Bad Guy The Rat Deli aka Keisha West

[acheela]

Steer CLEAR of these guys! I ordered a "test" Shipment of 2 packs of pink rats on 1/2/14. After 11 days of waiting, the website still said my order was pending. After two emails, and two phone calls I got this response:

Keisha West
To Me
Jan 14 at 7:42 AM
You order will ship out today.

Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2014 19:19:49 -0800
From: [email protected]
Subject: Where's my order?? Second email
To: [email protected]

Invoice #3055, placed on 1/3/14, STILL no change in status from "pending". Two phone calls have gone unanswered, and this is second email inquiry. I would greatly appreciate if you could tell me SOMETHING?? I understand things happen at times, but no communication this day in age is very unprofessional.

I then emailed the next day to see if they had indeed shipped, since the website still said "pending."

No response... I sent 4th email...

Me
To [email protected]
Jan 15 at 8:44 PM
I emailed you yesterday inquiring if you had indeed shipped my package as promised. You stated it would go out on Tuesday the 13th. The status is still pending, I got no reply from you on whether you honored your statement, I have no tracking number, and nothing from ups, or fedex stating that anything has been picked up and heading my way. What's up? Am I going to get what I paid for, or did you just rip me off? My phone # is 325-280-****... you can call, text, email, or send up a smoke signal with my tracking number if you would please.

I then got this a couple of hours later...

[email protected]
To Me
Jan 15 at 10:29 PM
The Rat Deli
PO Box 1422
Kernersville, NC 27285
US
Order Confirmation
Order #3055
Placed: 01/03/2014 06:56:43 EST
Status: Shipped

Thank you for your order. Below is a summary for your records. You may check the status of your order here. Feel free to contact us via email or at 3365777621 for assistance with this order.
Bill To
Name: gerri boggs
Email: [email protected]
Phone: 325280****
Address: ********
abilene, TX 79603
US
Ship To
Name: gerri boggs
Email: [email protected]
Phone: 325280****
Address: **********
abilene, TX 79603
US
Code Product Quantity Total
pinkyrats Pinky Rats 2 $17.50
Shipping: UPS Ground:
Sales Tax:
Total:
$13.23
$0.00
$30.73

And this later in the day...

On Friday, January 17, 2014 6:08 AM, Keisha West <[email protected]> wrote:
Your order was shipped and you should have been sent a tracking number. Your order should be there Friday (today). If not please let us know.

Thank you for your business.

Well, it got here alright, completely thawed, and NOT vacuum packed as advertised. I have escalated my paypal claim so hopefully I will get my money back soon. The rats were thrown into a 10X10X10 styrofoam container with no packing and no dry ice, I have taken pictures in case they might be needed for the claim on paypal, or if any more is needed to back up my claim here.

 

[ShadowAceD]

Post the photos here, please.

 

[acheela]

I know it's hard to tell that they are thawed, but you can see the pink color instead if the whitish color they should be, also, I lifted the side of the bag away from the rats to show they were not vacuum packed. I also tried to show the dead space inside the container, and the size of the container.

 

[ShadowAceD]

Because I enjoyed The Rat Deli's quality and service for a while, I want to repost this so people understand that this is NOT The Rat Deli that used to be based out of Texas.

That facility is no more.

That business is no more.

People who clearly lack the ability to understand quality that comes from hard work and dedication bought the name for a business in North Carolina.

-------- Original message --------
From: Most Awesomest <*****@aol.com>
Date: 11/28/2013 9:46 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: [email protected]
Subject: A Few Questions About The Rat Deli


Hello,

My name is Diem Boubede, I have been ordering from you guys since last year because your quality of rodents for the price you offer was exceptional compared to most other suppliers in the nation.


I have recently been informed that you guys have been bought out by someone else, and I was concerned as to if this was true or not. The information I am being given is that the purchasers of this business are new to rat breeding and supplying and there are concerns about quality suffering over time. I hope I am offering no offense by bringing this up, but the life of my animals relies on the quality of the product I offer them to eat, so this is a big deal to me. I have already had to switch providers three times since leaving Florida or Arizona.

If you could please offer some insight into this matter, I would greatly appreciate it. Thank you.

