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Bad Guy Avangel Geckos

I would like to clear up something really fast. Brian said a few things that I want to make known. When he first asked me about my snow line I began to first answer his questions but I did not disclose anything to him because he was being negative. I tried my best to explain and it seemed as nothing came of it. I have to now disclose what I used to create my line because now he has gotten this out of hand because he was upset with not getting what he was looking for. His intentions weren't to buy the gecko, it was actually to stur something up because as he continues to claim, there are only four snow "morphs" out there. He was ready, guns loaded. Also to why I deleted all of his negative messages off of my public youtube page, was because I do not believe in having anything negative on my personal pages. I do not mind blogs or threads though, but mine. I won't have it. I hope that is understood.
 
And furthermore, I responded to you answer asking you to clarify what you meant. You answered saying something along the lines of we crossed an existing line and then selectively bred, or something similar to that. All I said was isn't it still what you started with? I was asking honestly. Why would I come out of no where as you say guns ready and personally attack your line? I don't know you from Adam. Like I mentioned before, there was another person who chimed in , I won't quote them here, but that's when you got mad and said to PM you, which I did.
 
Avangel Reptiles said:
Someone asked about what the Ray Hine is. Yes Ray hine is two things. It is the person that created the morph as well as the morph itself. It is called a Ray Hine Dominant Hypo.
QUOTE]

So what you have there are hypo (Hine) mack snows/super snows. (Stunning BTW..:)) that have been line bred from the original pairing.
Click to expand...
 
Avangel Reptiles said:
When my gene hits. It is an enhanced snow, which was, yes, derived from mack snow, but why call my quality work a mack snow, when my snows look far different from that of a mack snow. I crossed a blood to my snow. One of the darkest tangs and still my gene conquered. Turning the gecko in to a variance of colors (when the snow does not hit. I have gotten an excess of lavender, xanthic, green...)
Click to expand...

I was re-reading a few things to make sure I didnt miss anything and I came across this part of your explanation.

From what you describe there it sounds more like you've hit on something completely separate from the actual snow aspect of this.

You state there that "When the snow hits, it enhances it" But "when it does not hit, I have gotten an excess of lavender, xanthic, green...". Meaning whatever you've developed, it has some sort of effect on the gecko whether the snow hits or not. Meaning, what you have is not a line of snows more than something else that produces lavenders, xanthics, etc. And when mixed with a snow, produces an enhanced version of a mack snow that you call your line.

That being said, I think the question would be, (since I know nothing about the Hine hypo), is it the Hine hypo gene thats having that effect? Or something that you've developed in your line breeding? I guess what Im asking is, what exactly does the Hine hypo gene do in a non-snow situation? Does it produce the lavender, xanthic, green visuals that you talk about?
 
I guess what Im asking is, what exactly does the Hine hypo gene do in a non-snow situation? Does it produce the lavender, xanthic, green visuals that you talk about?


It would be nice to see some pictures of these animals too.
 
Because they don't look like Mack Snows anymnore...obviously, so why call them Mack snows? He bred the line silly. Thats how new lines start. Maybe a few years down the orad when we see these bad boys all over, you will bite your words eh?
 
I posted a few pics on page 6. The ray hine gene is still a weird gene, but what I believe from what I have noticed about the genes is that when they combined, because they were two different co/dominant genes that instead of getting the natural cross effect like a snow enigma, they instead fused, in trying to fight for domination. I know it does not kind of make since but it is what I noticed. The combined morph is what effects other genes when the snow does not hit, versus when they are originally separate genes.

Someone asked if I had an original ray hine. I actually still have her. She has no hets at all, she is pure and original.

The reason why most do not know what the ray hine hypo is, is because they did not get their chance to shine for long. Which is why I did not disclose the ray hine gene before because most do not understand it, or what it can do.
 
Paul, you asked a question about do I have the ray hine hypos mack snows that I crossed and are line bred. I would say that what I did was actually crossed the two which merged them together then line bred the mergers and every now and again only added a bit of the ray hine. Not every season, but just enough.
 
Avangel Reptiles said:
The combined morph is what effects other genes when the snow does not hit, versus when they are originally separate genes.
.
Click to expand...

