Having trouble with Kingsnake.com Help Please!! Sorry, kind of long

[sschind]

I think that would depend on the content of the website. If Adam says nothing derogatory about KS.com I don't see how they can hit him with a cease & desist. There are probably ways that he (Adam) could make his case without mentioning KS.com directly but I am not sure how. Now, If he were to have his website, and put his list on there as to where to buy all the stuff that the vendors on KS are selling he might have a winner, and I might add that there isn't anything Jeff could do about it. He might want to contact the vendors of the products and get approval first though just to avoid any problems later on.


Steve Schindler

 

[Adam Block]

Well, let's see. First off I would like nothing more then the publicity Jeff suing me would bring so I can only hope this happens. However, from a legal standpoint. If I were to start a site called KINGSNAKESUCKS.COM and use it to advertise or sell a product along the same lines as kingsnake there would be merit. However, my intent is to use it as a personal site to stait facts about kingsnake.com be those good or bad.

So it'll run down as follows if Jeff plays my game the way I want:

I'll get a cease and desist letter in the mail with an impressive number of separate laws that I have violated, a number of the supposed violations will be talking about pretty much the same kind of thing.

Then because I'm sure he's going to want to be cheap about it he'll go for the UDRP.

To win anything at this point he'll have to proove the following:

1) The site is being used for commercial purposes.
2) That I do not have a legitimate interest in the domain name. Since the site is being used to criticize and not compete that would be shot down extreemly quickly.
3) That I've registered the domain name in bad faith. This would apply if I were in competition with kingsnake.com and that is clearly not the case.

With the following said the site will launch this week. I will do one of three things, take up a lot of Jeff's time and money with him trying to sue me over something he could have been a man about and fixed with my refund, a reply to my emails or not letting his ego get in the way.

Or I will run my site in protest of his poor treatment and help others from getting caught in the ego trap of Jeff B and his God like business ethics.

Or last option would be Jeff spends a lot of time on this, some how wins and I start another site having learned from my mistakes this round.

Any way you cut it I don't see it being worth the $54, but I'll run with it to kill some time before the move and to make a point that I won't be stole from. Any fuel Jeff wants to add to the fire will be welcomed by me.

Thanks a lot for pointing out the key facts guys,
Adam Block

 

[Uffern]

I'm not sure that's such a good idea. In today's courts, you can win monetary damages against someone for anything. If Jeff B. sues you, and seeks damages, and court costs, and wins, you and your wife and kids are out on the street. I would put a great deal of thought into this. I am all for standing up for one's principles, but that only comes after the family is taken care of.

 

[Classic Dum's]

thanks God I don't mind as I knew this was going to happen from day one.

Sounds to me like you set out looking for trouble, so why are you whinning about it? If you knew it was going to happen from day one, why do it? In your email you said I was acting like a child trying to play games, NO, you service sucked thats why I b!tched. What exactly do you think you are doing here? Knowing from day one you were in the wrong, but you continued, now that you have achived you goal, your jumping up and down screaming like a kid who didnt get his lolly pop. I think this is one of two things, either a set up for a law suit or your not getting enough attention from your wife so your seaking attention else where. You seriously acting like someone who is deprived of attention.

 

[Adam Block]

thanks God I don't mind as I knew this was going to happen from day one.

Knowing from day one you were in the wrong

Jason, you've lost touch with the real world I think and now you're making assumptions. First off the first quote is mine and correct. I knew Jeff was going to delete my account because I knew about his ego and I knew he wouldn't be able to handle me asking why.

The second quote is yours and I have no clue where you got the assumption I thought I was wrong.

My issues with kingsnake are as follows:
So far having in essence stole my money.
Their selective censoring of ads.
Their bias towards people based on money spent.

I have more but my issue isn't that Jeff deleted my account as I've heard a lot about him and knew he would do that.

As for the legal end of it. If you're thinking about doing what I am then worry and look into it before you do anything. If you're not then don't worry about me although I thank you for your concern. I've looked into things on my end and know where the laws site. When the C&D comes I'll handle it but I went into this expecting Jeff to go legal without merit.

