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Should personal issues be drug into the BOI or any other forum for that matter?

Like I said, it was probably just me that did not want to read about all of the personal private stuff to get to the real issue that took me 2 days to get to since I'm sick and haven't been able to sit at the screen for a long period of time to real 2 hours of posting personal issues to get to the post Tere posted that is:

I posted 3 of the Dachiu dragons on Reptileauction.com as a group. I had 4 total bids on the auction, 2 by Rtreptiles, 2 by bigmanjulio. Bigmanjulio won the auction. I emailed bigmanjulio twice after the auction and never received a response. I started getting a feeling that I had been taken…so I did a little research.

The contact information for bigmanjulio is: Julio Espasito, 1122 Free Lane, Freemont, Florida 33112. His email address is [email protected]. First, I searched the name Julio Espasito. From what I could find, there is no such person living in the State of Florida. According to the post office, 1122 Free Lane is not an existing address in Florida, and Freemont is not a town in Florida. The zip code 33112 is one of the zip codes for Miami. Once I started looking at the address, I noticed the use of the word “FREE”. I thought that was strange…there was only one person on the face of the earth that would have the view that I got these dragons for free…Mike Shoemaker. I also thought the use of a Miami zip code was odd, since the zip code of the man that started all this heartache for me, Mitch/Frank/whoever Triana, lives in Miami. I made a few contacts and asked if anyone could hunt down the ISP address of bigmanjulio. Once the ISP address for bigmanjulio was found, that ISP address was compared to that of Mike Shoemaker, and guess what? THEY MATCHED!!!
 
I honestly do not see what someones private relationship and private issues has to do with the fact that apparantly "someone" bid on "someones" auction with the intent to not pay just to leave a negative feedback.

Thats the only BOI issue I see from all of those long post is the fake user name auction bidding, not who argued about an amount of money for upkeep or who wanted to end a relationship etc, etc, etc.
 
Wendy

The only reason you see things this way is because YOU believe Mike's "side" of things. Maybe you should enlighten yourself first...he badmouthed you too, you know.
 
Tere, you are correct, I do believe what Mike told me 100% because as I told Paul all he told me was that he lived with you, he made some mistakes and things did not work out and he had lied to a few people that he was trying to make apologies to.He told me that you and Paul had helped him out, a place to live, money etc. And that things did not work out and he was upset about it. He never went into personal detail other than that Cory stayed with you and I didn't ask.

He also said that Paul was a great guy, with great animals and that Paul took amazing care of his animals, this prompted me to go to Pauls site and I am making a purchase from him for some leos and a baby ball python for my Cody's upcoming birthday.

He said that you Tere, had soem amazing dragons and that you had hatched a lot of babies recently and he hoped you did well with selling them all.

Mike and I have talked more about how hard it is to get over a long term relationship than anything else.

Everything he said to me about you and Paul were great things, so yes I believe that Paul has nice animals and cares for them well and that you have nice dragons and are selling recently hatched babies. What is there not to beleive about that?

Did he lie to me about you and Paul being good people?
 
Done

Wendy-

I'm done...I'm done with Fauna, I'm done in the reptile community...I'm just done.

No matter what I say or do, someone is always there to tell me what I did or said wrong.

I'm tired of trying to defend myself when I'VE DONE NOTHING WRONG!!!!!!!
 
Tere, Im not sure what you are talking about, I think you need to take a deep breathe.

I never asked you to defend yourself, why would I, all I have ever heard are good things about you and your dragons!
 
dragonflyreptiles said:
I honestly do not see what someones private relationship and private issues has to do with the fact that apparantly "someone" bid on "someones" auction with the intent to not pay just to leave a negative feedback..
Click to expand...
I've seen enough here (the posted IP research from more than one person, the "pattern" of actions of said person) to know that it wasn't just "someone" and "someones", it was someone who went out of their way to sabotage a bid. Why would it be the same person who seems to be on the wrong side of all these "personal" stories? Just coincidence? To me the fact that this person went to all the trouble (fake address, "clever" use of "free", outta Florida where Tere had previous trouble)to ruin the persons auction, lends more credibility to the stories and what happened. As another poster mentioned, maybe you have a bias showing.


