Info TRUTHS ABOUT THE HIDDEN GENE WOMA THAT ARE IN DIRECT CONFLICT OF KEVIN MCCURELY(NERD)

[Joe at PHR]

I see a group of people got together as a collective and intimidated Allan to get all of our stuff removed on the WOBP. The fact is, we wanted all of it removed anyway. We already knew that was going to happen... Just like what happened back in 06 on the other big advertising site. No Big Deal... I am glad we were on the WOBP for the time we were. As we have the correspondence and all the proof that we need period to satisfy us or anyone else in any capacity.

In fact, I am really glad I am here on FAUNA CLASSIFIEDS. This site is only for the 100% TRUTH and INTEGRITY of the INDUSTRY. The funny thing is, most of the people advertise on both big advertising sites. It is also where people can’t get pictures taken up and down on their word. People have to live by the sword and die by the sword on here period.

I am talking to the 20,000 plus people that are watching this thread closely. Not to the people posting on here as they don’t sign Clark’s and my paychecks... You can all read between the lines and see what is going on here. Clark and I are for the consumers purchasing the animals period. We always have been 100% for the consumer. If we ever make any claims, we back it up always with photographic proof. If you want a misconstrued snake from its original with big claims on Genetics (Hidden Gene Lessers needed that are not but just pretty Lessers), then buy from him. At least we wont say things like “I can’t explain it” or “I will eat my shoe if I am wrong" and then in the end just like the Hidden Gene Lessers “I don’t know what to tell you.” That happened right in this thread as well.

That is insulting everyone’s intelligence, completely inappropriate, and not giving the consumer a fair shake at all. We sell genetics here period. The more rare the genetics are in a snake, the more money the snake is worth (as long as it has eye appeal and there is a demand for it). It is not a complicated business. Make rare snakes, tell the TRUTH, provide the snake with a disease free super clean facility, and make sure the consumers who purchase from us are 100% satisfied. I also want to say, Most breeders blame me for crashing markets, when really they are selling animals back door at a much cheaper price. I just compete with that price and give it to the consumer. That is the way this industry works period. If I am hated for that, my feelings are not hurt in the least bit.

My snake is a little different than yours Kevin but very similar as your founding animal pictured in this thread is a Woma (with brown markings) with flames. My founding snake has black markings with flames and is definitely a Woma as well. Our Original Hidden Gene Woma looks more like your founding snake more than the Granite Hidden Gene Woma and that is a fact. Your stories have so many holes in them, as they change. No one will or can post definitve photographic proof of its genetics that you claim as seen in this thread last night. Also pictures being changed on the WOBP and everything else since this has been going on. I am glad I gave you the list to go off of.. Your Granite Hidden Gene Womas also have black markings as well as mine do that you sell to the public. I don’t mind being the person to stand up for the sake of the INTEGRITY of this INDUSTRY as I stated in the beginning of this thread. I am also not intimidated by you, as we all know. I put morals and ethics over anything first, as I would lose sleep if I did not.

I was only considering the WOBP to advertise in Europe and now I will just use another site. In fact, I am sure a lot of Europeans saw this little thread. We will display our new Morphs right here where they belong anyway. Just like we helped build this site with others and started advertising very expensive animals on here. Everyone that does business with me knows that, “what I say you can take to the bank”. It is always other people that haven’t bought from us that complains. We provide clean, high quality animals at great prices. We make no outrageous claims without providing photographic proof.

These people just want Clark and I to keep trying to satisfy them which we don’t need to at all. We are just all about the TRUTH as always. I have nothing to prove to the people posting against us on here, that is for sure. We take this industry very seriously and feel the need for full disclosure unlike others. We also feel the customer is first and stand behind everything we do 100%. If I am hated for that, oh well my feelings are not hurt at all.. The most important part of any business is the HONESTY and INTEGRITY towards the CONSUMERS. As I stated many times in this post and others, Clark and I are for the CUSTOMERS 100% and don’t believe in the misrepresentation of animals.

Thanks everyone for your business, time and understanding in this matter. No one who buys expensive animals is lacking the brain power to understand this. You all can read between the lines here.

Joe Capone at Power House Reptiles

Exactly like I said above all those people that just slandered me and said bad things have never even done business with me.

The fact of the matter is that any of these people can show pictures of multiple clutches of the clumped eggs stuck together with NON Granite HGW's, Granite HGW's, real Granites (non hgw), and normals or single NON granite mutations all coming out of the same clutches of clumped eggs. Not individual pictures of eggs or freshly hatched snakes.