As a private person I'm worth a collective $12 and don't own a thing in my name. If Jeff wants to waste his time to get my $12 that is welcomed by me as I have nothing but time on my hands with the pending move. Either way, I'll spend $500 on banner ads, advertising and so on to get my $54 or Jeff will do the same to keep from giving it. I don't care but I'm not going to have $54 stole from me because Jeff has an ego issue.

Thanks for reading,
Adam Block

 

[jbuncc]

My issues with kingsnake are as follows:
So far having in essence stole my money.
Their selective censoring of ads.
Their bias towards people based on money spent.

none of these are against any kind of laws. it's just how he wants to run his business, that's it. he didn't "in essence" steal your money. you gave him the $54 and agreed to abide by his rules, which you didn't (thereby relinquishing your right to your money or his service) and he revoked your right to use his service. to me, he was a nice guy to refund your money (which as has been stated before, will probably be on your credit card which has been tied up and that's not his fault, so you screwed yourself there too).

if he does take you to court, you'll probably lose (where are you anyway, all he has to do is file suit in whatever state he's in and you have to show up by spending your $12 to get there) because he has the resources and you don't (right or wrong wont matter).

you know, my dad always told me to pick my fights carefully, and if i were you, i wouldn't be picking this one. you have to pick them based on right and wrong, and the likelihood of success. and kingsnakesucks.com... c'mon adam. that's really childish. and any site bashing another site with the word "sucks" in it, is not going to get a second look from anyone worth influencing with your opinion.

so, in conclusion, i say just drop it and be bitter. that's what i'd do. hell, go spend some time with your wife and kids, don't you think they deserve a little of the attention your focusing on jeff? isn't that time better spent? or are you not a family man? and instead, just a whiner? and with those two statements... what kind of example are you setting for your kids? are you throwing yourself on the floor, kicking and screaming because you learned it from them, or because you want them to learn it from you?

ok, i've wasted too much time on this. i'm going to redirect my attention to something worth paying attention to.
jb

 

[Adam Block]

You keep saying I broke the rules and lost my account because of it. When if fact I got an email noting the ads were in violation of their TOS. I took heed and my account was canceled because Jeff didn't like how I spoke to him. I want others to know he will do the same to you regardless of weather or not you follow TOS. All you have to do is piss him off and he'll steal your money like he has mine to this point. I informed him right off the bat I wouldn't get those funds. If you're owed a refund from somebody who's choice is it to say how that money gets refunded? I owe somebody a refund right now, are you all advocating I refund it in a manner they won't ever get it? That's very bad business and you should all be ashamed for thinking much a less saying it in public!

As for being sued?

Let's make a list of other people who've tried and lost -sucks.com cases:

Lockheed Martin
Wal-Mart
Cabela’s
National Westminster Bank
Bally Total Fitness
eBay
PayPal

And the list goes on and on and on and on so I'll stop there.

If your worry is the legal end of it save your time and stop typing now.

As for my kids and family, now you're talking like I'm a sheep.

Anybody have anything to say that hasn't been said?

Adam Block

PS You can't all be scared to talk about kingsnake.com? I get plenty of emails and nobody will say it out loud other then Seamus?

 

[Fred Albury]

Ok...back after Eggnog festival.............

Haveing *consumed* 5 eggnogs,I feel this gives me a better clearer vision of this case. Or maybe its a fuzzier, cloudier vision....be that as it may,heres a few nuggets 0' truth.

I have had similar problems with kingsnake in regards to the TOS and the use of to many characters. After a protracted, ugly battle(Made uglier by my comments) I was told that my class priviliges would be revoked and my service canceled.


Long story short, Kingsnake changed the limitations of the characters used(Not as restrictive as before) and they notified me of this new change of format. In fact they notified alot of people about it, which surprised the heck out of me.




Adam....I understand your anger. Trust me on that one. But, it isnt going to do you any good. You can start a new site slandering them or just demean their name and it wont do any good.Not a damn bit.

Bottem line: Until *someone * comes up with a solid, viable competitive option for buyers that frequent kingsnake,it will continue to be THE premier reptile website on the net. Can someone launch a better site? Of COURSE they can. But, the question is will they? People bitch about kingsnake all the time, for real and unreal reasons, but it is still damn near the only game in town if you are trying to move product. Or just sell your cute little boa you raised for 4 years. Rather than trying to lash out against the injustice you felt predicated upon you, perhaps that energy would be better spent trying to amass people and resources and technical skills to offer a viable option to kingsnake.com. Competition is a good thing, as it motivates sellers to give better service, better prices and better customer relations. Believe you me,I am rebellious as ...well,I am rebellious. But even in the states of wretched anger I have been in, I realize that the only way to change something is to make something better. I think that you will see in years to come, that someone with the drive an initiative will take on this herculean task, and who knows, they may succeed, or they may fail. But either way it spells better service and better conditions for customers period.

