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Inquiry Genefreak339 / Michael Harshbarger

Sorry for double posting, but the difference between flipping snakes and reselling stocks is that stocks don't get stressed from repeated shipping or travel, don't get ill or pick up various illnesses or parasites going from one broker to another.

I don't say all folks that buy/resell animals are the Anti-Christ or anything, but there's a huge difference between some bits of paper and live creatures.
 
There are some resellers that send out lists to their clients - often just modified copies of their source's lists - and place their orders based on the orders they receive. This is probably the most frowned upon type of flipper, because the animals are not in their possession. At least in this case, Michael was making an effort to sell specific animals, and provide people with what they were looking for.
Michael, this would have eventually come to bite you on the ass, when you took money for a snake only to find that it was already sold.
 
Think what you want but what done is done and Im here trying to explain that I was wrong. If you are reading this thread though you will see I sold a mystic that the guy was completely happy with... that $1500 and he got his snake within days of purchase.

Chuckels said:
I hate to say it, but your ability recall anything is lacking.

If your ad on 7-21-2010 @ 11:23pm, you listed several animals for sale, particularly a 0.1 650 Gram Caramel Albino for $1600 Shipped. Matt Oakley then replied to your ad stating..exact quote..."Why are you using my picture of my Caramel in your ad without my permission?"

I dont think thats inquiring about anything. Your trying to pass off other people's animals as your own. Im willing to bet that if I paid you $1600 for that Caramel Shipped, I would have been waiting my entire life for that snake.
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I understand that and that is why I am here trying to say I was wrong, trying to get this behind me and move on.

This might be off topic but I am going to the gym I will be back in about an hour and a half to answer any more questions.


hhmoore said:
There are some resellers that send out lists to their clients - often just modified copies of their source's lists - and place their orders based on the orders they receive. This is probably the most frowned upon type of flipper, because the animals are not in their possession. At least in this case, Michael was making an effort to sell specific animals, and provide people with what they were looking for.
Michael, this would have eventually come to bite you on the ass, when you took money for a snake only to find that it was already sold.
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Genefreak339 said:
I happen to think that "flipping" is just like the stock market, buy for less sell for more. And you can say all I care about is the $$$$, every penny I made so far has went into buying myself ball pythons. So its more or less about me getting "discounts" on my purchases. :thumbsup:
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Well..Maybe your mind isnt feeble,but mable simple??..So what happens when you flip a snake that has IBD??...Who's fault is that??..Are you gonna tell the buyer they will get their money when you get yours from the person you originially got the snake from??..Flipping is a very tedious thing to do if you consistently keep snakes for a very short time period..


Chuckels said:
I hate to say it, but your ability recall anything is lacking.

If your ad on 7-21-2010 @ 11:23pm, you listed several animals for sale, particularly a 0.1 650 Gram Caramel Albino for $1600 Shipped. Matt Oakley then replied to your ad stating..exact quote..."Why are you using my picture of my Caramel in your ad without my permission?"

I dont think thats inquiring about anything. Your trying to pass off other people's animals as your own. Im willing to bet that if I paid you $1600 for that Caramel Shipped, I would have been waiting my entire life for that snake.
Click to expand...

Yeah you would have been waiting long for the snakes..Hell when someone is trying to sell them before they get them..It can show you where his head is at..To bad he wont be makin anymore money...
 
Genefreak339 said:
I understand that and that is why I am here trying to say I was wrong, trying to get this behind me and move on.

This might be off topic but I am going to the gym I will be back in about an hour and a half to answer any more questions.
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I suggest you go to night school in the evenings instead of the gym..You should take some kind of business class and learn about copyright laws as well...Not tryin to be mean..You really have broken the law here...
 
Michael,

There is one huge factor you are not considering here. What if the animal you purchase is sick? You then get it, don't notice it's ill, ship it out and it dies in transit. You are now out $$$.

I breed very expensive cats. A breeder recently tried a similar thing. She bought a bunch of discount cats and kittens and flipped them to her buyers. She is now taking cats back and paying for vet visits on every one because they have severe eye infections that popped up when they were stressed out by the second move. And now her name is dirt. To make a couple bucks she risked her entire reputation.

If a buyer asked specific questions about the animal would you tell them you didn't know because you didn't have it? Or would you make up an answer? Anyone with $5000.00 can do what you're doing. They don't because they know it's a bad idea.