Everyone wants to avoid this and say they don't know what we are talking about but that is why the "Granite Hidden Gene Woma". It is a completely misrepresented Genetically when it comes to being a 2 gene animal.

No one can provide the PHOTOGRAPHIC PROOF LISTED RIGHT ABOVE or overcome any questions that was asked in the beginning of this thread. As it is only A very few people that hijacked this thread.

Everyone wants to say how wrong Clark and I are but no one can show us the PHOTOGRAPHIC PROOF PERIOD.

 

[Joe at PHR]

Exactly like I said above all those people that just slandered me and said bad things have never even done business with me.

The fact of the matter is that any of these people can show pictures of multiple clutches of the clumped eggs stuck together with NON Granite HGW's, Granite HGW's, real Granites (non hgw), and normals or single NON granite mutations all coming out of the same clutches of clumped eggs. Not individual pictures of eggs or freshly hatched snakes.

Everyone wants to avoid this and say they don't know what we are talking about but that is why the "Granite Hidden Gene Woma". It is a completely misrepresented Genetically when it comes to being a 2 gene animal.

No one CAN'T provide the PHOTOGRAPHIC PROOF LISTED RIGHT ABOVE or overcome any questions that was asked in the beginning of this thread. As it is only A very few people that hijacked this thread.

Everyone wants to say how wrong Clark and I are but no one can show us the PHOTOGRAPHIC PROOF PERIOD.

Correction THEY CAN'T SHOW PHOTOGRAPHIC PROOF

 

[greensnake88]

the last post by kelli and johnny were pretty much dead on all this crap flinging is making me dizzy. what do i get from this as an enthusiast? i just started collecting and enjoying ball pythons in the last couple years. people who want to sell hidden gene lessers and need to have snakes named after themselves for profit really show the ugly side. ive bought snakes from a few of the people here and what i know to be true.is my first collection of amazon basin emeralds was lost because someone at ghi reptiles told me to buy a snake that was obviously thin and frail but it just needed a few feedings as it was a wild caught. within three months all my snakes were either viral or dead. then came the excuses you touched a water bowl , didnt properly quarantine, wash your hands before moving something.all of which i know i did. how? because i was there. i then watched the same individual purchase a basin at a show after i told him i just saw the guy selling probe 3 snakes without cleaning the probe. i then find out mr ghi isnt even a breeder all his snakes were being bred at a friends facility that specializes in emeralds. i actually gave up on the industry for 5 or 6 yrs because of this type of crap. it's also becoming pretty clear someones breeding for him now with his fresh collection of pics that it seemed to take some time to produce. im currently living with an importer who has been in the reptile business for 30yrs. and have heard some pretty shady conversations with some "big guys" in the industry. even a certain kevin on the speaker phone laughing about how he'got so many morphs he just throws a bunch of snakes together and waits to see what he gets. sorry to all who bought hidden gene lessers my lesser was only$300 and i will be purchasing my hgw from anyone but these guys . as for powerhouse ive bought a few animals from them and theyre all solid and doing fine. i know from reading this thread a few of you have a strong dislike for them but i havent really heard any reasons other than im on the side w/ the bigger rep. i know joe gets abit exited when he's wheelin and dealin but i dont see whats wrong with being exited about selling and owning cutting edge projects. i wish that was my job. im not trying to preach but powerhouse is the only people i've dealt with that has always answered all my questions shown me their facility and offered me a few thing i wish i could have jumped on because the prices were better. it looks like their ad was pulled because alot of big shots were afraid of losing money. i have a feeling another thread from hell will be here when people start looking to prove out theyre magic granites. it's a shame when such a great hobby is ruled by greed. i swear all of the above is the truth as ive seen it. ill bet ghi couldnt tell a woma,spark or yellowbelly from a normal [well maybe the yellowbelly]and please all you genetic engineers dont waste youre time. im not really interested in hearing about whats real and whats not. gotta go i just found a hidden gene lesser granite in my backyard

 

[radera5]

Correction THEY CAN'T SHOW PHOTOGRAPHIC PROOF

Your right Joe, I can not help you with those pictures you have asked for. Can you please show me the email with the proof you said you had? If so, please post it...

Lastly, why are you griping about someone misrepresenting an animal when you have a WHOLE thread full of people telling you, that you are misrepresenting your animals?