Sincerely,
Diem

-----Original Message-----
From: theratdeli <[email protected]>
To: Most Awesomest <*********@aol.com>
Sent: Thu, Nov 28, 2013 11:13 pm
Subject: RE: A Few Questions About The Rat Deli

It is true we purchased The Rat Deli about 3 months ago. We appreciate your concern and hope you will continue ordering from us. We are confident you will be pleased with our product and service. We have heard that several breeders are unhappy about us competing in there market and if those folks weren't talking...we doubt anyone would ever know about this change. We are currently growing leaps and bounds and are excited about our success. We look forward to supplying you with all your feeder needs. We also breed snakes and many different reptiles and would not send out a feeder we wouldn't feed our own.
If at any time you have questions or concerns feel free to contact us.
Management
Sent via the Samsung Galaxy Note® II, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone



They haven't even changed the website. All they did was alter the phone number.

This is a lie:

"The Rat Deli is a family owned and operated frozen feeder business.

We have been in business since 1994 providing quality service and product to our customers.

With over 30 years of reptile experience we work hard to ensure you receive a quality product.

If you have any questions call our number for any information you need. "

That pertained to the ORIGINAL owner. Not the new ones.

 

[SofaKing]

Well atleast the Styrofoam box wasn't mis labeled, There was less then 5lbs of dry ice in it

 

[acheela]

You got that right!! I have yet to hear back from them about giving me a refund.

 

[Lucille]

You got that right!! I have yet to hear back from them about giving me a refund.

If you escalated your case on Paypal they may be hesitant to issue your (deserved) refund in case Paypal also issues a refund simultaneously.

 

[Roerep]

I attended the Raleigh, NC Show yesterday and met some of the "Rat Deli" staff...three teenagers. It may be that they've gotten in over their heads. Hopefully you'll get this resolved.

 

[houseofscales]

I attended the Raleigh, NC Show yesterday and met some of the "Rat Deli" staff...three teenagers. It may be that they've gotten in over their heads. Hopefully you'll get this resolved.

If I'm not mistaken, the company is not owned by those teenagers. I believe my friend Rob (Rob Wynne) was telling me that the company is owned by two older twins who decided to have a go at producing rats and snakes. I'll see if I can get him to come on here and clear that part up for me. If it is the same guys though, they DEFINITELY don't have the "30+ years of reptile experience" like it says on the website. They just got in to the business within the past year or two, and if they're the same guys Rob was telling me about, they killed a large number of snakes in their personal collection, because they didn't know what they were doing.

 

[ShadowAceD]

If I'm not mistaken, the company is not owned by those teenagers. I believe my friend Rob (Rob Wynne) was telling me that the company is owned by two older twins who decided to have a go at producing rats and snakes. I'll see if I can get him to come on here and clear that part up for me. If it is the same guys though, they DEFINITELY don't have the "30+ years of reptile experience" like it says on the website. They just got in to the business within the past year or two, and if they're the same guys Rob was telling me about, they killed a large number of snakes in their personal collection, because they didn't know what they were doing.

Ted, what was quoted from that website was written by the original owners not them. They changed NOTHING on the site except for the phone number.

Nothing these guys have done seems on the up and up to me. And seeing that rodents are coming in not vacuum sealed and on meat trays anymore even though, once again, they have no changed that information on the website is enough for me to say "Good-bye" to them.

I still cannot get over buying a business out and telling NONE of the customer base.

 

[wlcmmtt]

Hey Diem, thanks for the response. I'm actually the one that posted the post you were responding to. Apparently, the last time Ted was at my place, he posted an ad, and forgot to log out (honestly, not entirely sure if he clicked "remember me" or if google chrome somehow kept him logged in.

Not that the mistake changes what I was saying, but I figured I should go ahead and clear that up now, since Ted is NOT the one that made that post. I alerted Webslave to it, and he said it'd be best if I just explained the mistake, since posts on the BOI aren't deleted.

 

[skiddog820]

If I'm not mistaken, the company is not owned by those teenagers. I believe my friend Rob (Rob Wynne) was telling me that the company is owned by two older twins who decided to have a go at producing rats and snakes. I'll see if I can get him to come on here and clear that part up for me. If it is the same guys though, they DEFINITELY don't have the "30+ years of reptile experience" like it says on the website. They just got in to the business within the past year or two, and if they're the same guys Rob was telling me about, they killed a large number of snakes in their personal collection, because they didn't know what they were doing.

yes there "the twins" .. the ones that bought my entire table at the raleigh show a few months ago and other vendors also.. they bought there way into the hobby and bought there way into the rodent breeding business also .. the teenagers are the sons and i believe a cousin or two also
had a number of vendors ask me about them yesterday and today at the show, the "twins" were wandering the show and trying to chat up other vendors..
and had alotttttt of customers complain about the teenagers and the rodent they were selling (mainly overwhelming smell)

 

[acheela]

I still have gotten no response from them on the inquiries about my refund. It takes paypal a while to issue refunds because they give the other party time to respond.... which they have not done.... big surprise.

