Shiloh Dorsett, Arizona C & S reptiles

[CrestedLady]

Paul what kind of reptiles do you sell? (Just curious...I can't buy anything right now since I don't have any money!) *grins*
~Sarah~
P.S. To everyone else, nothing yet. Getting frustrated. :-( Raghhghghgh!

 

[PAUL BOLLINGER]

Sarah

I was selling my collection which consisted of a bunch of odds and ends in order to fund my Southern Hognose Project. Right now I'm not selling anything. Just getting ready for an exciting year of breeding H. simus. -Sorry that you've not gotten any satisfaction with this person but, honestly it does not suprise me.
Good Luck,
Paul B

 

[Ken Harbart]

Has anyone notified him of this thread? I'd be interested in seeing what lame excuses he provides for his unethical behavior.

 

[CrestedLady]

I don't think anyone's told him, I'll go ahead and e-mail him.
~Sarah~

 

[CrestedLady]

One picture

 

[CrestedLady]

And the other one. It's pretty sad, but this is what I have. (these were taken after he'd been in the freezer for about 1 1/2 hours.)

 

[Ken Harbart]

"Lame excuses" may have been strong without actually hearing the other side of the story, but I tend to feel rather strongly about dealers that pull this type of crap.

He told her that he "couldn't take a hit on this" and picked up the phone to talk to me.

Too bad. His customer paid for two live geckos, but only received one. It's his responsibility to "take a hit on this."

[...]and then he e-mailed me, saying that he was not going to be held responsible since Paypal had charged him a $7 fee

That's the cost of doing business. If he can't deal with that, then he shouldn't be accepting PayPal. Sears doesn't screw their customers out of what they are entitled to, using such a lame excuse.. "Well, yeah...er did sell you defective merchandise, but Visa charged us a transaction fee, so we feel that we're right to screw you over."

and since shipping was $31 instead of $20

Tough luck for him. He quoted you a price. That was his fault, and does not relieve him from his responsibility.

That he was sorry[...]

Most con artists will say this.

Ever since, he's been very irrate and saying that he won't do anything.

I'd badger the hell out of him. While it seems he has no integrity, and every intention of screwing you out of what is rightfully yous, it will give you some satisfaction to annoy him to no end. He's counting on you just rolling over and taking the loss. Go ahead, give him an ulcer.

[...]and that he'll draw me into a legal battle. (that he's contacted a lawyer, etc.)

I can all but guarantee you that, in addition to being a shoddy businessman, he's also a liar. Call his bluff, as he's merely trying to bully you into taking the shafting that he's trying to give. Hell, I'd even take it one step further- if it's a legal battle he wants, give him one. Yes, it's a small amount, but you may also be able to tack filing fees, etc, onto your claim. I'd go into your county's Magistrate Court and ask the clerk of the court what the procedure & fees would be to file suit against an out-of-state defendant.

 

[CrestedLady]

Sounds like a plan. I e-mailed him and asked him for the name of the lawyer that he consulted and also gave him the link to this thread. I also called Paypal today and they told me to be patient. You know, I also called one of the companies that I've ordered geckos from before and they said that this wasn't how a dealer should take care of a situation like this. If he didn't do something wrong, why isn't he e-mailing me? I'd call him, but it's a Sunday and I know how much he "hates" getting calls on the weekend. I'm not afraid of what he thinks, I've just had a good day and don't feel like getting yelled at. We'll see if he replies to this thread.
~Sarah~

 

[PeterFromme]

Important Fundamental Business Rule...

Not sure if you will get your money back. I hope you do. Importantly I think this guy will soon learn one of the first rules of business "Good cusomers tell on average 3-4 people of their experience. Angry customers tell on average 10-12 people of their experience." Thank you for posting your experience with this guy...I'm never buying from him. I'm many will refrain as well. Make sure to send him this response.....

PF

 

[W.Wedeking]

Is this the same?

http://market.kingsnake.com/detail.php?cat=51&de=135069

Here is a C&S Reptiles that is advertising on KS, but they say they are in Atlanta, GA.

 

[CrestedLady]

Yes, it is the same person...they're in Atlanta too???
~Sarah~

 

[CrestedLady]

I finally got an e-mail from him today, this is what he said....