Please answer both questions...Thanks

 

[gsrept]

Its your thread right? You say there is no granite right? then you PHR joe need to prove it, no one else or do you just not grasp the concept of posting in the BOI. let me guess you will dodge this post also.

 

[Joe at PHR]

I cannot believe that this whole entire post has been hijacked by 10 or 12 people that have nothing to show as far as evidence to prove or disprove either parties claims. It has gotten to the point that there are about 10 or 12 of you just making all sorts of ridiculous accusations about Joe and myself. Nothing to do anymore with proving that Kevin's Granite Hidden Gene Woma is nothing more than a misconstrued single mutation animal.

Here is a link to a post were a Granite Hidden Gene Woma Pastel was bred to a Lesser Platinum and it clearly shows you 10 or 12 people you can go suck eggs!

http://www.captivebredreptileforums.co.uk/ball-royal-pythons/47453-soulsucker.html

I understand why these 10 or 12 people are consistently leading away from the point at hand because of posts like the one above. You 10 or 12 people just cannot stand that Clark Tucker and Joe Capone figured out that your hero sold you double mutation snakes that are not!!!! Clearly we are right on this topic but, cannot seem to shine through the hijackers!

You all know that our snake is hiding in the catacombs at that facility up north awaiting this situation that we are presenting now and it scares you that we are right!! Your all afraid of loosing your investment so, you make up slanderous claims about us trying to sell misrepresented animals. You want everyone to also think that we have dissatisfied customers which we do not. You would also like to keep on about Joe's involvement in Ball Python past which you have all misconstrued like Kevin's snake.

I did not want to come here. I tried to settle this with Kevin but he just insisted on calling me names and telling me I don’t know what I am talking about. Clearly this is not the case since everything that is truthful in this post has been quickly hijacked and covered with garbage. Fact of the matter is I am not concerned with the selling of these snakes just their presence on the internet is good enough for me as they are descendants from the Original Hidden Gene Woma which none of you 10 or 12 can disprove.

Like before I stated and I am stating again, I never came here to prove anything. I just came here to tell the truth about the misrepresentation of this particular morph, Granite Hidden Gene Woma.

Best regards,
Clark Tucker
PHR

Clark has it dead on and that is a fact.

 

[gsrept]

We have a winner. Ducked the questions again.

 

[gsrept]

what don't you get? how can you tell the truth about a misrepresentation with out proof?

 

[Cp3_Pythons]

Your right Joe, I can not help you with those pictures you have asked for. Can you please show me the email with the proof you said you had? If so, please post it...

Lastly, why are you griping about someone misrepresenting an animal when you have a WHOLE thread full of people telling you, that you are misrepresenting your animals?

Please answer both questions...Thanks

He want's proof yet he has still FAILED at providing the proof he said he had...
If you have the proof post it... otherwise stop flapping off at the mouth and misrepresenting your animals. None of us have done business with you because we can clearly see through you and your games as well as the fact we can see the diffidence in what you claim your animals are and what your animals really are. Why on earth would we pay you almost triple what somethings worth when it's clearly not what you say it is?

 

[morphed]

I actually sat and read this whole thread for some unknown reason. Bordem at work possibly. Either way i wasnt going to post anything but i feel compeled to say something.

For starters i bought snakes from Joe and Wes back when they were Morph King, yes Joe your animals were healthy and represented properly.

I do not agree with the way Morph King handled themselves with the blue eyed lucy matter, and i have to agree with every thing Mike said in his post.

Secondly i have bought snakes from Kevin and they too were healthy and genetically sound.

So i am not here to run to the side of either Kevin or Joe.

But Joe you are claiming that Kevin is misrepresenting his animals by saying he has a Hidden Gene woma line and a granite hidden gene woma line and that the GHGW does not actually throw granites and that it is in deed just a single mutation.

Ok thats fine, BUT WHO THE HELL CARES!!!!! Look at the animals Matt and Kevin are making with HGWs, then look at the animals you are making with your "HGW", they are not the same. That is like me seeling a Blood Python to someone and saying oh no its a hidden gene ball python i swear. That will never make it a Ball Python!

Maybe Joe is just not seeing the whole picture here. I, in some shocking turn of events understand why this thread was started but have no idea why the topic Joe brought to the table is such a big deal. If you really want a genetic granite you can buy them for $100 bucks, hell ill sell you one for $50.00. But that is not the point. The point is that Kevin and Matts hidden gene womas produce amazing off the chart snakes, your hidden gene woma creates animals that look like other breeders lesser womas that are not working with the hidden gene.