Me, personally,Im sending this thing back to hobby status where it belongs. I told you my observations on people in this industry and still believe those images to hold true. I'm no saint, no good guy, and certainly not major screw up free...nope I have had a few and still need to dig myself out of some of them, but I am truly tired by what I see, from vendors, from the public, from servers, from hosts, it sickens me. Be smart, do something that will make a positive effect for a lot of people, not just a short term dose of satisfaction for you. Im not trying to protect k/s from your advances, just saying that a REAL solution lies in makeing positive change, and that takes a heck of alot of work.But it is worth it.

Thank you,

Fred albury
aztec reptiles

 

[HerpVenue]

Jeff didn't like how I spoke to him.

Well it is his site.

When I was banned from kingsnake forums... I whined for a couple threads. Then I calmed down and realized attacking a moderator publicly was not conducive to keeping my account. But then again I did not know he was a moderator. But then again not knowing the guy was a moderator is no excuse for my behavior either. Needless to say....I should have thought a little bit more before I decided to hit the send button. Well I have paid and will probabluy continue to pay for those actions....even though I had good intentions. Like they say....The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

Anyway here is my take on it. You do not like something? You do not have to go there.

Besides I decided...instead of whining about it some more....which I already have. I can either shut my mouth or come up with something better. Well I can't come up with something better......so I will shut my mouth.

 

[Adam Block]

Fred and Ritchie I honestly owe you both a lot for those two posts! Those were some of the realest and truest words I've heard spoken on the BOI and I could tell they were heart felt.

I'm at an age where I'm old enough to know what to do but tooo young to listen to what I know. Am I pissed? HELL YES! I haven't like KS for a long time and kept my mouth shut because I needed them.

I too am truly tired by what I see, from vendors, from the public, from servers, from hosts and it sickens me as well. I guess there's little I can do about any of it in all honesty and I should just walk away at this point. I've been keeping reptiles for 23 years and haven't gone one day without owning a snake in that time. I started wanting to turn this hobby into a business right at the start of the internet and I haven't liked where the net has taken it in any way.

I've gone from 500 snakes to 20 in the last 12 months and I'm enjoying it very much!

I was ready to wage war with KS and these last two posts have made me rethink that.

I think I will just work on making impactreptiles.com a helpful positive site for people and I'll keep KINGSNAKESUCKS.COM as a very simple free speach site to voice KS issues.

Thanks a lot guys,
Adam Block

PS I love PSs so I had to add one. I'm so sick of "how much", "what's the cheapest", "I'll take it" and all the other STUPID emails! I can't tell you how happy I am to be done with them!

 

[thomas davis]

WOW

well adam it is not right but the fact is jeff can do what he did,ive met the man didnt care to much for him and ive had battles in the past on forums so i dont particuly care for ks,,,, but he has every right to ban you and im sure you will get your refund from him (maybe an a$$ but i dont think he's a theif),,as far as the kssux.com hahahaha go for it i guess lots of folks would get a kick out of it,i would,, and as far as your concerns on free trade?wow?,,grandpa used to say the value of something is WHATEVER someone is willing to pay for it,,bottom line free enterprize amigo free enterprize its what our economy is based on,,,,,peace-on,,,,,,and btw neil if ya read this geez be a man the way you suckup & defend ks and jeff barringer is truly pathetic"brownnose" ,,,,,,, totally agree w/you fred awsome post,,,and finally THIS is the site to be at heck i rarely go to ks since finding this place ,,,,,,merry christmas all(you to neil),,, thomas davis T&S reptile farm

 

[DISCERN]

Adam,

I do see your points and although the loss of $54 does suck, Jeff simply put down the rules on the TOS, and perhaps he was not happy with other ads you posted. Was this the last batch of ads you have posted lately?