dragonflyreptiles said:
Thats the only BOI issue I see from all of those long post is the fake user name auction bidding, not who argued about an amount of money for upkeep or who wanted to end a relationship etc, etc, etc.
Click to expand...
There was a lot of personal info, but I think more than just the fraudulent action was helpful, IE. it appears that the great animal someone received, and he took credit for, wasn't even one of his, it was one he recently received from Daichu. There is info that the person has poor husbandry issues, from cleaning to even feeding the animals (more than two posters seem to cooberate this). A lot of this is he/said, she said, but there seems to be a pattern and there are several people who have similar stories, given that and the fraudulent reptileauction actions, I may be wrong, but I'm leaning towards the preponderance of "evidence" JMO
 
And we all needed to know that his relationship ended and that his partner is still with Tere, that was so helpful is getting to the Auction issue.

His husbandry has nothing to do with the fake bid, like I said all of that could have FOLLOWED the issue that was being posted about and being proven.

How many post and paragraphs should a person have to find out that Mike, created a fake name to bid on an auction of Tere's just so he could leave her negative feedback.

My only Bias is that I am sick, me and my children have been fighting the flu bug for almost 2 weeks. And not only that I value my time, Id liek to k now the issue and proof immediately so I can make a post or thought about it. I don't want to read through a ton of stuff to ge tto the issue and a ton more to get to the proof. That is just silly to think anyone wants to know every personal detail to get to the point and proof.

The personal stuff COULD have been used as back up AFTER the POINT and PROOF were posted.

Sorry thats how I feel and Im not going to repeat myself over and over because some do not understand that I wanted to know what the issue was and the proof BEFORE I had to sit through a coupel of hours of personal backup.

I think most people, courts etc. would want:

#1 the Charge
#2 the Proof
#3 the personal issues from either side to help support the case

not the other way around!
 
All what was written here is really good. The BOI is about specific transactions, also it is about if they area good guy or not. That particular thread on both Tere and Paul's part was relevant to them. They were taken by a "Good Guy" in more ways than just being taken on an auction. There was a lot of financial issues according to them.

If it does not apply to the issue than, no, personal drama does not need to be in the BOI, if it is use to cover their side, than yes, it is relevant. I agree that the order needs to be as you stated Wendy. I would rather have read it all in that order, but that did not happen, all well, it is there and I read it.
 
Micheal,

My gripe was selfish really, I am sick, kids are sick and I had a hard time getting to and reading so much. Any other time I would have not though twice about it and should not have really thought anything this time Im sure. I should haev just said, well Im sick, don't have time to read and skipped it. But I felt there was an issue there and wanted to get it and see what the deal was. Again selfish at best.

But I started the thread, really tired, with one contact, coughing and sneezing among other things lol

Got a lot of views from it and all in all it ended the way it should have.
 
Hey Wendy,

Isnt this thread you started nothing more than a personal issue itself... :raspberry

Sorry, could not pass it up. I hope you and the youngins get to feeling better. My household just got over a 2 week battle with a cold bug ourselves.
 
Yeppers Sammy, kinda personal thing I had not being able to get to the issue, Im slow right now yet not so private I guess since I brought it up.

Thanks, Cody is feeling much better, so much better than he is driving me a little batty, he can't understand why I can't hear from my right ear (infection) and don't answer him all the time lol
 
