Has anyone dealt with Cameron or Ashley Glucheff

[chondrogal]

waste of education

QUOTE] The first part was being scammed and buying a snake from someone like Scott Cotey. The second part will be that when someone take advantage of you to fight for what is right.[/QUOTE]

Scott did not scam your son.

Scott proceeded with this transaction exactly according to your son's directions.

Anthony received live healthy snake and presented it to your son dead. Your son trusted Anthony. That is not Scott's problem.

You are simply barking up the wrong tree...... with all your education you aren't very wise in the way you've handled this transaction with your son.

 

[CGluhcheff]

Questions

Although I keep snakes, I was uneducated about necropsies. But, yes, I have contacted the vet and she said since it was frozen, it was too late to determine cause of death. Had I known about necropsies before the death of the snake, he would have been there as soon as he was found dead.

Another questiopn: I keep seeing the question, "well, which is it? what did he do wrong, what will you use?" Let me provide another scenario for you: You are going to the doctor, your stomach hurts, you have an ear ache, and you are running a temperature. Which symptoms do you tell the doctor? Obviously, you can not tell the doctor all of your syptoms, correct? This seems to be the case here. Are we only allowed to tell the judge one thing? I doubt it.

Please ask any other questions as I have forgotten them.

Since I am answering your questions, I am sure that Scott will now answer the one we have been asking. Scott, what would you do in our situation? Would you just say, "Oh well." Would you attempt to get your money back? Scott, if you would just suck up the loss, then I have a great DH ghost for sale, just $450!! I will not guarantee live arrival though. But, I bet it's healthy.

Also, I would like to address why nobody else involved is posting.
I have spoken to Anthony asking him to post. He has been reading this and refuses to post because he is afraid of everybody judging him without him getting a chance to tell his side of the story, mainly because nearly everybody here has already sided with Scott and Anthony is already being judged despite the fact that he hasn't posted once. Another reason Anthony has decided not to post is because of the message from Scott on his voicemail. I can not tell you what is on this message because I have only heard it once and do not remember everything that was said. Yes, I would like to post everything there and not just what makes me look good so I will wait until I have the entire message. Since I have not posted it yet, I am going to "save it for court". I would rather use it in a court of law rather than in a court of opinions.

 

[Super Petz]

Scott

I think alot of this info on here can help you out if you do happen to go to court.Just take screenshots of the facts and print them out.Im sure it will help your case out very much.

Blake Smith

 

[j tyler]

Like I've said before " Herpers are more interesting than Herps". This is by far one of the best BOI threads. Thanks Webslave and Ken for this great site. James Tyler

 

[hill4803]

The snake is dead for...

some reason other than it was sick prior to shipping. Your son is out $350 because of his own irresponsibility (and partially yours). By the way Caliornia also has one of the highest income taxes, what you actually make is not of any consequence, but you brought it up as a defense for your immature behavior! Good luck with your Ph.D. ... what is you dissertation on? Hopefully not teaching children character, you know, personal responsibility and honesty!

Ro Hill

 

[TJEvans]

Since I am answering your questions, I am sure that Scott will now answer the one we have been asking. Scott, what would you do in our situation? Would you just say, "Oh well." Would you attempt to get your money back? Scott, if you would just suck up the loss, then I have a great DH ghost for sale, just $450!! I will not guarantee live arrival though. But, I bet it's healthy.

I know if I were him, I'd ask my buddy Anthony what REALLY happened. What did he REALLY tell the seller when the snake arrived. If he in fact told him that the snake was perfectly healthy and everything was alright and it REALLY WASN'T, I'd hit him up for some restitution.....

BOTTOM LINE....ANTHONY SAID IT WAS FINE......SCOTT BELIEVED HIM.....can you really blame him for that?

Conversely......had YOU sold and shipped a snake to somebody, called them the day of shipping ot see if everything went alright and they told you it was fine and dandy, then 5 days later receive a message from the person's MOTHER that something is wrong....WHAT WOULD YOU DO.....just give the money back no questions asked? (of course, you would have ot realize that $450 is actualyl WORTH something to people that aren't as blessed as you)

I THINK NOT.........Ma'am, you need to put yourself in SCOTT'S shoes for a minute.....look at what the guy has to go on....ANTHONY said it was fine......ANTHONY gave the snake to cameron DEAD....NOT SCOTT

 

[ms_terese]

Scott, what would you do in our situation? Would you just say, "Oh well." Would you attempt to get your money back? Scott, if you would just suck up the loss, then I have a great DH ghost for sale, just $450!! I will not guarantee live arrival though. But, I bet it's healthy.

That's not the situation, Ashley, and you know it. It DID arrive alive. The truth is, in this hobby, live arrival is typically the only guarantee. Some sellers offer 24 hours to report any dissatisfaction with the condition of the animal. However, neither of these would be basis for a refund in this deal.