This bash fest that youseems to think is going to help here cause is not only irritating but unprofessional. I specifically told her to go to my website, where it specifically states that we do no provide insurance on packages that are not insured. You wanted to try and bargain down the price and did not purchase insurance on the package and unfortunately I cant be responsibile for your actions. I have been in the reptile breeding business for years and see no reason why I should give you your money back for a gecko that you didnt even pay the 5 dollars to insure. Also, if you dont know to insure things that you buy off the internet, then you really needs to pick up a "Dummies guide to buying off the internet" because theres a whole lot of people out there just waiting to take you. Even at best, the female I sold her was an excellent breeder with that male and they were breeding only two days before I sent her! That male fathered 7 of my babies and was not unhealthy in the least! Get a clue! I have been shipping with Fed Ex and UPS without holes in the box for years. You dont know what your talking about and if there was anyone on the site that knew what they were talking about they would tell you this.... One did you check for a live arrival guarantee? No you didnt so I sent you to my webpage. Have you gone there yet. Probably not. Why dont you go there now. Two, I stand behind all my products and shouldnt have sold them to you as an unprofessional buyer..Dont try to make me out to a be a bad guy when I'm not.


Paypal also wrote me a letter saying that they wouldn't give my money back since the goods were shipped, even though they were damaged.


As stated in our User Agreement, PayPal's Buyer Complaint Policy only
applies to the shipment of goods, not to disputes about the attributes or
quality of goods received. Therefore, we cannot reverse this transaction or
issue a refund. We encourage you to continue to work directly with the
seller to amicably resolve this dispute.

PayPal does not tolerate fraud or illegal activities. Your complaint has
been noted in the record of the PayPal user you reported. If we find this
user has violated our policies, we will investigate and take appropriate
action. If this occurs, you may be contacted in the future about the status
of this complaint.

We appreciate your business, and regret this experience. To make sure
future transactions proceed smoothly, we suggest reading these Security
Tips:

http://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=p/gen/fraud-tips-buyers-outside

Sincerely,

PayPal Protection Services Department

Any ideas?????
~Sarah~

 

[CrestedLady]

This is the reply that I sent to his last e-mail.

I have been to your website. It has a big Satanic leaf tail gecko on it. I read your shipping terms and conditions and I understand them. When the gecko arrived, it was only around 75 degrees or so...maybe 76. That's not above 90 or below 30. As I've said before, you quoted the price of shipping and I paid it. I'm not a "dummy" so I don't need a book for one. Bargaining on a price has no issue in this matter since I paid you full price for the geckos...excuse me....gecko. (Since I'm so intelligent, I suppose that I should be 100% exact in this case.) You say that you should not be responsible for my actions, my actions being what? Paying you for a breeding pair and opening it to find only one? What exactly did I do wrong? Paid what you quoted for shipping, was that wrong? As for selling to an "unprofessional buyer"...what makes an "unprofessional" different from a "professional"? How is it any different if a company opened the box and saw a dead gecko? You think of yourself as a professional and you won't even give me a refund or replacement. You still haven't given back a dollar of the money that you took from me, even after saying that you were going to. I paid $100 for a male and I got a corpse...how "professional" is that?
~Sarah~

 

[gila7150]

When you paid through Paypal, did you use a credit card or just a bank account transfer? If you used a credit card, you should be able to dispute this charge through your credit card company to get a refund.

you really needs to pick up a "Dummies guide to buying off the internet" because theres a whole lot of people out there just waiting to take you.

He's right...but you don't need the book, you experienced it first hand dealing with this con artist.

why I should give you your money back for a gecko that you didnt even pay the 5 dollars to insure.

He may need the Dummies Guide to Shipping because Fedex isn't going to insure a package containing live reptiles.
Just curious, did this guy insulate the box with anything (styrofoam inserts)?

Thanks for the heads up on this loser,

 

[Darin Chappell]

Unfortunately, the odds of you getting any money back out of this guy are very low indeed. I would try to make a claim for refund on your credit card, assuming that's how you paid through PayPal. Other than that, I'm afraid little else can be done.

This guy is full of himself, isn't he? Well, at least his name is now listed as a guy that will not stand up for his animals when there is a problem. His business should suffer from this, and we all need to make certain that anyone who asks about him is pointed to this thread. He is definitely a BAD GUY!

Sarah, I'm really sorry you had this happen to you.

 

[Monte]

bad reps multiply . . .

