Upstate Exotics (BAD GUY)

[Uffern]

A veiled threat is still a threat you said? not in court, that is fact. I know so dont argue this.

OK, you may be right, I'm not sure, but I bet if it is not considered a threat by the courts, it is considered harassment to repeated tell someone they will get what's coming to them at such and such a show. In my opinion, you, Dallas, have lost much face in this by the way you respond to people. Rather than by swearing at someone who points out an inconsistency and coming off like a child, you should simply explain the inconsistency. When you respond with a juvenile attitude, people lose respect for you. If you respond again, you will probably take this as an insult and go off again, but it really is meant in a constructive way, and should be taken as such.

 

[xtremecolubrids]

ritchie

Hey Ritchie.......
Partially wrong yes because I assumed that everyone else thinks along that lines if its not mark cb expect wc. As for My gloves bein off since my first post...... It had absolutely nothing to do with you and you had to get in on it anyway. So just shut your pie hole and stop posting on me. If you were up in my grill in person you wouldn't be saying anything..........
Unfortunately the internet gives people the acess to rant and rave about anything. Enough already @$$h0le. Yes bad language, Im just sick of all the crap that goes on here. It like a friggen third rate soap opera. My god lets get a grip here. Way to over dramatic turning everything in to some dynasty crap.
Just my opinion
Chris Duncan
Xtreme Colubrids

 

[Rob @ RK Reptiles]

Dallas,

I hate to say it, but with your attitude, vulgarity, and profanity, you have lost all respect and chance of anyone thinking you are right. Anyone that can not carry a conversation without posting like you have does not deserve respect from anyone. Regardless is you are right or wrong you still need to act professional and not go off like you have. From the beginning I was listening to you, seeing your side, and even trying to help you but when you act like this, call people names like you just did, use profanity you cooked your own goose. Whether or not you are right in this matter you are now on your own. Also you can probably bet that once Rich the Webmaster sees the new post by you that you will most likely be banned from the site as it is obvious that you are not even listening to his warnings. Good luck to you.

 

[xtremecolubrids]

DALLAS

Enough with the bad @$$ attitude Dallas. If your gonna do something do it already. would be the biggest mistake on your behalf if you try anything stupid. Put up or shut up.
Enough already like I said in my previous post cheap soap opera. My opinions.
Peace out,
Chris Duncan
Xtreme Colubrids
Ps Dallas ..........things work in a viscious circle but come back even worse.
Chris Duncan
Xtreme Colubrids

 

[HerpVenue]

Partially wrong yes because I assumed that everyone else thinks along that lines if its not mark cb expect wc.

Funny..now you are saying it is assumed WC if not marked as captive bred. But before you were saying it was clearly marked. Now it is just assumed. YOu gotta back peddle faster next time. You say it was CLEARLY MARKED. it was not marked at all. Therefore you are wrong. Hurry back peddle back peddle.

So just shut your pie hole and stop posting on me. If you were up in my grill in person you wouldn't be saying anything..........

AAAAOOOOEEEIIOOOOOAOOOUUUU Me Tarzan you Jane. Me thumping my chest over the internet.

I am showing holes in your arguement. You are the one to busy thumping your big chest over the internet.

Oh snap...another "I am 7 feet tall and weigh 300 pounds over the internet" guy.

Unfortunately the internet gives people the acess to rant and rave about anything. Enough already @$$h0le. Yes bad language, Im just sick of all the crap that goes on here. It like a friggen third rate soap opera. My god lets get a grip here. Way to over dramatic turning everything in to some dynasty crap.

hhhmmm interesting. So you hate all this stuff? I bet you will be back though.

 

[HerpVenue]

Re: DALLAS

Enough with the bad @$$ attitude Dallas. If your gonna do something do it already. would be the biggest mistake on your behalf if you try anything stupid. Put up or shut up.
Enough already like I said in my previous post cheap soap opera. My opinions.
Peace out,
Chris Duncan
Xtreme Colubrids
Ps Dallas ..........things work in a viscious circle but come back even worse.
Chris Duncan
Xtreme Colubrids

Chris meet Dallas..... oh ummmm I meant
Pot meet kettle. Kettle meet pot.