When you were asking the vet about the necropsy, did you explain the circumstances that the animal arrived fine, ate, and then died 2 days later? Did the vet explain to you that animals with disease that is close to killing them will not eat?

For someone who professes to know little about snakes, why are you insisting that this animal had a pre-existing condition that killed it, especially since SO MANY PEOPLE have pointed out that's not the case?

We have all (well, most) lost animals. Learn from it and go on. If you can't do that, go ahead and file in small claims court and let a judge explain it to you.

 

[HerpVenue]

Some snob wanna be rich woman was trying to tell me her husband PRIVATE E-1 was taking home more than $4000 - 5000 a month from the military

oh guys...don't get me wrong when I posted that.
I guess my communication skills are close to 0.
I was not talking about MRS G. her husband is an E-8 and does get paid more. And with serving in Iraq and separation pay and all the other goodies......he is making TONS more than the E-1 that I was talking about.

I was talking about a woman here locally to me.

sorry for the misunderstanding.

anyway back to the snake

 

[HerpVenue]

As I said, however, neither one of their incomes is relevant to this topic. Therefore, any further replies on tht tangent will be subject to deletion. Steer it back on track folks

shoot I should have read further....my mistake.

Another questiopn: I keep seeing the question, "well, which is it? what did he do wrong, what will you use?" Let me provide another scenario for you: You are going to the doctor, your stomach hurts, you have an ear ache, and you are running a temperature. Which symptoms do you tell the doctor? Obviously, you can not tell the doctor all of your syptoms, correct? This seems to be the case here. Are we only allowed to tell the judge one thing? I doubt it.

okay you are right.
so here goes.

Selling to a minor.......Obviously he had an adult "partner". He also conveyed himself as a business and an adult. Terms of Service of the place he bought the snake from says he has to be eighteen to participate. It was no ones fault but his own if he LIED. By pressing the agree button...he verified that he was 18 or over. And therefore he LIED. The snake was also sent to an adult. And somewhere in this thread you said yourself that cameron bought it, so he has to take responsibility for it. <---your own words and it is now in black and white and available for print out.

It was dead when cameron received it............... yeah but instructions where to have it delivered to a certain "adult" named anthony. Since he did not give any warranty implied or expressed........his part of the deal was done when he delivered the snake live to Anthony.

It was sick before it was sent...........According to someone here, Anthony is a "knowledgeable caregiver". And According to this "knowledgable caregiver" the snake is doing good.

He never looked at the snake before saying it was doing good........that is not the sellers problem. When yo sign a contract without reading the contract.....are you still liable for whatever is in that contract? YES.

Most States require a 7 day warranty...........Not on Reptiles. On other animals MAYBE.....But not on Reptiles.

Most Breeders give 7 day warranty.......I gave you three to four of the BIGGEST names in boid propagation. And they have 24-48 hour warranty.

All the vendors at the show had 7 day warranty.......okay, just how many where at the show? Also he does not have to give a warranty other than live arrival. There is no law. He does not have to do it just because "everyone else does"

He mailed it illegaly......If he mailed it....Go and Nail him. But he did not mail it. He sent it Fed Ex.



Any other arguments?

Oh yeah. I can tell you what you MIGHT be able to get him on.
Because I myself have forgotten to do this on a couple of things I have sent out. In fact many shippers forget it once in a while....Or they do not do it to the letter of the law/act. It is nothing big. But he can get fined if he forgot to do it and if they find out.....or should I say if they caught it. But they missed it.
But then again the Receiver (Anthony) would definately get in trouble to. After all he knew what he was receiving. And maybe Cammy would get in trouble too because he paid for it. But being a minor might save him. But then again they might hold his parents accountable.

If your son kills someone tommorrow without your consent or knowledge......YOU are still liable.

 

[ms_terese]

On the "selling to a minor" issue:

Ashley, does Cameron have your permission to buy reptiles without your prior approval? If yes, then you need to drop the argument. If not, then this is a great natural consequence, isn't it?

When did you learn that he'd bought the snake?

 

[bpc]

Ashley and Cameron,

You really need to ask your friend (the one who actually saw this snake while it was alive) what happened. This thread is all over the place, which doesn't do anyone any good. The facts are this:

Cameron lied about his age by using Reptibid.

Scott (the seller I think) shipped the snake where he was told to do so.

He checked on the snake and was told by your agent (the person who recieved the snake) that all was fine.

Scott is done with the deal at that point.

Your agent then fed the animal.

The animal ate. SICK BOAS DO NOT EAT!!! Scott can find hundreds of experienced keepers and verterinarians to testify to that, HUNDREDS!