I agree with everything that has been said here for the most part. I do agree that personal spats do not belong on the BOI.I would like to point something however...(Disclaimer: this is not in reference to any one particular thread on the BOI, just any post in general)
If someone has information that pertains to someone's character, I feel this is extremely revelant on the BOI. Personally, I do not want to buy from anyone or sell any of my animals to anyone that has questionable ethics. PERIOD. I do not want to buy an animal from someone who has...let's say "has no credibility"...if they will lie to one person, they will most certainly lie to you. Doesn't matter what it is about.
Or let's say someone wants to buy an animal from me...Well I will be damned if I am going to sell one of my babies to someone who is known for having "questionable husbandry practices" or someone I feel is not going to take care of my babies. I don't think anyone here on Fauna would want that. I personally have not responded to "teenagers or children" who have contacted me wanting to buy animals because I questioned the well being of the animal. It is the same thing here.
What folks do in their personal life is a reflection on how they are likely to conduct business, plain and simple.
Now I also do not feel like reading for an hour just to get to the point...just say it short and simple and if you are asked to go into detail later that is fine..
Personally, I want to know who I am dealing with all the way around. At least you can get some kind of an idea from other people's experiences. It is still no guarantee.
Just my opinion..
 
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Wendy-

I do have one more thing to say about this and then I promise I will shut up. Are you at all aware of the timing of posting this thread about Mike? We posted in when we did because you are due to send him a box of geckos on Monday.

dragonflyreptiles said:
His husbandry has nothing to do with the fake bid, like I said all of that could have FOLLOWED the issue that was being posted about and being proven.
Click to expand...

So yes, you see, his husbandry practices are QUITE relevant here. The fact that Paul and I addressed the husbandry issue was aimed at you in an indirect way. When we noticed that you and Mike were doing a lot of PMing to each other, Paul said "we HAVE to get this information on there tonight!" Translation...before Wendy sends those geckos to Mike.

So thank you, Michele, for addressing that. I couldn't have said it any better, only I thought Wendy would like to know this part was specifically for her.

I am sorry that Paul and I didn't put things in the order that some of you would have, but I tried to go about things in a timline fashion for easier reading and comprehension. I realized it was a lot of information, and wanted everyone to be able to put things together without having to jump around to do it...heck, it was hard enough for me to understand it all and I lived it.
 
Tere,

I did plan to GIVE Mike 4 normal females as pets for the price of shipping alone since he said he missed his reptiles.

I was to ship them tomorrow, I received an email yesterday am before I received the money order late afternoon, that I was to just keep the cash he sent for shipping and not to send the leos.

I wasn't sure why he wanted to do that but I knew he (and everyone else) knew that hubby had lost his job and Cody goes to an academy school with no buses so I drive him. Even if there were buses I would drive him.

Anyway, after he wrote that to me I offered to still send them to him since the deal was made, he said no, just use the money for what your family needs. I then offered to pay him back for the money later after our income problems were better or at tax time and he said, no, keep the money and the leos and don't worry about it.

So I really didn't get the husbandry issues pertaining to me, I guess since the leos being sent to him were already a "don't send them and here is some cash to help" issue to me.
 
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OK Im back with more time, maybe, Sorry Tere and Paul, I just think it could have been posted in a more readable way for others.

Im sure you had it all in line of what happened and what you wanted and needed to say but to "outsiders" from the situation it was/is a hard read to get to the actual points that are important.
 
I just dont understand it. In one hand you have someone that gives money to another to help them out yet the same person is lying to others about the living conditions of them and thier children and trying to get money out of them. I think i need to talk to a shrink to figure out the inner mind of what is going on in this one.
A lot of time personal issues go a long way as far as the motivation and cause for people to do what they do. Sometime a persons personal issues are the root cause of what they have done. To confront the personal issues along with the legal issues and the business issues at one time usually gives you a much broader and more understandable view of the person in question.
Can the people with this many issues turn themselves around??? Only time will tell??? Do people with this many issues need to seek help for themselves berfore seeking to help resolve thier issues with others...you bet.
 
Again Nick, read the thread, Mike has NO children and that I know of never claimed to.

Mike has already admitted he did wrong and is in therapy as you suggest he needs to be.

There are other issues about your point you can find in the thread maybe.
 
Just so that everyone knows where I stand on the Mike Shoemaker thread....

I liked having to post the conversation I had with Mike about as much as I liked hearing some of the horrible and troubling things he had to say.

If what I posted only served to annoy and disturb other members then I truly apologize.
 
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