 

[timopar]

My 2 cents worth

Whew!
It seems to me that a couple of things are happening here.
1. Upstate Exotics got caught misrepresenting a blackthroat monitor to a customer and they have not nor will not own up to that fact. Ok, duly noted and recorded for future use.
2. This IDIOT dallas gets a whiff of this situation and decides he needs to get rid of his sick snakes and here is a good way to do it.

Dallas,
How old are you? From your absolutely deplorable grammar and inexcusable use of the english language, I would have to guess that you cannot be more than 20 years old. You have done nothing on this baord except to completely and totally discredit yourself with your terrible attitude and lack of professionalism. At this point my only concern in your case is for the snakes which are unfortunately still in your care.

Mr. Duncan,
You are quite the case sir. It would seem that you had good intnentions when you joined in the discussion here, but, you failed to really read any of the previous posts. Now you are so angry about being called on your assertions that you cannot even respond to the questions that are being asked of you. Try to calm down and respond to Richie's questions with ANSWERS instead of inflammatory, nonresponsive remarks.
Here is one question that I would just LOVE for you to answer.....When you first posted on this thread you said that " The animal in question was CLEARLY marked on all adds and web site as an import people." This is NOT TRUE, this is WRONG, it was NEVER REPRESENTED AS ANYTHING OTHER THAN CAPTIVE BRED.....How did you come to the conclusion that it was CLEARLY MARKED as an import given what you have seen in the ads and emails?????????????
The fact that you can reach that conclusion and defend it so adamantly is rather disturbing. I for one will not do business with a person that has delusions, because without a better explanation from you that is all I can assume.

Richie...by the way... you are truly a great guy and your willingness to see the holes in ALL sides of an issue is what makes you so.

 

[Stardust]

am I missing something?

IMHO, this is getting ripped so much it is getting off topic.
Dallas may have showed that he gets drunk, may have shown that he has other sick snakes, maybe have shown that he can not spell very well and can get angry.
BUT, didnt he notify Upstate within 24 hours to say he didn't want the snakes? Regardless of his personality, he still did not want the snakes and voiced that within an acceptable frame of time. I for one, Dallas would like to see this video.
Another thing, he may not have diagnosed (SP) the snake but he STILL did not want them within 24 hrs of arrival.
I am sure you all will correct me if I am wrong or missed something.

 

[Stardust]

One other point I would like to address.
Upstate inquired about Dallas. Is this a practice to inquire about a buyer who sends money in advance? He did get a kudos from someone he had already bought from.
Just because he has sick snakes from someone else, (and he did not post here about them, so not a chronic complainer) doesn't mean he would switch snakes. That is an ASSUMPTION of his INTENT with in the twenty four hours that he complained about upstates snakes to them. Possibility? yes. Fact: no. Far fetched and reaching? very likely.
That is why I asked earlier if upstate had ever refunded money. I know some of the best breeders have had to do it. You can read the answer above. Sounds to me is the only time they have done this is to the first person who posted here, Gracie I believe.
People lets not get off track here or be manipulated to stray away from the original point.

 

[gracie]

Whoa whoa whoa everyone. Let's all step back a moment and take a death breath. Our focus should be on Upstate Exotics.

Chris,

Please stop with the profanity, it's really not nessicary. You have an opinion and are entitled to that opinion but what bothers me is how you think the email Upstate sent me was a typo. Please clearly, and politely, explain to me how the "He is CB" and the "...from my breeder" parts are both typos? Also, why in this whole thread has Upstate not even acknowleged that they have done business with you? Don't take me as bashing you, as I'm not, just trying to get the facts ironed out.

Sal and Alison,

I see you have been putting up quite the fight with Dallas about the sick boas you sent them but why have you abandoned the original topic of my misrepresented black throat? Even though I am keeping him I would still like to hear what your defense to the email where you clearly stated he was cb in is, and I'm sure everyone else would like to know as well.

Rob and Richie,

Sorry my post turned into such a bashing brawl and that you two got caught in the middle but I seriously appreciate all you posts and thoughts on my, and Dallas's, deals you've posted throughout this thread. I'm make sure my next cham comes from you, Rob

 

[UpstateExotics1]

Stardust...

