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Tony Hurts Genetic Guarentee??? (HETS)

Hello Paul,
I just came across this thread on the problems with the het albino from Tony Hurt. I am really surprised that Tony did not make things right immediately. That is what should have been done. I have bought from Tony and met him at the Expo in Daytona. I thought he was a nice guy, up front and a decent breeder. He is a professional person who has a careet aside from reptiles and usually that makes for someone who is professional across the board. And Paul, you and I have had some dealings as well and I know that you are a fair and honest person.

Tony Hurt should have honored his guarantee......verbal or not.....it is his reputation that is on the line. Fair is fair. He should refund you the money you paid him for the het Albino and send you a female Albino to replace her.

If one is a reputable breeder, one would stand behind any and all sales made regardless of whether they were baby balls, 100% het Albinos or het anythings. I care about my animals and I provide excellent care for them while they are here. When they are sold, I will make guarantees based on my observations of their progress and what I know to be their genetics. I will always stand behind my animals and if something like this comes back to question me, the only way to uphold my reputation is to honor the guarantee I gave at the time of the sale.

Paul, I do have a 100% het Albino from Tony Hurt. I bred her this season with a 100% het male (proven) but she did not become gravid. You can bet that I will be certain to breed her this year with my Albino to see what comes. We will see.

Paul, I hope this all works out for you. The good thing is that you do have 100% hets from the breedings and at least that is something.

If I can help in any way, let me know. Sorry this all came down on you.

Susan
SSNAKES Reptiles
www.ssnakes.com
 
Hi Susan thank you for the kind words. So you have a het from Tony. What year is it? Did he produce it? And did he give you any kind of guarantee? Paul
 
Paul,
Now that I look closely at the paperwork received from him with the het, I see it was produced by Joe Dembinski. It is a 2003 100% het high contrast....well, from a high-contrast male to a het female. Joe records on a "proof of genetics" that out of five eggs he got 2.1 Albinos and .2 hets. Dembinski refers to the "Line" as being Bob Clark. I have a copy of the KS ad Tony posted and on it he did say it was produced by Joe.

Paul, we have been down this road together before, haven't we? Why can't people just be honest? Don't they realize it will eventually come back to haunt them?

Susan Sentman
SSNAKES Reptiles
[email protected]
 
Paul,

Has Tony made good on your snake?
Has he contacted you and everything is okay now?
Just wondering.
Randal Berry
 
Hello Randal to answer your question, No Tony has not done anything for me. He did send me a few emails stating that he would buy back the female for my purchase price but thats all he is offering. I did agree to that and asked him to send me a refund and I would ship the snake back to him and then refused. He said I would have to send the female back first and I asked him to please send the refund and I would send out the snake and he would not do it. He said take it his way or get nothing. To be honest with you I dont trust him anymore at all. And I will not ship the animal first because if he does not give me the refund then I am out even more money for shipping her and then I will be out of a adult female also. Paul
 
wyblep said:
Hello Randal to answer your question, No Tony has not done anything for me. He did send me a few emails stating that he would buy back the female for my purchase price but thats all he is offering. I did agree to that and asked him to send me a refund and I would ship the snake back to him and then refused. He said I would have to send the female back first and I asked him to please send the refund and I would send out the snake and he would not do it. He said take it his way or get nothing. To be honest with you I dont trust him anymore at all. And I will not ship the animal first because if he does not give me the refund then I am out even more money for shipping her and then I will be out of a adult female also. Paul
Click to expand...
Tony is not well liked around the herp shows.
Too many fake hets and WC being passed off as CBB.
 
I would like to know his source also.
Tony has vended at my past shows and we never had a complaint about him.

Randal Berry
 
Paul showing his true colors

Well, it came time to give Paul and refund [which was above and beyond for selling someone a true 100% het] and Paul refuses to send the snake back because he knows I will prove it out.
After talking to a few people Paul seems to have trouble with several people he buys snakes from.
As a reptile breeder you have to be careful who you sell too, there are people out there who will try and pull any scam they can to get a few extra snakes or a few extra bucks. I just found some old spread sheets showing I had to send Paul a refund two years ago on some fresh captive hatched babies. I would guess Paul list of refund checks is long.
The good new is given enough rope people seem to hang themselves which is what Paul has done.
Paul, If I were you I would not send the snake back either. Your lies would become even more visable.


Tony Hurt
Snake Evolutions
 
JimO Paul mentions it earlier in the thread IE that there were some problems with some baby balls.

I don't know Tony I've done business with Paul and can't say there were any problems at all, there was even a minor problem with one of the animals which he notified me of. He didn't get upset and followed my advice and it worked out just fine.

I can think of a couple of people I've done business with that on more than one occasion there were problems with animals. Yet I still do business with them, the reason being is that They took care of me their customer, didn't yank me around or insult me ETC ETC they just gave good customer service and when something went wrong they stepped up and made it right by ME Their Customer. You know what is often said here about how one deals with a problem... Randy
 
Snake Evolutions said:
Well, it came time to give Paul and refund [which was above and beyond for selling someone a true 100% het]
Click to expand...
But barely adequate if it actually isn't a het.