In the event that the snow doesnt hit, would that not mean your only dealing with the single morph in that case? Snow being co-dominant if its not hitting for snow, then theres no snow there. Is there more to it that Im not getting? (Definitely possible with me..lol) Just trying to understand it the way you do
 
Brian, I just believe that if I want to know something about someones line, I ask them through private message because maybe they do not want to tell the world. If you ask me on my youtube page and I don't answer, it looks as if I am lying, and if I delete your messages on there then it looks like I am hiding something, but if you think about it, if I was hiding something I would have just deleted the whole video. That is the only thing about the whole situation. I was upset because it did not seem like you were interested in the line but interested in putting it down. (I see that you are not now) but at least through all this, you got all the info you were looking for.
 
ronritzer said:
Because they don't look like Mack Snows anymnore...obviously, so why call them Mack snows? He bred the line silly. Thats how new lines start. Maybe a few years down the orad when we see these bad boys all over, you will bite your words eh?
Click to expand...


Oh ok, so we can line breed a specific morph, say an albino to be super bright ( as in a previous example) and some how the genetics cease to be the original strain of albinism that we started with?

Unfortunately that is not how genetics work.
 
I'm thinking that a discussion of genetics might be better in a discussion forum?
 
bmr1052 said:
Oh ok, so we can line breed a specific morph, say an albino to be super bright ( as in a previous example) and some how the genetics cease to be the original strain of albinism that we started with?

Unfortunately that is not how genetics work.
Click to expand...

With albinos, you would always have to add albino because it's recessive. With the mack snow, you could just keep breeding to something else and not add any more mack over a 5 year time.
 
Kristi23 said:
With albinos, you would always have to add albino because it's recessive. With the mack snow, you could just keep breeding to something else and not add any more mack over a 5 year time.
Click to expand...

I understand that, but in order to still have the co dom snow kick in it has to be present in the first place. As you can see by the pictures he is producing supers, so clearly it is not become a line breeding project. There are still co dom genes contributing. The co dom gene never changes or ceases to be its original strain just because you have bred it over 5 years.
 
Kristi23 said:
With albinos, you would always have to add albino because it's recessive. With the mack snow, you could just keep breeding to something else and not add any more mack over a 5 year time.
Click to expand...

Well not really. Being that Mack Snows are a co-dom, you could think about the snows as visual hets and the supers as homo. Really it acts (for the most part) the same with the exception of the "het" being a visual expression. Meaning the "snow" part of this is and always has been a continuation of a mack snow gene, spiced up (beautifully) with the Hine gene.
 
Lucille said:
I'm thinking that a discussion of genetics might be better in a discussion forum?
Click to expand...

Normally Id be right there with you but I think in this case its the genetics that are the question. Sorry for the 20 (genetics) questions on my part, but Im trying nail down exactly what things are. Ive considered buying his snows in the past and Id like to understand what I can about them. Hopefully thats not boring everyone else to death :eek:
 
The genetics are the issue. He is still claiming that this somehow his 2 co dom genes have fused and that they are not simply mack snows. While I agree it is not only a mack snow ( as there are numerous mack snow combos out there ) I do believe that there is no new line of genetics in play here. It is very easy to say " well I have a special gecko no one else has and it is genetically different from anything out there, but how would one back up this claim.

As chaz stated, I claim there are only 4 snow morphs. What I mean by that is to date, there are 4 types of distinguished snow lines. That are genetically separated from each other.

If Chaz claims he has a new line, Then that is a very significant statement, and he can not stonewall people who are questioning as to its genes. When you put out youtube videos, facebook pictures or any other public information making such claims, you can not expect people to just take his word it is new. There will be questions and there will be inquiries. How he handled my questions was uncalled for. He made assumptions that I came " with loaded guns" and that I was " there to attack his line" when I had no clue who he was or what he was about. I dont know how after my 2 youtube comments he could come to such a conclusion of my intent.
 
Paul Kent said:
the genetics that are the question.
Click to expand...

Good point, but once it is all said and done perhaps someone could also bring it to the forums for the benefit of those who might be interested in the future.
 
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