Dallas did contact us within the ORIGINAL 24-hours to say that the snakes arrived, looked fine, just a little "chilled".

The next night is when he suddenly found that these snakes have some disease. There's many ways he can try to claim that he wants to return them, but he used IBD as an excuse, which they don't have and he REFUSES to prove. SO that shows that they DO NOT have it. Not only that, many of my customers have been emails me now worried that their purchases, all b/c Dallas decided to become a vet and diagnose healthy, eating snakes with IBD.

We have many emails proving how Dallas changed his stories with us, even putting the threats aside, he even stated that they only did this erratic behavior THAT one night and have never done it since. Not only that, he goes on to tell us, "well maybe it's not IBD". But the fact that he has other sick snakes, tries to constantly change his story, and comes on the BOI simply trying to BASH us and not back up his false statements, leads us to believe even more that there is nothing wrong.

He took this post as an opportunity to do whatever it was he had in mind. Whether try to pass off sick snakes as mine, his sales fell through on them and he doesn't want to be stuck with 4 boas, etc....I can't tell you what his plans were.

However another "good" point Dallas DID bring up was how he doesn't even have a vet NEAR to him that is qualified to care to reps and snakes. So now, I feel terrible for his entire "collection" b/c as he states "he is not a vet" and with that said who cares for his animals?? If you decide to get into something, mammals, reptiles, snakes, etc. you always make sure you have a QUALIFIED vet that can care for them BEFORE you go and puchase them.

And he offered to take them to a vet, or at least have his girlfriend do it, but now he thinks by posting on the BOI that relieves him of anything that he stated to us? Maybe he didn't realize that I had copies of everything, maybe he didn't realize I save all correspondence...I don't know. What I do know is this is just someone trying to pull a quick one, and when he saw it wasn't working he showed his maturity for a 27 year old who has been in the business "15 years".

When I did an inquiry on him when I saw where all this was leading, how come there is only one person that HAS done business with him that came here. And how come there is no one else here trying to defend him???

Makes me wonder.....

 

[Stardust]

The IM's you posted are what I am having a problem with.
I see that he said exactly what you said, but I also see he was not done. A minute later he said he checked them out better and one was jerking. Am I mistaken or is that on the same day?
Maybe for future reference, and so no one gets confused, what excuses do you need for exchanging or sending back an animal or animals that you bought? Do you have to have it vet checked BEFORE you send it back if you don't want it?
Also, correct me if I am wrong, but when he said he thinks it has IBD it was in e-mail or IM's? He hadn't posted on here yet?
Are you saying that because he put a label on what he thought could be wrong that that is a basis for not getting a refund?
Just trying to clarify things here. It seems, at least to me, that some answers are getting lost here.
Thank you

 

[Stardust]

Silly me, I forgot something. Dallas started this on BOI on the 28th, you inquired about him on the 26th, was this after he tried to tell you he wanted a refund? What day did he receive the snakes? And did he pay you in advance?
thank you again

 

[HerpVenue]

Are you saying that because he put a label on what he thought could be wrong that that is a basis for not getting a refund?

Actually the reason he decided not to refund is because Dallas states he talked to Robyn from proexotics about the situation. He stated that Robyn was his friend.
Well upstate was ready to refund considering they got word from someone more experienced that IBD was supect. But when Upstate verified Dallas's story, Robyn has not even heard of Dallas...much less give a diagnosis over the phone of IBD.

In conclusion. He found Dallas to be lying. Therefore is is possible he is also lying about the snakes.

quite frankly I do not blame them for this thing with Dallas.
If I was ready to refund something.....then I found out you are lying to me about something....I will seriously have to reconsider my refund offer.