If you really feel you have a good business plan at least do yourself and everyone else a favor and start selling electronics instead of snakes.
 
Iguanachic said:
Michael,

There is one huge factor you are not considering here. What if the animal you purchase is sick? You then get it, don't notice it's ill, ship it out and it dies in transit. You are now out $$$.

I breed very expensive cats. A breeder recently tried a similar thing. She bought a bunch of discount cats and kittens and flipped them to her buyers. She is now taking cats back and paying for vet visits on every one because they have severe eye infections that popped up when they were stressed out by the second move. And now her name is dirt. To make a couple bucks she risked her entire reputation.

If a buyer asked specific questions about the animal would you tell them you didn't know because you didn't have it? Or would you make up an answer? Anyone with $5000.00 can do what you're doing. They don't because they know it's a bad idea.

If you really feel you have a good business plan at least do yourself and everyone else a favor and start selling electronics instead of snakes.
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You hit the nail on the head with a dump truck lol..I dont think we are gonna get through to this guy though..Sounds like he is bent on makin a quick buck versus makin good money and becoming a legit seller..
 
Iraqvet said:
You hit the nail on the head with a dump truck lol..I dont think we are gonna get through to this guy though..Sounds like he is bent on makin a quick buck versus makin good money and becoming a legit seller..
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I think you are correct. :iagree:

This is why I won't be buying from him no matter how many times he "explains" himself. The explanations are self-serving now, imo.:shrug01:
 
There is a Huge difference between what a flipper does and what this guy is doing... a Flipper actually OWNS the animal he's selling! Big Big Mistake to try to sell something that you don't even have in your possesion.. for example... the kinked tails on the pythons you produced and didn't notice.. say one of these snakes that you are selling comes to you with a crooked back, kinked tail, RI.... etc... now what do you do?!?! Do you send it back to the original and risk the animal dying in transport from being shipped AGAIN, do you send it to your customer thinking they may not notice.... It's just a disaster waiting to happen! Yes.. there are many flippers out there and some may be successful but most aren't so successful.
I myself have purchased groups of animals only to sell off the ones that I don't need for my own projects... am I a flipper... I don't consider myself one because when I receive a group of animals I make sure they are feeding, Healthy, treated for anything they may/may not have... wait SEVERAL Months then resell them. Big difference. I take pride in what I sell and want to make sure the customer gets what they are expecting.

Just my .02
 
For what it is worth the last couple of animals I posted I do have and they have been eating and look 100% healthy. I will post some pics to prove I have them.... As far as making a quick buck, I stated earlier that every penny I have made goes into my collection..... I am building up a good collection of ball pythons the best way I think I can, Im sorry but I dont have 20grand to spend all at once on snakes. And for the kinked tails I have been talking to a few breeders and we have come to the conclusion that it was probably because I used maternal incubation. It doesnt matter to me if you plan to buy from me or ever will, I am simply here trying to state what i did... Im admitting I was wrong and trying to work past it.
-Michael

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Michael, I think at this point, you need to stop trying to EXPLAIN and just focus on DOING. You can EXPLAIN until the cows come home about how you know you were wrong and how your reasons and intentions were somehow not so bad....but words like that mean very little when it comes to rebuilding a good reputation. Words are like sticks of dynamite in a situation like this...the wrong words will continue to blow up in your face. And even the very rightest words...said with true contrition and making it clear that you've learned a valuable lesson....all they can do is blow away the debris of your mistakes. Your ACTIONS will begin to rebuild the foundation of your reputation, and only your actions.

You are simply not going to walk away from this thread with a good rep in anyone's eyes, no matter how much you talk. You need to realize that it's going to take a tremendous amount of work and time to build a solid business. There are no shortcuts...and if you find some and take them, you'll find yourself right back here again...or worse. MOST people spend YEARS building up their collections and their reputations. Every single person that I've personally known or watched that took shortcuts or built up their collection/business too fast (even if they had their own money to start with) ended up failing...and sometimes failing very hard.

Stop trying to explain....and stop trying to take shortcuts in a business where animals' lives are on the line. Work with what you have....build from there as you are able...and most of all, make the bedrock of your reputation impeccable integrity. THEN you might have a chance at succeeding in this very challenging business.
 
I really dont see the point in this post besides trying to insult me. Also I must add that I am only 22 (birthday was 08/25) and I am currently enrolled in college pursuing a degree in business.



