BLACKLIST ME, THEY WOULD BE MORE THAN
WELCOME. HOW MUCH GOOD WILL IT DO THEM WHEN PEOPLE
COME OUT AND SAY WHAT THEY DID?? (ALBIET I FIRMLY BELIEVE THAT BONNIE AND JAMES WHO RUN THE TEXAS SHOWS WOULD NOT "BLACKLIST ANYONE".)
 ONE THING I HAVE LEARNED AND CAN SAY WITH 100% CONFIDENCE IS THIS :
STAND UP FOR WHAT YOU BELIEVE IS MORALLY RIGHT, NO MATTER WHAT THE CONSEQUENCE MAY BE. AND EACH TIME
YOU DO, PRAY ABOUT IT, ASK GOD TO BLESS YOU IN THE RIGHT THINGS YOU ARE TRYING TO DO. IT HAS NEVER FAILED
ME, ACTUALLY, GOD HAS NEVER FAILED ME. EVERYTIME I
(OR YOU) DO MY BEST TO DO WHATS RIGHT, GOD ALWAYS HAS MY BACK, AND WILL ALWAYS PROVIDE FOR ME. ALWAYS
HAS AND ALWAYS WILL. (BTW, IF ANYONE WOULD EVER LIKE
TO HEAR ABOUT WHAT GOD AND JESUS HAVE DONE FOR ME AND MY LIFE, AND WHAT THEY CAN DO FOR YOU , PLEASE
NEVER HESITATE TO EMAIL OR CALL ME - THATS SOMETHING I CAN TALK ABOUT ALLLLLLL DAY LONG.)
WELP, I BETTER GO GET SOME MORE COFFEE. THAT FIRST
GALLON JUST WORE OFF.

GOD BLESS AND GOD BE WITH ALL OF YOU
BEN SPARKS
C.R.C. <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>  <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>  <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>  <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>  <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>  <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>  <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>
 
Dana,

I am sure that you were not the only CB dealer there who was upset. Get a group of you together (nothing formal just grab a few) and go to the promoter. Make sure he understands your problem (expressed in a non-emotional, logical manner like you've done here) and that all of you will look for other shows if he won't address them. Make sure he knows that you are an active member of boards like this and will spread the facts about his show. Once he sees that you won't just get mad and rollover and that there is more than one dealer upset common business sense will make sure that he follows through on fixing the issues. The promoter gets his paycheck from you so you have power seat.

Marketing Tip: POD = Points of Difference. Broadcast "loudly" the reasons your animals are better. Consumers are not "bright" enough to pick out the differences in reptiles (compared to someone that has raised them from day one and deals with reptiles on a daily basis). Explain to them the signs of dehydration when they come to your table. That way when they go down the aisle they will notice the difference between yours and the WC ones that are poorly taken care of.

Thanks for relaying your experiences though. I am getting a sign made up ... "Benefits of CB over WC" for our next show.  <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>
 
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