The animal then dies, days later, AFTER IT ATE!!!

How/why is Scott responsible for the demise of an animal that was in the care of your friend?

I understand that you want your money back. But, you should be talking to the guy who killed your snake, NOT SCOTT!

 

[Wilomn]

Re: Questions

Although I keep snakes, I was uneducated about necropsies. But, yes, I have contacted the vet and she said since it was frozen, it was too late to determine cause of death. Had I known about necropsies before the death of the snake, he would have been there as soon as he was found dead.

It is SUCH a shame my roses were so well fertilized just last week.

Hey Guys, pay attention, if you freeze a snake you can't tell whether or not it DIED FROM TRAUMA. Wow, in all my years of snake keeping I have NEVER heard that one before.

ashley, I believe that YOU knew nothing about necropsies and not freezing but your SUPPOSED expert REALLY should have known that if you freeze a snake it is difficult to tell if it died from something OTHER than physical trauma. Ohhhhhhh wait a minute, MAYBE he did know that and was COUNTING on the fact that you DID NOT.

Talk to a reptile vet. You know, a vet who ACTUALLY knows about and treats reptiles. I think you may find out that freezing will make NO difference in his determination of whether or not the snake died from TRAUMA.

Webslave, as the Honorary Mayor of Hell, I just wanted to let you know we have PLENTY of room for this mess over there and it would sure LIVEN things up over there to have some fresh input from someone so well edumacated as ashley and her offspring.

Wes Pollock

 

[CGluhcheff]

Re: Re: Questions

Hey Guys, pay attention, if you freeze a snake you can't tell whether or not it DIED FROM TRAUMA. Wow, in all my years of snake keeping I have NEVER heard that one before.

ashley, I believe that YOU knew nothing about necropsies and not freezing but your SUPPOSED expert REALLY should have known that if you freeze a snake it is difficult to tell if it died from something OTHER than physical trauma. Ohhhhhhh wait a minute, MAYBE he did know that and was COUNTING on the fact that you DID NOT.

Talk to a reptile vet. You know, a vet who ACTUALLY knows about and treats reptiles. I think you may find out that freezing will make NO difference in his determination of whether or not the snake died from TRAUMA.

I called the Vet. I asked the vet. My exact words are, "I have a snake that has been frozen for the past couple of days. I would like to determine the cause of death"

She told me, "I am sorry, it's too late. You should have refrigerated it and brought it in within 24 hours."

That is what I said, that is what she told me. If you don't believe me call Veterinary Hospital at (760) 949-7387. I called yesterday at about 12:30 P.M., I believe. I do not know the name of the person I spoke to, but I am sure she will tell you I called.

 

[Wilomn]

You seem to have missed the part where I assured you that a reptile vet can determine whether or not a snake was killed by physical trauma EVEN AFTER freezing.

Find a vet that specializes in reptiles and take the snake there.

Unless of course you DON'T want to rule out death by physical trauma.

Wes Pollock

 

[Randy T.]

One thing I was wondering. Scott you can answer this one. Early on it was stated that Cam and his partner purchased the snake off of reptibid but did not purchase him through reptibid (the reserve was not met, but they contacted you asking to purchase this animal.) So do we know if Cameron actually has a reptibid account? I personally do not have a reptibid account but have looked at a few of the auctions, so I know it is possible to view but unsure if you are able to contact the sellers without actually having an account. This needs clarified, as it will show if Cameron and his partner lied about their age to gain access to reptibid or not.

Also Mrs Gluscheff, you need to contact the vet clinic again and ask them if they can do a necropsy on the snake and see if the animal died of a physical trauma (whether you believe it is from a pre existing condition or not, the physical trauma possibility needs ruled out) If that vet clinic says it is not possible then you need to contact another one as 2 of the local vet clinics (the first 2 I contacted) said that whether the animal has been frozen 24 hours or 24 days they can still find out if it was a physical trauma that could have contributed to the demise of the animal.

Also please listen to webslave and activate your account. The multiple users on one account is becoming extremely irritating and some what confusing as to who is posting what.

AND RICH!! I think this is a great HELL forum topic to add, as it has become a pissing contest more then anything worth keeping on the board of INQUIRY..

Just my opinions..
Later all

 

[Ken Harbart]

Scott, if you would just suck up the loss, then I have a great DH ghost for sale, just $450!! I will not guarantee live arrival though.

The snake arrived alive and healthy. This isn't too hard of a concept to grasp, is it? Apparently it is, so I'll say it again. The snake arived alive and healthy. What that's you say....you still don't get it??? The snake arrived alive and healthy.

There's no arguing the fact that Cameron did many things to misreoresent his age, short of outright lying (except to Reptibid). A reasonable person, under the same circumstances, would be led to believe that Cameron was an adult.