I do fault upstate for their dealings with Gracie.
But when it comes to Dallas vs. Upstate......I do not know where to find fault

 

[Stardust]

I do not know where to find fault either, hence the questions.
It is just looking at the IM's he was trying to settle this matter first with Upstate.
I still say lie or not, (and lying happened after he asked for a refund) he still wanted to send them back and get a refund within a good time limit.
I have to wonder though, why it is in both these instances, it is like pulling teeth to get a refund or even an offer of a refund from Upstate?
Upstate has not been known to be honest themselves. So we have two people who have proven to be dishonest.
Push all that stuff aside, and we still have the beginning.
That is he received snakes he was dissatisfied with, talked to them about returning them, for whatever reason, and again, like with Gracie had to fight.
Both Gracie and Dallas had the same problem, Gracie chose to deal with it in a proper honest way, Dallas chose to go the other path.
Fact remains the same, both contacted Upstate early, both had to fight. I am not so sure everything else that was said is in issue, only that Upstate puts up a huge fight, by whatever way they can to not refund.
That I am pretty sure everyone can agree with.
Now what remains in the mind of everyone who reads this is:
Do you want to deal with Upstate?
How far do you have to go to get a refund?
Is it worth the headache to do so?
Is there anyother dealers out there that would have said, "yes I will give you a refund because you are not satisfied, send the animal back?"
Because if there are people out there who will do that, then maybe none of what else went on would have happened. Not trying to prove, through lies or truth, no getting frustrated, no headaches.

 

[dqreps]

No more argueing...