Iraqvet said:
I suggest you go to night school in the evenings instead of the gym..You should take some kind of business class and learn about copyright laws as well...Not tryin to be mean..You really have broken the law here...
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You know I get where you are coming from and I am going to try to work through this and build up a good rep. I understand it takes time. I was just trying to explain what I was doing... If you read in previous post I made a final post a while back but after PMing with a mod he said it would be best to come back here and not walk away from the thread but yet everyone is now saying stop explaining.... I feel I am getting the run around and really dont know what to say or do anymore.....
-Michael

JudyC said:
Michael, I think at this point, you need to stop trying to EXPLAIN and just focus on DOING. You can EXPLAIN until the cows come home about how you know you were wrong and how your reasons and intentions were somehow not so bad....but words like that mean very little when it comes to rebuilding a good reputation. Words are like sticks of dynamite in a situation like this...the wrong words will continue to blow up in your face. And even the very rightest words...said with true contrition and making it clear that you've learned a valuable lesson....all they can do is blow away the debris of your mistakes. Your ACTIONS will begin to rebuild the foundation of your reputation, and only your actions.

You are simply not going to walk away from this thread with a good rep in anyone's eyes, no matter how much you talk. You need to realize that it's going to take a tremendous amount of work and time to build a solid business. There are no shortcuts...and if you find some and take them, you'll find yourself right back here again...or worse. MOST people spend YEARS building up their collections and their reputations. Every single person that I've personally known or watched that took shortcuts or built up their collection/business too fast (even if they had their own money to start with) ended up failing...and sometimes failing very hard.

Stop trying to explain....and stop trying to take shortcuts in a business where animals' lives are on the line. Work with what you have....build from there as you are able...and most of all, make the bedrock of your reputation impeccable integrity. THEN you might have a chance at succeeding in this very challenging business.
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Genefreak339 said:
You know I get where you are coming from and I am going to try to work through this and build up a good rep. I understand it takes time. I was just trying to explain what I was doing... If you read in previous post I made a final post a while back but after PMing with a mod he said it would be best to come back here and not walk away from the thread but yet everyone is now saying stop explaining.... I feel I am getting the run around and really dont know what to say or do anymore.....
-Michael
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I can understand the confusion. And I can understand someone suggesting that you not just walk away from something like this. If you walk away with the wrong attitude (or what appears to be the wrong attitude), or at the wrong time, it certainly doesn't help your case. But when you're just answering the same questions/accusations over and over again... :shrug01:

Some guys may rant about it if you're no longer participating in their game of "Poke the Badguy", but MOST people reading this thread will draw (and have already drawn) their own conclusions. Only your own actions in the future will have any positive affect on those conclusions.

My advice would be to bow out as gracefully as you can...without attitude or resentment....and then stay bowed-out...unless some entirely new issue comes to light.
 
Genefreak339 said:
I really dont see the point in this post besides trying to insult me. Also I must add that I am only 22 (birthday was 08/25) and I am currently enrolled in college pursuing a degree in business.
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I wasnt tryingt to insult you..I even said I wasnt tryin to be mean in my post...You really did break some copyright laws...You just need to stop getting ahead of yourself and pay more attention to your animals..Not trying to call you dumb but the "young and dumb" thing isnt gonna last forever...I mean,claiming you didnt know about the tails til the last moment,or not knowing you couldnt use other peoples pics,or thinking it was ok to sell snakes you didnt even own..I mean,there really is no excuse for any of that at age 22....I dont wanna pick on you...But if your doing this for side money and wanna stick around for a while you are really gonna have to change the way you do things...
 
I plan on it! :wavey:

Iraqvet said:
I wasnt tryingt to insult you..I even said I wasnt tryin to be mean in my post...You really did break some copyright laws...You just need to stop getting ahead of yourself and pay more attention to your animals..Not trying to call you dumb but the "young and dumb" thing isnt gonna last forever...I mean,claiming you didnt know about the tails til the last moment,or not knowing you couldnt use other peoples pics,or thinking it was ok to sell snakes you didnt even own..I mean,there really is no excuse for any of that at age 22....I dont wanna pick on you...But if your doing this for side money and wanna stick around for a while you are really gonna have to change the way you do things...
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It's going to be hard building up your business, when everyone knows what you have done. Word spreads quickly through the ball python community and it will be hard for you to sell anything for a long time. You might want to just cut your losses and move on to something else. Just my piece of advice
 
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