Warranties, real or implied... Sorry to bust your bubble, but seven days is the exception, and not the norm. The normal "warranty period" offered by most dealers/breeders is 48-72 hours. Some offer more, others choose not to offer anything beyond live arrival. As was stated earlier, the snake arrived alive and healthy. The seller is responsible for ensuring live, healthy arrival to the address specified by the buyer. He is not responsible for the care provided to it after it was received. Anthony was the one who provided Cameron with a dead snake.

Now then, the rest of this is off topic, but I feel the need to address the gross misinformation posted earlier by Mrs Gluhcheff regarding the US Armed Forces...

The National Guard makes up 65% of our miliary today.

The NG does not make up 65% of the military. The NG and ANG combined comprise only 20% of the military's end strength. This number goes down even further if DoD civilians are included in the total end strength.

There job is to search houses, patrol the streets, recover vehicles, and to support the other units.

Perhaps you're speaking of Iraq, because the NG, along with the rest of the military, is generally prohibited from performing civilian law enforcement duties.

Without the 6,500 people in my husbands unit who are currently in Iraq there would be civil unrest.

1) Currently, there are only 3,187 CA Guardsmen activated. Of these, some are serving here in CONUS. Others are deployed to Gitmo, still others to the Balkans. The remaining activated guardsmen are spread between Iraq, Afghanistan, and Kuwait.

2) In case you haven't been watching the news or reading the paper, there is already civil unrest in Iraq.

This is also the first time since WW2 that the guard has been called to war.

I guess that silly little fracas back in 1990/91 wasn't a war, then. I could've sworn it was, and I could've also sworn that over 62,000 Guardsmen were activated for purposes of that war. How silly of me to actually have a grasp on miltary issues.

In short, I'd be very careful about accusing other people of not knowing facts about certain subjects when you don't have a grasp on them yourself.

 

[The BoidSmith]

Please look again at the pictures before (from Reptibid) and after (dead boa). Th picture of the live animal shows a thin boa. No fecal bulge is apparent in the lower gut. The the spinal chord is apparent under the skin on the posterior 1/3 of the body. This is also stated in the ad, the snake was grown slowly.

Now look at the picture of the dead snake. There is huge distention of the stomach area. In my opinion this corresponds to an equivalent of a couple of relatively large mice (we never heard how much it was fed), taking into consideration it was a 30 inch snake. The snake could not handle that big of a meal.

In my opinion the most likely cause of death was inadequate temperature to handle that volume of feed.

Regards.

 

[Cruciform]

temperature

But wouldn't inadequate temperature take a longer time to manifest potentially deadly symptoms, or be more likely to result in regurgitation, than if high temperatures were used with a large meal. Higher than normal temps could accelerate decay and bloating of the prey item, and increase the probability of intestinal blockage would they not?

(this is not intended to state the cause of death of this threads snake in particular. I'm just curious as to which error would be more likely to result in rapid death.)

 

[Wilomn]

Over heating could kill a snake in a matter of just a few hours, less if it's extremely high. It would also account for the liquid coming from the snakes mouth.

Wes Pollock

 

[repfriend]

Ashley,

Do you PURPOSELY just ignore certain facts/answers or are you......just a little """"DENSE""""????

So ok, you wanted people to answer YOUR question how they would have acted if the roles were reversed. They answered you and again proofed you how wrong you are.

Yet you keep on happily IGNORING certain facts and questions.

Oh smart woman you are, please humor me by adressing those questions and not ignoring them once again....

- Have you yet realized that in the herp world "live arrival" and nothing beyond is the norm??? Do you need more proof and names of breeders/sellers on that one???

- Have you yet realized that a sick boa will NOT!!!!! eat??? (and ate happily enough for Anthony)

-Have you yet realized that Anthony replied to Scott saying the boa arrived healthy and alive??? and please, don't tell me he didn't at least look it over while taking it to its enclosure...i mean PULEEZE

- Have you yet realized that your son broke some rules???? Maybe your supervision isn't all that, and you are trying to make up for that by "fixing" your sons mistakes???

-Do you need help figuring out how to open your own account on this forum? Its not that hard you know, us lowly uneducated people have figured it out, I'm sure YOU can, too...
Need help???

So Ashley dear...can you manage to adress some of those issues, since you don't have a small toe to stand on?

Or do you still plan to be laughed out of court, when you try to convince the judge how terrible it is to sell to a minor, when said minor "conceiled" his age, talked about partners, had snake shipped to "adult partner" and broke the rules by even using reptibid to purchase something to begin with. In short, said minor acted a bit....shady.

Oy, don't you rather just want to save yourself this embarressment?

(not holding my breath on getting some answers, either)

Everything is in my humble opinion only.

So lets hear it from you....