ALRIGHT, ENOUGH ALREADY! I am SORRY for the language. Yeah, maybe it IS childish ok. I almost 30 and i do know what being childish is. I AM human and do have my limits. I have been furious about this situation because i have never dealt with someone that is so incompetant in their dealings. I am NOT large dealer but i breed high quality animals and have a good reputation with the small group of people i deal with. Upstate or someone said why is only one person defending me or something. Well, my customers do not spend all day on baords like this ok. This IS childish and they have better things to do, as i do also. I just wanted to help and got kicked while i was down once again. I dont care what anyone has said about losing respect for me or anything. My customers know the difference and all future customers will also see the difference because believe it or not, not everyone lives in this world of the fauna BIO ok. So admited i was wrong for the way i acted but i cant say i am sorry. Like i said, i am human and i am not gonna take abuse. Ritchie, that means wether i am on on a public forum or not, ok? Because i am not the one that did wrong and people should not turn the true top of upstate exotics being scammers into something that has no relavince on that topic. You say i could send back different animals instead of the original ones? implying that i could send other snakes that are sick right? well, last time i remembered they posted pics of these snakes so they have proof of what they friggin look like ok! Use your head, i cant send back different snakes unless they were not bright enough to know what they just sent out. Also Ritchie, you have sadly missed the facts. Please address this ok. I have sent them a video of the snakes in question. HOW CAN YOU, UPSTATE EXOTICS OR ANYONE ELSE deny this is not proof enough? i told them i wanted to send them the tape the night i talked to them, they did not care and did not want to see it. How is this proffesional and how is a video tape of their snakes not evidence enough? please answer this upstate AND Ritchie. Otherwise you have no respect for yourself if you can bash others but choose to ignore obvious facts that closes the case. All they have to do is look at the snakes, see the symptoms and then they will know they ARE ill AND that those are the same snakes they sent. Any person should be able to figure this out.
Stardust, thanks for adding some helpful imput. I dont want anyone to take sides but to be objective, ritchie and some others are not and are getting off the topic severely. I did pay for the snakes in advance. You are very right, just because i had recieved a few snakes with resp infections DOES NOT mean the ones i got from upstate caught it and showed uncontrollable shaking/jerking/twitching responses the next day. Ritchie and upstate exotics.... as i said before i am not a vet but i di not know these are all symptomes of resp infection? maybe i am wrong, you are the smart ones (sigh). Also, have to say again in response to upstate exotics, you keep going on about proof and this and that well, i sent the tape so post to everyone what you see when you get it ok, please be honest because i am gonna send one to you stardust because you requested and i would like someone else to see them so Upstate can not say i am lying. Stardust please email me and i will send you the tape express mail, it cost me $17 but the money does not matter, it is the point of the whole thing. Also, YES Upstate exotics, i DID INDEED say i would try to take the snakes to a vet which intails me driving two hours to portland maine. But myself or my girlfreind were gonna do it just to shut your trap about it ok. BUT before i emiailed you that response you emailed me saying that you will not respond anymore to me. THEN i sent you the email stating i would do my best to get them to the vet, just to shut you up because you are consumed with it. SINCE i did not get a reply and have not since , said the heck of with it because i KNOW you would not pay for the bill and i would just get stuck to it. you are definatley lying when you say you would, just like you lied when posted the email you sent me before when you said you were gonna give me a refund. Also, you said you wanted a refund saying the snakes have IBD. I NEVER said that is absolutely positively what they have, NEVER! I simply said that is what it looked like. I was not out of line at all stating what it looked like they had, telling you the symptoms. So am sure if it ended up they did not have IBD But instead something else, you would have not payed for it and i would have got screwed once again. I asked you many times if you would cover the bill no matter what it was and you did reply so i assume not. You guys have a real bad habit of only answering "certain" questions. So considering all this, i am happy i did not take the day off from work and drive two hours away just to find out that that is more money i have spent and will not get refunded. Oh, and about what you said that if i do not have a qualified vet close i should not have these animals or be in this biz, Whatever it was you said. Well, i assisted a vet for a little less than a year at the wildlife i used to work at. I have ALWAYS performed all the treatments my animals need, by my self. I am very good with this and it is not a prob. So if they have resp infections, mouth rot, anything at all, i treat it my self with great success BUT IBD now, that is a different story. It IS terminal and no matter what i do, if these snakes have IBD, their is nothing i can do about it. To tell you the truth, it looked very much like they had IBD that night. If you see the tape you can see in great detail something is severely wrong BUT now since that night, they are not shakeing/twitching/jerking at all NOW. Now i guess one could say, gee, none of the above symptoms now so they must be ok right? well, all i can say is this. If a snake shows these symptoms and then for the next week does not, i would not call him cured. Something is severely wrong with these animals to do the fore mentioned. So Yes Upstate, i was being honest when i told you that and you know what, with you guys, honesty does NOT pay off. Damn, i was trying to be cool and even when i did that, you have to change it into something else totally off the wall. Being honest is a good quality, try it sometimes. Anyone can say whatever they want about me but i am honest and always will continue to be. I sent you guys a few refs from people i have sold to and they all check out. i can send more if you want from more well known dealers i have bought from but what does that change? Also, i recieved these snakes the 21nd and emailed and AIM upstate exotics about the symptoms i was seeing the 22nd. This was before i posted here. I DID NOT have a master scheme planned out to send them different snakes. I WILL KEEP SAYING THIS. I SENT THEM THE TAPE, IF THEY DONT KNOW WHAT THEIR OWN HERPS LOOK LIKE, THEY HAVE PROBS! I do not even had that good of a memory but can remember every snake i sent out withing a week and a half which is how long it will be by the time they get the tape this monday. I wish they replied to me sooner and i would have sent it then. Also, the thing about Robyn got blown totally out of proportion. Upstate exotics brought him into this and tried to use him as a tool to not refund me, he did not take their side in anyway. I is a good character ref for me as far as that goes, that is all i meant and would not say anything bad about me. That has nothing to do with the fact that i got bunk snakes and wanted a refund. And Timopar or whatever your name is. You are the IDIOT son, for not having your facts straight. Stick to the topic, forget all the stuff that comes before, after and all of that. If you do not like bits and pieces of the story, who cares. The fact is, i got the snakes and did not want them because they were acting rediculously out of control, enough said. Things that happened after that have nothing at all to do with the fact that they promised a refund and then went back on their word when they decided to use robyn as a tool to get what they wanted which was too keep my $400. Upstate Exotics, Timopar, Ritchie, say what you want and pick apart everything the way you like. Fact is, you want proof? A tape is all that is needed and like i said before, if a court of law will take it has evidence, it is good enough for anyone on the fauna. By the way, i am not apologizing for anything i said late last night but i can be man enough to admit when i am upset and lose it a little. I quickly grow impatient with people that ignore plain facts. I did not plan on posting on here again after last night but when lies are spoken, false truths etc are posted, i can not just stand by and watch. That is my and my Type A Personality. So believe what you want, say what you want to say about me. I do not feel like i have to nor do i want to impress anyone. My goal was to make others aware, bottom line. Like i said, stardust or anyone else that ones to see a copy, email me at [email protected] and give me your addy and i will send it out monday ok. I am only doing this to prove a point about this people and what they are made of. I will not go into depth on that one, not anymore.

