Bad Guy Underground Reptiles Stay away!!

[lillyorchid]

Jay I would post all emails asap and not wait until Monday morning.

 

[bobbafett]

I don't see how the dead gecko matters at this point because OP isn't asking for a refund for that gecko.

You sold him a male gecko, and labelled it as a female. Your TOS says that you won't guarantee sex, yet you sold OP a "female" at a higher price than a male.

The TOS might make sense if you sold all animals as unsexed and at the same price, but what's the point of claiming animals to be a certain gender when you won't even back it up?


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[MikeCurtin]

I think it is disgraceful to invoke God's name in association with a business whose business practices are so questionable. I never.....ever.....would have mistook Ryan for a Christian. His actions here on numerous occasions have shown quite the contrary.

 

[iJMORGAN]

I also learned the hard way. Spent 700$ on a pair of caimans just to die 31 days later. Finally got 150$ refunded after 7 months. Only reason it happened was that he made my gf cry at a show and people started looking over and talking.

 

[Lucille]

http://www.browardpalmbeach.com/1999-02-04/news/cold-blooded-smuggling/5/

From the article above:


"Gittman, an adrenaline junkie and former loan collector from Queens who used his fists to extract money from deadbeats"

Oh i love it. I got multiple phonecalls from Rian Gittman today. Threatening me physically. haha Bless his little heart

From the article, above:

" I wake up in the morning and ask God what he has planned for me."

I don't think that He plans or has asked that you call and allegedly threaten to hurt people, Rian.

 

[UndergroundReptiles]

if your really interested:
I called Jay today to ask him what I ever did to him maybe to make right what I did wrong you know patch things up, I spent good money with him for a couple years and it was good his animals were first class. when I called him he cursed me out like a dog from the first sentence and as far as threatening him I asked him why at the Daytona show he didn't curse me out to my face I guess that's kind of a physical threat in a way. but truth is I'm 49 years old and a father of 6 so beating people up is kind of a long ago thing and yea I got a past and its no secret I never tried to hide it goodness its all over the internet but I paid my debt and I promise I wouldn't hit the guy, I haven't been in a street fight in over 25 years. If I owe you money just call me ill credit you or refund you but just try to be reasonable. we ship a lot of orders every week as well as handle some very large corporate store accts and have very few complaints and a very small percentage of mistakes. we really appreciate any and all business we get. Jay hates me hates my business and hates my faith. Do I owe him money? Did I beat him up as a kid? What is it then? whoever thinks I've wronged them Call me talk to me lets settle it. If not ok live on your keyboard and tell your group I suck ok feel better? Did you solve your problem?
I live a dream helping folks follow their dreams Its been my honor and blessing. I'm sorry to all you guys holding these hurts in so long call me lets solve them!

 

[mfasano]

"we really appreciate any and all business we get"

Good way of showing it. Cant fix a $20 problem, didn't even respond to anything about it on this thread. I may have only ordered 3 cheap Panther geckos but it's still a sale and it went bad by Underground Reptiles fault of not being able to sex a gecko correctly.

 

[Ed Clark]

Rian, we have old business to discuss. I will call you to see if your post is sincere...if it is I will be happy to report here that you made things right.

 

[Jay Sommers Reptiles]

Jay I would post all emails asap and not wait until Monday morning.

Lilly I cant i have a family weekend out of town i am not going to deprive my kids or my wife by wasting time on this.because once i start writing and posting emails it will take me an hour at a minimum.

 

[Jay Sommers Reptiles]

Well Rian i am 41 and a father of 4 what is your point? Again you keep referencing beating people up and me hiding behind a keyboard.
I hate you and underground because you are not a man of your word. You broke a deal with me when i hand delivered your order from 1600 miles away to daytona. I delivered you refused. I have it all in email. I dont hate your faith well maybe YOUR faith but not christianity. I actually dont hate any religion i just dont believe in them. I do however hate people who manipulate and lie and BS people into buying from them or trusting them because they are such hardcore god loving people. You are like so many bs christians i have known. Like the guy I worked for back before i was a full time breeder. He used to wear a cross on his neck and drive with a bible on his dash where everyone could see it when he pulled up to bid jobs. He would go straight to the god thing it made me sick. Oh do you know why? Because he was a coke addict who beat his wife and kids. When i found out i quit. I also kicked the crap out of him. He was a wanna be fighter like you. He talked a lot of smack.Just like you. So you are just one of many lowlife smack talking wanna be fighters i have had to deal with in my life.

You seem to forgotten our brief conversation yesterday. I said when YOU threatened me YOU crossed the line. And then in an attempt to intimidate me you threatend me again yesterday. I told you to stop calling me and you said you would continue and you did i will post proof of that. I don't tolerated threats from anyone. You don't know me well enough to make threats. You did not beat me up as a kid you couldnt have. Nor could you beat me up as an adult. You don't know my history what i have been through or my abilities but people who know me do and they would tell you that you probably shouldnt threaten me. You do not and could not intimidate me. Like i have told you stop threatening me and deal with your aggression in person with me. I will be happy to engage. You do not know what true rage is,i will be happy to show you,I earned mine the hard way unfortunately. Maybe someday I will go on Oprah and share my life story so you can learn from it. It really is quite riveting. Until then be quiet about "beating me up" and stop lying about the facts of our unhappy ending. and stop having your little puppet who worships you(Ryan B) get on here and puke complete lies and fabrications. Come monday all facts will be laid out with email verification. Off to Arizona!