I really like Kingsnake.com. It has helped me to meet people in this hobby, contact breeders from all over the US, and the info on the forums and the ads on the classifieds, well...my hobby has been for the better because of it.

I thought your website was cool, and it did seem like you had a good heart in promoting the care of reptiles, but it seems like you spend too much time whizzing out over things, and what people think of you.

The thought of launching some immature site called Kingsnakesucks.com is completely laughable. Adam, grow the freak up! Seriously! Is your life that boring as for you to waste your time trying to give a site that you had a squabble over a bad name?

Don't you have reptiles that would benefit from proper husbandry in the time wasted doing that website? How about using that time constructively and spend it with your wife and kid(s)? Do you understand what I am getting at?

Bro, you know that in your attempt to try to discredit kingsnake, you are actually contributing more horse manure to this beautiful hobby? They didn't rob your house, they didn't shoot your dog or your mom, they didn't get you fired from your job, they just cancelled a $54 account. WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!!!!

Their are much more important things in this world to get mad about. People are starving, homes get ripped apart by tornadoes, wives suffer from spousal abuse, children are abused, and terrorists are threatening our peace and quality of life. BUT, Adam Block had his ads deleted after violating the TOS rules. See how pathetic the comparison is?

I do think you have some good energy and talent, with your snake breedings and all. Really, I do. Your webpage was very cool and I enjoyed reading it. I just wish that you would care enough more about your time with what is really important vs. what is meaningless. Setting up a website to combat kingsnake is the dumbest thing or idea I have read about on this thread. I say this not to rip on you personally, but to bring some coffee for you to smell and wake up to reality.

Adam, seriously!

Take care!

Billy Fraser

 

[WebSlave]

I'm so sick of "how much", "what's the cheapest", "I'll take it" and all the other STUPID emails! I can't tell you how happy I am to be done with them!

Adam,

You would be amazed at how handy the filters are in most email readers. I have set mine to filter out ANY email that has the words 'cheap' or 'free' in it. Amazing how much of the garbage that will weed out! I have no desire to do business with anyone looking for, or offering, anything that uses those two words as descriptors.

 

[Adam Block]

You're right Rich, I have mine set to kick out anything with attachments but I should have put more in place. Is that why all the emails I send you asking if I can have your cheap snakes for free don't get replys?

Okay, well, I'm not going to address all this stuff again. I see you guys are like me and don't read all the posts, only the last one.

Free trade is fine but the Country is founded on free of speach and it was there the trouble lay. It is Jeff's site but HE DIDN'T KICK ME OFF FOR VOILATING TOS!!! I was only giving out the information and I was kicked off because Jeff wasn't going to let me question why as that would have shown his true colors.

I've been placing ads, the same ads for 3 years on KS and they NEVER got touched. Then I draw some attention to myself and he finds a reason to delete all my ads, when asked about it he kicks me off.

Yawn, well I just woke up. I have NOTHING better to do today but fixed my car as I'm basicly retired for the next 3 months. So I guess the toughest part of the day's going to be if I drive into the desert and shoot 500 7.62x39 rounds or if I take the .223 and let 500 of those go?

As you can see, life is tough when you're not working and have nothing but time to focus on your friends or enemys!

Thanks guys,
Adam Block

PS I'll work on KSS.COM tonight, if you have a story you would like me to add email it to me and I'll be more then happy to protect your name.

 

[WebSlave]

Damn, Adam!

Now look what you have done.

I just got off the phone with Jeff Barringer. Guess what he wanted to talk to me about?

Pretty tough question, huh?

His closing comment to me was something in the order of "Since you will not remove Adam Block's postings from your website, any mention of the BOI on KINGSNAKE.COM will be banned."

(Heck, I thought it already was!)

Excuse me if I cut out all of the details of the conversation.

Whoowee! I narrowly missed being targeted in a BOISucks.com site being set up overnight!

 

[HerpVenue]

Since you will not remove Adam Block's postings from your website

I am all for Jeff taking care of his site...
I am all for Jeff doing whatever he wants to people on his website.
But to call you and ask you to delete a thread that does not violate any rules is pretty PHUCKING Pathetic.

I mean what is wrong with this thread?
What rules does it break?
Does it tell lies?
or
Does it tell of someones personal experience with his site?