 

[Lucille]

I have escalated my paypal claim

Once you escalate a dispute to a claim, Paypal renders a decision. The other party make be hesitant to give you a refund after escalation because Paypal may refund simultaneously.

 

[Chameleon Company]

I still have gotten no response from them on the inquiries about my refund. It takes paypal a while to issue refunds because they give the other party time to respond.... which they have not done.... big surprise.

As noted, it is exceedingly unlikely that you will receive a voluntary refund while you have a PayPal dispute pending, as it is essentially in the hands of PayPal until they rule. And they will not until the full response period has expired.

It is exceedingly unlikely that they will rule in your favor, as you did receive a shipment. That is PayPal policy. However unsatisfactory that it was, do not expect PayPal to fix it. If you paid by credit card via PayPal, then you have a far greater chance of initiating a dispute with your credit card provider.

This rodent supplier is in way over their heads.

 

[Lucille]

It is exceedingly unlikely that they will rule in your favor, as you did receive a shipment. That is PayPal policy.

Paypal has two separate ways to dispute- not received, and not as described. One can receive goods and open a dispute and win if they are not as described.

 

[Chameleon Company]

Paypal has two separate ways to dispute- not received, and not as described. One can receive goods and open a dispute and win if they are not as described.

I understand, but in my experience, which is broad, they are exceedingly loathe to grant such. My main point was to have the buyer look at any possibility of initiating a dispute via their credit-card company, and to educate those how may read here of how the gears turn at PayPal. There are 100's of threads here to document such, but new readers may not be so informed.

I would be pleasantly shocked if PayPal rules in the favor of the buyer on this. I hope to be shocked !

 

[acheela]

As noted, it is exceedingly unlikely that you will receive a voluntary refund while you have a PayPal dispute pending, as it is essentially in the hands of PayPal until they rule. And they will not until the full response period has expired.

It is exceedingly unlikely that they will rule in your favor, as you did receive a shipment. That is PayPal policy. However unsatisfactory that it was, do not expect PayPal to fix it. If you paid by credit card via PayPal, then you have a far greater chance of initiating a dispute with your credit card provider.

This rodent supplier is in way over their heads.

I've been dealing with paypal for years, and fully understand the way it works. I may not have been clear, I have not received a response from The Rat Deli, and they have not responded to paypal either. Just because I got the product does not automatically mean that paypal will rule against me. The key here is the representation of the product. On the website, which is the rat deli's legal representation of it's products, it clearly states that the rats are
1)vacuum packed (they are not)
2) all orders are guaranteed frozen upon arrival (they were thawed)
3) that shipments will go out on a certain day of the week provided your order is placed within a certain time frame (it was placed on time, and it was not shipped at the time it is guaranteed)
It also stated both on the website, and in my last response from them that if there was any problems to contact them... I did, and they refuse to respond. The paypal dispute can be dropped by simply clicking the "resolved" link. The way for the rat deli to ensure paypal siding with me is to ignore the dispute and let the time run out. I have proof that the rats were grossly misrepresented. This is all I need to prove, and bide my time. It also clearly shows pictures on their website of rats in properly vaccuum packed packages, and with anything other than pink rats on meat trays and obviously vaccuum packed, and the packaging that was sent to me is obviously NOT vaccuum packed, there was no means provided in the overly large container to ensure the rats stayed frozen, and so I got thawed out ruined rats that were not usable. I've had to open a couple of disputes on paypal before through the years, as well as defend myself against a dispute filed against me, and have never lost my side, I am an honest person, and made sure I went through proper channels, and backed up my claims with proof, just as I have done now. There is at least one other person with the exact same complaint as me, so the reputation of the rat deli is quickly going in the toilet.

 

[Lucille]

and to educate those how may read here of how the gears turn at PayPal.

It is not Paypal 'policy' to not rule in the customer's favor in a 'not as described' dispute, so saying that is not correctly educating anyone. I have won 'not as described' disputes.

A credit card dispute is also possible, but one should not get the idea that a 'not as described' dispute is not worth doing.

 

[acheela]

I understand, but in my experience, which is broad, they are exceedingly loathe to grant such. My main point was to have the buyer look at any possibility of initiating a dispute via their credit-card company, and to educate those how may read here of how the gears turn at PayPal. There are 100's of threads here to document such, but new readers may not be so informed.

I would be pleasantly shocked if PayPal rules in the favor of the buyer on this. I hope to be shocked !

You will be shocked... Its called covering your a$$ with paperwork, which I have done...