 

[Big Borg Reptiles]

I also kicked the crap out of him. He was a wanna be fighter like you. He talked a lot of smack.Just like you. So you are just one of many lowlife smack talking wanna be fighters i have had to deal with in my life.

You did not beat me up as a kid you couldnt have. Nor could you beat me up as an adult. You don't know my history what i have been through or my abilities but people who know me do and they would tell you that you probably shouldnt threaten me.

You do not know what true rage is,i will be happy to show you,I earned mine the hard way

I honestly haven't seen any proof of Ryan making any threats, but you definitely are. I'm not on anyone's side, but you might want to stop accusing people of things that you are blatantly doing yourself.

 

[Big Borg Reptiles]

Ryan B is completely fabricating. Would you care for me to post all the emails? I have them. I dont threaten people.

I just went back through the posts and found this. You aren't painting yourself in a very good light. Unless you have some undeniable proof, anything you say about anyone should be taken with a grain of salt.

 

[Big Borg Reptiles]

This is directed to the OP, Mel:

I am a completely neutral bystander in all of this. I have never dealt with Underground Reptiles in any way, I do not know anyone that works there, nothing. Here is the issue that I have with what I've seen.

You are benefiting from the fact that everyone is on the 'hate Underground' bandwagon right now, which is an unfortunate side effect of the BOI and a simple case of argumentum ad populum. If I were Underground Reptiles, I would also be hesitant to give you a refund or credit, and here is why: you ordered a male and two females. You are now claiming that one female died and the other is actually a male. However, your proof of this is nothing in the case of the dead one (for some reason you didn't take any pictures?) and a picture of a male gecko to show that you didn't get a female.

If you ordered two different gendered geckos from them, my request would be that you take a picture of BOTH remaining geckos, side by side, to show that BOTH of them are male. You showing us a picture of a male gecko is not proof of anything other than that you did, in fact, receive a male gecko.

I am not saying that you are wrong or lying, I'm just saying that you haven't really shown any proof of your claim. If you can show the two geckos side by side in the same picture, both males, it would give much more validity to your accusation, and I would absolutely agree that Underground Reptiles owes you compensation. In the meantime, as someone who is looking at this on a purely factual basis, I do not think that you have proven anything and the fact that Underground even offered a replacement based on what you've shown was a very generous gesture on their part.

 

[mfasano]

This is directed to the OP, Mel:

I am a completely neutral bystander in all of this. I have never dealt with Underground Reptiles in any way, I do not know anyone that works there, nothing. Here is the issue that I have with what I've seen.

You are benefiting from the fact that everyone is on the 'hate Underground' bandwagon right now, which is an unfortunate side effect of the BOI and a simple case of argumentum ad populum. If I were Underground Reptiles, I would also be hesitant to give you a refund or credit, and here is why: you ordered a male and two females. You are now claiming that one female died and the other is actually a male. However, your proof of this is nothing in the case of the dead one (for some reason you didn't take any pictures?) and a picture of a male gecko to show that you didn't get a female.

If you ordered two different gendered geckos from them, my request would be that you take a picture of BOTH remaining geckos, side by side, to show that BOTH of them are male. You showing us a picture of a male gecko is not proof of anything other than that you did, in fact, receive a male gecko.

I am not saying that you are wrong or lying, I'm just saying that you haven't really shown any proof of your claim. If you can show the two geckos side by side in the same picture, both males, it would give much more validity to your accusation, and I would absolutely agree that Underground Reptiles owes you compensation. In the meantime, as someone who is looking at this on a purely factual basis, I do not think that you have proven anything and the fact that Underground even offered a replacement based on what you've shown was a very generous gesture on their part.

Stated in many of my posts. I am not asking any credit or replacements for the dead female because she died weeks ago and I did not have proof. I was not even going to email them about it until the other female turned male.

Also pictures of both males are posted on this thread. THey are not side by side but are clearly different geckos, one is striped and one is banded. Don't see how I haven't proven anything

 

[Big Borg Reptiles]

You posted the picture you sent them, that they didn't ask for, that just showed the underside of a gecko that was male. This could have been any gecko in the world as far as I'm concerned. I'm just saying, if that was the only picture that you sent them, I'm surprised they offered anything.

Again, I am NOT saying you are in the wrong...I just think that you are benefiting from people not looking at things objectively at the moment. I think that sending them a picture of both males together, it would have much more validity than just showing the underside of a male gecko.

 

[mfasano]

Along with 2 aditional pictures, one of each male. In the same post

 

[Big Borg Reptiles]

Did you send Underground those pictures though?

 

[mfasano]

They never asked for a picture. They have been on this thread enough. They have seen it.
Offering credit on a $20 gecko only benefits them so why not offer me credit. Then I have to purchase something else from them and pay shipping again just to get a female I ordered.

 

[Big Borg Reptiles]

If you did not provide them any proof other than the underside of a male gecko (that could have been ANY gecko, and you had a male from them too), and they offered you a replacement on a future purchase WITHOUT ASKING FOR ANY PROOF, why on earth would you post on the BOI that they are bad people? It sounds to me like they were more than willing to work with you even without you proving anything. I personally would have asked for evidence before just giving someone free money.

 

[Big Borg Reptiles]

The value of the animal is beside the point, but to put it in perspective, pretend that you sell someone a $500 reptile. They contact you almost A MONTH LATER and say that it is a different sex. The only proof they provide is a vague shot from the underside of a reptile showing it is male.

Would you personally be inclined to send them a full refund? Would you offer them anything without requiring further proof? If so you are a saint, and I'll buy everything you have right now.