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Dan Means AKA HerpLover (BAD GUY!!)

Chelsie,
First off welcome!! Also it is easier to add your name in a signature so you don't have to remember to type it every time, you can do that in the user cp button on the top of the screen. I have figured out that Dan actually lives in CO and his girlfriend lives in CA. Yet another day gone by with no responce back from Dan. Guess if I get "mom" tomorrow I'll let her know what her son has been up to! More updates tomorrow.....
 
Ken,

Your objective is undoubtedly either getting your snakes or your money back. Have you though about writing a letter ("nicely") to both families letting them know what happened? You can state just the facts, no threats or insinuations of what you might do. Just a simple letter to made them aware of what's going on. I know you have said..."well it's only $200"...But do this as a favor for this person(s) and his family, because if he gets away this time he might be tented to go for something bigger next time with the obvious consequences.

Good luck!
 
Dan Means BAD GUY!

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but Dan Means is deffinately a bad guy. He lives 20 minutes from me and i have done a trade with him before. I traded him 3 patternless leopard geckos for 2 rosy boa's. The rosy boas were kind of thin, but he assured me their previous owner was just under-feeding them and they were otherwise healthy. I was reluctant to do the trade, but decided to anyway. Bad decision.

I fed the rosy boa's later that evening and one of them regurgitated within 30 minutes of eating. I emailed Dan that evening and told him that the snake had regurgitated and that if it happened again in a week or so that I wanted to trade back the snakes for the leopards. He said sure no problem.

I fed them again and the same snake regurged right away again. I contacted him and told him that I wanted to trade back as we had agreed. He told me he no longer had the leopard geckos. He had said they were for his breeding project, so I assume he had them, but lied and said he didn't.

To make a long story a little shorter, he never responded to my emails or calls after that and the one snake died a few days later. Oh, and as for his age, he is about 19 or 20 I think. He's a real scumbag. I told him not to ever contact me about a trade again. I hate to say it, but I doubt you will ever get anything out of him.

Kim Lange
Santa Maria, Ca
 
Kim,
Wow, thanks for that! I will be calling his house here on my way into work. I am hoping his mother answers. I bet she would like to know what her little boy is up to. I'll agree, I doubt I'll see my cash again, but I won't go down without a fight.....
 
But do this as a favor for this person(s) and his family, because if he gets away this time he might be tented to go for something bigger next time with the obvious consequences.
Click to expand...

I meant to say tempted! Anyways I was giving this guy the benefit of the doubt with regards to being a young, inexperienced kid, living with his mother. This is a grown-up and he knows what he is doing.

Good luck Ken, and please keep us posted.
 
Alvaro,
Yeah I to was thinking that this was also a kid looking to make a quick buck! But now I do believe that he knows what he is doing. Yet another call to "moms house" today left a nice message. Although I once again doubt that I'll hear anything back. But I'll call 20 more times a day until I get a living person and see what is going on. I know if I was living at my mom's and running a scam she would kick me out in a second! Although it could be a whole family thing...One just never knows....But at least everyone can now see that he is truly a BAD GUY!! With this I doubt he will be so willing to post animals and try to scam anyone here again. I may have lost money but hopefully nobody else will fall into his trap!
 
Well I'll be the first to admit, I may end up looking like a FOOl to put it lightly! I just hung up with Dan, and he was moving and misplaced all my info. We have a new shipping date for next week. So we will see how that goes.....It is looking like I jumped the gun on the bad guy post.........
 
Ken.

Hopefully all it was was a case of misplaced info. I must commend you on your demeanor here. In all of your posts you kept on an even keel and didn't post anything inflamatory. I think that more than makes up for possibly having jumped the gun. I seriously doubt that any seller would be able to honestly hold this thread against you given the time frame, even if it was an honest mistake.

As far as your PM goes, I'll echo the sentiments, If you are ever around the Kenosh WI area drop in.

Steve Schindler
 
Makes up for having jumped the gun???? What?!?!?!

As far as i'm concerned a person who can't make a call, can't find your info, and doesn't bother to return a call will always be a 'bad guy in my book'. So I guess this 'losing the info' was that reasonable 'family or serious emergency" hmmmm?. You mean to tell me, he called 5-6 days later after NO contact and said "i'm sorry I couldn't find your info"? Sounds as about unprofessional as it gets, and to be honest, I don't buy it for a second. If he lost your info and was so desperately ready to send you your animals, why did he not return the first 20 calls you made? I'm sure you left him contact info multiple times for him to get in touch with you, and then he takes over 5 days?!?!?. So what, he was moving, big deal, I'm sure he knew that well before he took your money and made a promise to ship on a certain date, and the he decided (note he DECIDED) not to call and leave you out in the cold. I don't think 'I lost your info" is good enough, not when you have called numerous times giving it to him over and over. That's called INCOMPETENCE. Even if he decides to finally to treat you like you were a valued customer, I would NEVER buy from someone who interests don't seem to be the in the interests of the customer. My 2 cents Mike B.
 