Gee Jeff...you do not want Adam to post about your site on the BOI
BUT
You sure do want people to post about "other" sites on the BOI

You do not want to see the name kingsnake on the BOI...
BUT
You sure do not have problems trying to get people to post about other companies do ya? know what I mean?

 

[thomas davis]

wow

wow rich thats pretty funny jeff would actually want you to delete this thread then threaten you w/thBOI being banned on his site ,after allready doing just that?months ago?,,man he really showed some "true colors" there,,i mean there is nothing wrong w/this thread? and adam he kicked you off his site (jeff b.) because he wanted to,,, youve stated that over&over again that it wasnt about the TOS thing,may not be right BUT he has every right to do so its not fair but neither is life accept it and move on,let kingsnake.com dig its own grave,,faunaclassifieds.com is the one!!! ,,peace on,,,,merry christmas everyone!! !!,,,thomas davis T&S reptile farm

 

[Adam Block]

That is just another case of Jeff trying to play god and not admitting his wrong doings. He will go to great lenghts to try to hide and cover his actions and has read this but will neither say anything in public, call me, refund my money or admit any other wrong doing. He will just keep banning people from his site and putting up restrictions until one day it dawns on him that it's been his downfall and he has more people against him then on his side.

I'm fine with Jeff deleting my account. I have no issue with that at all as I knew he would do it. I've spent 3 years walking a fine line and bitting my toung because many people know if they disagree with him he will delete your accout. For many kingsnake is a lifeline and the only way to sell items. Jeff knows this and loves playing god.

If you would like to read our full email exchange you can now do so at KINGSNAKESUCKS.COM! I'm on the edge right now of popping the funds for banners or not and I will decide that in the next two days based on the information I'm able to get up and if I see my refund or not.

Jeff, the 1st amendment may not apply on your site but this is the real world. If you want to run your snake business like a snake be a man and deal with people not liking you. You can call me a King or an A$$hole and I'll treat you the same. I'll give you more respect if you call me an A$$hole but the treatment won't change.

I've gotten about 15 emails along the same lines as my concern with Jeff. I'm working on getting some of them up on the site now so if you have anything to add please let me know. I'm waiting for submission to the search engines till things are done.

Thanks a lot,
Adam Block

 

[dwedeking]

Adam,

I just went to your site. I read the emails back and forth. From the beginning you were just begging to get kicked off by pushing his buttons. I put forth the theory that you instigated this as an attention-getter (gee, suprise there, as this is your standard mode of operation) and your game plan from the beginning.

Your definitely a PITA.

Kingsnake definitely has it's faults and you have to toe the line. That's just real world (ever meet cops in a small town, man what a pain in the butt, nothing to do so they bust your balls about little crap). But you went out of your way to instigate a brawl.

 

[ScottsReptiles]

I just read your email exchange and conducted a little research of my own.. and.. I must admit.. your level of ignorance and stupidity just blows me away. Were you the kid in the class that no matter how many times the teacher said no.. you kept doing it until you got a detention?

Lets see if I can sum up all of your warnings..

1)On Tuesday, December 17, 2002 at 11:17 PM
- 4 ads have been warned with explanations of what was wrong and the next few steps in the process if the problem was not fixed

2)On Wednesday, December 18, 2002 at 12:15 AM
- a second day warning allowing you to still correct the problem

3)On Wednesday, December 18, 2002 at 12:42 AM
- you were finally booted.

Now.. the TOS clearly states that "You may NOT post advertisments for other businesses or individuals" in the TOS it also states "...that account will be IMMEDIATELY TERMINATED ". Following the rules stated on the TOS, you should not have been given a second chance.

This second chance was given as a courtesy to you. Your reply was "I'm going to repost the ad selling "a list" with the information" and "...I'll figure out another way to word it or sell it."

In your wholesale list in question.. I see direct links to 11 other businesses.

Also in the TOS.. "Being Abusive/Belligerent/Argumentative to Staff - All of the services we provide, whether its classifieds or forums, we provide as a service, and grant you the privilege to use them. If you violate that privilege, either knowingly unknowingly, we may contact you and ask you to stop. If you persist or become abusive, belligerent, argumentative with an employee, we have the right and the ability to revoke your classified and other site privileges and cancel your services."

Now.. I only took a few law courses in college.. but.. in what ways did Jeff or Kingsnake.com do you wrong?