. . . Funny, I'm in the market for a male crested and saw one of C&S Reptile's ads. I considered it - until I read this thread.

I can't figure out why people want to damage their reps over a relatively small amount of money. We're not talking expensive ball python morphs - these are crested geckos - and C & S Reptiles has hurt their reputation over it.

You can be sure that I will remember this thread. It's too bad this has to happen. C & S Reptiles could still rehabilitate their reputation by RESOLVING THIS ISSUE.

BAD REPS LINGER C & S Reptiles - give this gal a break.

It's the RIGHT THING TO DO.

Hang tough Sarah.

 

[W.Wedeking]

It sounds more like C&S is the one being unprofessional. There are pelnty of crested breeders out there so you definately have a choice and don't have to go through him.

I had seen their adds for dragons on Kingsnake and wasn't terribley impressed, but will now make sure to add them to the list of "NEVER BUY FROM".

If you purchased the geckos through an add C&S placed on Kingsnake, you can submitt a complaint to them. 3 unresolved complaints and their account will be frozen until they resolve them all. It may not help immediately, but it will help if others have this problem. With that attitude, I am sure others will.

 

[CrestedLady]

Thanks to everyone for your replies, they really do help. I paid with a credit card through Paypal and I did already call Bank of America...they temporarily returned my money, but I can't use it for 3 months until the entire investigation is over...so I still may not get it. :-(
I never set out to hurt this guy, if the deal had gone well, I would've left a completely different kind of message on this board. I seriously don't see how he can tell me that he's been in business for 10 years, especially when he treats his customers like this.
I spoke with another breeder of geckos that I buy from and they said that most would give some kind of refund or another gecko. *shrugs* I guess some guys are good, and some try to squirm out from under an obligation.
As for the bad reputation getting out, I really did just want the public to know about these people. Monte, if you're looking for some awesome people with some great reptiles... go to www.noahsboas.com I purchased a hatchling from them and they were great! Wendy, thanks for your advice. I'll keep everyone posted on what's going on. I still haven't received an e-mail back from Mr. Dorsett yet, though he usually writes back after a few days.
If you guys know of anyone trying to buy cresteds send them over to Noah's Boas. Mr. Perez has been so helpful and even took the time on a Sunday to give me a call and see how the gecko was doing and to talk with me about possibly obtaining a Rhacodactylus leachianus. (Hmm...I'd have to change my name to leachicrestedlady! *laughs*...yeah, I'm a dork.) He even took the time to discuss how he gutloads his crickets. (Mine all seem to be dying for some reason.) Really is a great guy, as is his wife. Well, great girl.

 

[Monte]

I think I might know the problem . . .

. . . I think a lot of people who sell herps aren't liquid enough. They get the money from paypal, and spend it immediately, instead of holding it until the transaction is complete (if they don't have a nest egg for these things). I think this is C&S's problem - and he's covering for it by making an argument. (Just my hunch)

I might be wrong - but I've had this hunch about a lot of herp dealers for a long time - the money comes in and goes out pretty fast.

It's OK to be liquid!!!

Keep us up to date. Thanks for the tip on Noah's Boa's - I actually have a few that originated from his line.

 

[TJEvans]

I couldn't agree with Monte more.

most of the problems here on this board could be solved rather quickly and painlessly if the people whom refunds are being requested actually had the money to refund.

In this case, I see a guy that got some money for possibly the last geckos he had for sale. He spent the money and then had no geckos to sacrifice. Therefore, since he found himself in a position to never be able to repay the customer, he tries to weasel his way out of it.

This is just my opinion......it may not be the case at all.........

Though, monte hit it right on the head.......People need to collect money from a transaction and KEEP it for a specific ammount of time before spending it on other things. Even if they kept it until receiving an e-mail from the customer saying how pleased they are with the deal. If your really hurting for money to pay the bills, that you'll spend your income that quickly, then maybe you need to find another line of work, or a day job that can be supplimented by your reptile "business." In all reality, most people in this "business" that have succeeded in making it their primary income either own and operate pet stores, or already had the capital to sustain themselves, regadless of their profits. Most, I'm sure, have another occupation outside of reptiles.

Some of the best dealers/breeders I know, also work "day" jobs. Some just need to be aware that their income from their "day" job, might have to make up for bad situations that come with dealing in livestock.

Thanks
Todd Evans