What i have gathered from this whole long smear of he said she said, is that PHR is selling animals they trully "believe" are hidden gene womas. I guess as long as you tell your customer the TRUTH......

"these animals will never produce the hidden gene woma crosses that kevins line produces"

and you can find the sucker to pay top dollar for an imitation animal then that is on you and how you choose to run your buisness.

Note to the wise --- Change the name of your animals Joe, to something entirley different. Market them differently instead of piggy backing on a morph they will never be. And continue to tell your "kinda nutty" truth to your new potential buyers. Better yet you should make a link to this post as a signature for your email responses to your customers, that way they can all see what they are buying.

Ok this is my first and last post. Unlike Joe ill just continue to read in the shadows and keep my mouth shut

Kim
N.A.R.C

 

[greensnake88]

theyve already shown proof [look as link in clarkes message above]the otherside hasnt shown the requested pics because they cant. phr's snake is obviously a hidden gene woma

 

[gsrept]

What proof i see no pics from him showing no granites in a clutch. All I see is false claims and reposting the same quoted post over and over.

 

[mountain top]

I cannot believe that this whole entire post has been hijacked by 10 or 12 people that have nothing to show as far as evidence to prove or disprove either parties claims. It has gotten to the point that there are about 10 or 12 of you just making all sorts of ridiculous accusations about Joe and myself. Nothing to do anymore with proving that Kevin's Granite Hidden Gene Woma is nothing more than a misconstrued single mutation animal.

Here is a link to a post were a Granite Hidden Gene Woma Pastel was bred to a Lesser Platinum and it clearly shows you 10 or 12 people you can go suck eggs!

http://www.captivebredreptileforums.co.uk/ball-royal-pythons/47453-soulsucker.html

I understand why these 10 or 12 people are consistently leading away from the point at hand because of posts like the one above. You 10 or 12 people just cannot stand that Clark Tucker and Joe Capone figured out that your hero sold you double mutation snakes that are not!!!! Clearly we are right on this topic but, cannot seem to shine through the hijackers!

You all know that our snake is hiding in the catacombs at that facility up north awaiting this situation that we are presenting now and it scares you that we are right!! Your all afraid of loosing your investment so, you make up slanderous claims about us trying to sell misrepresented animals. You want everyone to also think that we have dissatisfied customers which we do not. You would also like to keep on about Joe's involvement in Ball Python past which you have all misconstrued like Kevin's snake.

I did not want to come here. I tried to settle this with Kevin but he just insisted on calling me names and telling me I don’t know what I am talking about. Clearly this is not the case since everything that is truthful in this post has been quickly hijacked and covered with garbage. Fact of the matter is I am not concerned with the selling of these snakes just their presence on the internet is good enough for me as they are descendants from the Original Hidden Gene Woma which none of you 10 or 12 can disprove.

Like before I stated and I am stating again, I never came here to prove anything. I just came here to tell the truth about the misrepresentation of this particular morph, Granite Hidden Gene Woma.

Best regards,
Clark Tucker
PHR[/QUOTEppp


It makes sense to me clark. K. Matthews

 

[gsrept]

Very obvious this thread is going no where fast, so I will stop wasting my time and good luck to all who buy morphs from PHR. You will never get the truth from them and thats the real truth.

 

[Ghi Reptiles]

EVERYONE PLEASE READ CAREFULLY!!!

Quoted from Clark

Here is a link to a post were a Granite Hidden Gene Woma Pastel was bred to a Lesser Platinum and it clearly shows you 10 or 12 people you can go suck eggs!

http://www.captivebredreptileforums....oulsucker.html

And Joe's response to Clarks post "Clark has it dead on and that is a fact".

But wait a second here...if my photos don't count of my animals neither should the ones in the link above because...drum roll please...

Quoted from Clark

We want to see multiple pictures of multiple clutches of Granite HGW's, Non-Granite HGW's, Granites (real ones), and single Non-Granite mutations or normals all coming out of the eggs together (with the eggs clumped together NOT a bunch of individual eggs or fleshly hatched snakes).

Quoted from Joe

Matt,
A bunch of eggs clumped together. Multiple clutches just step back and take picks of the full clutches coming out with eggs clumped together. With NON Granite HGW's, Granite HGW's, NON Granite single mutations or normals and NON HGW Granites all coming out. Not freshly hatched snakes. Genetically speaking, it should be a piece of cake...