I don't believe that you knowingly sent Paul a normal passed off as a het. But we are left with the mathematical fact that that at this point there is only a 1 in 8,911 chance that she actually is a het, which also means that there is only a 1 in 8,911 chance that you are justified in making some of the harsh assumptions that you are, AND an only 1 in 8,911 chance that she will prove out for you if you take her back.
After producing 13 eggs fathered by a visual with no albino produced, blaming bad odds is reaching, and to allude toward the accusation that Paul is actually trying to scam you seems more like a tactic of someone who knows they might be wrong and won't admit it.

Is it not even remotely possible that an accidental mix up occurred? That a snake got put in the wrong tub, or a label fell off and was mistakingly replaced on the incorrect bin? For someone dealing with the number of snakes that you do I would have to think that it is at least within the realm of possibility. Making a mistake in and of itself does not make you a bad guy, but accepting the possibility that is might have happened and rectifying it is the determining factor.

I have to say that after seeing the way you choose to handle a problem situation, your apparent refusal to address points brought up in this thread, and the attitude you present in your last post, I would not be inclined to do business with you.
 
Snake Evolutions said:
Well, it came time to give Paul and refund [which was above and beyond for selling someone a true 100% het] and Paul refuses to send the snake back because he knows I will prove it out.
After talking to a few people Paul seems to have trouble with several people he buys snakes from.
As a reptile breeder you have to be careful who you sell too, there are people out there who will try and pull any scam they can to get a few extra snakes or a few extra bucks. I just found some old spread sheets showing I had to send Paul a refund two years ago on some fresh captive hatched babies. I would guess Paul list of refund checks is long.
The good new is given enough rope people seem to hang themselves which is what Paul has done.
Paul, If I were you I would not send the snake back either. Your lies would become even more visable.


Tony Hurt
Snake Evolutions
Click to expand...

Does this also count for people you participate in with breeding loans? Kettle meet pot.
 
Well Well Well. Its very nice to see that you could crawl out from that rock to finally answer some questions here. It only took you three weeks but you know what they say, better late then never. First of all I asked if I could keep the female and get the refund of $1100.00 and you would not agree to that. So I then said fine. Send me the refund and as soon as I receive the refund I would contact you to set up the shipping arrangements to send the female to you. You said that you would not give me a refund first. I then explained that I do not feel comfortable sending the animal back first because If you do not follow through with the refund then I will be out even more money ( delta shipping $85.00 and the cost of a adult proven normal female). I told you flat out I wanted the refund first.

Lets do a little recap here shall we. I trusted you when I sent you the $1100.00 I trusted you when I purchased a supposedly a 100% het from you. I trusted you when after the first year of breeding you told me I just had bad odds and that she would do much better for me next year. And we see now where trusting you got me. I'm sorry Tony I do not trust you anymore. That is why I did not agree to send the animal back without a refund first.

On to your next accusation. Yes I had one other dealing with you and if you would have read the entire thread you would have seen that in post #80 I outlined all the facts about that transaction. You sold me 50 normal CH baby males that were on there death bed. When I contacted you about your ad you told me they were all eating great and the only reason you were selling them cheap was because you wanted the females out of the groups. Well when I received them they were dropping like flies and you sent me some flagyl to try and save some of them. You did give me a refund for half of the animals that died. I kept you notified through out the whole process. Lets face it you were selling total garbage snakes that were not cared for properly in there first few days in the states and that is why they were dying off like they were. If you go to this thread there were alot of others that were having the same problem at the same time I was. http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=70747&highlight=tony+hurt

And to answer your next allegation that there are a long list of people that I have received refunds from? Please name them or better yet ask them to come on here and post themselves. You are so full of lies it will be fun to watch you get caught up in them. Unless you run away of course, and not answer your phone like you already have.

And just to let you know it would be very easy for you to get this female back and post next season that she produced albino's. That is why I was so adamant about keeping the female and breeding her again this year. I was going to document it with pics and post all the results here so everyone can see and confirm what a piece of work you really are. Paul
 
I thought I was done but everytime I read that thread of yours it makes me cringe. Tell me one person that has sold me a animal and the transaction did not go smoothly? You are so full of :censored: Lets see some names Tony :angry:
 
wyblep said:
Also how many of you guys have bred a homozygous animal to a het for two consecutive years with no homozygous animals being produced? With fairly nice size clutches of course? Paul
Click to expand...

with 6 eggs that hatched - the odds that none are homo recessive is very low - it will happen only 1.56% of the time.

with 7 eggs that hached - the odds that none are homo recessive is lower, and will happen only 0.78% of the time.

0 out of 13 will be homo recessive will only happen 0.012% of the time.

It's pretty clear you got ripped off.
 
What happened to Tony? He was reading this thread for about a 40 minutes and then just left? Where are some of those facts to back up all of the garbage you have been talking? I'm waiting Tony. Paul
 
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