 

[dqreps]

STARDUST?

Why the slam on me saying i am dishonest? Please tell, i am not dishonest and i just noticed you put that on when i posted my message. i am a stand up guy and have never had any probs. Would i go to these great lengths such as to send out tapes for $17 PLUS the damn cost of the tape to prove so unless i was? yes, i DO have a reputation to effect. Although none of my customers come here, i dont want people thinking i am dishonest. It seemed before you were one of the ones that had your eyes open, what happened? If you are referring about the thing with robyn, then do not even think about it. They edited half that post. I did in fact bring him up for a reference and implied he is knowledable. Nothing less, nothing more. They can change emails, AIM or whatever they want but that does not change the fact that they ARE wrong. I wonder why they only copy and paste "certain" things and not the whole truth? They do not put some of their idiotic replies and so on that make no sence at all. Like it even states in their AIM message, (the part that they surprisingly did not edit) they had no clue what ibd was? Somehow they got the idea i was getting the info from someone that was AIM me, i did not. i was talking to my brother in cali at the same time and for some reason everyone likes to make assumptions. I know very well what IBD is. i have done a LOT of research on it just to educat myself. Regardless of IBD or not, a refund was in order. You think i am dishonest? well, let me tell you this. i read their "terms" page before i payed for the snakes. I READ and i was TOLD they gurantee satisfaction or my money back. If i was not satisfied with the snakes all i had to do is tell them and they would refund my money and take the snake back right? Well, that is what they implied and that is what they told me over AIM. I know this is really bull but i did not know that before i ordered. What this does mean though is that all i would have had to do is tell them i did not like the snakes and get my money back. I would not go throug all the trouble to tell them the snakes are sick. C'mon, i would have just told them i wanted to return the snakes because they were not what i wanted. That has happened before with no probs. Anyway, just wanted to clear the air on the Stardust and to eveyone else that doubs me. I would appreciate it though if everyone else would stop acting childish like i was accused of and get to the top, UPSTATE EXOTICS and their antics. later....

Dallas Quarles

 

[Stardust]

I will indeed write you and give you my address, call it a gut feeling but I think you are being honest about what you saw.
Whether the snakes are fine or not, still is not the point I am trying to make, and that is.... how much does it take to say you are not satisfied and want a refund in an appropriate amount of time?
Trust me on this as well, I would not stick up for Ritchie and still am not, BUT in this instance, what I saw was him just reacting to your post when you were becoming irate, and trying to look at both sides.

 

[Stardust]

Again silly me, forgot.
If I saw one of my animals I just received twitching and jerking I would be upset as well. I would contact the seller and find out what is going on. Either they (hopefully) would..... try to help me find what could be wrong, not just put hmmmmm on an IM. They would ask what I wanted to do, perhaps, and acknowledge that I told them in a fair amount of time. With that I would probably calm down and listen to what they have to say and hopefully come to some kind of an agreement on what to do. Does that sound reasonable or totally one sided on my part?

 

[Stardust]

Dallas, I did say that, and it was directed toward the Robyn thing. Sorry if I insulted you, Please don't sweat the small stuff, look at the big picture of what I am saying. There is a big picture here you know.
Re-read all I have written. I will try to spell this out to you simply.
A. you bought and paid for snakes in advance
B. snakes arrived you found them slow and ok but cold.
C. Upon further inspection that evening, you found one to be jerky.
D. You immediately contacted Upstate, and explained what you are seeing and surmised what you thought it might be.
E. You asked for a refund.

Did you get your refund? No
Would this post have been posted here had you have? No
Would all this mud slinging gone on if you had gotten your refund? No

None of my questions above has been answered thus far by either Upstate or other buyers.
I am trying, and I wonder if in vain, to get people to see that this other stuff would not be topic and should no deter from what this started out to be.
Calm down.