Do you guys really forget the BS you spew that quickly? So now this one clutch which fails all of your criteria for photographic proof is gold? Both of you are officially pathetic

 

[Otter_23]

the last post by kelli and johnny were pretty much dead on all this crap flinging is making me dizzy. what do i get from this as an enthusiast? i just started collecting and enjoying ball pythons in the last couple years. people who want to sell hidden gene lessers and need to have snakes named after themselves for profit really show the ugly side. ive bought snakes from a few of the people here and what i know to be true.is my first collection of amazon basin emeralds was lost because someone at ghi reptiles told me to buy a snake that was obviously thin and frail but it just needed a few feedings as it was a wild caught. within three months all my snakes were either viral or dead. then came the excuses you touched a water bowl , didnt properly quarantine, wash your hands before moving something.all of which i know i did. how? because i was there. i then watched the same individual purchase a basin at a show after i told him i just saw the guy selling probe 3 snakes without cleaning the probe. i then find out mr ghi isnt even a breeder all his snakes were being bred at a friends facility that specializes in emeralds. i actually gave up on the industry for 5 or 6 yrs because of this type of crap. it's also becoming pretty clear someones breeding for him now with his fresh collection of pics that it seemed to take some time to produce. im currently living with an importer who has been in the reptile business for 30yrs. and have heard some pretty shady conversations with some "big guys" in the industry. even a certain kevin on the speaker phone laughing about how he'got so many morphs he just throws a bunch of snakes together and waits to see what he gets. sorry to all who bought hidden gene lessers my lesser was only$300 and i will be purchasing my hgw from anyone but these guys . as for powerhouse ive bought a few animals from them and theyre all solid and doing fine. i know from reading this thread a few of you have a strong dislike for them but i havent really heard any reasons other than im on the side w/ the bigger rep. i know joe gets abit exited when he's wheelin and dealin but i dont see whats wrong with being exited about selling and owning cutting edge projects. i wish that was my job. im not trying to preach but powerhouse is the only people i've dealt with that has always answered all my questions shown me their facility and offered me a few thing i wish i could have jumped on because the prices were better. it looks like their ad was pulled because alot of big shots were afraid of losing money. i have a feeling another thread from hell will be here when people start looking to prove out theyre magic granites. it's a shame when such a great hobby is ruled by greed. i swear all of the above is the truth as ive seen it. ill bet ghi couldnt tell a woma,spark or yellowbelly from a normal [well maybe the yellowbelly]and please all you genetic engineers dont waste youre time. im not really interested in hearing about whats real and whats not. gotta go i just found a hidden gene lesser granite in my backyard

Timmy?

 

[Willow]

What does that thread on another forum have to do with anything??

No one here has a problem with the LESSERS in this situation

That thread you posted, talks about using normal lessers alongside a HGW to make a Soulsucker...no one has argued with you on that. Not even Kevin, tho he will say HIS lesser make Soulsuckers that look a little more intense due to the line of lessers he works with. Just like someone working with a reduced pattern line of enchis or a blackback line of pastels.

That does not change the fact that your animal is NOT a HGW to BEGIN with

 

[mountain top]

Quoted from Clark


But wait a second here...if my photos don't count of my animals neither should the ones in the link above because...drum roll please...

Quoted from Clark


Quoted from Joe


Do you guys really forget the BS you spew that quickly? So now this one clutch which fails all of your criteria for photographic proof is gold? Both of you are officially pathetic

Very obvious this thread is going no where fast, so I will stop wasting my time and good luck to all who buy morphs from PHR. You will never get the truth from them and thats the real truth.

how many times are you going to use childish disturbing a motor cons as well as your bullshit to draw the thread off course. I'm amazed at the level of peoples willingness to hide and distort the truth. you make wild accusations without ever having purchased from them and having no proof just tell lies and spread rumors. K. Matthews

 

[Willow]

It is quiet obvious who is hiding and distorting the truth. Kevin Matthews, enjoy being in the same scammer category as the rest of them. Joe and Clark have proven nothing, and REFUSE to see all the evidence sitting right in front of them that they are WRONG.

 

[Willow]

I'm going to start calling my Dachshund a German Shepard....cuz apparently if you say it enough times and repeat over and over that you are the ONLY person who is correct and EVERYONE else is wrong, people will start to believe you.