Dan Means

Amen Mike! That is exactly how I feel. If he is a "good guy" he would have returned the first call immediatley. I hate to say it, but I don't think Ken is going to get the snakes. Even if he does, if they are the ones I saw about 6 months ago or so, they will not be ready to breed for anther year. It is also suspicious to me that he would sell to hets for albino white waters for only 200.00 shipped. They are most likely normals. Just my 2 cents.
 
Ken,

In this instance I agree with Mike and Kim. Hopefully I'm wrong and he sends you the snakes next week. One way or the other he should have contacted you sometime ago. By the way did he call or you called?

Please keep us posted and good luck.
 
Guys and Kim,
First off I will agree 100% hets for albino whitewater for 200 is a great deal. And we all know if a deal sounds to good to be true chances are it's not true. Although even if they are just normals, 200 for a pair isn't all bad depending on the age. Kim did you look at the link in the very first post? They seem to look like adults to me, although we will see what I get if I do get anything!

Mike,
I do agree the whole thing sounds a bit fishy. Although I myself did just move and I have yet to find a few things. But it does kind of sound like a very bad excuse. It almost sounds like "oh my this guy tracked me down and I have to talk to him, what do I say..." I do now have a cell phone number so I should be able to find him. Key word there is SHOULD.

I'll let you all know what happens if anything. Although after reading Kim's first post, I'll be very careful with these before I put them in with the other snakes here!!!

Once again thanks for all the replys!!!!

Oh yeah Steve, I'll be driving through WI in Oct on my way to ND...Although I doubt I'll have time to stop, but thanks for the offer!!
 
Alvaro,
I forgot to answer your question. I had left at message at his mothers house on Tuesday on my way to work. About 5 pm EST. She called me at work and gave me his girlfriends cell number. So I called and left a message. A few hours later Dan called me back telling me he had lost my info. And he tried to ship them but the UPS station wouldn't let him ship live animals. Then the truck broke down.... after that I lost interest in the excuses. So I asked him to ship out on Tuesday. Wednesday I'll be watching for the UPS truck, although I am wondering if it will show up!!!
 
If you want to get his attention

He lives in California and is selling California native reptiles. I highly doubt this guy has a commercial propagation permit to allow him to do this. From the description given by another poster in this thread he may even be selling wild-caught rosies, a big no-no in California. Even the het albino rosies require a permit to be sold. Also, he cannot say that someone else with a permit produced them and he is just reselling them. Unless he is a pet shop with a store front, he needs to have a permit to make any sales of native rosy boas aside from true albinos.

I assume you have emails from this guy to document this sale. Just call the Calif Dept of Fish and Game poaching hotline and report this guy. The number is 1-888-DFG-CALTIP (1-888-334-2258). Their web page is at http://www.dfg.ca.gov/.

A phone call from these guys will certainly get his attention.

Rick Staub
 
Rick,
He now lives in CO, I guess he just moved there from CA. Heck the whole thing is kind of foggy to me!! I do wonder if he had the permit when he did live in CA...Yet one more thing to ponder as I wait for my snakes to finally get here....
 
Ken, it really won't help you much but have you contacted Stephen Emerick from Napa valley Snakes? I'm sure he can't identify those particular snakes but he can probably at least tell you if he sold any hets in 2001 and possibly if he sold any to Mr. Means or not.
 
Bobby,
To be honest, I was more worried about actually getting the snakes then if they were really hets or not. I'll have to contact Stephen an ask about these snakes. I know Stephen is here a lot reading posts, Stephen if you do read this, could you confirm that you did sell hets to Mr. Means...PLEASE.....
 
I was thinking more to establish the level of honesty of Mr. Means. Good luck, I hope you get your snakes and it'll be a bonus if they are in fact hets.
 
hope you get them

This was a long time ago, but he has tried to trade me those exact snakes, for bearded dragons, then a python, I have his paypal info if you need it, the only reason I know this, is I was selling a big albino burm, he told me to go airborn and it would only run like 40.00, I had stated in my ad that I didn'y want to ship because he was to big, but he told me he worked, with a post office company, and I could go airborn it wouldn't cost that much, so like a dumb @ss I accepted his money...went down to send and the cheapest way was like 140.00, so I refunded him his money. This is all along story, when I 1st went to send the snake I went to a little company to that picked up for airborn, that place told me it would be like 260.00 to ship, that's when I refunded him his money, but I felt awfull for making a deal, then canceling the deal, so I checked around and UPS told me like 140.00 so I told him if he still wanted them I would pay half the shipping, he told me he didn't have the money now would I be willing to trade, for those rosey boa's, the value was suppose to be like 500.00 I told him no, I wasn't into het because I knew nothing about it, he told me he had all the paper work,,and along time before that, he wrote to me using a differant e-mail, and wanted to trade them for some dragons, the value for the snakes then was like 250.00, when I asked if he was the same person I never got an answer, the only reason I know it was is because it was the exact same picture....none of this may have anything to do with any of this, but I do have paypal info if you need it....
Good-Luck
Shannon Hall
 
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